To WG: Is there anything being done about the essex/midway?

[jonasnee]

Yeah, i would rather that the Essex did not go from 1/2/2 to 0/2/3, that fighter squad is necessary, to help push through and do damage, and I would also point out Japanese CV's also get fighters in their aggresive loadouts now, so it would not be fair to take the fighter squad from essex.  I would probably even prefer 2 fighter 2 torp 1 dive.   The strike loadout of every american carrier from Langley through Lexington is broken at present, so why break Essex and Midway too. I would prefer for instance Ranger and Lexington to get say 1 fighter 2 dive 1 torp as its strike

 

here is the thing, we don't want those fighters, we just want our torpedo bombers, they are the only good thing we have.

[lankylad11_lankylad]

I tend to feel a carrier with absolutely no fighters at all is a little vulnerable, and it might prove difficult to get attacks through without them.  My point was more that Japanese carrier captains could go for the fighter loadout because that can also do damage so you see a Japanese carrier dominating the sky because its air superiority loadout is more sensible, thats not balanced.  The strike loadout of the USN CV's is also not viable till Essex imho

[jonasnee]

I tend to feel a carrier with absolutely no fighters at all is a little vulnerable, and it might prove difficult to get attacks through without them.  My point was more that Japanese carrier captains could go for the fighter loadout because that can also do damage so you see a Japanese carrier dominating the sky because its air superiority loadout is more sensible, thats not balanced.  The strike loadout of the USN CV's is also not viable till Essex imho

 

it was a lot more fun running around with a 3 torp 3 bomber set up as japan, then they took 1 torp bomber and that was a pretty big nail in the coffin.

[Leonadios]

 

it was a lot more fun running around with a 3 torp 3 bomber set up as japan, then they took 1 torp bomber and that was a pretty big nail in the coffin.

 

Agreed, especially when IJN TB spread is so crap it's hard to hit even 3 torps.

[wredus]

1st of all there need to be 2 kinds of cv players one who go for strike setup coz he like to piss off bb players, and 2nd one with fighter setup coz he want to punish that 1st one. while on t8 and t9 is pretty nice balance between those two kind of play stale - on t10 is just none...

current scaling between fighter taiho and fighter hakuryu is off - while taiho vs essex  or strike taiho was well balanced (fighters block pretty ezy essex strike groups even with fighter escort) while fighter haku vs strike midwey is unable to stop it duo to lack of firepower of fighters with is on same level as tahio in term of raw power that make situation where midway or strike haku torp bombers just dish out full loadout from top haku fighter squad and go hit there target and! t10 attack planes suddenly got astronomical  hp poll and that epic speed...and here where is current problem with top fighters, they dont stop them! is simple as that current "pros" just abuse inability of fighter squadrons on tX to stop attacks, if u dont catch them  above 25 km from there target they will hit target no matter what(unless you spend all 4 squadron on one torp squadron) wg need to implement that attack plane being under fighter attack cannot drop load or they take 200-300% more dmg when they do final drop approach or just simple rise PROPERLY avg dmg... its just laughable that my taiho or shokaku(i dont count hiryu coz i played her in time where there was no mirrors and fighting  haku and midweys was...hmm "fun"?) did deny on many occasion enemy cv his "ezy" dmg and exp while haku is just feel like t8 cv with 4 fighters...and dont get me wrong i dont say that making avg 3k exp on fighter taiho was ezy coz was not  but my current 2k avg haku making me wonder just wtf . instead of punishing "pro strike hard" cv i punishing my self...well hakku till next update...

 

 

[lankylad11_lankylad]

I like the strike setup as much as the next person, but as soon as the enemy has a carrier with fighters, if you have none, you are very vulnerable to your attack runs being intercepted, with just one squadron, you can use them to tie up the other cv's fighters and attack with your strike aircraft as you please, also if people put catapult fighters up, your fighter escort can shoot them down.  If i was in my Lexington, and for example the Shokaku i was facing had no fighters, i would clean up with my 2/1/1 loadout.  My problem is that strike loaduts for USN do not get any fighters at all till Essex, where i think Ranger and Lexington need 1 fight 2 dive 1 torp

[jonasnee]

I like the strike setup as much as the next person, but as soon as the enemy has a carrier with fighters, if you have none, you are very vulnerable to your attack runs being intercepted, with just one squadron, you can use them to tie up the other cv's fighters and attack with your strike aircraft as you please, also if people put catapult fighters up, your fighter escort can shoot them down.  If i was in my Lexington, and for example the Shokaku i was facing had no fighters, i would clean up with my 2/1/1 loadout.  My problem is that strike loaduts for USN do not get any fighters at all till Essex, where i think Ranger and Lexington need 1 fight 2 dive 1 torp

 

i know you werent there back when we had a 0/3/3 set up but trust me it was the most liked set up, our problem is that the jap strike load out is forced to be 33% fighters which we don't want, we want strike crafts.

[lankylad11_lankylad]

two words to anyone who thinks high tier carriers are over powered.  Defensive Fire.  If you stick together, and your cruisers do their work, you can stop the carriers being able to do huge damage in an attack run.  Problem is, battleship drivers insist on sailing off on their own, the carrier takes advantage, then they come on a forum and complain that high tier carriers are OP.  If battleships stick together, you will probably shoot down most of an attack run particularly with catapult fighters, but if BB's insist on going solo, CV's will continue cleaning up

[lankylad11_lankylad]

also, the role of the american carrier changes at tier 9.  The strike loadout of every previous american carrier is broken, so Essex is the first one that can use strike effectively.  This means the carriers job is purely to deal damage, so people don't always have the fighter cover of their friendly carrier, this means cruisers have to defend the fleet, and if you aren't near a cruiser then......

[Spellfire40]

Even if they sail of alone. The densety of BB/CA lanched fighters prevent much damage without def ability or Fightercover. Thanks to Mirrored MM CV cant sent their fighter out too much till the enemy stirke planes are spoted or risk geting sniped.

[lankylad11_lankylad]

If anyone actually looks at the loadouts of the Taiho and Hakuryu, you will see they are better than the Essex and Midway loadouts.  In the strike loadouts, the Japanese win because they have more fighters than the Americans (whats that about americans getting air superiority), yet with the air superiority loadouts, the Japanese get 8 more torpedo bombers to the Americans 0.  this isn't fair.  Make the Hakuryu 4 fight 4 dive and Taiho 4 fight 3 dive, then it balances, or give midway 3 fight 1 torp 1 dive.  As for strike, give the Taiho 1 fight 3 dive 3 torp, and the  Hakuryu 1 fight 4 dive 3 torp.  Essex and Midway can be completely cancelled out with the current loadouts by their japanese rivals, and two squads over one means that with the level 5 commander skill, the Hakuryu wins 10 7 on fighters, which is ridiculous, while having the same number of strike aircraft

[Spuggy]

For me, the real disparity between USN and IJN air groups is the difference in their fighter performances.

 

The fighters have almost identical stats (within each tier) however USN FP's are in groups of 6 vs IJN group of 4.

 

IJN FP's are also slower which means that the dogfighting expertise skill boosts the already more powerful USN FP group over the IJN's. This is why USN FP's murder IJN air groups. It's the fact that they get the speed differential boost and the numbers advantage so as soon as they kill the first plane in the group in becomes very quick for them till the remainder without taking any losses.

 

I have learned to lure USN FP's into kill zones with friendly AA fire but this is really difficult. I feel if IJN FP's had a higher DPM this would balance out a little. 

[lankylad11_lankylad]

I agree.  however, at tier 10, IJN fighters are slower so the dogfighter skill works the other way, and the Hakuryu will almost certainly have more fighters than a Midway in the air in any given loadout unless the Midway goes defensive (which he can't because he isn't allowed 3/1/1).  I also thought that IJN carriers were meant to be aggresive with minimal fighter escort, not with more fighters in the air than its american counterpart if the midway picks the strike loadout (which he is going to) and 2 extra fighters in the air superiority loaout isn;t enough to balance the EIGHT less torpedo bombers that Midway gets in the fighter loadout, hence my argument in the 3/1/1 which would balance things

[Lieutenant_Hubert_Gruber]

I had a tier 10 game in my NC today. Vs a Midway. My North Carolina is AA specced, but still has the stock hull.

I shot down ~35 planes. Yes, with a lowly North Carolina. I call [edited] on Midway being immune to AA.

I ctrl clicked on the squads and maneuvred to make him work to get me. He managed one proper drop on me, with 4 torps.

Surely you guys don't expect a CV to lose many planes if you give him the best approach angle and sail straight?

 

I own an Essex too and managed to sink a few Iowas without losing any planes, but in those cases they sailed straight and I bet they didn't ctrl click on the squad. Who knows if they were AA specced. Probably not.

I also had a few North Carolinas cause me problems and shoot down a lot of my planes. It can be done, just don't be a potato.

 

In conclusion, it's a l2p and upgrade/captain skills issue. Midway is powerful, but its targets are not helpless.

 

Then why can my fully upgraded NC + AA cap skills and AA mods only take down 3-4 planes?  I can deal with carriers, but the midway is just picking who dies next.

[Leonadios]

two words to anyone who thinks high tier carriers are over powered.  Defensive Fire.  If you stick together, and your cruisers do their work, you can stop the carriers being able to do huge damage in an attack run.  Problem is, battleship drivers insist on sailing off on their own, the carrier takes advantage, then they come on a forum and complain that high tier carriers are OP.  If battleships stick together, you will probably shoot down most of an attack run particularly with catapult fighters, but if BB's insist on going solo, CV's will continue cleaning up

 

12 torpedo hits in 1 run is overpowered. Unless you're in a decked out Des Moines sailing in the middle of the fleet, you're never going to shoot down all of those.

[lankylad11_lankylad]

doesn't matter, the defensive fire of a tier 6 or up cruiser can completely mess up the spread of torpedos/bombs of the attack run even of midway, so you will get minor damage instead of alpha'd

[DJ_Die]

 

12 torpedo hits in 1 run is overpowered. Unless you're in a decked out Des Moines sailing in the middle of the fleet, you're never going to shoot down all of those.

 

Nor are you ever going to hit 12 torpedoes especially in higher tiers at least a few of the bombers will be shot down and theres often an AA cruiser nearby but yeah even 8 is still a lot if you manage to get your planes through

[Reyte]

Pepole still think they can drive alone. An when the cv strikes on them they are suddenly op. Srsly. Dont go alone as bb. Cv at hightier is the only hardcounter to bb. If bb goes alone he will deserve his fate. Also cv will often for the easiest target. I still see so many bb player just going solo. Also a lexington will spit on ur new mexico the same way as midway sill spit on a NC. Of course the tierdifference matters. After all also a aoba can spread out torpedobombers as much as des moines can. Only difference is the range of aa in this example.

 

Srick to ur cruisers! Dont be the easiest target. Turn in and dont turn away form us torpedos

[lankylad11_lankylad]

guys.  shooting down the planes isn't the thing at tier 10,  the defensive fire wil break up the attack run, i mean a tier 6 cruiser can break up the attack of FOUR squadrons at once, and once the torp run is broken up, you might get one or two hits if lucky.  that is the point

[Hauptbahnhof]

 and once the torp run is broken up, you might get one or two hits if lucky. 

 

If the torp run is a Japanese one yes, then you might get one or two hits if lucky....

 

The US Midway/Essex however can get as much as 3-4 hits still against longer targets even when the torp run is "broken up"  by AA ability, it's that tight to being with.

[CV_11_Intrepid]

It's pretty accurate. These ships raped the IJN in the Pacific. Besides, the US CVs aren't OP, your brain is UP. Only idiots who have no concept of tactics die at the hands of carriers and then come to forums like little bitches to cry.

[Leonadios]

It's pretty accurate. These ships raped the IJN in the Pacific. Besides, the US CVs aren't OP, your brain is UP. Only idiots who have no concept of tactics die at the hands of carriers and then come to forums like little bitches to cry.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

Midway tops damage records, average XP, credits and win rate. Just because ships were historically better, it doesn't give WG a reason to make ships overpowered.

 

Besides, you have 0 games in CVs so how can you even make a judgement?

 

 

[CV_11_Intrepid]

Super easily. I take to heart the work of Jingles and iChase.

[Leonadios]

Super easily. I take to heart the work of Jingles and iChase.

 

Jingles doesn't play CVs himself so his views are questionable. iChase perfectly demonstrates why the Midway is so overpowered.

 

Jingles' damage contest was won by 2 Midways.

[CV_11_Intrepid]

And in both of their reviews demonstrate the massive tactical errors many players make while playing against carriers. People think they're in a battleship and that makes them invincible. You sail off like a moron without proper AA protection, you're asking for it.