Soviet destroyers suck!

[mtm78]

Yup. Totally underpowered

 

 

http://worldofwarships.eu/en/community/accounts/515528647-/#tab=pvp/account-tab-ships-pvp

 

You're overall stats on it aren't that stellar though, especially wr. 

 

Here are mine ->

 

 

 

My wr sucks even more. I do the same dmg in Isokaze but that is 'concentrated' damage 'where it counts' so I win a LOT more with that. I can get dmg done over time, but you can't influence a match nearly as much. 

 

edit:

 

Yes, they suck terribly, unless you are terribly lucky. I am quite frustrated. As soon as I fire a gun, even from maximum range, I am spotted. My torpedoes have a laughable range and unless I face reckless idiots who drive straight around islands I stand no chance to actually be able to use the torpedoes.

 

And as soon as I am spotted and any cruiser who is not a total idiot is within range and LOS, I am dead.

 

What is the role of the Russian/Soviet destroyers? To provide free kills for the enemy? I cannot think of a role for them.

 

We are intended to fight other DD's, not engage BB's ( re: cammo nerf ) from distance.

[ShockPirat]

Mtm, what stats are you talking about? My stats on Strozhevoi (tier 2) are exceptional (only 3 battles but still), and on Derzki (tier 3) I have a similar average damage as you do in Izyaslav and Isokaze (tiers 4). You didn't even play tier 2 and tier 3 SU DDs. And I haven't played Izyaslav yet.

[Silverno]

The Russian Destroyers was in real life created to protect the convoys against submarines. Early in the war Russia did not have a big fleet at sea and mostly of the ships was borrowed or bought from others countries. The Destroyers was equipped with big engines and big torpedoes, and relative big guns for the purpose to fast and quick hunt down submarines. They was not made to fight others warships with big guns. In the beginning of the war Germany did not have big ships in the Norwegian and Barents sea. After Russia started to win battles in the sea Germany moved ships like Scharnhorst and Tirpitz up north. 

[Kenliero]

 

http://worldofwarships.eu/en/community/accounts/515528647-/#tab=pvp/account-tab-ships-pvp

 

You're overall stats on it aren't that stellar though, especially wr. 

 

Here are mine ->

 

 

Spoiler

 

My wr sucks even more. I do the same dmg in Isokaze but that is 'concentrated' damage 'where it counts' so I win a LOT more with that. I can get dmg done over time, but you can't influence a match nearly as much. 

 

edit:

 

 

We are intended to fight other DD's, not engage BB's ( re: cammo nerf ) from distance.

 

I noticed that with Izyaslav, damage was "okaysh", but winrate was horrible, but when I got tier 5 Gnevny, it turned around. The ship became fast, caliber went up, but effective damage went way down. By being fast, I can make big difference in the outcome, unlike in izyaslav, which results to good winrate (73%), but having few guns and short range torpedoes(4km), the damage goes way down. in tier 5 you can not just sail extra 3 kilometers visible to torp something.

[II_Nemesis_II]

Guys, iChase in his video about those DDs was also talking about that concealment expert skill on captain also reduces the penalty of firing the guns. So it would not be 6km penalty but 5.4km, so there you have another 600m of opportunity and that should give a quite usable breathing space to invis-fire.

[mtm78]

Mtm, what stats are you talking about? My stats on Strozhevoi (tier 2) are exceptional (only 3 battles but still), and on Derzki (tier 3) I have a similar average damage as you do in Izyaslav and Isokaze (tiers 4). You didn't even play tier 2 and tier 3 SU DDs. And I haven't played Izyaslav yet.

 

Only wr, not dmg as dmg can be a fine looking number, wr is what counts right? I skipped everything till tier IV, that is right, I know I wouldn't like them one bit ( suicide torp range and still useless guns for the most part ( don't show me single good games, it won't convince me ). 

 

 

I noticed that with Izyaslav, damage was "okaysh", but winrate was horrible, but when I got tier 5 Gnevny, it turned around. The ship became fast, caliber went up, but effective damage went way down. By being fast, I can make big difference in the outcome, unlike in izyaslav, which results to good winrate (73%), but having few guns and short range torpedoes(4km), the damage goes way down. in tier 5 you can not just sail extra 3 kilometers visible to torp something.

 

I'm hoping for it, but Izyaslav doesn't work as a concept, not in my hands.

 

edit:

 

 

Guys, iChase in his video about those DDs was also talking about that concealment expert skill on captain also reduces the penalty of firing the guns. So it would not be 6km penalty but 5.4km, so there you have another 600m of opportunity and that should give a quite usable breathing space to invis-fire.

 

I get spotted at 11.6km with Izyaslav, with 12km gun range. I got a 12 point captain at tier IV, you telling me the concept is fine I just need a better captain at tier IV?

[II_Nemesis_II]

 

I get spotted at 11.6km with Izyaslav, with 12km gun range. I got a 12 point captain at tier IV, you telling me the concept is fine I just need a better captain at tier IV?

 

No no I was just adding some info to WehrmachtMirEssen calculations. And those of course are for the high tiers with tier 5 captain skill.

[maxie86]

The Russian Destroyers really do suck, no enjoyment playing with them at all.

[Kenliero]

 

No no I was just adding some info to WehrmachtMirEssen calculations. And those of course are for the high tiers with tier 5 captain skill.

 

Yeah, I also remember that from his video. I did not take that into account in my calculations. Getting all those skills is a lot of work, and I can see that helping in high tiers, but then again.... USDD's still have much better concealment AND torpedoes?!?!?! So what are these Soviet DD's about? Not fire damage, because fire damage does not work anymore, after they nerfed it. Quite frankly I don't see any reason to play these ships anymore, so I went back to my battleships. If I want to play DD, I would play USDD, because this gunship role is just better in them.

 

My point is, with pisspoor concealment they have, it is just better to play Cruisers instead, because most of the time you are going to be visible anyway

[Entombet]

Yeah, bad. I find them great to hunt other dd and then focus on other things.

 

[Kenliero]

Yeah, bad. I find them great to hunt other dd and then focus on other things.

 

 

Yeah, they are good in hunting DD's and carriers, but they do not make good damage. In this screenshot of yours, you had only 93 hits, which is actually not even high. Would of been nice to show the actual damage screen, because even with 6 kills, I don't think you did a lot of damage, getting only 1967xp from the game(Good results anyway, thumbs up). You can get many kills by killing DD and low health targets, but you won't do a lot of damage with these ships.

 

That said, these ships are FAST and they are very good in capping and controlling flanks. You can get a good winrate, even without making a lot of damage.

[Huandor]

Yesterday I started playing the Tier 4 to 7 RU DD.

 

The bad concealment itself is a bad surprise, 9km base concealment on the Kiev often means, you're detected way before you've got a clue who is around, a IJN DD will discover you ~3 km before you can detect him yourself. If the opposing Team is smart, their CA will insta shoot my Kiev so I've got to run.

 

The Speed 42.x kn in Addition with six fast firing, fast turning guns make this Tier 7 DD shine.

 

Tier 4, 10 Battles, 7 won, 34 k avg damage

Tier 5, 5 Battles, 3 won, 40k avg

Tier 6, 2 Battles, 1 won, 50k avg

Tier 7, 4 Battles, 3 won, 67k avg

 

21 Battles, 14 won. = 67% WR.

43 K avg damage, more then my avg of 36k

 

my Hit rate with RU DD around 45%, witch is way better than my avg hit rate of 27% - I really suck at Long range and the US howitzers.

 

Torpedos are another one.

Doing a Torpedo run on an skilled enemy usally means loosing own ship as well, 4 km is so Close that everyone will blow your DD out of the water. nevertheless I Managed to kill some ships with Torpedos, mostly Players which were stuck at unlucky situations or were really surprised by a DD rushing in with 46 knots, the first is not reliable, the later will not happen to often in the future once the stats of These DD are better known or did not realize the Tier 4 has 5 km range, not only 4 and then looking at 3x3 torp carpet in their slow BB/CA.

 

The guns are punchy and most Players do not expect this, they Show their broadsides to make use their full gunset, this will Change soon, I blew a Murmansk with one Salvo at Close range using AP.

 

Enemy Shooting at me often missed, I think because of me being way faster then expected.

 

what works for me in General:

I use the Speed to go around the enemy, and start Shooting them from behind, so their turrets Point elsewhere, if they turn to me, they get citadelled by others, and I run of, hide in smoke. If they don't turn around, well, let it rain and maybe Close in for torping. I harrass their CV as well, using the 12-14 km gun range, the CV will of course use their planes to Counter so my BB are free of aircraft striking them.

Capping depends, vs other DD barely a Chance, you get spotted earlier and get blown out of the cap by CA firing.

No other DD or way slower DD, rush in, cap, smoke, wait for enemy to Show up, shoot guns and maybe torps, run of when smoke disapears.

 

It seems, that this DD does not make wins itself, but can easily make the own Team win by giving adavantages.

 

I think, some of my success happend because of most opponents do not know how to handle the RU DD yet. Once their weaknesses and tactics are known, they can't shine anymore.

But currently they are really fun to Play, if your Team uses the Advantages you give them. If they don't use the Advantages you die pretty fast.

 

 

[Kenliero]

Yesterday I started playing the Tier 4 to 7 RU DD.

 

The bad concealment itself is a bad surprise, 9km base concealment on the Kiev often means, you're detected way before you've got a clue who is around, a IJN DD will discover you ~3 km before you can detect him yourself. If the opposing Team is smart, their CA will insta shoot my Kiev so I've got to run.

 

 

The Speed 42.x kn in Addition with six fast firing, fast turning guns make this Tier 7 DD shine.

 

 

Tier 4, 10 Battles, 7 won, 34 k avg damage

Tier 5, 5 Battles, 3 won, 40k avg

Tier 6, 2 Battles, 1 won, 50k avg

Tier 7, 4 Battles, 3 won, 67k avg

 

Looking at your stats. Are you free XPing every ship?

I mean you have just few matches in most ships

Also your results varies massively. With Kiev you did 67k damage and won 3 of your 4 matches, while at the same time with Farragut you played 46 matches, did 22k avg and won only 34%.

Also, 14k average damage in Benson? What?!?!?

 

How come you suddenly make a lot of damage with Soviet DD's, when they are not even better(Better RoF yes). Your USDD stats are really really bad in comparison.

[mtm78]

 

Looking at your stats. Are you free XPing every ship?

I mean you have just few matches in most ships

Also your results varies massively. With Kiev you did 67k damage and won 3 of your 4 matches, while at the same time with Farragut you played 46 matches, did 22k avg and won only 34%.

Also, 14k average damage in Benson? What?!?!?

 

How come you suddenly make a lot of damage with Soviet DD's, when they are not even better(Better RoF yes). Your USDD stats are really really bad in comparison.

 

Also means non stock grind et all ;)

[PanzerFuchs]

The combination of having the worst guns and torps in the game and having to deal with +5 German gun-hedgehog boats per game isn't making the pre-tier-4 Soviet DD gameplay any easier.

 

Hit a full HP Myogi with a full salvo once, didn't even kill it. That's 10 torps for you.

[Ryuuteimaruu]

My experience is they simply don't do enough damage to warrant there place on the team, they lose most of the benefits of been a DD to try be a CL so your pretty much limited to been a ineffective minor nuisance at range.

[Kenliero]

My experience is they simply don't do enough damage to warrant there place on the team, they lose most of the benefits of been a DD to try be a CL so your pretty much limited to been a ineffective minor nuisance at range.

 

Yeah, you can still do things to earn wins. After 18 games with Gnevny, I am running in 78% winrate(and I actually have done a lot of things to bring win for us), but average damage is STILL only 22k... damage really needs a buff. The role that these things are "meant", is not happening, now I just brawl Cruisers from close range and use fast maneuvering to get things done. long range firing?... nope, not working.

FAST relocations to protect for example your carrier / prevent enemy cap  -> 10km range and citadel hits to Cruisers = win.

[ShockPirat]

 

Only wr, not dmg as dmg can be a fine looking number, wr is what counts right? I skipped everything till tier IV, that is right, I know I wouldn't like them one bit ( suicide torp range and still useless guns for the most part ( don't show me single good games, it won't convince me ). 

 

2 games in a row. Last ones in Derzki for me.

 

 

 

So now my average in Derzki is just under 30k.

Thats consistent, and not a single game.

 

Just got the Izyaslav, I'll see how that goes

[mtm78]

2 games in a row. Last ones in Derzki for me.

 

 

 

So now my average in Derzki is just under 30k.

Thats consistent, and not a single game.

 

Just got the Izyaslav, I'll see how that goes

 

The problem is not in ability to deal damage over time, they do that quite well. The issue is that the dmg is spread out a lot and isn't as influential in battle. You deal damage but you depend more on your team. I don't have that much less dmg then you yet I had like 32% wr.

 

[Kenliero]

 

The problem is not in ability to deal damage over time, they do that quite well. The issue is that the dmg is spread out a lot and isn't as influential in battle. You deal damage but you depend more on your team. I don't have that much less dmg then you yet I had like 32% wr.

 

 

Yeah damage is not bad in tier 4 and below, because you are still slow, but after tier 5... your role sort of changes and you go where you are needed, but while relocating, you are not dishing out damage... Of course, you can remain in one flank all than time and get some more damage done, but then you also lose more...

 

I don't know, it just seems it has no role at all... except DD hunting... and I guess that is main reason damage remains slow?

[rafparis]

 

Yeah damage is not bad in tier 4 and below, because you are still slow, but after tier 5... your role sort of changes and you go where you are needed, but while relocating, you are not dishing out damage... Of course, you can remain in one flank all than time and get some more damage done, but then you also lose more...

 

I don't know, it just seems it has no role at all... except DD hunting... and I guess that is main reason damage remains slow?

 

yea, at high tiers they seem to suck bad... the damage is low since ships got more armor (300 dmg for HE in general), and you can't stealth fire anymore, so they are just very weak cruisers now...

With the stealth firning at least they could do something. Before the nerf, with the Ognevoi, i hold an entire flank hitting 2 BBs and 2 cruisers with invisifire, i wasn't doing much damage, but they retreated for some time anyway

now you can't even do that

[Kenliero]

After long consideration.... I decided to drop the whole line... I want to play class that does damage... playing Soviet DD's is just not fun at all... If I wanted to play bad Cruisers, I would just play normal cruisers with massive nerfs... so... better stick to Battleships and CV's that actually damage ships....

 

Well, at least this supernerf made sure that tiers 8-10 still remain only battleships and CV's, and they are not getting more DD's anytime soon(Which also means I am not going to play tiers 8-10 anytime soon)

[Dreadnought1985]

 I play the Gnevy like a light cruiser long range sniping - had a real good fight with tier 7s killed a DD, Clevland and a BB with guns ended up the last hope against

3 more BB (6-7t)  scores are tied 2 mins to go and my dead team were like ambush the BBs with u 4km  torps lol   

 

I manged to get to 6km using a island as cover and made a dash for the Colorado witch spotted me b4 I even got out of cover dodges a salvo and lauched my torps 3.5k range b4 he reloaded - But Starlin was not on my side and the BB dodged all 4 torps lol

*%^**$"*&%   Angry team chat  -  My bad   still love the guns though

[Ryuuteimaruu]

I find the Gnevy guns pretty useless against BB, it's very rare to do over 300-400 damage a salvo and fire chance is pretty low.

[Kenliero]

I find the Gnevy guns pretty useless against BB, it's very rare to do over 300-400 damage a salvo and fire chance is pretty low.

 

Ognevoi tier higher has the same guns, so good luck....