Nuernburg is a joke. Heck everything in the German tree suffers. Everything.

[ApesTogetherStronK]

Pros: 

- Good accuracy

- Good Range

- Good Damage after penetration 

- Excellent against destroyers

 

Cons: 

- Terrible number of penetrations

- 50mm of armour at Tier 6 

- Less health than all of it's contemporary opponents except DD's

- Can meet Tier 8's, often. 

- Awful tuning circle for a CL 

- Huge Citadel

- Everyone knows it's a joke so you get targeted more than normal

- Torpedoes are shorter ranged than everyone else's except Russian DD's, even then they can be outranged sometimes. 

- Not good at Range, if you close you die. 

- AA seems lacking, but not terrible at least. 

 

Sums it up. Rant over. 

In short you'll do fine if not shot at, but everyone knows how awful your defense is at the tiers you must play at, so you get noticed and shot at. 

Something needs to be done about German cruisers  ASAP, or we'll be left with an entire tree that nobody wants to play. Two decent ships before Tier 6 (Dresden and Koenigsberg, who have their own problems too) will not be enough to keep most people playing until higher tiers. 

[VonNorwegen]

 Koningsberg is good and Nurnberg is ok. Atleast compared to the Yorck which is absolute crap. And the Hipper is much worse off then tier 5 and 6 due to low dodging ability and a MM dominated by high tier BB's and Carriers. So my point is dont play this line anymore if you dont like Nurnberg. Its just be alot of grievences

[VonPletz]

I 100% agree that some heavy buffing needs to be done on the ENTIRE line but the Hermelin and Dresden are actually pretty fun to play.  The Konigsberg/Nuernberg are ok..but their turn radius and horrid engine/steering damage is ridiculous.  But you can get some good game out of them on Tier 5/6.

 

The rest...rubbish...however, I have not played the Hindenburg and I am working my way up to that one. 

 

[OldGrandad]

The Nurnberg, after some great experiences in the Konigsburg has felt to me as a very poor upgrade. Whereupon with the Konigsberg I was getting multiple citadels (16 max) in battles I am struggling so much with the Nurnberg. Although only 4 battles in with just the 1 victory, I feel that I cannot do a great deal in battle  in comparison with its lower tier sibling. As it is, I am leaving the Germans alone now as I feel they just have to have some sort of help in the way of buffs. I just hope so.....

[Gatt]

Pros: 

- Good accuracy

- Good Range

- Good Damage after penetration 

- Excellent against destroyers

 

Cons: 

- Terrible number of penetrations

- 50mm of armour at Tier 6 

- Less health than all of it's contemporary opponents except DD's

- Can meet Tier 8's, often. 

- Awful tuning circle for a CL 

- Huge Citadel

- Everyone knows it's a joke so you get targeted more than normal

- Torpedoes are shorter ranged than everyone else's except Russian DD's, even then they can be outranged sometimes. 

- Not good at Range, if you close you die. 

- AA seems lacking, but not terrible at least. 

 

 

^ This is becoming quickly a problem. And not becouse german ships are new but becouse a couple of 155 HE shots can disable the engine, the rudder and shut down one or two turrets.

 

Everyone and their mother shoot again german cruisers as soon as they get in range. I've never seen so many ships running away from fights as german ships.

 

Coming from the Tirpitz, it is a shame. The Tirpitz could be a wallet-warrior ship but at least when you get close to enemy Tier VII-VIII battleships you can see the effect. Yesterday, in the end of the game, I went straight to cap an enemy flag defended by 3 North Carolinas (one at 75%, two low on HP). The first I sunk with the Tirpitz excellent guns/shells, one I torpedo-ed and another one I rammed.

 

Anyway, I sold my Konig and my Hipper is in the port till WG will fix something.

[eLampo]

Good lord, reading this, I will just stop playing the German cruisers for now. I'm at the Karlsruhe right now and am hating every second of playing it. If the higher tiers don't get any better I will not waste my time with this steaming pile of crapany longer. I don't understand what they where thinking while designing the German line...

 

[RapscallionDK]

My review so far of german cruisers:

 

Karlsruhe: Made me psyhically sick to play it. Mustered a few games before i free xp past it.

 

Koenigsberg: In my opinion every should start here for the german tree, good ship, good range, good gun dmg from AP vs other cruisers, engine gets shot out very easy though.

 

Nurnberg: Engine problem still an issue, i dunno what WG has put on them for armor but i never had this problem in US cruisers. Also it has 8000(!) less hp than its US counter, guns are still good though and better range than cleveland.

 

Yorck: Only had a few games but yes obviously the Yorcks problem is gun travese. With upgrades and skills its down to 38 seconds but its still so slow you have to plan your moves like you were in a BBs. At least the engine problems seems to be gone. Hp is also still lowest of the cruiser group again, but at least the guns now get a 17.3km range meaning you can stay a bit further back and not be the focus.

 

Only reason im continueing to play the germans is that ive heard everyone say the Admiral Hipper is good.

 

 

 

[Gojuadorai]

Good lord, reading this, I will just stop playing the German cruisers for now. I'm at the Karlsruhe right now and am hating every second of playing it. If the higher tiers don't get any better I will not waste my time with this steaming pile of crapany longer. I don't understand what they where thinking while designing the German line...

 

 the high tiers get better than the karlsruhe   esp 5/6 but not enough.

i would sugest  fight through the karlsruhe (maybe even in coop) enjoy the königsberg and if youre through before thy buff the rest just wait till they do

[kamuka]

 

Karlsruhe: Made me psyhically sick to play it. Mustered a few games before i free xp past it.

 

Working as intended.

[DBaron]

My observation so far is:

 

T1-T4 : meh ...

T5: Königsberg does suffer from lack of armor and a "throw away" engine and steering, but it is a nice ship with high rof and great AP damage (which is situational if you dont see enemy broadsides)

T6: More a sidegrade than an upgrade, basically the same ship with higher MM, but still enjoyable if you dont get taken out early.

T7: OMG ... the pain ... the horror .. the suffering ... worse than T1-T4 combined.

T8: Hipper is a decent ship, I find it on par with its piers on T8, not the easiest ship to play but you can have good games in it.

T9: Unlocked the Roon yesterday, somehow dreading to take her out yet

[Gatt]

Only reason im continueing to play the germans is that ive heard everyone say the Admiral Hipper is good.

 

 

Hipper's gun and shells seem OK. She seems a mini Tirpitz as far as gunnery is concerned. She is always an 80mm armored cruiser so, compared to 100-140mm armored cruisers, she will always be weaker. Maybe the real Hipper-class had a sloping armor, I dont know. She is always classified as a heavy cruiser but with such a light armor ....  Anyway, I have only a few games with her but she seems (I repeat: seems) less glass-ish than other Tier V-VII german cruisers.

[ApesTogetherStronK]

Ducat1st0, on 30 October 2015 - 06:50 AM, said:

The Nurnberg, after some great experiences in the Konigsburg has felt to me as a very poor upgrade. Whereupon with the Konigsberg I was getting multiple citadels (16 max) in battles I am struggling so much with the Nurnberg. Although only 4 battles in with just the 1 victory, I feel that I cannot do a great deal in battle  in comparison with its lower tier sibling. As it is, I am leaving the Germans alone now as I feel they just have to have some sort of help in the way of buffs. I just hope so.....

 

Funnily enough I have similar use out of it, in 4 games, all 4 kills were in my first and only decent game (because I wasn't shot at and was matched against mostly tier IV's and V's.) Every other game I was citadeled multiple times before I was even in range, and the turning circle wasn't enough for me to avoid BB shells at 18+km. Always took a couple hits each time; and the citadel being so huge, it got hit. 
 

Gatt, on 30 October 2015 - 01:18 PM, said:

 

Hipper's gun and shells seem OK. She seems a mini Tirpitz as far as gunnery is concerned. She is always an 80mm armored cruiser so, compared to 100-140mm armored cruisers, she will always be weaker. Maybe the real Hipper-class had a sloping armor, I dont know. She is always classified as a heavy cruiser but with such a light armor ....  Anyway, I have only a few games with her but she seems (I repeat: seems) less glass-ish than other Tier V-VII german cruisers.

 

The German armour system contained air pockets as well as slopes, non-air pockets filled with various substances and other additional protections. It worked in a very similar way to a modern assault vest, it was designed so that a shell's kinetic energy was dissipated across as much space as possible to minimise damage. It should be as effective an armour scheme as the other Tier VIII's due to these bonuses, but unfortunately all WG is using is the thickness, not the additional benefits, so they suffer tremendously at all tiers in game. 

 

(Oh bugger double post, sorry about that.) 

 

[Gojuadorai]

 

The German armour system contained air pockets as well as slopes, non-air pockets filled with various substances and other additional protections. It worked in a very similar way to a modern assault vest, it was designed so that a shell's kinetic energy was dissipated across as much space as possible to minimise damage. It should be as effective an armour scheme as the other Tier VIII's due to these bonuses, but unfortunately all WG is using is the thickness, not the additional benefits, so they suffer tremendously at all tiers in game. 

 

(Oh bugger double post, sorry about that.) 

 

thats the bane of good engineering good construction is often not obvious to the ones that havnt designed it

(sometimes like code in programming ^^)

[Psusennes]

I agree, Nurnberg is a joke.

 

[pl_markov]

Ha ha never seen more favorable MM

[ApesTogetherStronK]

I agree, Nurnberg is a joke.

 

 

Do that in a game with Tier 8's and I'll take that sarcasm more seriously. Any higher or equal tier ship can do that well in that situation.

[Gatt]

Tried the Roon and the Hindemburg in the test server. I'd say that the with the Hipper, they are the only german CA which can compete with equal/higher Tier CA and DD.

 

About the Konig, or the Nurn or the York: everytime I found one with my Murmansk/Cleveland his ruined/flaming running arse is all I can see. If these has to fight against Tier V-VIII ships are first bullet magnets or dead meat in a few minutes.

 

All these after action reports we see posted are about lucky battles or battles against retarded and/or lower Tiers.

 

German CAs up to Tier VII are IMO weak, or even a joke, they need a tweak

 

P.S.: just back from a game. A Konig was chasing our CV with about 75% of his HP. I got him with two 150mm HE salvos: the first one detonated him and second one citadel-ed him. Dead.

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

Yesterday I was driving Nurnberg. I angled myself and fought against Aoba, Cleveland, 2 Nurnbergs and Fuso. I forced Aoba and Nurnbergs to retreat, one of the Nurnbergs on half HP. Fuso gave up after 4th missed salvo. Cleveland was still pushing. I also spotted Fujin, but dispatched him fast - german sonar is OP. Unfortunately, I had to dodge some torps, and in the process got 2 full AP salvos from Cleve into my broadside, which left me on around 1/4 HP. However, I retreated, and fought this Cleve on around 9 - 10 km. And won. He was full hp, angled, and I still won. I watched with glee when he sunk and his last salvo finished me off. 

 

And I was alone on whole flank. 

 

Now, granted, my opponent's weren't the best skippers around, sure. But one ship was able to stop 4 CA and 1 BB and 1 DD from pushing into base for the duration of almost whole game. Nurnberg reminds me Des Moines - very good dmg output, reasonable mobility, but very very fragile. Calling him a total joke is just insulting. Learn how to play it, angle yourself, wiggle with this german butt, launch torps into chasing enemies, shoot mostly AP, use HE only on very well angled opponents. Play to your strenghts. And quit the whining.

[Andreevson]

Yesterday I was driving Nurnberg. I angled myself and fought against Aoba, Cleveland, 2 Nurnbergs and Fuso. I forced Aoba and Nurnbergs to retreat, one of the Nurnbergs on half HP. Fuso gave up after 4th missed salvo. Cleveland was still pushing. I also spotted Fujin, but dispatched him fast - german sonar is OP. Unfortunately, I had to dodge some torps, and in the process got 2 full AP salvos from Cleve into my broadside, which left me on around 1/4 HP. However, I retreated, and fought this Cleve on around 9 - 10 km. And won. He was full hp, angled, and I still won. I watched with glee when he sunk and his last salvo finished me off. 

 

And I was alone on whole flank. 

 

Now, granted, my opponent's weren't the best skippers around, sure. But one ship was able to stop 4 CA and 1 BB and 1 DD from pushing into base for the duration of almost whole game. Nurnberg reminds me Des Moines - very good dmg output, reasonable mobility, but very very fragile. Calling him a total joke is just insulting. Learn how to play it, angle yourself, wiggle with this german butt, launch torps into chasing enemies, shoot mostly AP, use HE only on very well angled opponents. Play to your strenghts. And quit the whining.

 

Tried that once. Fuso killed me in a single salvo from 14km... I was not showing a full broadside and i was decently angled, 3 shots connected.

 

Next battle got detonated by a DD firing HE at me at the start of the battle.

 

Individual experience means nothing.

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

It was just an example. I usually don't remember my battles unless I stream my games. However, this particular was a funny one, cause I remember how Clevelands are so deadly and absolutely murder Nurnbergs - they tend to just explode when entering Cleveland shooting range. 

[Psusennes]

Reaper_JackGBR, on 02 November 2015 - 03:16 AM, said:

 

Do that in a game with Tier 8's and I'll take that sarcasm more seriously. Any higher or equal tier ship can do that well in that situation.

 

I've done. Just yesterday and I have taken out a Hipper and a Nagato in my Nürnberg.
 

The thing presents like this.

 

I got Nürnberg, Hipper left in the Port. Why? Because they can perform well. I have been able to take out a lot of higher tier ships, Hindenburg most prominently yesterday with my Admiral Hipper. I agree, if all are shooting at you, you are not sitting in Tirpitz, you will get killed.

 

Why I did not keep Yorck. -> The guns turn so slow, they way u got to play the CA does not fit with their turret turn rate. And Yorck did historically never exist.

 

Hipper and  Nürnberg Turrets turn quite quick.

 

Nürnberg is a great DD killer. extremly fast firing rate and you can switch in 3 sec from HE to AP and back. If I encounter a Tirpitz, first thing to do. Set it on fire with HE. Then take AP and keep moving yourself. Have an eye on his guns, if they aim at you, you'll be dead. Don't go close. My Tirpitz secondaries fire at 7Km range with my Capt Skill and Flags. You got to mind this. Your torps will not be in range. Nagato is cool to kill close up at 5Km behind the islands, if available and let it drive directly into your torps. And one golden rule with Nürnberg. Don't engage a Atlanta or a Cleveland alone. The second golden rule. Don't engage BB if these are not engaged with others. You will attract all fire on you. Avoid this. Wait for a Nagato to engage the others of your group, then start bombarding him. As already said, change from time to time from AP to HE and backwards. Ship on fire means for some ppl to hit R button, then for the second time they are on fire there is two minutes of waiting to have R again. They will litteraly burn down. With AP you help to make it happen faster ;-)

 

I got 21 battles with Nürnberg now and i get good performance. Still, not all battles will be a winner. Thats not cruiser dependant, btw.

 

Like Iowa/North Carolina vs my Tirpitz. They loose 9 out of 10 times.

 

One last thing on skills. Skill your captain of your Nürnberg/Hipper on Tirpitz. You need some skill point which are essential. Why on Tipitz. Easy. You get every much roughly 5k EP. From zero to 12 Skillpoints goes in 3 Days. It cost you nothing to transfer to Tirpitz. It will cost you 500 Gold to bring him back to Nürnberg/Hipper. But with 12 skill point worthwhile.

 

 

 

 

 

[pl_markov]

Agree with most of pros of Nurmberg except maybe damage output. For me seems much worse than Konigsberg on which yesterday I won solo battle with Pensacola. I wouldn't dare on Nurnberg. Also seems more fragile than Koenig (or maybe because much stronger opponents).

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

I think it's opponents - you meet tier VIII BB's - that's where the CA's begin falloff in terms of dmg, survivability, usefullness. On tier V you are rarely placed in tier VII MM.

[pl_markov]

I think it's opponents - you meet tier VIII BB's - that's where the CA's begin falloff in terms of dmg, survivability, usefullness. On tier V you are rarely placed in tier VII MM.

That could be.  I'm not experienced with high tiers also not asking for BB  nerf  or CA  buff but maybe it would be a good option to limit number of B&B's per team as it is for CV's. When I play with X tiers is sometimes 1 DD and 1 CA per team. That's not fun. 

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

Well, higher tiers are not that bad - usually it's 5 BB's 3 - 4 CA and 1 - 3 DD, with some occasional CV flavour. It's more about the power spike of BB's on tier VIII. On tier VII the worst you can encounter is Nagato. On tier VIII both NC and Amagi and especially Tirpitz will make your life real hard.