Why bring kriegmarine?

[Kanjejou]

since they got no good boat(historicly speaking)  and french or british boat would have made more sense...?

 

simply put german ship were badly designed (slow unarmored and bad rudder conception) ship not because of illwill but becasue of ressource scarcity they couldn't make good boat because boat are a ressource sink , reason why they failled on sea (add a bit of number disavantage  and kriegsmarine simply is useless.

[Getzamatic]

Well, in WWI the Germans had the second largest navy in the world which included a great many fine warships.  There's more to WoWs than WWII you know...

[HariSeldon]

French? Really? Are you saying french navy would be more sense? A navy that mostly stayed in ports as static ships?

 

And i'm not saying french navy was bad, it had ships i like to see in combat in game, because armored turrets and 8 guns front is an interesting thing, but their relevance in war was null. Italy have more sense if we are not going to be biased.

 

And germany have one of the most modern fleets of their time in wwii because...you know, they have to do it from nothing. 4 battleships, 3 light cruisers raiders, several cruisers....all of modern, albeit maybe wrong, desings. But it makes sense, and more in a game where they will be not wipped always from the air, because air sup here is a joke compared to real life, were no BB did a real impact in the war....where CV was the force that matters.

 

So please, be grateful to see the KM ships, as they could be arcade tested in battles they never archieved because of the war doctrine.

[Gatt]

No good boats  ? Another troll ?

[lordofhavoc]

German Forum 800.000 posts

French forum 135.000 posts

Story told and I rest my case.

[Cosseria]

 

Troll

 

Please don't waste time answering to that BS.

 

[VonPletz]

simply put german ship were badly designed (slow unarmored and bad rudder conception) ship not because of illwill but becasue of ressource scarcity they couldn't make good boat because boat are a ressource sink , reason why they failled on sea (add a bit of number disavantage  and kriegsmarine simply is useless.

 

Go ask the sailors on HMS Hood.  I think they would disagree with you about the capabilities of the German Kriegsmarine.

Or better yet...google SMS Emden.  Again, the British would disagree with your post.

[Kanjejou]

the Hood you mean this unfinished boat that was ill equiped and send to its death to slow down a boat that will get killed by planes later on.?

 

most british ship sunk were or old or badly used or willingfully sacrified. all the "real" british boat weren't sunk.

[VonPletz]

the Hood you mean this unfinished boat that was ill equiped and send to its death to slow down a boat that will get killed by planes later on.?

 

most british ship sunk were or old or badly used or willingfully sacrified. all the "real" british boat weren't sunk.

 

So you want to discount HMS Hood...how about HMS Prince of Wales that was right with Hood and took heavy damage from Bismark and ran for its life.  I bet those sailors would also disagree about the capabilities of the Kriegsmarine.

 

Or maybe even Winston Churchill who stated " German Fleet presents an immediate danger to the British people, Nazi ships operating in the North Atlantic must be destroyed at all costs."  St. Petersburg Times March 1941. 

 

I don't think Winston Churchill would be sending old out dated ships to and carriers to the North Atlantic if they did not pose a serious threat.

 

 

[rigawe]

German Forum 800.000 posts

French forum 135.000 posts

Story told and I rest my case.

 

Because you have to be a french speaker  to use french ship?

Damn I knew I should have checked the people using french tanks ability to speak french in wot....

[Gatt]

 

So you want to discount HMS Hood...how about HMS Prince of Wales that was right with Hood and took heavy damage from Bismark and ran for its life.  I bet those sailors would also disagree about the capabilities of the Kriegsmarine.

 

Or maybe even Winston Churchill who stated " German Fleet presents an immediate danger to the British people, Nazi ships operating in the North Atlantic must be destroyed at all costs."  St. Petersburg Times March 1941. 

 

I don't think Winston Churchill would be sending old out dated ships to and carriers to the North Atlantic if they did not pose a serious threat.

 

 

 

Churchill words have to be taken with a grain of salt. He even announced operation Pedestal as a british success ... go figure.

 

About his words on german navy: he had every interest in embroiling the US in the war as soon as possible. Anyway, the sooner we will see the RN in the game the better.

 

This is valid for french and italian navies as well. Then, this game will be much more interesting and rich.

 

[Historynerd]

Churchill words have to be taken with a grain of salt. He even announced operation Pedestal as a british success ... go figure.

 

Technically it was; at a huge cost, but a success nonetheless. 

[lordofhavoc]

 

Because you have to be a french speaker  to use french ship?

Damn I knew I should have checked the people using french tanks ability to speak french in wot....

 

Yes and you know why? There are not too many fans of the French.... Outside of France, I mean.

 

And do you also know the old saying? "Could be worse, he could be French"

[Gojuadorai]

And do you also know the old saying? "Colud be worse, he could be French"

 

oh thats not only for cars but for ships too?

[rigawe]

 

Yes and you know why? There are not too many fans of the French.... Outside of France, I mean.

 

And do you also know the old saying? "Could be worse, he could be French"

 

Ok then let's find out how many non french speaker players are using amx 13 90, batchat, amx 50-100...

[piritskenyer]

German Forum 800.000 posts

French forum 135.000 posts

Story told and I rest my case.

 

That's a crapargument regarding how good the ships were, you know.

If the number of people was to determine wether something is good or bad, then idiocy would be considered good and intelligence bad... oh wait...

 

the Hood you mean this unfinished boat that was ill equiped and send to its death to slow down a boat that will get killed by planes later on.?

 

most british ship sunk were or old or badly used or willingfully sacrified. all the "real" british boat weren't sunk.

 

I don't even...

 

1. The Hood was a Battlecruiser (to be refitted as a fast BB) and not a boat
2. "Sent to its death" - u wut m8? In war everyone is potentially sent to their death, and noone would have imagined Hood would take the first hit to the bloody magazine...
3. "boat killed by planes" - again: u wut m8? The Bismark was sent to the bottom by the combined firepower of HMS King George V (BL 14" x10), HMS Rodney (BL 16" x9, 24,5" trop x2), HMS Norfolk and Dorsetshire (BL 8" x8 each). Bismark was shot up to the point where none of her guns were left functioning and she was basically a floating, burning wreck with engines. She was scuttled by her own crew when they suspected the brits may try to salvage the hull (which at that point was in pretty good shape considering).

 

Oh and that other thing?

• HMS Barham
• HMS Ark Royal
• HMS Prince of Wales
• HMS Repulse
• and the list goes on and on and on.

We're talking about a war here, where casualties must occur and ships (being the most complex and expensive machines of war) are rarely thrown into the fire for no good reason (notable exception: HMS Campbeltown).

 

I would like you to shut your trap about things you don't know anything.

[warsinger2]

Feeding trolls is bad mkay.

[GrumpyWorm]

Calm down & get back on track please

[mirage77]

 

That's a crapargument regarding how good the ships were, you know.

If the number of people was to determine wether something is good or bad, then idiocy would be considered good and intelligence bad... oh wait...

 

 

I don't even...

 

1. The Hood was a Battlecruiser (to be refitted as a fast BB) and not a boat
2. "Sent to its death" - u wut m8? In war everyone is potentially sent to their death, and noone would have imagined Hood would take the first hit to the bloody magazine...
3. "boat killed by planes" - again: u wut m8? The Bismark was sent to the bottom by the combined firepower of HMS King George V (BL 14" x10), HMS Rodney (BL 16" x9, 24,5" trop x2), HMS Norfolk and Dorsetshire (BL 8" x8 each). Bismark was shot up to the point where none of her guns were left functioning and she was basically a floating, burning wreck with engines. She was scuttled by her own crew when they suspected the brits may try to salvage the hull (which at that point was in pretty good shape considering).

 

Oh and that other thing?

• HMS Barham
• HMS Ark Royal
• HMS Prince of Wales
• HMS Repulse
• and the list goes on and on and on.

We're talking about a war here, where casualties must occur and ships (being the most complex and expensive machines of war) are rarely thrown into the fire for no good reason (notable exception: HMS Campbeltown).

 

I would like you to shut your trap about things you don't know anything.

 

I agree almost 100% with you. The problem is HMS Pince of Wales and HMS Repulse. Sending those 2 ships without aerial cover a few months after Pearl Harbor is exactly like the last attack of the Yamato : KAMIKAZE. A waste of brave sailors lifes.

[Synth_FG]

 

I agree almost 100% with you. The problem is HMS Pince of Wales and HMS Repulse. Sending those 2 ships without aerial cover a few months after Pearl Harbor is exactly like the last attack of the Yamato : KAMIKAZE. A waste of brave sailors lifes.

Repulse and PoW were sunk a 2 days, not months after Pearl Harbour

The decision to send them was taken months before PH as a deterrent to the Japanese and the original plan included an modern CV as part of the fleet, however losses in the med and damage to Formidable nixed this

PoW and Repulse also came close to intercepting a Japanese troop convoy.

The error was in not co-ordinating with the RAF based in Singapore and not screaming for air cover when they knew they were sighted 

However given at the time they were sunk no Capital Ship at sea had been sunk by enemy air power alone the decisions made were understandable

[Hanszeehock]

Repulse and PoW were sunk a 2 days, not months after Pearl Harbour

The decision to send them was taken months before PH as a deterrent to the Japanese and the original plan included an modern CV as part of the fleet, however losses in the med and damage to Formidable nixed this

PoW and Repulse also came close to intercepting a Japanese troop convoy.

The error was in not co-ordinating with the RAF based in Singapore and not screaming for air cover when they knew they were sighted 

However given at the time they were sunk no Capital Ship at sea had been sunk by enemy air power alone the decisions made were understandable

 

Excellent and concise summary of the facts, have a +1

[Olligarchy]

To the OP: 

 

As others have already noted the Kaiserliche Marine during the Great War was bluntly put the second most powerful in the world, and it's growth being one of the principal reasons the United Kingdom sided with the Entente rather than the Central Powers. It can be argued their successes were somewhat muted, but that was not due to poor ship design or even lack of skill on part of the officers, but because of the tight rope they had to walk politically. The Army would always have first pick of resources and the Americans were making noises about not liking the submarine warfare the Germans were doing.

 

In World War II they were a lot less important, but still a major player.

 

As opposed to the French who stayed in Port during the Great War and lost most of their fleet in the second war after being Blitzkrieg!

[Synth_FG]

To the OP: 

 

As others have already noted the Kaiserliche Marine during the Great War was bluntly put the second most powerful in the world, and it's growth being one of the principal reasons the United Kingdom sided with the Entente rather than the Central Powers. It can be argued their successes were somewhat muted, but that was not due to poor ship design or even lack of skill on part of the officers, but because of the tight rope they had to walk politically. The Army would always have first pick of resources and the Americans were making noises about not liking the submarine warfare the Germans were doing.

 

In World War II they were a lot less important, but still a major player.

 

As opposed to the French who stayed in Port during the Great War and lost most of their fleet in the second war after being Blitzkrieg!

 

The German navy at the start of WWI was probably the 2nd most powerful in the world, however it was also still outnumbered almost 2:1 in capital ships in the north sea by the RN, and vastly behind in numbers of CA's DD's etc. It had a good strategy of sortieing in order to attempt to trap a small portion of the RN Grand Fleet (usually the BC force) and overwhelm it, however it was hamstrung by a desire not to take significant risks with the ships

 

French Naval Operations in WWI were mostly concentrated on the Mediterranean covering the Austrian and Turkish Fleets and keeping the sea lanes between Suez and Gibraltar open, especially once submarine warfare got going in anger , an even less glamorous  role than the distant blockade of the north sea

 

During WWII after the French surrender in 40 and the operations at Oran, the Vichy French maintained a large Fleet at Toulon, this force (a thing of nightmares for Churchill) remained in place until after The invasion of French North Africa in late 42 when the Germans occupied Vichy, The French then scuttled the Toulon Fleet

 

The Free french maintained a small navy with the support of the RN 

 

[Olligarchy]

 

The German navy at the start of WWI was probably the 2nd most powerful in the world, however it was also still outnumbered almost 2:1 in capital ships in the north sea by the RN, and vastly behind in numbers of CA's DD's etc. It had a good strategy of sortieing in order to attempt to trap a small portion of the RN Grand Fleet (usually the BC force) and overwhelm it, however it was hamstrung by a desire not to take significant risks with the ships

 

French Naval Operations in WWI were mostly concentrated on the Mediterranean covering the Austrian and Turkish Fleets and keeping the sea lanes between Suez and Gibraltar open, especially once submarine warfare got going in anger , an even less glamorous  role than the distant blockade of the north sea

 

During WWII after the French surrender in 40 and the operations at Oran, the Vichy French maintained a large Fleet at Toulon, this force (a thing of nightmares for Churchill) remained in place until after The invasion of French North Africa in late 42 when the Germans occupied Vichy, The French then scuttled the Toulon Fleet

 

The Free french maintained a small navy with the support of the RN 

 

 

I believe at the height of the British Empire, the Royal Navy outnumbered and outmatched the rest of the Great Powers by a fair margin, but that doesn't mean the rest of the worlds fleets didn't exist, does it? The British still felt threatened enough by the Kaiserliche Marine that they felt they should side with the other guy and that makes them far more significant than the French at the time.

 

I'd imagine France and Italy will be bought in enmasse for example when the much spoken of, but little seen Austro-Hungarian fleet is put in game. That way the Mediterranean has equally balanced factions.

 

And thanks for the refresher course on French WWII naval history which can be summed up in "Didn't act independently at all." Maybe they can be thrown a bone by giving the Germans and Brits a few French ships? 

[Tigger3]

 

I agree almost 100% with you. The problem is HMS Pince of Wales and HMS Repulse. Sending those 2 ships without aerial cover a few months after Pearl Harbor is exactly like the last attack of the Yamato : KAMIKAZE. A waste of brave sailors lifes.

 

The PoW and Repulse (Force Z) were supposed to have had cover provided by the carrier HMS Indomitable but she was damaged when she ran aground on Nov 3rd 1941 and had to go to the US for repairs. HMS Indomitable was assigned to Force Z in June 1941 for deployment to the Far East (during her commissioning trials), a long time before the Pearl Harbour attack. 

 

By Dec 1941 no major surface vessel had been sunk by aircraft while they were manned and underway. in the restricted waters of the channel  ports the German Luftwaffe managed to sink four British destroyers (which spent long periods of time tied up to the docks), while the French lost one. 

 

Heavier losses were at Crete but even there the heaviest loss were cruisers (Gloucester and Fiji which by then had practically run out of ammunition and the old HMS Calcutta which had been converted to an AA Cruiser). Battleships were damaged but not put out of action and none were sunk.