US BB disspersion

[T0rad]

Hello, 

 

i'm fully aware, that there was a thread like this somewhere in the past. but the author of that thread didnt want to complain, which im here to do. my NC dispersion is killing me so hard. today i fired 2 salvos at stationary Mogami 8kms from me. i hit 1 shell, all others went in front or behing, doing maybe 3000 dmg. IJN cruisers with their sleek profiles are essentialy immune to my fire. i dont care about getting penetrations on BBs, i dont care about lot of things. but ive been killed by Mogami in two matches in this week, and its so frustrating and undermining the power of BB, which has been nerfed quite hard. So i sit in this excellent ship, do NOTHING wrong and am punished hard. I dont understand why cant i have an accuracy buff like IJN BBs.

 

Apart from the fact that we are slow, lumbering, hard manuvering, cheescake for any torpedo carying boat that knows its game, that we have to compete against other BBs, we are now at mercy of dice roll against CRUISER? 

 

this is stirring my stomach so bad id rather have minute reload and let the shells fly precisely where i want them than this. it makes no sense trying to be a better player when your actions dont determine anything. it makes no sense to learn where the citadels are, where the weak armour is, when you cant even hit the ship at 8kms. replace all of wows with throwing dice and we will see who will win. 

 

Make player count! because now driving a BB is only about being well positioned and at angle, shooting of main batteries could be AI controlled and it would make no difference in current state. you play chess with BB, you can only hope that if you put your enemy in the middle of your dispesrion elipsis, he will be to kind to eat some of those shells. 

 

edit: for example in destro and CV, driver makes all the difference. and skilled driver with a sip of luck will win the match.

[trrprrprr]

Hello, 

 

i'm fully aware, that there was a thread like this somewhere in the past. but the author of that thread didnt want to complain, which im here to do. my NC dispersion is killing me so hard. today i fired 2 salvos at stationary Mogami 8kms from me. i hit 1 shell, all others went in front or behing, doing maybe 3000 dmg. IJN cruisers with their sleek profiles are essentialy immune to my fire. i dont care about getting penetrations on BBs, i dont care about lot of things. but ive been killed by Mogami in two matches in this week, and its so frustrating and undermining the power of BB, which has been nerfed quite hard. So i sit in this excellent ship, do NOTHING wrong and am punished hard. I dont understand why cant i have an accuracy buff like IJN BBs.

 

Apart from the fact that we are slow, lumbering, hard manuvering, cheescake for any torpedo carying boat that knows its game, that we have to compete against other BBs, we are now at mercy of dice roll against CRUISER? 

 

this is stirring my stomach so bad id rather have minute reload and let the shells fly precisely where i want them than this. it makes no sense trying to be a better player when your actions dont determine anything. it makes no sense to learn where the citadels are, where the weak armour is, when you cant even hit the ship at 8kms. replace all of wows with throwing dice and we will see who will win. 

 

Make player count! because now driving a BB is only about being well positioned and at angle, shooting of main batteries could be AI controlled and it would make no difference in current state. you play chess with BB, you can only hope that if you put your enemy in the middle of your dispesrion elipsis, he will be to kind to eat some of those shells. 

 

edit: for example in destro and CV, driver makes all the difference. and skilled driver with a sip of luck will win the match.

There is no awful dispersion on BBs...sure, you sometimes ge ta random shotgun shot, but you learn to shoot properly by playing. Even more accurate jap BBs get affected by RNG where shells just decide to fk with you.  And every BB has its own shell trajectory and dispersion, so i suggest you sometimes see how they fly and land, so next time you can aim better and use that knowlege to your advantage.

 

Like there is no point to shoot full salvo in one go to and enemy facing straight at you...same goes if enemy get stuck at island and so on....just shoot one gun at a time and you will get better results than shooting full salvo in one go(as most shells tend to go horizontal...not sure how to say it right with my lack of english, but full salvo will land in like 200m horizontal line, where two shells will have alot less horizontal dispersion.  And it never worked for me if at very close ranges you aim at waterline...you have to aim a bit higher to hit most of them...sure some will go behind him, but youll have less ones that just hit the water.

[Zgicc]

What dispersion?

 

http://gfycat.com/SickLazyAmericanmarten

 

 

Thing is BBs are already the most powerful class after CVs, especially at high tiers.

 

I know you want to be happy driving your immortal nuke cannon loaded ships but BB accuracy is fine atm.

 

Maybe not trying to snipe from 24km would help you hit better.

[LittleGentleman]

Don't let these WG fans tell you otherwise mate it is terrible. It is so to encourage players to go close with BB and that's the best way to play them in this game. Especially pre tier 8 USA BBs since they don't get the accuracy module like IJN BBs. It is fundamentally to prevent players just attempting to keep distance at all times since. There are some USA BB which are just not very good i.e. the Colorado and South Carolina. 

[Zgicc]

Colorado is absolutely fine. Always has been. The buff only increased the reload and gun traverse, things which no one really mentioned when they stated it was a bad ship. The only downside is its HP which tbh considering its armour, isn't really that big a problem.

 

This is my avg.damage per ship. At T7 the Colorado and Nagato are clearly dominating. When it comes to BB damage the only other contenders which come close are CVs.

 

[Sander93]

What dispersion?

 

Maybe you shouldn't discuss ships you don't have. Wait until you get the North Carolina / Iowa, and you'll start hating the dispersion too. Shotgun accuracy. 

 

A game based on RNG is annoying, not fun. I'm not saying they should buff battleships, but the way they're currently balanced (by RNG) sucks. It's annoying to play a game where player skill gets neglected by sheer luck. One time you aim for a cruiser and you get several citadel hits, and the next time you aim at the exact same place but RNG decides your shells have to miss. The Iowa struggles to place good hits even at ranges down to 10km. 

[Zgicc]

I had those BBs in beta... and I thought the Colorado was the worst ship of the line/game according to 100% of the playerbase!? What is this madness.

 

With all due respect Sander93. Look at your stats in your BBs. They're really good. And yet you're arguing that the BBs are crap and should get more accuracy? Really? I think having a longer reload would be even less fun. Make them more accurate but reduce damage? Rip DDs/CAs because citadel hits will still wreck them.

 

Yes, RNG can be annoying but for the most part it averages out.

[LittleGentleman]

Colorado is absolutely fine. Always has been. The buff only increased the reload and gun traverse, things which no one really mentioned when they stated it was a bad ship. The only downside is its HP which tbh considering its armour, isn't really that big a problem.

 

This is my avg.damage per ship. At T7 the Colorado and Nagato are clearly dominating. When it comes to BB damage the only other contenders which come close are CVs.

 

 

Your like a politician with his catalog of stats, bore off. Stats can be portrayed in any which way possible, Colorado is one of the worst ships in the game bar none end of story. 

 

 

[LittleGentleman]

I had those BBs in beta... and I thought the Colorado was the worst ship of the line/game according to 100% of the playerbase!? What is this madness.

 

your completely right mate it's just some people are in denial because they probably got lucky in some games. madness

[LittleGentleman]

I love you bill

[trrprrprr]

Don't let these WG fans tell you otherwise mate it is terrible. It is so to encourage players to go close with BB and that's the best way to play them in this game. Especially pre tier 8 USA BBs since they don't get the accuracy module like IJN BBs. It is fundamentally to prevent players just attempting to keep distance at all times since. There are some USA BB which are just not very good i.e. the Colorado and South Carolina. 

Another noob and WG hater.....  Theres nothing wrong with Colorado, as lost of damage its easy to do at beginning of game - so in ~ 20km range. You should join thos whining idiots that you dont get enough credits too, so unable to buy tier 9-10 ships as soon as you get exp ready. You would fit in there just prefectly.  Your stats are even better than mine and still not enough? BBs are very powerfull as it is right now, if you want to get ability to one salvo everything with each new salvo....keep dreaming, just close your eyes before that.

[T0rad]

Like there is no point to shoot full salvo in one go to and enemy facing straight at you...same goes if enemy get stuck at island and so on....just shoot one gun at a time and you will get better results than shooting full salvo in one go(as most shells tend to go horizontal...not sure how to say it right with my lack of english, but full salvo will land in like 200m horizontal line, where two shells will have alot less horizontal dispersion.  And it never worked for me if at very close ranges you aim at waterline...you have to aim a bit higher to hit most of them...sure some will go behind him, but youll have less ones that just hit the water.

 

It is better to hit water in front of target than behind, because shell travel underwater and you may still hit some nice score. That mogami i was talking about was full broadside to me, pracitacly stationary 8kms from me. yes, you learn to anticipate, yes you learn to pick your target. but then you have your fckin ideal target, which you positioned yourself to get, adn the RNG says "oh no no, doesent matter if you prepared perfectly and he didnt, he lives, you die". thats like playing chess with dice. each attack you roll dice. you had won the match 2 times already and then rolled bad? to bad! 

 

To the person that posted those videos, neither of those are T8, T9 od T10 USBBs, there is a Colorado which got changed in so many patches i dont know how it is now and how old is taht vid. (i remember that when i played it, trough the whole grind i got 2 citadels on BBs of equal or higher tier - so the video seems VERY unprobable). As i see it ive got some 64k avarege dmg, but im in real tryhard mode to get those and i dont even know if thats good worldwide. positioning, target picking, situation anticipation, luring enemies and ofc good aiming. but its so frustrating, when you do everything right and have no reward for that? thats opposite of what i want a game to be. 

[Sander93]

With all due respect Sander93. Look at your stats in your BBs. They're really good. And yet you're arguing that the BBs are crap and should get more accuracy? Really? 

 

No, I urge you to read my post again. I explicitly said battleships should not be buffed, but that I hate it that they balanced battleships by giving them totally random accuracy. 

 

Instead, I said that they should balance battleships by other means, not by RNG. For example: why do battleships have to do 10.000 damage shots? Why not lower the damage of citadel hits / penetration to 5000 damage and increase the accuracy? This way player skill in aiming would actually be rewarded and doing damage wouldn't be mostly down to sheer luck.

 

I've put a lot of effort into learning about the game and learning to aim, and now it's mostly neglected because of RNG (at least in the Iowa). A perfectly aimed salvo by me has as much chance to do crippling damage as a random salvo by a 45% wr player, and in my opinion that's just wrong.

 

 

I had those BBs in beta...

 

They've changed the accuracy since then, even if the dispersion might be the same. Never bothered to check tbh. Fact is that the guns fire all over the place now. Dispersion stats might've remained the same, but there are other hidden soft stats like spread that could have been and probably were changed. Once you get the North Carolina back, you'll understand. It aint fun to see your perfectly aimed salvo fly all over the place and barely scratch the paint, while next up you fire a random salvo in panic and you hit two citadels. Playing with US BB tier 8-10 is like playing one of those slot machines. The only player skill involved currently is down to maneuvering. 

[LittleGentleman]

Another noob and WG hater.....  Theres nothing wrong with Colorado, as lost of damage its easy to do at beginning of game - so in ~ 20km range. You should join thos whining idiots that you dont get enough credits too, so unable to buy tier 9-10 ships as soon as you get exp ready. You would fit in there just prefectly.  Your stats are even better than mine and still not enough? BBs are very powerfull as it is right now, if you want to get ability to one salvo everything with each new salvo....keep dreaming, just close your eyes before that.

 

Man they don't need a buff as such as much as some cruisers need a nerf. When you are 17km are doing 2 salvos a minute and hit a couple of shells for 1k dmg and the cruiser is doing 4k per salvo + fire which you cant avoid hmm...

[LittleGentleman]

 

No, I urge you to read my post again. I explicitly said battleships should not be buffed, but that I hate it that they balanced battleships by giving them totally random accuracy. 

 

Instead, I said that they should balance battleships by other means, not by RNG. For example: why do battleships have to do 10.000 damage shots? Why not lower the damage of citadel hits / penetration to 5000 damage and increase the accuracy? This way player skill in aiming would actually be rewarded and doing damage wouldn't be mostly down to sheer luck.

 

I've put a lot of effort into learning about the game and learning to aim, and now it's mostly neglected because of RNG (at least in the Iowa). A perfectly aimed salvo by me has as much chance to do crippling damage as a random salvo by a 45% wr player, and in my opinion that's just wrong. 

 

^^

[T0rad]

Well as i think about it more and more... the only conclusion that could be made here is to get rid of the concept of HP. lets just have Buyoancy and then modules which could be lost, maybe repaired. i did not play alpha, i dont know how it looked back then. but citadel hits would not shoot Cruisers out of water, instead hull penetrated by such shell would take in water, maybe engine could be permanently crippled or taken out entirely? and guns? and secondaries? to the point of disintegration of hull if hit well? like in real life? the only concept, that could maybe balance the game a bit. 

[Sander93]

Well as i think about it more and more... the only conclusion that could be made here is to get rid of the concept of HP. lets just have Buyoancy and then modules which could be lost, maybe repaired. i did not play alpha, i dont know how it looked back then. but citadel hits would not shoot Cruisers out of water, instead hull penetrated by such shell would take in water, maybe engine could be permanently crippled or taken out entirely? and guns? and secondaries? to the point of disintegration of hull if hit well? like in real life? the only concept, that could maybe balance the game a bit. 

 

The developers removed the aircraft fuel system for aircraft carriers because it was deemed 'too complex' for the average player. For the same reason they will never implement anything like you're suggesting I'm afraid. 

 

 

[T0rad]

yes i know... complexity is fear word in Wargaming... because huge warships, basicaly afloat military bases are not complex at all.... as i thougth that wows may actualy be a good game i see it more and more clearly. WG has become a great company with great cashflow and for that reason they will not implement anything risky, anything out of well proven complex that they can milk for cash. long gone is the desire for making good games, greed is only thing left. Wargaming is the new EA games... i just had another game where i got screwed with by RNG.... i dont know what more can i do. at least when i [edited]up, i know that i did... not the game for me. 

[trrprrprr]

 

It is better to hit water in front of target than behind, because shell travel underwater and you may still hit some nice score. That mogami i was talking about was full broadside to me, pracitacly stationary 8kms from me. yes, you learn to anticipate, yes you learn to pick your target. but then you have your fckin ideal target, which you positioned yourself to get, adn the RNG says "oh no no, doesent matter if you prepared perfectly and he didnt, he lives, you die". thats like playing chess with dice. each attack you roll dice. you had won the match 2 times already and then rolled bad? to bad! 

 

To the person that posted those videos, neither of those are T8, T9 od T10 USBBs, there is a Colorado which got changed in so many patches i dont know how it is now and how old is taht vid. (i remember that when i played it, trough the whole grind i got 2 citadels on BBs of equal or higher tier - so the video seems VERY unprobable). As i see it ive got some 64k avarege dmg, but im in real tryhard mode to get those and i dont even know if thats good worldwide. positioning, target picking, situation anticipation, luring enemies and ofc good aiming. but its so frustrating, when you do everything right and have no reward for that? thats opposite of what i want a game to be. 

im atm on NC and i find Myoko and Mogami and US tier 8 Cruiser to have some force field. I just cant hit em at close range where on long ranges its easier to double citadel everything.   Prolly its a damn RNG joke for my NC, but ive died lots of times by two tier 8 cruisers attacking me, where full calvo land one shell with overpenetration at close ranges....Mogami is even more confusing  Maby cos those cruisers have very low profile and even milimeter higher trhan must be aimed end up with shotgun.   Most times full salvos to them end up with flying over and landing meters b4 it. Where in ranges of 16-23km its a 100% citadel

[T0rad]

im atm on NC and i find Myoko and Mogami and US tier 8 Cruiser to have some force field. I just cant hit em at close range where on long ranges its easier to double citadel everything.   Prolly its a damn RNG joke for my NC, but ive died lots of times by two tier 8 cruisers attacking me, where full calvo land one shell with overpenetration at close ranges....Mogami is even more confusing  Maby cos those cruisers have very low profile and even milimeter higher trhan must be aimed end up with shotgun.   Most times full salvos to them end up with flying over and landing meters b4 it. Where in ranges of 16-23km its a 100% citadel

 

yeah but you hit in oce. I died several times exactly as you said it. i feel that NC was nerfed hard in last patch. i struggle to hav ehalf the results ive been having before. maybe cruiser mafia cried long enough to have this happen?

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

 cruiser mafia cried long enough to have this happen

Oh, that's new. There is a "cruiser mafia"?

 

[T0rad]

Oh, that's new. There is a "cruiser mafia"?

 

 

well they allways cry about BB mafia so i wanted to hit back but yeah, half the people on forums complain about the cruiser fragility and low utility... i have t7 crusier and really dont feel like it dont take me too seriously. 

[C4PT41N_0BV10US]

Well, I mostly play US CA and I would definitely count into "cruiser mafia" group. Who's the Don of cruiser mafia though?

[Zgicc]

Aim better, don't try to snipe, learn to do your job as a BB.

 

Skill of a BB player is not just about doing damage and definitely not about sniping. A well played BB is the most influential ship on the battlefield.

 

Fact is most BB players are special.

They chose BBs because they want to be the biggest and best ship in the game.

This is the reason why most of them complain about literally everything when they get killed, even when they die against other BBs.

"CVs are OP"

"DDs are OP"

"CAs and their fires are OP"

"This game is totally RNG based and skill has no part in it"

 

---

Most of the skill of a BB player is not knowing how to shoot at 20km+ range but knowing when and where to push at the right time. In this regard, most players are complete idiots.

The dominance of this class makes playing any other class pointless (well CVs are even more OP but they're kinda boring to play, which would explain the lack of them at T9/T10 and DDs are a niche role).

I started playing in a 2xBB div yesterday and we had a 76% WR. Two decently played BBs can win a whole flank with no effort required. Until they fix the balance I don't think I'm going to touch any of my T10 CAs. I have to bust my *** off in a Zao to deal anything more than 85k damage, with very rare games being upward of 120k, when in a BB its just an average game in a T7/8 BB with no real effort required, not to mention that you can can do this while pushing entire flanks or holding off the whole enemy team.

[lycea]

+1 to zgicc 

 

Getting the full potential out of a BB is awereness and insight. 

Closing the range between you and the enemy will result in better dispersion, but knowing when to/when not to engage/disengage is the real trick. Sniping at max range the entire match is not an option if you want to win battles