Losing? the problem is no teamwork

[Lookyhere]

Fairly new to WoW, supported the game by buying premium, got an Atago and as my stats show, I suck big time

I am sure there are games available where I can help a TEAM, (definition for those that don't know what this word means: group of players that work TOGETHER) and the team can win and help me not to suck... BUT

I have found a real lack of team player mentality on this game - and I gotta say the game does not lend itself to team play. An example is on a number of occasions I have stayed with the AC to help fend off planes and only got shot down award for doing so. Didn't mind cos that what a TEAM member does.

 

I have also found you lot are very quick to criticise.

 

So - need a team that will help me play my Atago well, where we can work together to win some matches.

 

AND, WG - why not bolster up the functionality of the team so that teams can play a role and work together?

 

 

A month on ........

and I would like to offer suggestions and opinions..

 

But first - what would I say to some one new?

 

How to explain World of Warships to someone wanting to start.

 

Well, you are given a ship and put in a group. Low tier and limited everything as you are limited in your knowledge.

It is strongly suggested that you look at the on-line vids that show how you aim, fire and destroy (or try to destroy) other players ships.

 

When you get into the map you are going to play, DO NOT by ANY stretch of imagination, believe that you are in a team because you are not. You are playing by yourself and if you EVER get someone directing you more likely than not, they will be calling you an idiot for doing so.

Then there may be people on YOUR side that think you look like a good target and will either fire at you or spam torpedoes at you. (true story that)

You fire guns, spam torps, 20min of life gone.

 

Fun - No

Is this a group game?  - No

Is this a team game - No

Is it easy to create groups and fight together - No

Will I resub premium ???

 

NO

 

Disappointing

 

P.S. And for those that mistakenly say that purchasing a premium ship is wrong, take time to explain why - specifically from the pixel perspective. I can see that there is a difference if you don't know how group mechanics work, but as I have posted out in the post - THERE IS NO DISCERNIBLE TEAMWORK!

Thank you 

[Reyte]

Greetings, for every new captain.

 

But i ve to disappoint u in several different aspects. Dont take it personal or that i want to say you are stupid human, no but...

 

You should never ever buy yourself a tier 8 premium, not even a tier5 before u ve mastered the basics and also some of the more advanced features. U ve to face off in atago ships as yamato or midway aircraft carrier. Both of this ships will even other tier 8 cruiser more or less see u as an easy kill. Generally a atago is a quite difficult startership while u can ve quite some success in tier5 murmansk. And again ( dont take it personal) its well know between all those well expierenced cv player that most atago players generally suck. Not because atago is bad ship, because many people bought this ship without knowledge of the game. So i would recommend u to let ur atago in ur port for the moment. U will do urself no favor in continue to drive it for the moment.

 

 U should reuby some tier2 or tier 1 or tier3 ships and soloy drive coop. To become a better player u should generally ve an idea of the game mechanics. There is no way around. I can recommend "the mighty jingles" on youtube for some more basic guide and replays for the ships.

 

About the teams....

 

Generally i wouldnt trust ur teammates so much. Some will rescue u and help u even in worst situations while others just ignore every bit of reasoning and soley drive for their fun. If u dont have and idea of what to do ask ur teammates. Worst case is that they dont respond

[Kurbain]

There are no rewards for teamplay in this game, so don't expect your teammates to play as a team.
If your suggestions don't work, you could try leading by example. If I see my team play very passively, I sometimes decide to play aggressive and start tanking the enemies myself even in a cruiser, which usually pushes the enemies back and motivates your team to move up.

Either way, at the very least they tend to stick together and move to one side of the map as a bundle, especially on the higher tiers.

I recommend cruising along with some of them. It will greatly increase your chances of survival and thus increase the damage you can dish out.

Apart from this advice, I can only reiterate what Reyte has already said. As a new player, I highly recommend going back to T3 and learning the basics from the bottom up. On T8 every other player has played many more battles than you and you are probably going to be more of a hindrance to your team rather than a blessing since you're filling a spot than somebody could have taken that knows how to play, which you can see by your low Winrate.
I'm sure you can agree that being outclassed in every aspect by your enemy (Map awareness, aiming, dodging, armor angling) is not much fun.

I would start by watching the "Captain's Academy" videos by iChase, especially the ones about Angling and Citadels and applying those ideas on T3/T4.
https://www.youtube.com/user/ichasegaming/videos

His citadel video alone improved my average damage by at least 20% since I actually knew where to aim for after watching it. Even at T5 I was still thinking the superstructure was supposed to be the citadel. 



 

[OldGrandad]

Fairly new to WoW, supported the game by buying premium, got an Atago and as my stats show, I suck big time

 

Unfortunately your self diagnosis is spot on, currently you are playing poorly. We have discussed in the past on the forums as to why new players should not buy high tier premiums purely because you really do need good basic understanding and skill to play at those higher tiers.

 

Read through the beginners thread and take Kurbains advice above in watching as many tutorial videos as possible, and then practice what you have read and watched in Co-op first then when proficient get back into random. 

 

You have as yet not played battleships, you may well be better in those so research those and have a go with them. 

 

But please, do not sail the Atago again until you have attained the skill to match the tier. 

[Picard12]

Of course people will critisize you when you do your derpy first beginner games (we all had them, obviously) in a tier where people expect others to (or at least wish for them to) not suck badly. Especially Atago players have a notorious reputation. Think about it, when you start this game, would you rather derp against all the other people that are also just beginning, in Tier 1, and then build your tiers up as you build your skill up or would you rather jump immediately into a game where probably all other players have 600+ games behind them? Of course that's both gonna make them angry at you and make your stats suck. I recommend you to play up regularly until you reach the respective tiers of your premiums and only then really start playing them.

[Lookyhere]

Many thanks for your replies, good to see that the majority of you had constructive comments - and with the exception of being called a stupid human because I bought a higher tier ship, I appreciate your feedback. There was one glaring omission -  the subject matter. 

 

The subject was about teams - where are they, why is there not a team based structure in the game, Why the "team" is limited to max 3 players in game (on the default comms selection), but I see no team playing in this game.

 

Back to the other comments.

 

Thank you for your affirmation Ducat, that I suck at this tier, but it is the most fun and I will keep on playing it as I like it. Target me and kill me if you want as I believe in getting in the middle of it and mixing it up, so should be fairly easy, but I will not stop playing it! BTW Kurbain, I have watched the iChase videos on the captains academy. He has good information that act on.

 

I have given the game a month and if I do not see evidence of teaming, I will go elsewhere.

[robertsrevenge]

you can also go play coop against bot teams to get used to certain aspects like allways zig zag try to remember the reload times of ships you are against , even team up with players make friends is allways good idea . I just play coop only cant be asked with the  hussle and bussle of random .

you done the right thing by asking on the forums

[Ascender]

The idea of a preconstructed team will likely come with clans, clanwars and all that in the future™.

 

But please do realize that you will get a lot of hate because you don't just suck, you are terrifyingly bad with the Atago. And in playing that you are negatively influencing the enjoyment of others that get you on their team, THAT is why you get rude comments (which I will agree with). Especially because, how can you evaluate something you do not understand? You can't. This is why co-op and low tier ships exist, so you don't get thrown into tier 8 matches without understanding the game.

[OverPenokio]

Hi Lookyhere, 

I took the liberty to add you in game. So if you feel like you need help or someone for some teamplay you can contact me. 

 

Cheers, Gilles. 

[Drycon]

Many thanks for your replies, good to see that the majority of you had constructive comments - and with the exception of being called a stupid human because I bought a higher tier ship, I appreciate your feedback. There was one glaring omission -  the subject matter. 

 

The subject was about teams - where are they, why is there not a team based structure in the game, Why the "team" is limited to max 3 players in game (on the default comms selection), but I see no team playing in this game.

 

Back to the other comments.

 

Thank you for your affirmation Ducat, that I suck at this tier, but it is the most fun and I will keep on playing it as I like it. Target me and kill me if you want as I believe in getting in the middle of it and mixing it up, so should be fairly easy, but I will not stop playing it! BTW Kurbain, I have watched the iChase videos on the captains academy. He has good information that act on.

 

I have given the game a month and if I do not see evidence of teaming, I will go elsewhere.

 

If you have a problem with the teams as of now you will still have it in a month, it's simple as that.

Teams is a very lose description for what actually is "x amount of perfect strangers dropped in the same group", there are no "teams" in WoWs.

There are people cooperating with eachother and there are people playing to shoot with big guns.

In every game the mayority of the players will be of the latter attitude.

 

Having said that, the fact that people do not play as a team does not necessarily mean you can't win or can't have fun.

Keep an eye on the minimap and support your fleet where it's needed.

Help is always appreciated and by helping others you essentialy become the team "factor" for those ships.

That's how it works for me, I support others because I can't rely on others supporting me.

It's a cliche but it works: Don't think about what your team can do for you but what you can do for your team.

 

Now, since you have bought a T8 ship and are mostly fighting people who are actually competent at that tier (and that's not meant as an insult) you will be a burden to your team until you learn how to play.

So you will need some skin to get through the first month because it will be rough (and you will be called out by the most friendly of 'em).

And I'm a stranger in this age of streamviewers and tutorial watchers I guess, I'd recommend you to start playing at the lowest tiers and not watch video's until you reach a point where you think...is there more to learn?

[Lookyhere]

Now, since you have bought a T8 ship and are mostly fighting people who are actually competent at that tier (and that's not meant as an insult) you will be a burden to your team until you learn how to play.

So you will need some skin to get through the first month because it will be rough (and you will be called out by the most friendly of 'em).

And I'm a stranger in this age of streamviewers and tutorial watchers I guess, I'd recommend you to start playing at the lowest tiers and not watch video's until you reach a point where you think...is there more to learn?

 

Thanks for replying Drycon... but you need to answer one small question...

 

WHAT TEAM?? - how can I be a burden to a team if I have NEVER seen any teamwork.? Yes, a team is described as you have, but if it is a number of people in gamechat, swearing and abusing people (not me btw) for being cowards and dickheads is your version of a team - I want nothing of that.

 

And Gilles - look forward to playing with you.

[xxNihilanxx]

OP, a quick question. Do you use the chat to organise teamwork? You have identified a problem with the game but seem, and I do not mean to be rude here, to be waiting for others to implement the solution.

 

I have found, in this game far more than most, that if I or another team-mate initiate a conversation at the start of the match discussing where we intend to go and what we intend to do that others in the match join in very quickly and on many occasions there has been constant tactical communication all match. If everyone just stays silent (or spams the chat commands) then people tend to drift all over the map with little to no coordination.

 

Seriously, this is not a dig at you but rather a genuine suggestion.

 

Also, NEVER show your broadside in the Atago. They are SO easy to kill. You want to keep you bow/stern (preferably bow) towards the enemy and turn only enough to fire your guns when they are fully loaded before returning to the safer orientation. If you see another cruiser broadside to you hit him with AP (aim at the water-line amidships*) and watch his health vanish. Even just your front guns against a broadside cruiser can be devastating.

 

The Atago is a great ship. Find some youtube videos (I like Notser, iChase & Business6) to watch and you will pick it up in no time.

 

*As a general rule of thumb

[Gunship14]

 

Thanks for replying Drycon... but you need to answer one small question...

 

WHAT TEAM?? - how can I be a burden to a team if I have NEVER seen any teamwork.? Yes, a team is described as you have, but if it is a number of people in gamechat, swearing and abusing people (not me btw) for being cowards and dickheads is your version of a team - I want nothing of that.

 

And Gilles - look forward to playing with you.

If you want nothing with that, then stop playing online games perhaps? Really, did you come here expecting to see ESL-level cooperation or something? This is still an online game, a free one at that (even worse imo), where people like you with good intentions are put in with people who just got off work, had a bad day and looking to let off some steam. I'm not supporting the griefers, but I don't see how you wouldn't know this, unless this is your very first online game.

 

Also, it is entirely possible to win without cooperating. Chances are, the enemy team isn't cooperating either, so the winner is the team with the better (on average) players. You bring that average down, and your team's chances of winning. Your shot-down planes while sitting in the back can never compete with the enemy Atago that got 60k damage, planes shot down, caused fires, spotted and killed destroyers that would kill his side's Battleship. 

 

Point is, you won't magically get better and stop being a "burden" (don't like that word, honestly) if there is a team that cooperates. They'll want you to do things that your skill isn't capable of yet, in order to cooperate with them and eventually win. 

[katie111]

There are no rewards for teamplay in this game, so don't expect your teammates to play as a team.

 

There is, it's called a WIN. 

 

This mentality has always troubled me, ever played in a Division? You'll find that is much more satisfying as you are looking out for your other two team mates as well as yourself and usually works pretty well. Usually, the only thing that will kill a group of three ships together is another group of three or more, however, usually, you'll take on just one or two at a time.

 

Most of the time though, you're bundled with 11 other strangers and sometimes it works, most of the time it doesnt. At the start, try to get a concensus as to a general direction. The usual "hi guys, A or C?" usually concentrates most of the ships to one rough objective. 

 

As for your plan to protect the carrier, very good and nice to see BUT only when appropriate. Most of the other team will only see this as loosing some guns from the fight and that's why you got some stick for it. If a large group of planes are seen heading for the CV or indeed, a DD or two, then yes, turn and defend. However, if the CV has decided to stay well away from the main group then he can't expect a cruiser to spend the entire game sat with him, earning no points either. 

[Drycon]

 

Thanks for replying Drycon... but you need to answer one small question...

 

WHAT TEAM?? - how can I be a burden to a team if I have NEVER seen any teamwork.? Yes, a team is described as you have, but if it is a number of people in gamechat, swearing and abusing people (not me btw) for being cowards and dickheads is your version of a team - I want nothing of that.

 

And Gilles - look forward to playing with you.

 

As already stated the word team is a very losely used term on the bunch of primates you sometimes get.

However, in no battle at all are 20+ bigmouth crybabies, I guarantuee you that at least half to three quarters of your team is actively trying to win, just like you.

 

It's entirely up to you, and this counts for every competitive game, to sort out who is who.

You can depend on nothing but your own judgment in a team (again that word) of strangers.

That's part of the experience when you level up.

 

I've seen people in that two brothers map (i think it's called), calling for the north group to come south, our cap zone was north.

That's your typical shout before you think player and it's up to you to recognize those. (and correct them before people start listening!)

 

You also have to recognize that you are a new player in a T8 battle with other players who have played maybe 700-1000 battles.

For them it is not battle 12 with more dumbasses but battle #250 and at that tier you may at least expect from everyone that they know there roles and can shoot a moving target.

It's easy to get frustrated if your backup is a clueless newb in a T8 cruiser you know, thats no backup but a burden. 

 

 

[Phroco]

It's easy to get frustrated if your backup is a clueless newb in a T8 cruiser you know, thats no backup but a burden. 

 

 

 

My Myoko got torped from behind by a friendly in an Atago a few days ago. When I (slightly) cussed him out he just "sorry, it's my first day". And he was playing in a T8 and trying to torp a DD that was about 12km away!

 

[Admiral_noodle]

If you want team work you have to employ some psychology and also the chat channel. Sometimes it even works.

 

I've had games where I've convinced some players around me to form an ad hoc division. And we've got good results.

 

"Stick together and capture A". And the two cruisers and the DD nearest me, and A, answered yes (well two did the other just followed). From that moment I realised I had an ad hoc division, so I led it. We pushed on A and straight through (on fault line). So then I made up the next move - "Omaha (last cruiser) protect our rear. Rest of us towards B. And they started communicating back. It was brilliant.

 

Sometimes you get games where someone will lead and others are willing to follow. Other times... Well no. But if you can spot when you have a potential team that just needs a leader to get them working together it's great.

 

Sometimes you get players who just stick to you. You might not even need chat. It's good when that happens too. There are team players out there you just need to spot who.

[Kenliero]

it's all about brainwashing your allies to do your bidding

 

Don't tell them what to do, make them do what you want

[triumphgt6]

I confess that I do see the point of making sure premium ships can only be bought when you have a ship of a similar tier already. I doubt it would ever happen but I hate to think what I would have been like in a tier 8 in my first game, especially one with torpedoes!

[Drycon]

Sometimes you get players who just stick to you. You might not even need chat. It's good when that happens too. There are team players out there you just need to spot who.

 

Yep, drive a BB, I swear someone covered the stern of my New Mexico in maplesyrup...

 

[TheCinC]

Op, I have to commend you for your spirit, in wanting to help out your team in whichever way you can.

There is no 'I' in team, as they say.

 

I also have to say, you probably need to learn the hard way, at least the basics of the game.

Not just the game mechanics, but also some basic tactics, the maps and the strengths and weaknesses of not just your own ship, but those of the other players.

For example, I often find myself glancing at my ship's stats just before I enter a game.

What is my detection range? What is my torpedo range? Those are useful things to know in any game.

Many new players just jump in and see what happens, with predictable results.

This game can be very unforgiving, experienced players will take full advantage of any mistake and some ships are just very, very powerful.

As a result, people are wary of newbie players in high tier vessels, as those will often do things that will set their team back.

Far too often you see someone in an Atago or Tirpitz heading straight for the enemy and succumbing to a torpedo attack or just getting shot at by 3 or more enemy ships and not lasting longer than the first few minutes.

You are smart enough to realise that and try to support the CV, which is too often neglected with unfortunate results, so more points for you.

 

People are quick to criticise, I myself do try to give constructive criticism or tips, such as warning players in lower tier battles not to fire torps from behind as that is a pain in the lower backside.

As for team play, unfortunately, as with any online game, that leaves a lot to be desired, although some times you may be happily surprised, at other times, your worst nightmares may come true.

Quite often, I don't even receive a reply when I ask a team which way they want to go, so everyone does their thing and sometimes it works out, but more often it doesn't and we fail big time.

As you said, it doesn't help that the game modes don't really invite team play, often people are focused on getting 'their' kill, sometimes even at the expense of others.

 

Anyway, I am not a great player by any means and still make plenty of mistakes, but I like your attitude, so feel free to add me in game (same nick as here) and ask me to div up with you, if just to encourage you to keep thinking like that.

I do have plenty of ships, at least all Japanese DDs now, so I'll always have something to work with, but I'm not making any promises on being successful or skilled, I just play quite a bit.

 

[Semillon]

Fairly new to WoW, supported the game by buying premium, got an Atago and as my stats show, I suck big time

I am sure there are games available where I can help a TEAM, (definition for those that don't know what this word means: group of players that work TOGETHER) and the team can win and help me not to suck... BUT

I have found a real lack of team player mentality on this game - and I gotta say the game does not lend itself to team play. An example is on a number of occasions I have stayed with the AC to help fend off planes and only got shot down award for doing so. Didn't mind cos that what a TEAM member does.

 

I have also found you lot are very quick to criticise.

 

So - need a team that will help me play my Atago well, where we can work together to win some matches.

 

AND, WG - why not bolster up the functionality of the team so that teams can play a role and work together?

 

In 'World of ' series games: do not expect 'team play'; there are too many kiddies playing and selfish players that do not want to understand the game / strategies - just 'bang, bang, wheeeeeee' mentalities.

 

And, before everyone jumps on my back - strategy IS a key part of playing ANY game 'properly', and the only way to ensure this is by having some kind of organised team formations AND the above comment DOES NOT apply to ALL players (just most).

 

I just hope that 'clans' will be added asap.

 

Sem ;-)

[Admiral_noodle]

...and team mode! I want team mode! Imagine being able to join a channel or create one with forum members (assuming chat is fixed) - and then picking a team to go fight each other! I want this!

[Kenliero]

...and team mode! I want team mode! Imagine being able to join a channel or create one with forum members (assuming chat is fixed) - and then picking a team to go fight each other! I want this!

 

Yeah. That would be very good idea. I am currently member in Wot clan, where I (used to played some clanwars)never play... but if they make team mode for this thing, I am going to find a clan to play warships in a team. I can only imagine how much fun that can be

[mtm78]

What is the problem in a team?

 

Simple, it's the ratio of normal to decent to good players. The amount of mouth breathing monkeys playing at the moment is astonishing. Especially if you're in a team dependant ship like a BB, and you have monkeys in DD's who don't spot, and 'bad players' in CA's who ignore enemy DD's. If you're in a DD you can play 'for fun' and not bother anyone, you can do the same in a cruiser, but in a BB you need your team to not be mongoloids. And sadly, the ratio of 'bad players' is atm killing most fun. 

 

edit: censored