Screw the Royal Navy - Bring on the Marine Nationale!

[Spuggy]

First things first. I am British so saying this is weird I know. However, I am ex-army so, you know, rivalry and all that.....

 

Anyway.......

 

Being a little bored I thought I would start doing some low level research into the Marine Nationale (French Navy for you uninitiated among us) and I started to see some really interesting stuff about their battleship line. Check this stuff out:

 

The République class battleship was a "pre-dreadnought" type. One dual 305mm in the front and another in the back. 19kts speed. Nothing special yeah? Well it also had a rather superb secondary armament of 18 164mm guns. That's pretty epic for an entry level BB.

 

The Liberté class battleship, another "pre-dreadnought" type is similar to it's predecessor. One dual 305mm in the front and again in the back. 19kts which is slow but meh. So again, nothing special. But! Secondary armament consisted of ten 194mm, yes, 10 x 194mm guns. That is some powerful secondary that I imagine would have some pretty epic range.

 

The Danton class battleship. Again, considered a "pre-dreadnought" type. Again it's a slow 19kts. It's main armament is again a single dual 305mm at the front and back but, secondary armament; 6 dual 240mm guns and 16 x 75mm guns and AA looks like 10 x 47mm hotchkiss guns. Again, that's some epic secondary battery firepower and those 240mm guns would have some insane range.

 

There seems to be a pattern to these Marine Nationale BB's eh? Slow with a strange focus on secondary armament.

 

The Courbet class. The first "dreadnought" type. A slight move away from the current form and closer to "standard" BB design. Only 21 kts so still slow. 6 x dual 305mm guns with two fore (superfiring), two aft (superfiring) and two in the centre side by side. Not the best arrangement but it's okay. The secondary armament guns are only 138mm. However, there are 22 of them. 

 

The Bretagne class battleship. Similar to the Courbet class the Bregtagne class appears to be a simple upgrade. It sports 10 x 340mm guns mounted in 5 dual turrets down the centre line of the ship with the two fore and the two aft in superfiring setups. 22 x 138mm guns as the secondary. Still slow at 21 kts.

 

The Dunkerque class is where things get a little weird but in a good way. A fast battleship. It could do 31kts. and it has 8 x 330mm guns. These are places in two quad turrets, both in the front of the ship in superfiring setup. Now I think this is interesting. It means you can place all of your firepower onto the target whilst showing the smallest profile. This is pretty unique in this game at the moment. The secondary armament is also pretty bonkers. it's mostly at the rear with 3 quad and two dual 130mm dual purpose guns. Plus 5x dual 37mm and 8 x 13.2 mm AA guns this thing will eat aircraft.

 

The Richelieu class is essentially an upgrade to the Dunkerque class. Same setup but with 380mm main battery guns and 152mm secondary instead of 130mm. Still an interesting ship.

 

The Alsace class (paper ship) is possibly the top tier BB of the Marine Nationale. Similar to the Richelieu class but sporting a third quad 380mm gun in the rear. Again, secondaries are 3 x triple 152mm DP turrets and a metric tonne of AA too.

 

So, why do I like these better than the Royal Navy ships?

Well I think that they are far more interesting. I really believe that the Royal Navy BB line will be a little dull with their ships focusing on survivability for the most part. Whereas these ships are quirky. The earlier BB's have silly powerful secondary armament. The mid BB's are fairly standard but then the late BB's are a little strange themselves.

 

What do you think?

 

 

[robertsrevenge]

oh dear about the royal navy we have to come and sink your fleet again then

[praetor_jax]

Royal who? Whatever Nationale? Bring the Regia Marina!

 

[Vanhal]

oh dear about the royal navy we have to come and sink your fleet again then

 

Again like thugs at Mers-el-Kebir? Tsk, tsk.

[Comrad_StaIin]

I want german BBs ! 

 

[Aotearas]

I just want them all. Royal Navy, Marine Nationale (yes, because Dunkerque), Regia Marina/Marina Militare (the italian navy had quite the tradition with torpedo boats, so their destroyers should be fun) and the rest of the existing techtrees.

 

[Adwaenyth]

Nah. First we get Arpeggio of Blue Steel... 

 

Btw. I just watched it on Netflix and have two things to say about it:

 

1. Japanese are utterly bats*** crazy regarding what they make animes about (in a disturbing yet not negative way)
2. Kongou is the same kind of crazy

[IamTroublemaker]

I want german BBs ! 

 

Oh yes, I can't wait for them as well, the sooner they come the better

[22cm]

The Richelieu and Dunkerque  should have a very interesting and unique gameplay.

[Historynerd]

First things first. I am British so saying this is weird I know. However, I am ex-army so, you know, rivalry and all that.....

 

Anyway.......

 

Being a little bored I thought I would start doing some low level research into the Marine Nationale (French Navy for you uninitiated among us) and I started to see some really interesting stuff about their battleship line. Check this stuff out:

 

The République class battleship was a "pre-dreadnought" type. One dual 305mm in the front and another in the back. 19kts speed. Nothing special yeah? Well it also had a rather superb secondary armament of 18 164mm guns. That's pretty epic for an entry level BB.

 

The Liberté class battleship, another "pre-dreadnought" type is similar to it's predecessor. One dual 305mm in the front and again in the back. 19kts which is slow but meh. So again, nothing special. But! Secondary armament consisted of ten 194mm, yes, 10 x 194mm guns. That is some powerful secondary that I imagine would have some pretty epic range.

 

The Danton class battleship. Again, considered a "pre-dreadnought" type. Again it's a slow 19kts. It's main armament is again a single dual 305mm at the front and back but, secondary armament; 6 dual 240mm guns and 16 x 75mm guns and AA looks like 10 x 47mm hotchkiss guns. Again, that's some epic secondary battery firepower and those 240mm guns would have some insane range.

 

There seems to be a pattern to these Marine Nationale BB's eh? Slow with a strange focus on secondary armament.

 

The Courbet class. The first "dreadnought" type. A slight move away from the current form and closer to "standard" BB design. Only 21 kts so still slow. 6 x dual 305mm guns with two fore (superfiring), two aft (superfiring) and two in the centre side by side. Not the best arrangement but it's okay. The secondary armament guns are only 138mm. However, there are 22 of them. 

 

The Bretagne class battleship. Similar to the Courbet class the Bregtagne class appears to be a simple upgrade. It sports 10 x 340mm guns mounted in 5 dual turrets down the centre line of the ship with the two fore and the two aft in superfiring setups. 22 x 138mm guns as the secondary. Still slow at 21 kts.

 

The Dunkerque class is where things get a little weird but in a good way. A fast battleship. It could do 31kts. and it has 8 x 330mm guns. These are places in two quad turrets, both in the front of the ship in superfiring setup. Now I think this is interesting. It means you can place all of your firepower onto the target whilst showing the smallest profile. This is pretty unique in this game at the moment. The secondary armament is also pretty bonkers. it's mostly at the rear with 3 quad and two dual 130mm dual purpose guns. Plus 5x dual 37mm and 8 x 13.2 mm AA guns this thing will eat aircraft.

 

The Richelieu class is essentially an upgrade to the Dunkerque class. Same setup but with 380mm main battery guns and 152mm secondary instead of 130mm. Still an interesting ship.

 

The Alsace class (paper ship) is possibly the top tier BB of the Marine Nationale. Similar to the Richelieu class but sporting a third quad 380mm gun in the rear. Again, secondaries are 3 x triple 152mm DP turrets and a metric tonne of AA too.

 

So, why do I like these better than the Royal Navy ships?

Well I think that they are far more interesting. I really believe that the Royal Navy BB line will be a little dull with their ships focusing on survivability for the most part. Whereas these ships are quirky. The earlier BB's have silly powerful secondary armament. The mid BB's are fairly standard but then the late BB's are a little strange themselves.

 

What do you think?

 

 

 

Nothing wrong with wanting the Marine Nationale; its ships are going to be very interesting.

 

But I'm afraid that, if not for some one-off premium, we can forget about seeing any predreadnought in the game. 

[Aotearas]

Nah. First we get Arpeggio of Blue Steel... 

 

Btw. I just watched it on Netflix and have two things to say about it:

 

1. Japanese are utterly bats*** crazy regarding what they make animes about (in a disturbing yet not negative way)
2. Kongou is the same kind of crazy

 

If it's only Netflix you're watching, you've seen NOTHING!!!

 

And I mean that in both the positive and negative implications. There's stuff around that makes you question what drugs the drugs those guys took were on. And then there's masterpieces that makes you wonder why on earth it isn't available.

[WhiskeyWolf]

 Screw the Royal Navy - Bring on the Marine Nationale!

 

1st Class Clickbait Title.

[SonofaSailor]

praetor_jax, on 17 December 2015 - 03:39 PM, said:

Royal who? Whatever Nationale? Bring the Regia Marina!

 

I dunno... you'd end up having to buy the same battleship twice! Once in it's original configuration, and again after it had it's 1930s face lift. Is that good value for your hard earned XP?

 

Mind you, 45 knot destroyers... that's enticing.

 

22cm, on 17 December 2015 - 04:15 PM, said:

The Richelieu and Dunkerque  should have a very interesting and unique gameplay.

 

Two of my favourite designs. But if you're going to have those ships, you really need to have the Panzerschiff to complete the set! Part of the reason for the design of these ships was to hunt down the German Deutschland class. Then we could do what they never got the chance to do in real life!
 

[Niaro]

Just give me my Nelly.. After that I wouldnt mind some French Quad turrets..

[praetor_jax]

 

I dunno... you'd end up having to buy the same battleship twice! Once in it's original configuration, and again after it had it's 1930s face lift. Is that good value for your hard earned XP?

 

Mind you, 45 knot destroyers... that's enticing.

 

Not too different from how the already implemented japanese and american battleships work.

[Historynerd]

 

I dunno... you'd end up having to buy the same battleship twice! Once in it's original configuration, and again after it had it's 1930s face lift. Is that good value for your hard earned XP?

 

Mind you, 45 knot destroyers... that's enticing.

 

Not necessarily.

Both in their original configuration, and in the modernized configuration, the Conte di Cavour-class and the Duilio-class battleships had some differences from one another, especially in terms of secondary and AA firepower (and also perhaps of maximum range for the main armament).

In any case, both configs would be adequate, respectively for Tier IV and Tier V.

[Meneleus]

Royal who? Whatever Nationale? Bring the Regia Marina!

 

Regia Marina? That you grandmother's name? ;)

 

Bring the rest of 'em German ships, the Hochseeflotte will rise again!

 

 

 

Cheers, M

[SonofaSailor]

Aotearas, on 17 December 2015 - 03:47 PM, said:

 (the italian navy had quite the tradition with torpedo boats, so their destroyers should be fun) and the rest of the existing techtrees.

 

 

Why can't we have torpedo boats in WoW? You could organise them into squadrons under a single player, like the aircraft on a carrier. The only difference would be that to knock that player out of the game you'd have to destroy every last boat, but the player could keep fighting right down to his last boat.

 

Hey, I like that idea.

 

Only problem I see is reloads. Is every boat a one or two shot deal, after which it's just a decoy for incoming rounds? Historically, there are many designs to choose from. The earliest had a single stern-launched torpedo... we can skip those. WW2 boats often carried 4 torps, and those that only had 2 often added more guns. Then there were the Motor Gunboats in the Royal Navy that had no torps at all and carried even more guns. Some of these boats could take wreck destroyers with gunfire!

 

I would suggest a combination of 2 and 4 torp boats, so that when all torps are gone you've still got guns to chase the destroyers with. Or let them run back to an island base to re-arm. But then they might get blockaded inside or out by the enemy.

 

Okay, set a recharge time limit for each boat. Make it significant. Got to be longer than a repair cycle. 5 minutes? That might encourage the player not to shoot everything at once (unless he's got a cherry target, of course).

 

Hmm... where do I file suggestions?

 

ooh! ooh! New thought.

 

If we're going for the Marine Nationale, we've got to have the Surcouf! I know submarines are verbotten, but this has got to be an exception. A submersible 8 inch gun cruiser!

 

You could actually make the argument in favour of submarines in WoW if you recall that all the early designs right up to the end of WW2 were really 'submersible' torpedo boats - the U-boat always functioned best on the surface, and in the early days did most of it's fighting, both with guns and torpedos, on the surface! The submerging thing was considered a way of sneaking about, deploying unobserved and escaping after an attack. It didn't become the primary means of delivering an attack until anti-submarine technology started to improve.

 

So why can't we have submersible torpedo boats with 8 inch guns that are restricted to firing while surfaced?

 

 

[Adwaenyth]

 

If it's only Netflix you're watching, you've seen NOTHING!!!

 

And I mean that in both the positive and negative implications. There's stuff around that makes you question what drugs the drugs those guys took were on. And then there's masterpieces that makes you wonder why on earth it isn't available.

 

Official answer? I'm only watching Netflix... 

 

Unofficial answer: Whatever the drugs they take, they should either take less or more of it. Then again there are some really really good anime among those. Although they would still be classified as absolutely strange by most people here... and yeah, I've got a friend who actually studied Japanese and even got his degree just because he wanted to understand the ideas behind animes and mangas better. - Okay he really is a good artist himself, although he mostly paints abstract art and we arrive at a lot of different conclusions of what his work actually is, but he says that's fine and he likes what I think about his work so I guess I can't argue with that. 

[Tigger3]

The Danton class battleship. Again, considered a "pre-dreadnought" type. Again it's a slow 19kts. It's main armament is again a single dual 305mm at the front and back but, secondary armament; 6 dual 240mm guns and 16 x 75mm guns and AA looks like 10 x 47mm hotchkiss guns. Again, that's some epic secondary battery firepower and those 240mm guns would have some insane range.

 

There seems to be a pattern to these Marine Nationale BB's eh? Slow with a strange focus on secondary armament.

 

 

 

The Hotchkiss guns were not AA they were for use against the early torpedo boats, very rapid fire. When this ship was launched the threat from the air was considered to be more reconnaissance by airship than air attack on the ships (after all first heavier than air craft flight was only 3 years before the Danton was laid down and France did not have an air arm until the Danton was commissioned.

[Admiral_H_Nelson]

 

Regia Marina? That you grandmother's name? ;)

 

Bring the rest of 'em German ships, the Hochseeflotte will rise again!

 

 

 

Cheers, M

Very nice "oompah" music, but I can't see that having the same emotional impact at a German equivalent of "Last Night of the Proms" as "Rule Britannia!" does at the real "Last Night". 

 

But yes, I'd love to see German WW1 ships live on in WoWS.

 

Introduce them with a promo video that sees them rising up from the sea-bed (like in the spine tingling opening to the PhlyDaily videos on YouTube).

[imply_tha_best]

 

But yes, I'd love to see German WW1 ships live on in WoWS.

 

 

You already can! The Karlsruhe awaits you... 

[Adwaenyth]

 

You already can! The Karlsruhe awaits you... 

 

Ooooor... you take the much better known SMS Emden - a Dresden-class light cruiser. 

[Aotearas]

I want a full fledged battle cruiser line for Germany. It can replace the Carrier line, since Germany pretty much didn't have anything to speak of, just a couple ships converted into small escort carriers and that one Graf Zeppelin, plus maybe one or two paper projects. Certainly not enough to make a decent line-up. But Germany did very much have a distinct history with battlecruisers and such types (Deutschland class pocket battleships for example) that wouldn't quite fit into the cruiser or dreadnought categories.

[Seaman_Staines1]

oh dear about the royal navy we have to come and sink your fleet again then

 

Yes we will... Nasty French team killers sink them all......LOL