Some interesting info around the world

[Domin1c]

 

I got a survey after my last battle asking if the sides were balanced. Said yes, I hadn't really thought about it before. The one's that bug me are Strait battles where 2/3 of one side is vs 1/3 the other.

 

They (supposedly) fixed that in a previous patch. I find it way better now, than the retarded 7/4 split spawns, so my bias tells me the fix has worked.

[Kurbain]

That has nothing to do about tier 5 destroyer balance compared to tier 10, all the above says is your team wasnt supporting you.

 

I think what creamgravy was trying to say is that the performance of IJN DDs is much better at the mid-tiers because there are a lot more inexperienced/stupid players around.

 

In my opinion the Minekaze is indeed the best-balanced IJN destroyer. It has very good torpedoes, but is forced to get close to the enemies to use them, which puts the Minekaze into a dangerous position.

However, it has the lowest detection at its tier, which means it can usually prepare its escape before the enemies starts firing at it.

 

Forcing the Shimakaze into the same kind of playstyle is generally a good idea, but it faces several problems the Minekaze doesn't:

1. Radar. I like the idea of radar, but now that the high-tier IJN DDs have been re-balanced it is too powerful against them.

2. All of the enemy non-Russian DDs which the Shimakaze meets in battle have a concealment which is better or equal to it: Benson, Fletcher, Gearing, Fubuki, Kagero.

 

A useful feature of the Minekaze is that if it's low-tier, it is guaranteed to have the lowest detection of anything on the field, which can allow it to perform very well even in T7 battles.

Meanwhile the Shimakaze always has to go up against ships with a better concealment than itself.

 

In my opinion IJN DDs should have by far the best torpedoes and concealment, but should be forced to get close to use them as a trade-off. That's exactly what the Minekaze is about.

[Ictogan]

 

I think what creamgravy was trying to say is that the performance of IJN DDs is much better at the mid-tiers because there are a lot more inexperienced/stupid players around.

 

In my opinion the Minekaze is indeed the best-balanced IJN destroyer. It has very good torpedoes, but is forced to get close to the enemies to use them, which puts the Minekaze into a dangerous position.

However, it has the lowest detection at its tier, which means it can usually prepare its escape before the enemies starts firing at it.

 

Forcing the Shimakaze into the same kind of playstyle is generally a good idea, but it faces several problems the Minekaze doesn't:

1. Radar. I like the idea of radar, but now that the high-tier IJN DDs have been re-balanced it is too powerful against them.

2. All of the enemy non-Russian DDs which the Shimakaze meets in battle have a concealment which is better or equal to it: Benson, Fletcher, Gearing, Fubuki, Kagero.

 

A useful feature of the Minekaze is that if it's low-tier, it is guaranteed to have the lowest detection of anything on the field, which can allow it to perform very well even in T7 battles.

Meanwhile the Shimakaze always has to go up against ships with a better concealment than itself.

 

In my opinion IJN DDs should have by far the best torpedoes and concealment, but should be forced to get close to use them as a trade-off. That's exactly what the Minekaze is about.

Forcing ships to get close in high tiers isn't really that great an idea, because the other ships often hang at the back, which means no support in knife fights and there are additional ways of spotting DDs in high tiers(radar). If they decided to force it to come close before radar I would be fine, but now it feels like a bad decision. Also don't forget that often half the team focuses fire on a Shima the second he's spotted whereas there's much less focused fire on destroyers in mid tiers.

[Takeda92]

If the give the high tier IJN DDs an additional 2 km for their gun range, maybe they can use their stealth fire properly without having to take AFT.

Since the USN gets 18 rpm for their 5" which was the maximum for (and only for short amount of time, the guns had to be cooled downed after that) then Give Kagero and Shimakaze 9-10 rpm which was the maximum rof for their guns.

 

Fletcher pretty much had the same good torpedoes that Kagero has, sacrificing a bit of range for a bit of speed. Unless Fletcher's torps get nerfed too, I can only see improving the IJN DDs guns to be the way.

[Ictogan]

If the give the high tier IJN DDs an additional 2 km for their gun range, maybe they can use their stealth fire properly without having to take AFT.

Since the USN gets 18 rpm for their 5" which was the maximum for (and only for short amount of time, the guns had to be cooled downed after that) then Give Kagero and Shimakaze 9-10 rpm which was the maximum rof for their guns.

 

Fletcher pretty much had the same good torpedoes that Kagero has, sacrificing a bit of range for a bit of speed. Unless Fletcher's torps get nerfed too, I can only see improving the IJN DDs guns to be the way.

 

Having 9-10rpm and 2km more range would put them I the strange position of having similar guns to the Russian ones, while having much better torps.

[Panocek]

 

Having 9-10rpm and 2km more range would put them I the strange position of having similar guns to the Russian ones, while having much better torps.

 

IJN 127mm are already effective provided one isn't afraid to use them. Having rof and range buffed you will end up with DDs that have IMO the best cannons - RU AP are good, but situational, while IJN can just HEspam and burn everything while having decent ballistics, the best concealment and still potent torpedoes.

[Ictogan]

 

IJN 127mm are already effective provided one isn't afraid to use them. Having rof and range buffed you will end up with DDs that have IMO the best cannons - RU AP are good, but situational, while IJN can just HEspam and burn everything while having decent ballistics, the best concealment and still potent torpedoes.

Imo the main problem with IJN DDs at high tiers is that they can't properly use their stealth anymore. Now that radar has been introduced, often it is impossible to stay hidden and even not considering that, the Kagero doesn't have the speed to get out of bad situations whereas the Shima doesn't have the stealth to stay out of them. Although it's still a lot better for the Shima because its guns are at least still useable while maneuvering whereas any attempt to use Kagero guns while maneuvering is useless.

[ColonelPete]

Speed could be increased to historical values and manoeuvrability could be increased.

[Takeda92]

 

Having 9-10rpm and 2km more range would put them I the strange position of having similar guns to the Russian ones, while having much better torps.

 

I was going for either instead of both. I should have made that clear I guess.

[Mayv]

Kurbain, on 13 May 2016 - 02:25 AM, said:

In my opinion the Minekaze is indeed the best-balanced IJN destroyer. It has very good torpedoes, but is forced to get close to the enemies to use them, which puts the Minekaze into a dangerous position.
However, it has the lowest detection at its tier, which means it can usually prepare its escape before the enemies starts firing at it.

 

The Minekaze is fast and nimble. The Shimakaze is just straight line fast.

The Minekaze is small. The Shimakaze is big. (for a DD anyway).

Secondaries shoot further at high tiers and despite what BB captains say, you dont want to stay in secondary range long.

Maps are bigger at high tiers and you arent any faster. (Slower if counting speed in turns and accelerating). It takes longer to get within your torpedo range of each different target, unless they are all together.

 

[Todger_Fairmile]

 

They (supposedly) fixed that in a previous patch. I find it way better now, than the retarded 7/4 split spawns, so my bias tells me the fix has worked.

 

No they haven't fixed it. I'm still getting in those battles.

[Xerkics]

Is radar actually that much of a problem at tier 10 as people claim tho for shimakqze ? Or is it confirmation bias .Quite often when you get pulled into tier 10 you see 2-3 cruisers max compared to how many DDs and Bb And first those cruisers try to stay as far back as they can to avoid being wrecked by bb and not hunt for DD and then again only Soviet and USN ones have acess to radar? And is radar on top of anti air consumable? Because USN ones tend to use anti air .

[Ictogan]

Is radar actually that much of a problem at tier 10 as people claim tho for shimakqze ? Or is it confirmation bias .Quite often when you get pulled into tier 10 you see 2-3 cruisers max compared to how many DDs and Bb And first those cruisers try to stay as far back as they can to avoid being wrecked by bb and not hunt for DD and then again only Soviet and USN ones have acess to radar? And is radar on top of anti air consumable? Because USN ones tend to use anti air .

Radar replaces the plane, not the anti air. Russian radar is only a problem when on low HP due to the short duration, but a US ship using radar can be quite devastating. Of course it also depends on the situation. It's not really a problem to be detected by radar while 9km away from the ship that's using it but it's a death sentence if a Des Moines 6.5km away uses his radar - that insane RPM combined with 40s radar makes it an insane DD killer. Which is why I never get that close to ships that have radar and there are ships in the area that have the DPM to kill me during the radar duration.

But I don't really care about the radar on a ship like the Dmitri because he himself won't be able to seriously hurt me during that 25s duration of his radar, but if other enemy ships are nearby which could kill me, I will be more cautious.

 

Also there is a decent amount of cruisers in high tiers. Since patch 0.5.5 the number of DDs has dropped a lot.

[Spellfire40]

Radar replaces the plane, not the anti air. Russian radar is only a problem when on low HP due to the short duration, but a US ship using radar can be quite devastating. Of course it also depends on the situation. It's not really a problem to be detected by radar while 9km away from the ship that's using it but it's a death sentence if a Des Moines 6.5km away uses his radar - that insane RPM combined with 40s radar makes it an insane DD killer. Which is why I never get that close to ships that have radar and there are ships in the area that have the DPM to kill me during the radar duration.

But I don't really care about the radar on a ship like the Dmitri because he himself won't be able to seriously hurt me during that 25s duration of his radar, but if other enemy ships are nearby which could kill me, I will be more cautious.

 

Also there is a decent amount of cruisers in high tiers. Since patch 0.5.5 the number of DDs has dropped a lot.

 

​Im not concerned with Radar in an IJN DD. Im concerned with being inable to hit a retreating Taget with Torpedos and the lack of 2 of the 3 nerfed DDs Speed to atually make use of the high risk Torpedos without geting in near suicide risky situations.

 

But we are geting awfully offtopic. There are more than enogh Topics with the pro and cons of the IJN Torps and before we see what they mean with their more gentle aditional nerfs it be all Gusswork anyway. Just what i fear a bit is that they are totallly unplayable once they "fix" CV gameplay enogh to bring them back iti the equasion because in CBT DDs were basically stattkiller due to the fact that invisibility is useless if you sit in an low HP ship and 7 squads of planes roam around in nearlly every game.

[Xerkics]

 

​Im not concerned with Radar in an IJN DD. Im concerned with being inable to hit a retreating Taget with Torpedos and the lack of 2 of the 3 nerfed DDs Speed to atually make use of the high risk Torpedos without geting in near suicide risky situations.

 

But we are geting awfully offtopic. There are more than enogh Topics with the pro and cons of the IJN Torps and before we see what they mean with their more gentle aditional nerfs it be all Gusswork anyway. Just what i fear a bit is that they are totallly unplayable once they "fix" CV gameplay enogh to bring them back iti the equasion because in CBT DDs were basically stattkiller due to the fact that invisibility is useless if you sit in an low HP ship and 7 squads of planes roam around in nearlly every game.

I can assure you that cvs are way more annoying than any destroyer for everyone else between tier 4-9. It's only tier 10 where DD are really an issue.

[Spellfire40]

I can assure you that cvs are way more annoying than any destroyer for everyone else between tier 4-9. It's only tier 10 where DD are really an issue.

 

​Tell that WG because Kagaro and Fubuki have to live with the nerfs too and they have neither the ship Speed nor the sheer number of Torps of a shima to compensate

[Ictogan]

 

​Tell that WG because Kagaro and Fubuki have to live with the nerfs too and they have neither the ship Speed nor the sheer number of Torps of a shima to compensate

 

Fubuki was buffed, not nerfed. Unless you are talking about the whole 3s delay when SA goes off.

[Babykim]

 

A bit more of news digest from getfun:

 

Source:

 

1. Currently player surveys about the MM appear at the end of the battle. If you leave the battle before it ends, you will not get a survey. This will be changed in the future, so that more players can partake. The developers say that the data collected in surveys are analyzed by a competent team.

 

2. The developers concede shortcomings in the balancing of divisions that pertain to the distribution of divisions between the teams.

 

3. One developer said that a new matchmaking engine is under development. No details.

 

[edited]

 

[Pajosaurus]

The only thing Minekaze (and Isokaze) could stand to have nerfed is their torpedo reload time. I do think it's a bit too fast. Take cca 10 or 15 seconds off and it's perfect. 

[Kurbain]

[edited]

 

Well, it is quite difficult to accurately gauge the effectiveness and strength of IJN DDs.

 

Firstly they are heavily countered by the presence of CVs and other DDs more than any other classes. If planes or DDs spot your torpedoes, they are rendered largely useless.

Secondly the effectiveness of IJN DDs greatly depends on the players they fight against. Versus inattentive or inexperienced players that drive in a straight-line they can be very powerful, but against an attentive player using WASD and dodging all torpedos they can have very little impact.

 

Subsequently the impression players have of IJN DDs can vary greatly.

If there are 1 or 2 good CV players in your match and you try to your best to dodge the torpedoes of the enemy DDs, you may get the impression that they are completely useless.

If no CVs are around and you are a player that likes to drive in a straight-line often, you may be surprised by a sudden wall of torpedoes appearing out of nowhere and get one-shotted, which might entice you to consider IJN DDs horribly overpowered.

 

I guess it boils down to whether you want to view them from the perspective of an average or good player.

 

As a big fan of the WASD hack and good situational awareness, I tend to rarely get hit by torpedoes, which leads me towards the impression that ships like the Minekaze are not overpowered, because their effectiveness can be heavily reduced by every enemy they face if they play correctly.

Considering the way torpedoes work in-game, you have to rely on your enemy making mistakes in order to deal significant amounts of damage, which is no fun in my opinion.

DDs should have a fair chance to deal damage even if the enemy is a proficient player, just like any other ship class.

That's why I consider the Minekaze with its excellent reload, 3 launchers and concealment, but short range a good example of IJN DDs.

[Panocek]

 

Well, it is quite difficult to accurately gauge the effectiveness and strength of IJN DDs.

 

Firstly they are heavily countered by the presence of CVs and other DDs more than any other classes. If planes or DDs spot your torpedoes, they are rendered largely useless.

Secondly the effectiveness of IJN DDs greatly depends on the players they fight against. Versus inattentive or inexperienced players that drive in a straight-line they can be very powerful, but against an attentive player using WASD and dodging all torpedos they can have very little impact.

 

Subsequently the impression players have of IJN DDs can vary greatly.

If there are 1 or 2 good CV players in your match and you try to your best to dodge the torpedoes of the enemy DDs, you may get the impression that they are completely useless.

If no CVs are around and you are a player that likes to drive in a straight-line often, you may be surprised by a sudden wall of torpedoes appearing out of nowhere and get one-shotted, which might entice you to consider IJN DDs horribly overpowered.

 

I guess it boils down to whether you want to view them from the perspective of an average or good player.

 

As a big fan of the WASD hack and good situational awareness, I tend to rarely get hit by torpedoes, which leads me towards the impression that ships like the Minekaze are not overpowered, because their effectiveness can be heavily reduced by every enemy they face if they play correctly.

Considering the way torpedoes work in-game, you have to rely on your enemy making mistakes in order to deal significant amounts of damage, which is no fun in my opinion.

DDs should have a fair chance to deal damage even if the enemy is a proficient player, just like any other ship class.

That's why I consider the Minekaze with its excellent reload, 3 launchers and concealment, but short range a good example of IJN DDs.

 

3x2 launchers can be useful, balanced and fun, 3x5 is just too hard to balance. 15 torps every 45s is just nope.avi, unless you give them like 8k damage per torpedo.

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

If the give the high tier IJN DDs an additional 2 km for their gun range, maybe they can use their stealth fire properly without having to take AFT.

Since the USN gets 18 rpm for their 5" which was the maximum for (and only for short amount of time, the guns had to be cooled downed after that) then Give Kagero and Shimakaze 9-10 rpm which was the maximum rof for their guns.

 

Fletcher pretty much had the same good torpedoes that Kagero has, sacrificing a bit of range for a bit of speed. Unless Fletcher's torps get nerfed too, I can only see improving the IJN DDs guns to be the way.

 

+1 for your sig alone

[Babykim]

I have found these notes, apparently leaked from a test server. Anyone seen these before?

 

Buffs:

• New Mexico ​Hull C - some single-mount Oerlikon -[become]-> twin-mount Oerlikon. AA goes to 58/75/60 (outer/mid/inner AA ring, add up for total AA, and check in-game stats for current AA)

• Cleveland - 127mm DP has 5km range as secondary armament. (was 4km)

• Colorado ​Hull C- some single-mount Oerlikon --> twin-mount Oerlikons, some twin-mount Bofors --> quad-mount Bofors. AA goes to 58/161/133.

• N. Carolina​ Hull A - ALL Bofors --> quad-mount Bofors. AA goes to 151/159/166. 127 DP has 5km range as secondary. (was 4.5km)

• N. Carolina Hull B - more quad Bofors!. AA goes to 151/239/158. DP buffs.

• ​Iowa Hull A - ALL Bofors --> quad-mount Bofors. AA goes to 151/223/76 ​Max speed goes to 33knot with engine upgrade. DP has 6km range as secondary.

• Iowa Hull B - more quad Bofors AA goes to 151/286/176. DP and speed buffs.

• Iowa Hull C - more and more quad Bofors. AA goes to 151/302/195 (a total of 19 quad Bofors installed, historical config. Hurray!). DP and speed buffs.

• Montana -​ Get 1 more quad Bofors to surpass Iowa. (20 mounts, was 19, guess where is the new Bofors installed ;) AA goes to 157/318/194. Maximum speed goes to 30knot. 127mm DP has 6km range as secondary. (was 5km)

• Ishizuchi - Now she has AA! AA goes to 6/0/0 (go and get your first plane shotdown in Ishizuchi)

• Myogi Hull C - has more 25mm AA gun installed, and say bye-bye to small caliber AA guns. AA goes to 15/40/0.

• Kuma Hull B - more AA guns! AA goes to 0/30/5.

• Furutaka - the old Hull C is her new Hull B, and the new Hull C comes with 3 twin-mount main turrets! (30s/180deg, 36s for single-mount turrets) Reload time is independent from the Hull upgrade, 200mm shell always takes 22s to reload and 203mm takes 15s. AA goes to 20/20/7.

• Fuso Hull B - more small caliber AA guns! AA goes to 40/14/35.

• Fuso Hull C - bye-bye small caliber AA guns! AA goes to 40/81/0.

• Aoba Hull A - now uses the same DP as Furutaka Hull C. AA goes to 20/10/53. She now has more hit point. (30500, was 26300)

• Aoba Hull B - has more hit point. (31900, was 30500)

• Nagato Hull B - more 25mm AA guns! AA goes to 40/70/0. And she now has turrets with rangefinders!

• Nagato Hull C - more 25mm AA guns! AA goes to 40/188/0.

• Amagi Hull C - more 25mm AA guns! AA goes to 81/215/0​.

• Hipper -​ Hull C (new). With powerful AA guns. AA goes to 100/135/53 (See below for her Hull B stats).

• Roon Hull B -​ More AA guns! AA goes to 100/165/60. (See below for her Hull A stats).

• From Hipper Hull B all the way to Hindenburg - HE ammo changed to "203mm Spr.gr. L/4.7 Kz." (2500 13%, was 2300 11%, spam the HE!)

• U.S.S.R. ships - Global buff to three AA guns. 37mm 70-K AA gun has range increased to 3.2km (was 2km). 37mm 66-K and 37mm 46-K AA gun have range increased to 3.5km (was 3.2km). Check in-game to see who are affected.

• Moskva - 130mm DP has 6.5km as secondary. (was 5km, U.S.S.R over U.S. indeed, play soviet ships for the win!)

Tweaks:

• Karlsruhe - armor scheme changed.

• Konigsberg Hull B - removed some AA guns for a new catapult and catapult fighter consumables. AA downs to 24/10/12. Armor scheme changed.

• Nurnberg - Hull C (new). Removed two torpedo tubes and catapults for additional AA guns. AA goes to 32/60/89. The total research cost is unchanged.

• Hipper Hull B - ALL 20mm Flak 38 --> 37mm Flak 30. AA downs to 100/55/52 (enhanced mid ring but nerfed inner ring).

• Hindenburg - ALL 40mm Flak 28 --> 7 new twin-mount 55mm Gerat 58. AA downs to 133/206/72 (but mid ring now has consistent range of 5km, consider it a tweak).

Nerfs:

• Roon Hull A - 37mm Flak LM/42 --> 20mm Flak 38. AA downs to 100/117/30. (enhanced inner ring but nerfed mid ring, consider it a nerf).

• Japanese ships - Global nerf to 100mm DP. It lost 36% of its original AA strength. (13.3dps each mount, was 20.8). (Zao, Ibuki, Taiho and Hakuryu are affected, do your math to see how bad the nerf is)

[Gojuadorai]

seems like someone at WG hates carriers....

 

in my view the nürnberg c hull is strange.

trade 2x3 torps and fighter for aa mounts .... not so sure i want that

not what the ship needs

lower waterline *cough*

 

[Takeda92]

Yeah these were on reddit