Torpedo bomber sandwich!

[Blackeon]

Can anyone suggest how in a BB you avoid being the meat in a torpedo bomber sandwich?

This keeps happening to me in the Wyoming where a CC has two sets of torpedo bombers and attack from either side of your ship. You just cannot avoid getting hit by 3 or 4 torpedoes.

 

P.S. don't say stay with the cruisers because they won't stay with you and why should they they get almost no reward for acting as AA defence

 

[KptStrzyga]

You can`t. If carrier player has his eye on you only thing left for you is thinking "carriers aren`t OP, they are balanced and fair". 

[Synth_FG]

There's no way of avoiding taking some pain in such a situation, nor should there be

Once you hit the Later hulls of the New Mex or Colorado you'll make them pay tho

Best advice is save your repair for the flooding and your recovery for the damage

[Cosseria]

There's no way out but luckily those situations are quite rare as this kind of attack requires high skills and perfect timing. I must have seen this happen to me, say, one time per week.

[Blackeon]

Seems to me these low tier BB are just there to make the game worse and put people off the game, great game design WG

[Whatever08152]

Cant remember the turn of a wyoming but a very basic tip (if you dont do this anyway) is slowing to 1/2 for a very short moment and accelerate to full again while turning towards any of the bombers. They have to aim in front of you and this screws up their aim a bit. At least it should be enough to not get oneshot ...but then again. I am only doing this in a New Mexico and cant remember if a Wyoming performs similarlly in this situation.

 

Rest was already said, save repair for flooding and buy AA (have all my BBS as AA and feel pretty comfortable against carriers if they arent of a higher tier)

[FaceFisted]

This happened to me just few times in this game, and only in low tier BBs with no AA. When I see torp planes, I Immediately start turning towards them. If CV tries to create a sandwitch, he usually cant and he also looses a lot of planes in process. 

[Drycon]

This happened to me just few times in this game, and only in low tier BBs with no AA. When I see torp planes, I Immediately start turning towards them. If CV tries to create a sandwitch, he usually cant and he also looses a lot of planes in process. 

As a hobbyist CV driver, yes I can and the amount of planes lost is situational just like the amount of torps you'll eat.

If you are bugged by cruisers and destroyers as well as me there is a big chance you will get damaged.

If my planes are bugged by cruisers and fighters then there is a big chance you won't get damaged.

 

In 1 vs 1 I'll take my time and you will turn into a bad spot eventually.

BB's simply can't keep up with the planes and their idiotic turn rates.

[trrprrprr]

Can anyone suggest how in a BB you avoid being the meat in a torpedo bomber sandwich?

This keeps happening to me in the Wyoming where a CC has two sets of torpedo bombers and attack from either side of your ship. You just cannot avoid getting hit by 3 or 4 torpedoes.

 

P.S. don't say stay with the cruisers because they won't stay with you and why should they they get almost no reward for acting as AA defence

 

You can avoid most of them and get hit by 1-2max, as soon as you spot torp bombers goin your way- face one of them, as soon as he start to go in flank, turn its way, so most of the time you can avoid that wave and sail trough, but get hit by second ones 1-2torps. Its works even better with faster BBs.  And dont wait to react in 3-4km range as you are dead by then....you have to react while they are 7km+ out, sometimes they see you charging in and change target to another teammate....even more chance for that if frendly CV  have fighter squads.

[Whatever08152]

As a hobbyist CV driver, yes I can and the amount of planes lost is situational just like the amount of torps you'll eat.

If you are bugged by cruisers and destroyers as well as me there is a big chance you will get damaged.

If my planes are bugged by cruisers and fighters then there is a big chance you won't get damaged.

 

In 1 vs 1 I'll take my time and you will turn into a bad spot eventually.

BB's simply can't keep up with the planes and their idiotic turn rates.

 

With descent AA the BB will not let you take your time. Beginning with the Colorado amerikan BBs wont let you cycle around them very long if they have AA build

But indeed it is very situational and also RNG. Some rounds you shoot down all planes of a TBsquad and next time in almost the same situation the AA cant even down one single bomber ;)

[ParEx]

Can anyone suggest how in a BB you avoid being the meat in a torpedo bomber sandwich?

This keeps happening to me in the Wyoming where a CC has two sets of torpedo bombers and attack from either side of your ship. You just cannot avoid getting hit by 3 or 4 torpedoes.

 

P.S. don't say stay with the cruisers because they won't stay with you and why should they they get almost no reward for acting as AA defence

 

 

You cant do anything. At tier4 the AA non existant, you can hope for a smart CV captain to provide cover and take down enemy bombers.

A lone BB is a large bunch of free damaage in CVs and DDs view.

What you can do is stick to friendly CAs as you proceed up the tiers (AA gets stronger, a lone BB is still a juicy target). Or ask your CV for support.

Thing is: as long as there are no smart allied ships around that see the need to help you are lost most likely.

 

[Drycon]

 

With descent AA the BB will not let you take your time. Beginning with the Colorado amerikan BBs wont let you cycle around them very long if they have AA build

But indeed it is very situational and also RNG. Some rounds you shoot down all planes of a TBsquad and next time in almost the same situation the AA cant even down one single bomber ;)

I guess with higher tiers you should indeed not circle around long.

I'm speccing most of my captains as AA. They are not in high tiers yet but it still gives me a good insight of what to do as a BB and also what to avoid as a CV.

 

 

[Nevercalled3]

This happened to me just few times in this game, and only in low tier BBs with no AA. When I see torp planes, I Immediately start turning towards them. If CV tries to create a sandwitch, he usually cant and he also looses a lot of planes in process. 

 

lol......

 

Play CV and u will see that it doesn`t matter. Only when u are 2 tiers higher than CV or u have CA support ( with defensive AA on - not all ppl have it lol) it can be usefull.

 

And from t8 BB they are long.....too long.... Any torp run is an easy cake to hit with 5-6 torps ( the minimum i got on USN CV was 4).

 

 

the best torp avoiders are t7 right now with fast rudder however they have not enough AA to do anything with planes. When u see that BS started to turn one side u can easily move tB to the second side and full salvo will hit. U only miss when u see enemy fighters incoming or enemy CA and are afraid of loosing bombers.

 

When u hit T7 CV u have like 70 planes so u don`t care about loosing bombers anymore.

 

At t9-10 enemy CV has so many bombers and USN 2 squads of TB rape everything. The only way is to hide behind your CAs

 

 

It looks much better when u fight with IJN CV but still.

 

 

[trrprrprr]

Most importan thing that doesnt get advertised mych is that YOU CAN SINGLE OUT desired plane squad for your AA to focus on, i always target torpedo squads...sure they come last, so AA starts firing randomly fighters and bombers, but as soon as my targeted squad is in AA range all guns focus on that and as soon as you shoot down even one of those planes, most CV players stress out and do mistakes....sometimes just fks up manual drop, so they have to retreat a bit and try again...thats the window where he loses more and more as you can turn away from it even in slow bb....but sure, sometimes you will get killed by one manual drop, sometimes even by one torp if it hits ammo.

[Whatever08152]

 

lol......

 

Play CV and u will see that it doesn`t matter. Only when u are 2 tiers higher than CV or u have CA support ( with defensive AA on - not all ppl have it lol) it can be usefull.

 

And from t8 BB they are long.....too long.... Any torp run is an easy cake to hit with 5-6 torps ( the minimum i got on USN CV was 4).

 

 

the best torp avoiders are t7 right now with fast rudder however they have not enough AA to do anything with planes. When u see that BS started to turn one side u can easily move tB to the second side and full salvo will hit. U only miss when u see enemy fighters incoming or enemy CA and are afraid of loosing bombers.

 

When u hit T7 CV u have like 70 planes so u don`t care about loosing bombers anymore.

 

At t9-10 enemy CV has so many bombers and USN 2 squads of TB rape everything. The only way is to hide behind your CAs

 

 

It looks much better when u fight with IJN CV but still.

 

 

 

Errm, no ...and no.

 

Try to torp an AA build NC and you will see how she rapes your planes. BBs dont have to be afrait of equally tiered CVs and they dont have to hide behind CAs ... I can even defend against a Midway in a full AA Iowa (well defend means that he has to attack me in two waves until Im done ...but usually they will just take an easier target after the first wave)

 

 

[gronaAnkan]

I find that the best thing you can do is to turn tail and run away. Yeah sure, planes will catch up to you eventually but even if you only got a little bit of AA (like even the upgraded Wyoming hull), that will give your AA enough time to do some work and it puts the carrier in the position of having to choose between taking time and suffer exposure to yours and others AA or take a sub-optimal rear shot. If you're with friends with good AA, you go unscathed; if you're alone, you'll take one or two torpedoes unless you mess up. Either way, that's 5 minutes worth of effort from the carrier, only taking one or two torpedoes in a battleship means that the carrier is behind.

 

I think the important thing to grasp is that when you're targeted by a carrier, you are no longer playing the game you intended to play, the one where you shoot at things (why, I imagine, some people don't like carriers). No, you're playing a game where your job is to survive and must drop everything else you're trying to do in order to achieve that.

[Drycon]

Survival is the first rule of combat I think.

But 1. It is harder to dodge torps from behind, you are very limited in your movement (at least, thats my experience)

and 2. You are running away and thus (I guess) not contributing to your team.

So the CV captain has not only achieved damaging you (if at all) but also kept you from shooting his teammates (in some cases).

 

And by the time you turned your big [edited]BB around again the next wave might be chasing you 

 

 

 

 

[pra3y]

I think constant turning in 1 direction still seem to be the best method though (unless yr bb has high AA). Going around in circles make a tb drop extremely tough since if the cv captain tries to torp sandwhich u they have to constantly juggle those 2 wing to ensure that their torps hit you and I don't know about the others but to me its pretty difficult  as a cv captain to do that (compared to say u sailing in a straightline/slow down/speed up/turn left turn right etc).The added benefit while u keep doing yr constant hard turn is that as mentioned in previous posts yr aa can chew up the planes or at least ensure you'll take 1 less torp while the cv captain tries to manouver and get the best possible attack angle. 

[Hauptbahnhof]

Can anyone suggest how in a BB you avoid being the meat in a torpedo bomber sandwich?

This keeps happening to me in the Wyoming where a CC has two sets of torpedo bombers and attack from either side of your ship. You just cannot avoid getting hit by 3 or 4 torpedoes.

 

Did you try turning the ship so the bow faces one of the squads and your aft face the squad on the other side of the ship?

[Drycon]

Keep turning in circles and you will eat more torps than you can handle.

A circle motion is just as easy to calculate for a CV captain and you might end up with 4 hits instead of 2. (from IJN bombers)

[Hauptbahnhof]

Keep turning in circles and you will eat more torps than you can handle.

A circle motion is just as easy to calculate for a CV captain and you might end up with 4 hits instead of 2. (from IJN bombers)

 

It's close impossible to hit with 4/4 torps with IJN bombers unless your targeting the longest ship in the game and angle + time it perfectly so the first torp hit the extreme rear and the last torp hit the extreme front. It simply doesn't happen.

 

In IJN CVs you should count with reliably doing:

 

1/4 hit - bad drop, good dodging, fairly common

2/4 hits - decent hit, bad dodge from target, most common if your decent CV captain.

3/4 hits - perfect hit, no doding from target + long ship target at high speed and right angle. Pretty rare

4/4 hits - one in a million.

 

 

 

Yesterday I had an enemy ranger (234m long), fit between two torps in a spread launched perfectly perpendicular towards it ( disrupted by fan effect, but still you should get an idea of how wide the IJN spread is ).

[Drycon]

If a ship keeps turning you make the drop from behind while he is steering away.

Doesn't require a big ship but a big turning circle, which a lot of BB's have, cruisers are better off.

Everything is situational ofcourse.

 

I do have a pretty good idea of the IJN torps, I only have a IJN CV.

The torps should be tighter together or a lot faster, at the moment it's just laughable easy to dodge IJN torpsquads.

Manually dropping is the only way to score hits.

[trrprrprr]

If a ship keeps turning you make the drop from behind while he is steering away.

Doesn't require a big ship but a big turning circle, which a lot of BB's have, cruisers are better off.

Everything is situational ofcourse.

 

I do have a pretty good idea of the IJN torps, I only have a IJN CV.

The torps should be tighter together or a lot faster, at the moment it's just laughable easy to dodge IJN torpsquads.

Manually dropping is the only way to score hits.

 

And manual aiming should be only way of scoring the hit. How many CVs ive met, who just autoattack and forget...and they pay the price for that. Like one of last games in Colorado, where one tier 7 CV autoattacked me three times with torps and bombs, in all three times he did manage to hit me with one bomb for 3k damage, no torpeds did hit or was even close to my ship. Only manual attack pays off and its all fine there!

[Drycon]

 

And manual aiming should be only way of scoring the hit. How many CVs ive met, who just autoattack and forget...and they pay the price for that. Like one of last games in Colorado, where one tier 7 CV autoattacked me three times with torps and bombs, in all three times he did manage to hit me with one bomb for 3k damage, no torpeds did hit or was even close to my ship. Only manual attack pays off and its all fine there!

 

A lot of CV captains would sell their CV pretty fast if manual was the only way.

That would make a lot of other captains very happy I guess.

I sort of agree with you, after all the main guns on other ships do not fire by themselves as well.

 

The only planes I sent away to bomb automatically are the dive bombers, they hardly do damage and people do not even try to avoid them.

But the attack order is always given in the last minute, not from the other side of the map.

[DJ_Die]

I don't even understand why someone besides newbies in T4 CVs would use autodrop as it's completely useless against anyone with a half-working brain