Players refusing to work as a team

[Warfare80]

K im NOT a good player. Started like 5 days ago. But i do understand teamwork in "PvP".  The problem is that most ( 9/10) players imo go for easiest target even if they must cross the entire map. 

Holding a area between 2 islands for example..sometimes 3 players can hold 8 enemies at bay for like 5+ minutes and at the end you find yourself alone or maybe with one other player left because the other 2 flees the field.  And then you notice that most of your team havent caped anything because they are hunting a damages destroyer across the map. Ofc the enemy caps all nods,kills you and attack your friends in their back and wipe them. You get flamed because you havent had any kills (hard to sink ships 1-2v8)

So my question is:  Im doing it totally wrong and im the reason my teams usually loose the fights (i survive 1/10 battles if im lucky) ?  Or i should stop whining and join a guild or clan (whatever its called in this game)

Any tips would be helpfull. And maybe ive missed some strategy guide on forums wich explains it all.

[EsaTuunanen]

That's how it should go, the side with less players against superior enemy force trying to distract and stall advance while those on other side should push agressively toward enemy base/caps.

Often that lemming train just doesn't even get to that wild goose chasing because of wasting time hugging map's edge.

 

Haven't really played low tiers since closed beta, but no doubt there's some horribly bad play in there.

Best ship class for acting independently from incompetence of other players would be DD because of their stealth and speed with even USN torps usefull for threatening incoming enemies.

Because of fragility destroyers just need lot of skill and trying to hold flank alone would be very hard.

(but supporting couple heavier ships in holding flank can work well)

 

But also your hit ratio is quite lowish so you probably have lot of learning ahead in gunnery.

You can start by going into game's settings and Controls-tab enabling "alternate battle information" or something like that to have aiming distance and shell flight time always visible.

That flight time is needed for being able to reliably estimate needed lead and once learning necessary lead for one flight time it scales linearly from that.

Of course different ships move at different speed so you need to get experience to be able to get correct lead for different ships.

 

Also trying to keep some more distance from most enemy ships might help to do more damage by surviving longer...

Unless you have problems in hitting enemies.

[Warfare80]

EsaTuunanen this was helpfull. Thanks alot

 

[StuntMan0369]

Welcome to Multiplayer gaming...

 

Honestly though, I can sympathise with the teams not doing what they theoretically should be. I mean, when a Warspite is having to hunt the destroyers instead of the Pensacola and Furutaka who have gone to chase down a BB on the other side of the map.... Yeah, it happens in this game. And considering it's very rare to be able to 'carry' a game on your own, it can make some infuriating moments. My advice is to take it with a pinch of salt, and as long as you know you had a 'good' game by your own standards (varies player to player, I always aim for a base XP of close to 1000 on a defeat, closer to 1800-2000 on a win) then I would take the result and move on to the next team. You win some, you lose some, you downright lose your mind on some.

[Jagdpants_666]

Honestly though, I can sympathise with the teams not doing what they theoretically should be. I mean, when a Warspite is having to hunt the destroyers instead of the Pensacola and Furutaka who have gone to chase down a BB on the other side of the map.... Yeah, it happens in this game.

 

Been there, done that. Few things are more frustrating in the life of a BB captain than those "not meaning to be a bother or anything, but can someone stop chipping paint off that enemy BB for a second and PLEASE KILL SOME OF THESE F***ING DESTROYERS?!?!" moments. Then again, I've probably been grinding the gears of a hundred BB players by doing the exact same thing.

 

Then again(again) it's extremely satisfying when you can pull off an "allright then, if you want something done, you'd better do it yourself" and just go full HMS Uwotm8 on the pesky little buggers. Even if you dont have the time to load HE, 6 car-sized holes in a destroyer hull tends to make them unhappy.

 

In the end, expecting much in the way of coordination between 12 people from up to 12 different countries, who have no relation to one another, owe one another nothing, each at their own skill level and with their own ideas about how to play, their personal biases and communication limited to a text chat, yeah..... I wouldn't get my hopes up.

[triumphgt6]

Admittedly the Warspite is probably one of the better BBs to hunt destroyers in! Very good secondaries and quite nimble! But of course you are correct. When driving cruisers, I do try to escort as much as I can. Can be frustrating if the BBs hang around the back though. It is also difficult not to get quite tied up when the shells start flying around and suddenly finding yourself alone as the BB has beaten a hasty retreat. But at least trying to work as a team is rewarding as you feel as if you are working together.

[Drycon]

Try to keep it light and don't let those "players" killing the fun for you.

Man, that's some solid advice, I should follow it up someday!

Most of the time however I'm praying.

Stuntman hit the nail on the head, you win some, you lose some and sometimes....man...

[HarTarJinx]

Cant really say about higher tier game meta considering teamplay. But T5 and below that is uncommon as hell and in my few games in T6 havent seen it either. But who can ya blaim? WOT is the same but in that game one can yolo and survive mainly 'cos of premium ammo. And frankly i think this is one of the reasons that some big WOT youtuber personalitys dont play this game. Do you see Quickbaby doing the same in this game as he does in WOT...yeah. But this is a very fun game and yes, sometimes your team just melts and causes frustration but it is just a game after all. When i play badly or team does, i just turn PS3 on and start playing Sherlock Holmes Crime and Punishment. Take a break, take a Kit-Kat

[Warfare80]

I did follow these advices and it really helped. First rule is to NOT try to win. To win you need strategy and with a team filled with monkeys thats suicide. Im just enjoying the game and keeping an eye on my carrier (i usually go back to assist them if im close enough) Its pretty much same thing as protecting a lady against hyenas. Ofc i try to do that. Then after a few games my cowardly strategy (im playing bb mostly) i do the same old misstake. I try to win and coordinate the monkeys. 

I get violated and i go back to my cowardly strategy  (using other as a meatshield)  I do this because there are almost always 2-3 players who attack the enemy 8 player main force. I do a few strikes,maybe get  a few kills and them im leaving that area. Leaving burning ships behind. Both teammates and enemies often. Ofc i join the fight if the team actually do use some teamwork. The thing is that now i enjoy the game. Im still learning and i do often get excited and forget to check my surroundings. I ofc end up dead those times. 

[EsaTuunanen]

Sometimes MM accidents happen and you get also some good team mate, who knows exactly how to use his ship and act in different situations.

Last match of the evening was such.

Me in Gremy and Colorado basically held one flank alone against five enemies killing last just before rest of the team finally managed to cap enemy base:

Nagato (T7) and T6 cruisers Aoba, Cleveland and Nürnberg, plus one Mutsuki.

Early there was also Königsberg trying to defend that flank.

But he didn't do much any damage before turning away showing his side for enemy to citadel.

 

Also myself lost nearly 10k hp early when launching torps against those incoming cruisers:

Mutsuki spotted me just when I had started to evade his torp salvo and some cruiser shells jammed rudder for few seconds (before getting it repaired) spoiling evasion and making stern overswing into one torp.

That forced me to be more careful keeping distance to enemy main force, instead of more agressively hunting that Mutsuki and being more exposed to fire from cruisers

Luckily one of my torps hit Aoba for 13½ k damage and nearly simultaneously Colorado's salvo took out the rest.

After that it become that stalling battle with Colorado keeping armor angled and trying to limit number of enemies being able to shoot him effectively.

 

While launching distraction torps and showing myself to Mutsuki by shelling enemies from 12km that Mutsuki made the mistake of getting too close showing himself.

After fast loosing over third of his hitpoint he realized he couldn't hit me before getting himself gunned down and disengaged with smoke.

But before that I had launched mixed narrow&wide torp broadside on his path... Getting the satisfaction of him eating one final fish.

That freed me to do better angle torp launch, which got four hits into that Nagato leveling fight for Colorado.

 

Who had kept his armor angled against Nagato, while also having killed that Nürnberg and probably getting some hits to Cleveland. (who was trying to cut corner and put us between fire from two directions)

By that time also I had caused some damage and when Cleveland was down to ~10k hp Colorado fired front turrets when Cleveland was possibly starting to back of.

Anyway Colorado's hits left Cleveland with 2k hp and I finished him fast with my three remaining guns. (earlier attracted salvo from Nagato destroying one gun)

By that time Nagato was also at around 10k hp and I again launched torps.

Shortly after Colorado's rear guns made good hits leaving Nagato below 2k hp.

I also found some undamaged spots with HEs until torpedo finished that IIRC 23hp Nagato.

Second or two later enemy base got capped.

 

By then my DD was at 2½k hp and Colorado probably around 5k hp.

My gunfire between torpedo launches for total of 32k damage might have well been deciding factor saving him. (58k+6k from torps)

Neither of us got anywhere out of our map end, but we topped scoreboard with my 2284 XP and Colorado's 1636 before one New Mexico 200 XP lower.

And neither did we do any communication.

There even wouldn't have been much time for that. (if he hadn't known what to do)

[Warfare80]

Esa THAT was a fun fight! I love when people work as a team. I dont care if we win or loose, as long people atleast try to work together. Im in the military irl so im pretty ok with strategy and i love it. Well ill just hang on and skill up. Once im good enough and clans have launched im sure ill love this game even more (with friends/teams)

 

[Drycon]

cool story bro

 

It's really a shame that these battles only happen seldomly.

You'd expect from people who are playing a tactical game that they enter the game with a tactical mindset.

But nooo, I came here to blow stuff up and wreck other stuff, I don't  have got no time to think, need to blow up stuffz!!!

[teemu92]

I know

 

[EsaTuunanen]

Having checked replay I was actually at ~1300hp after Nagato wasting that one AP salvo on me instead of shooting Colorado.

Like I've sometimes said driving DD to its fullest potential needs balancing between agressiviness and avoiding situation you can't survive...

 

It's really a shame that these battles only happen seldomly.

That's one of the reasons why I've played almost exclusively in DD after end of closed beta and mostly neglected plans of others.

I'll usually just rush ahead to scout and exterminate any lonely enemy DD who happens to show himself and not run away.

Lacking them I'll target often cruisers because of slow BBs being farther away.

Without those enemy BBs become lot more vulnerable.

Gremyashchy is excellent for that "hunt everything" game play.

 

But have had few other times with well working cooperation without any actual planning/communicating.

 

In July had one match which I and half health Cleveland turned into victory against two Clevelands and one IJN DD with also time running short.

I had been defending our base and managed to put one torpedo into closer good health Cleveland dropping him to near 10k hp and also scaring other ~10k hp Cleveland to run away behind island.

Own team Cleveland wouldn't have had enough time to get into enemy base and cap it even if I had managed to keep resetting enemies and was running back.

So I kept spotting that enemy Cleveland and waited some half minute for him to get island out his LOS to enemy Cleveland.

At the moment they started firing I opened fire with Gremy's guns and concentrated fire killed that enemy fast.

Half minute later we got same situation with remaining Cleveland and we killed him similarly leaving my team mate with ~5k hp.

We guessed roughly where enemy DD was and turned there. Cleveland was in lead so I wrote to him to fall behind me to avoid torpedo ambush.

About half minute later I spotted that DD and we sent him turning around so fast he didn't even have time to launch torps.

In another 30s I spotted enemy again for final time for him.

So by not using their brains enemy first lost victory chances and then also draw chances when that DD still tried to engage two DD killing machines.

[Peregrine101]

Worst scenario is, when someone is yelling in the team chat "Follow me", storms into the enemy team base, while the enemy team is not even bothering to move. gets killed and then starts yelling at all the other players that are smart enough to take it easy. Had that once while playing with a battle ship. Funny enough, a lot of players did follow suit, and that saved the battle for our team. They managed to just kill off enough enemies. Took down most of our team, too, though. Together with some other players I took down a couple of ships of the enemy team who also took the long route around one of the islands. I then had the time to look at my team chat to see that one of the players who was killed of, was still yelling orders, and decided another player and I had to be reported for not going with his lemming train tactics....Never bothered me, though I am wondering if that kind of stupid claims are looked after, or that you can really be banned if you happen to get more of this big mouths thrown at you, and the game bans you just because there are a certain number of reports made.

[Seikin]

Worst scenario is, when someone is yelling in the team chat "Follow me", storms into the enemy team base, while the enemy team is not even bothering to move. gets killed and then starts yelling at all the other players that are smart enough to take it easy. Had that once while playing with a battle ship. Funny enough, a lot of players did follow suit, and that saved the battle for our team. They managed to just kill off enough enemies. Took down most of our team, too, though. Together with some other players I took down a couple of ships of the enemy team who also took the long route around one of the islands. I then had the time to look at my team chat to see that one of the players who was killed of, was still yelling orders, and decided another player and I had to be reported for not going with his lemming train tactics....Never bothered me, though I am wondering if that kind of stupid claims are looked after, or that you can really be banned if you happen to get more of this big mouths thrown at you, and the game bans you just because there are a certain number of reports made.

 

Nah - worst scenario is everybody lemming-training to one side and then NOT storming in.. instead sitting at max range, plinking away doing minimal damage while your outnumbered other side gets wiped - then they cap everything and the lemming-bag (I won't call it a train - trains move) - gets surrounded and destroyed.

 

 

I'll pretty much always storm in if we have even or better numbers on that side - but that's with my 20kt Colorado, so its more like a waddle-in.. Others can keep up if they decide to follow me, If they rush ahead - sorry -I can't keep up - but if I sit back - then I'm effectively out of the fight if it moves only slightly away from me (range isn't great either). I have a LOT more fun, get a lot more XP and have a much bigger impact on the battle up close and brawling - even if I do sometimes end up alone and dead.

But then lately I seem to be ending up on the 'weak side' of the map - with people crossing over to the other side for the 'lemming train' right at the start, leaving me alone (or almost alone). I'm too damn slow to switch sides so often end up tanking half the enemy team for half the game - then when dead - If I see our lemming train just sitting there at the back, then yeah.. grinds my gears...  Chances are they're only sitting there because the only guy who was willing to start a push for them was left alone from the beginning...

 

 

[Matchbreakers]

It becomes less of an issue as you go up in tiers. I get many more close matches at tier 7 and up then you otherwise do. And when it comes down to the last few, its fairly often the case thats its some of the more experienced people that are still alive. This also mean coming back from what should be a defeat is easier. 

 

I had a game in my Kiev where it was me, i had about 12000 hp left, a Myoko with about 15k, and our full health carrier against 3 Clevelands, a Tirpitz at about 40k, a half health Pensaola and a Amagi and North Carolina at full health. And what happens is the Clevelands and the Tirpitz decide to push the caps, sailing right trough the kind of ambush territory that the soviet DD´s love. So while i took out a couple of Clevelands and the Tirpitz the Myoko manages to finish the other Cleveland and the Pensacola. This however put the Myoko at about 4000 health, and the carrier down to about 5-7000 health. And they still had 2 BB´s. But they couldn´t cap, and with us holding more caps, and sinking that many of their ships fairly fast meant we snatched victory in the last minute of the match. But i couldn´t have done it if the Myoko hadn´t drawn fire, and he couldn´t have done it if i hadn´t laid a smokescreen allowing him to fire without being fired back upon. 

 

Ofcourse thats not going to happen any game, but the matches tend to be alot closer with less stompouts, so don´t fret the problem becomes a bit less problematic as you go up. Unfortunately it never dissapears. 

[Drycon]

Last night I actually got flamed and insulted for rushing to a carriers aid who was not moving at all.

Rushing is kind of a big word for the New York but you get the gesture.

I managed to damage the dd but the CV did'nt survive the encounter.

 

Now you might think that the other players flamed me for wasting precious time saving a bad captain who can't be bothered with moving his ship around.

No, it was the cv captain and his colleague (who already died earlier) who did for not getting any support.

Continiously insulting throughout the reminder of the game these guys tried to make up for their bad round or something.

There are so many special snowflakes who crave their attention in this game.

(edit: I have to confess I showed my frustration to the guys as well, weakness on my part.)

How about YOU pick up your fat behind and start becoming useful for your team? 'course not. 

 

Another game I lead a rush of 2 New Yorks and 3 cruisers T5/6.

Two cruisers and a T4 BB showed up and they all turned tail!

It wasn't until I called them out that we seriously outgunned them that they started to attack again.

I survived, with a dreadnought achieve cause as I fell back the other BB and cruisers passed me and pushed the enemy back.

Teamplay is such a wonderous thing, even for a solo game as this. 

[Bulrim]

What amazes me most is how people can't use the minimap. Not just some tactical masterplan but simply counting the enemy ships on display, the number of times I've been holding the weak flank with a couple of guys (usually 2:1 odds or worse) spamming torps etc just to slow them down while the ships on the other flank can't count and work out that they outnumber the enemy so just snipe. Gah!

[Drycon]

I'm also noticing a pattern of me surviving encounters and getting insulted every other round, very annoying...

[Jagdpants_666]

I'm also noticing a pattern of me surviving encounters and getting insulted every other round, very annoying...

 

I have yet to be insulted personally in WoWs, mostly it's just "OMG IDIOT TEAM WTF", but yeah, running away on 1% health after you have stalled the enemy advance on a flank through half of the battle with virtually non-existent support is obviously just a cowardly move.

[Zathras_Grimm]

Sooner Clans are up the better, if there is chat amongst teams then there should be better play (win or lose).

 

My gripe is the cheat some teams employ where they explode a stink bomb into a Cap area. Although aircraft seem to be able to penetrate the Cap, the fallout seems to be able to keep up to 5 friendly ships clustered just outside (even with 2 enemy ships, knowing they are outnumbered, retreating from the area). It doesn't matter how much you plead with your team, not one of them enter the area. Whatever happens it must be bad if it can keep a group of ships with air support grinding to a halt (as if they have come to a cliff edge) for some considerable time. WG please stop this cheat

 

[Drycon]

 

I have yet to be insulted personally in WoWs, mostly it's just "OMG IDIOT TEAM WTF", but yeah, running away on 1% health after you have stalled the enemy advance on a flank through half of the battle with virtually non-existent support is obviously just a cowardly move.

 

Most reasons for insults:

- I tell a group of players not to run away from a dd (omg you fracking noob, it's a dd, gonna kill us all)(<- people like this, please uninstall the damn game for the love of...)

- I stay in range of a carrier when I notice he/she is alone

- I stay in range of a cap zone when there are still small fast vessels in the enemy team

- I abandon cv drivers who refuse to move (such a noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooob yes yes but I can spend my time better than protecting a sitting duck)

but also...

- I comment on crybabies in chat and tell them that it was their own fault they got their rear handed to them. 

[EsaTuunanen]

Just had a team which wanted to loose really badly.

 

First charged into that northern cap in Strait detonating incoming Königsberg with first salvo.

And from same smoke while capping kept hammering another Königsberg when someone accidentally managed to get some hits from max range into it and I soon finished also that relieving Minekaze detected by it.

With Minekaze in lead enemy CV was next target receiving some good damage and fires before disappearing behind island while I turned toward center cap.

(Minekaze went after CV eventually torping it)

All this time other ships in northern part just sit in rear with thumbs deep up their arse and not even trying to do anything intelligent. (except CV)

They literally did nothing but watch southern part of team getting butchered by enemy team reinforced by those who run away from north.

Of course enemy team then turned back to north and I had to sink four more enemies to get victory.

I racked 6 kills, First Blood, 2 Devastating Strikes, High Caliber, ~145k damage and nearly 3000 XP.

 

Even after victory bonus team's 6th best scorer lost in XP to enemy team's counterpart.

Considering bonus also that Nagato didn't do well for being top tier ship.

[Seikin]

Seems to be beginning a pick up a bit now. I'm starting to feel like its more and more often the minority of the team now, rather than the majority.  Had a few positive instances recently of getting support while pushing (me playing Colorado). I'm happy to go first and take all the fire as long as others follow and mess up the opposition, and that's been happening. Even had the odd cruiser push up ahead of me to take the flack for a while so I could drop back a little and repair (shame he didn't back off to when he needed to!).

I've been seeing more cruisers hunting DDs and I've been happier to leave ships that are not quite finished off, being more confident that someone else (with faster-firing, lower damage guns) will get them.

Been seeing some good AA cover from both CV's and CA's.

 

Still see the odd US BB Brawler that insists on staying max range and turning away at the first sight of incoming fire, though... or the odd JPN BB staying flat-broadside-on vs other BB's just asking for citadels, the odd cruiser going tunnel-vision on an enemy BB, not noticing the nearby DD, crashing into friendly BB's and gifting that DD with 2 nice easy targets for his torps, and the odd bit of careless torp-spam from our own side causing friendly-fire- but I do think the good is starting to outweigh the bad.