North Carolina

[monger]

Hey guys, im really struggeling with this one.

Would love some advise regarding how to play this thing, seems like that for the life of me i cant do any damage with this one, 

and with the slow shells im kinda at a loss here.

 

[IamTroublemaker]

Well, first of all if you just looked a bit down on the forum, you would have seen 2 topics about NC already.

 

Anyway, I don't remember how it was with stock hull (didn't play many battles in it), but I can say its a very very enjoyable and strong ship to play when fully upgraded.

The key is not to show your broadside as its very weak and prone to citadel hits. When playing against higher tiers always try to keep some distance (especially against Yamato) while I found it really enjoyable to play at ~10-15km away from opponent BBs (when outnumbered only) and always try to show your bow because then the opponents will have hard time penetrating you and the 6 guns you have in front should be enough.

 

It was really hard for me to get used to NC after brawling so much with Colorado, but NC is a different ship with a different playstyle, more suited for playing at a certain distance (not too much tho, because sniping with a BB can mostly harm you and your team) and try to make your opponents expose their broadside and punish them for that

[Ascender]

Turn a lot. Especially at range the NC's turning circle is deceptively tight. Even if the rate at which it turns is not that different to other ships it makes judging where it's going to be hard as you expect it to make a wider turning circle than it actually does.

 

Anything else probably best to look at other topics as mentioned I guess.

[WWladCZ]

I am really dissapointed by the shell arc and armor. I have stock hull any everything deals damage to me everytime while I sruggle to hit where it would normaly be easy for me. Also it is really pissing me off when I hit enemy and shells deal no damage like they shoot marshmallows? This BB needs hull upgrade for sure!

[IamTroublemaker]

I am really dissapointed by the shell arc and armor. I have stock hull any everything deals damage to me everytime while I sruggle to hit where it would normaly be easy for me. Also it is really pissing me off when I hit enemy and shells deal no damage like they shoot marshmallows? This BB needs hull upgrade for sure!

 

It gets much better with the hull upgrade!

 

Try to show only your "nose", those 6 guns should be enough to deal nice amounts of damage. It has a weak broadside tho, so try not to expose it too much!

As for the shells, I don't remember having anything bad to say about them, they seemed quite similar like on the Colorado, but maybe they also get better with the second hull (I didn't play with stock hull for a long time so I cannot really compare).

[WWladCZ]

 

It gets much better with the hull upgrade!

 

Try to show only your "nose", those 6 guns should be enough to deal nice amounts of damage. It has a weak broadside tho, so try not to expose it too much!

As for the shells, I don't remember having anything bad to say about them, they seemed quite similar like on the Colorado, but maybe they also get better with the second hull (I didn't play with stock hull for a long time so I cannot really compare).

 

I think it needs the upgrade just like Colorado and NM it gives the BB the stats it needs to be great.

[Leutnant_Kramer]

Well, she suffers from current AP mechanics (if you shoot AP). I haven't had decent AP damage against cruisers for days. So...try to shoot battleships, I guess.

[IamTroublemaker]

Well, she suffers from current AP mechanics (if you shoot AP). I haven't had decent AP damage against cruisers for days. So...try to shoot battleships, I guess.

 

AP is fine, it was always fine. The thing that was changed (mistake I guess) with 5.1 was the cruiser armor and it was fixed with 5.1.1

After it, I have no problems shooting cruisers. Its all just in your head

[Admiral_noodle]

I'm struggling to hit anything with her. No one else goes close so I get stuck at a fair distance dispersion seems poor. Add that in to my inexperience at leading high tier ships and I don't get hits much at all. Oh and then there are the high tier maps I'm not used too...

 

Only 44% WR and 58k average damage. It's early days but disappointing. I do the turning and angling thing all the time and usually avoid a quick death, but I don't feel I'm having the impact I did with say New Mexico.

 

Any tips? Or is it a case of practice harder?

 

(Couldn't find another NC thread so necro'd this one)

[Poster_2015]

1) The broadside armor of NC is not exactly weak - its just at t8 stuff starts to hit hard. I dont find citadelling Colorados in my Iowa even a tiny bit harder than NC - if they show side they get punished. Point is - its not really NC specific - starting at t8 you will really need to angle a LOT - battleships dont really have any relatively safe distances anymore - anything including Yamatos can be citadeled rather easily if not angled. The good aspect of it - NC has 6 front guns (2/3 firepower). The bad is that if you want to make use of 3rd turret, better be sure you are duelling a cruiser - cause its almost never worth it vs a BB (I mean in a duel-like situation - if you are attacked by 2 BBs from different side, its usually better to broadside the easier target and hope you can kill him quick enough).

 

2) To elaborate on the point above - the citadel armor is about same as Colorado - and not sufficient at t8 (same goes for Iowa, Montana has actually decent armor vs anything but Yamato but thats diff topic). However the armor on NC is vastly improved in layout on NON citadel space. Thats something people tend to omit, focusing their armor evaluation on "can it be citadelled". NC armor tends to produce a lot more overpenetrations, and if you are nose-first bounces. Yes you will receive more citadels (because your opponents are stronger while armor is not), but at the same time non-citadels are a lot easier to shrug off. I had a nice sample of that in ranked battles in premier league. Everytime someone would bring in a Colorado or Nagato (because they have same guns and better armor then NC and Amagi), i would get nice juicy 10-12k AP salvos on them (without a single citadel), where Amagi in same situation would take 3-4k. Same goes for HE. 

 

3) The guns can be actually very annoying and many consider them the weakest point of NC. The guns are more or less the same as Colorado - but NC shoots super heavies even at stock hull. The result of shooting such heavy shell from relatively short barrel is very long flight time - making it hard to aim, and giving it penetration problems at most common range in game (it can help at very long range when the shells penetrate decks, but MOST encounters it makes it harder to penetrate). The upside is a bit less overpenetrations vs cruisers.

 

4) The guns are not accurate, and sorry but they never will. Iowa will solve the flight time problem - but the "US shotgun" dispersion will stay with you till end of the line.  There is also the case of "cheating Amagi" - the dispersion on Amagi/Nagato is same as other jap BBs of the same line - but the game engine bends it in their favor. Since HE shells on Amagi/Nagato have a LOT longer flight time than AP shells (so much longer i often ended up shooting DDs at long range with AP just for better chance of hitting), the game applies the "max dispersion" to HE shells, while AP shells have it freely lowered. 

 

5) T8 is still somewhat enjoyable for US BBs but some problems emerge. Problem is, you really want to go brawling nose first - get close personal, and use your "shotgun". But the random game playstyle almost never supports it. You either go Yolo alone (even if people agree on push and follow you initially they will bolt at first sight of danger) and die, or you are forced to 20km sniping matches - something which japs simply do better. Thats why you dont feel you dont have an impact. If you actually can lead a decent "charge" down a flank, you will have your impact. To do so there are 3 ways. a

 a) wait for that 1 of 100 games with both non-chicken and non-retarded team

 b) play with 2 friends in a platoon and just make your own strike force

 c) play rankeds - this is mostly why i played rankeds, the cash for rank 1 was nice sure, the flags i didnt care , the competition i felt mixed about. But 7v7 format really helps me enjoy the game more. 

[Admiral_noodle]

Thanks. I did try divisioning. It made things worse

 

Unfortunately my division mate's Mogami blew up straight away. Yesterday I was in a division with a cv and a DD and that didn't help much.

 

I clearly have a lot to learn about tier 8 gameplay in general - although I'm pretty handy in tirpitz my New Orleans is similarly woeful.

 

I'll keep going, though it's ruining my stats

[Cosseria]

Just purchased this ship too, thanks to your advices I managed to finish the first battle, where I found myself alone defending the cap and died under a hail of shells, with a passive of only 12000 credits (I expected something like 100k). The very first shots I fired citadelled (but didn't oneshot) a Yorck.

Yeah, she feels powerful, but I'm not spiritually ready for the frequent passive outcomes. It spoils the bit of fun I get from firing those big guns. I'll wait the months it will take to my teammates to catch up to T 8 and then I'll only play in division with them. In the meanwhile I may keep playing Atago, which I almost never go negative with, or Benson and Fubuki as I feel I'm better with DDs.

[vaskemaskina]

Anyone else loving the 3x"1310" after hitting the broadside of a cruiser?

 

[Namolis]

1) The broadside armor of NC is not exactly weak - its just at t8 stuff starts to hit hard. I dont find citadelling Colorados in my Iowa even a tiny bit harder than NC - if they show side they get punished. Point is - its not really NC specific - starting at t8 you will really need to angle a LOT - battleships dont really have any relatively safe distances anymore - anything including Yamatos can be citadeled rather easily if not angled. The good aspect of it - NC has 6 front guns (2/3 firepower). The bad is that if you want to make use of 3rd turret, better be sure you are duelling a cruiser - cause its almost never worth it vs a BB (I mean in a duel-like situation - if you are attacked by 2 BBs from different side, its usually better to broadside the easier target and hope you can kill him quick enough).

 

2) To elaborate on the point above - the citadel armor is about same as Colorado - and not sufficient at t8 (same goes for Iowa, Montana has actually decent armor vs anything but Yamato but thats diff topic). However the armor on NC is vastly improved in layout on NON citadel space. Thats something people tend to omit, focusing their armor evaluation on "can it be citadelled". NC armor tends to produce a lot more overpenetrations, and if you are nose-first bounces. Yes you will receive more citadels (because your opponents are stronger while armor is not), but at the same time non-citadels are a lot easier to shrug off. I had a nice sample of that in ranked battles in premier league. Everytime someone would bring in a Colorado or Nagato (because they have same guns and better armor then NC and Amagi), i would get nice juicy 10-12k AP salvos on them (without a single citadel), where Amagi in same situation would take 3-4k. Same goes for HE. 

 

3) The guns can be actually very annoying and many consider them the weakest point of NC. The guns are more or less the same as Colorado - but NC shoots super heavies even at stock hull. The result of shooting such heavy shell from relatively short barrel is very long flight time - making it hard to aim, and giving it penetration problems at most common range in game (it can help at very long range when the shells penetrate decks, but MOST encounters it makes it harder to penetrate). The upside is a bit less overpenetrations vs cruisers.

 

4) The guns are not accurate, and sorry but they never will. Iowa will solve the flight time problem - but the "US shotgun" dispersion will stay with you till end of the line.  There is also the case of "cheating Amagi" - the dispersion on Amagi/Nagato is same as other jap BBs of the same line - but the game engine bends it in their favor. Since HE shells on Amagi/Nagato have a LOT longer flight time than AP shells (so much longer i often ended up shooting DDs at long range with AP just for better chance of hitting), the game applies the "max dispersion" to HE shells, while AP shells have it freely lowered. 

 

5) T8 is still somewhat enjoyable for US BBs but some problems emerge. Problem is, you really want to go brawling nose first - get close personal, and use your "shotgun". But the random game playstyle almost never supports it. You either go Yolo alone (even if people agree on push and follow you initially they will bolt at first sight of danger) and die, or you are forced to 20km sniping matches - something which japs simply do better. Thats why you dont feel you dont have an impact. If you actually can lead a decent "charge" down a flank, you will have your impact. To do so there are 3 ways. a

 a) wait for that 1 of 100 games with both non-chicken and non-retarded team

 b) play with 2 friends in a platoon and just make your own strike force

 c) play rankeds - this is mostly why i played rankeds, the cash for rank 1 was nice sure, the flags i didnt care , the competition i felt mixed about. But 7v7 format really helps me enjoy the game more. 

I concur with much of the above. Just to reiterate about point 3; keep in mind that the 701 m/s muzzle velocity is (afaik) the slowest in the game, so it really takes some reconfiguring of your brain to lead enough without it feeling "wrong". I always struggle to understand why the NC does so poorly statistically, but I think trouble with the guns can be part of the explaination. Going back and forth between NC and other ships will mess up your aim badly. When you're shooting Kievs and Tashkents you may actually find yourself leading them outside the screen on maximum zoom. The heavy shells will bleed their speed very slowly, though, so if you lead based on the center of the target, you will hardly require any compensation for range. Which is nice.

 

Once you master the guns (which I realize takes some time), though, NC is fantastic (upgraded, that is, though she's better stock than many other ships in the game). She is in many ways the most flexible battleship in the game, a true jack of all trades. Depending on the situation, she can do absolutely everything decently: she can snipe (not very good with that dispersion, but at least the target won't be leaving the threat zone with a small turn), she can tank all shells save the 460, she can kill planes, she is reasonably fast, she is the last US battleship that is manouverable enough to dodge "surprise" torpedoes, hide its citadel and fight torpedo-wielding ships (including destroyers) aggressively with any degree of success.

 

The trick in playing NC successfully lies in identifying what you can do well at a particular moment; or, rather, identifying what your oppoinents can not do well, and then manouver to take advantage of their weakness. Most games start out as snipe-fests, but very few stay that way until the end. You'll need some patience.

 

Also, Poster_2015, I didn't understand what you meant on point 4 about cheating Amagi. Is there anywhere I can read more about that?

 

 

 

Btw, If you're still not sold on the NC, consider that you can actually set her up to invisifire.

[Admiral_noodle]

Aaahhhh. The muzzle velocity is screwing my aim. I was so rubbish in Cleveland I sold here. NC feels a little like an up gunned Cleveland in some ways!

 

I think I'll wander off to coop to practice my shooting with her. Thanks!

[vaskemaskina]

North carolina does feel like a cleveland.....

Does any of you use the range module update? MK8 mod2? It seems to ruin the already ruined 'accuracy'...

[ollonborre]

North carolina does feel like a cleveland.....

Does any of you use the range module update? MK8 mod2? It seems to ruin the already ruined 'accuracy'...

 

It does make it worse yes, but not terrible considering there are very few BB*s in the game that can comfortobly sit at max range anyways. I only use the full range to take pot shots while advancing, and if my aim is good and RNG with me I can get some free damage before they can retaliate.

 

Still apart from the shotgun accuracy at times and slow velocity as mentioned above, I still think it is a very solid ship. Guns have good penetration, good damage, turn fast enough, the armor is great if you keep it angled or do the "bow towards enemy", AA is fantastic and she is fast.

[Admiral_noodle]

North carolina does feel like a cleveland.....

Does any of you use the range module update? MK8 mod2? It seems to ruin the already ruined 'accuracy'...

 

Wait yes. It makes dispersion worse?? I can't hit at super long range anyway (and I shouldn't. People should move). Might remove it. I hate the long range anyway. 

[Poster_2015]

Once again in another topic. The modules that increase range, do nothing bad to accuracy. The dispersion increases, but its maximum dispersion at new max range. I dont remember the values so they are completely arbitrary (no game here atm), but for example

 

NC max range 20.0km , dispersion 250m

 

after upgrade range 22.0 km , dispersion 275m

 

The new dispersion means you are LESS accurate at 22km than you were at 20km before upgrade. At 20km range you will have same 250m disperion with or without module.

[vaskemaskina]

Can you confirm this poster_2015 ?

[Admiral_noodle]

Wouldn't that also depend on whether the dispersion algorithm is linear? I confess I don't know how the dispersion works in game. Also I'm less bothered by maximum dispersion, rather the distribution of dispersion probabilities, which is unknown to me.

[Namolis]

The information as I've understood it thus far:

 

Quoted dispersion is 60 + 0.01*distance for USN BBs (except Montana, which should have 296, but has 297, so it's probably (0.01+very small number)*length).

 

Now, as far as I understand, the quoted "max dispersion" is actually the lateral dispersion (left-right), and is a Gaussian function. The quoted number denotes either where you are likely to find 50% of shells, or the FWHM of that Gaussian. The longitudinal (lengthwise) dispersion varies from ship to ship as far as I can tell, but isn't displayed in game. Rumor will have it that the accuracy module only affects lateral dispersion, not longitudinal, but I don't know for sure.

[Poster_2015]

Ok nothing of this is confirmed by WG or anything like that. But:

 

1) Max dispersion is just linear function of maximum range. It has different coefficients for different nations and gun types (basically "big" - 305 and above, "medium" 200-210mm , "small" everything else). It doesnt matter how you achieve the range - be it different ship, different fire control from tech tree, or the extra module for range. 

 

2) This one is the least trustworthy, and its just based on my observations. Thats why I already regret mentioning Amagi dispersion - its far from "proven". However here it is, and take it with a grain of salt. It seems like the function to determine actual dispersion at medium-long range, is linear but not with respect to range, but to shell flight time. This means 1 common thing for all kinds of ships - that dispersion actually accelerates in growth as the distance gets higher. However in case of few ships with vastly different shell speeds (Amagi was used as an example - the HE shells have almost 50% more flight time at 24km (with spotting plane), Yorck would be the opposite - with HE shells being much faster), the maximum dispersion applies to the slower shell type, and as a result the faster one gets a lot lower dispersion then expected. 

 

3) The short range dispersion is modified by something. Its hard to give any formula (if there even is one - maybe its hand modeled for ships). But short range dispersion is obviously MUCH higher then it should be. I assume its for gameplay reasons - otherwise 2 cruisers meeting at 5km would just 1 shot each other. There is the base dispersion as Namolis said - 60m for US ships, but i feel there is more to that - as lower tier ships seem to have their minimum dispersion set a lot higher then high tier ones. 

[vaskemaskina]

I just bought the range upgrade, and it seems to be inaccurate as ever. This ship is hopeless. If the almost non-existent armor wasnt enough, its plagued by the negative world-record shell 'velocity'. 

[Maye35]

I just bought the range upgrade, and it seems to be inaccurate as ever. This ship is hopeless. If the almost non-existent armor wasnt enough, its plagued by the negative world-record shell 'velocity'. 

 

Really ? Non existent armor ? Really ? Accuracy is not good, we get it, but armor ? Really ?