The reason why CV is OP and RNG is a big part of this game

[goodman528]

I have played CV up to tier 10 Hakuryu / tier 7 Ranger, and BB up to tier 8 Amagi / NC. I have now realized the real reason why people complain that CV is OP:

 

The single most important factor in how much damage a CV does in a game is NOT match making, nor torpedo activation time, nor AA, nor ability cool down time, nor whatever other factor you think it is. The single factor that mostly determines how much damage a CV does in a game is TIME. The longer a game lasts, the higher damage the CV does. Now, because in most games cruisers and DDs hide behind BBs, and the BBs hide in a corner of the map sailing in circles firing at maximum range. This means most games last 15-20 minutes. So, Bingo! CVs are OP! If your team actually attacks and caps everything and win or loose the game in under 10 minutes, CV average damage will be halved.

 

This is also the reason why people complain about RNG. Close to 5km and you need to switch your screen off if you don't want to kill anything and everything in 2 to 3 salvos with a BB. But at 20km+, yes RNG becomes a big part of the game.

[JohnHusky]

Well said. Devs can we now have our cv's back to normal?

 

Should have taken a screen of my last game. 4 BB's where "hiding" in the top left cornor at full health. While trying to shoot at 2 BB's going towards them at half health

 

[Maj_Havoc]

Did this realisation come to you all at once, or did it sink in slowly over time?

 

The more time you have available to shoot the enemy the more damage you can accumulate: ✔.

The longer the range the greater the dispersion: ✔.

 

Check back next week where the op runs you through his observations on the log in process.

[Syrchalis]

Well, as obvious as it is, apparently a lot of people aren't aware of it, so why mock his post?

[IamTroublemaker]

But still, how are people supposed to kill a CV quickly? Especially if it's fast and hard to catch for DDs or CAs...

[Syrchalis]

But still, how are people supposed to kill a CV quickly? Especially if it's fast and hard to catch for DDs or CAs...

 

Well thats kinda the point - you don't kill the CV.

 

If everyone stays back and plays super defensively game will drag along and CV can kill one after another.

If everyone rushes forward, you might break through the enemy frontline fast enough and CV might be exposed. Either way, game will be shorter and given that CV attacks have 3-4min cooldown he will get a lot less attacks in.

 

I think that's what OP wants to say.

[Kaptain_Tripps]

People hiding at the back is really starting to get me down in this game. When I'm in a BB I'll lead a charge only to have all my support turn tail and run at the first sight of the enemy and when I'm in a CA I seem to waiting for our BBs to close to a range I can actually get involved in the fight. Half the CVs seem to only hide at the back and keep their fighters for self defense rather than keeping up with the fleet to pool AA. 

[Protonentechnik]

I agree with the TE. I play mostly BBs and i like to fight at distances of ~10-15km, but there a few problems when you try to get closer to the enemy and play more aggressive...

1. You will be often alone 

2. In most situations you will then get focused by the CV.

3. You move into the DD torps and that means you lose time to dodge them.

4. There is no reward for Spotting or fighting in close Quarters (except the more Damage you will make).

 

 

[Luckyio]

Well, as obvious as it is, apparently a lot of people aren't aware of it, so why mock his post?

 

Because he appears to suggest that this rule only applies to CVs and not other ships, which are in the exactly same boat on this one.

[Un1eash]

But still, how are people supposed to kill a CV quickly? Especially if it's fast and hard to catch for DDs or CAs...

 

you don't need to kill CVs... just kill their plane ,in fast game defensive fire already kill da CVs

[IamTroublemaker]

 

you don't need to kill CVs... just kill their plane ,in fast game defensive fire already kill da CVs

 

A good and smart CV captain will not let his planes go near ships with strong AA, unless he has to...

 

If I have to face a strong AA ship in my US CV, I just sacrifice the fighters squad (let them go above the ship first so it focuses fire on them) and that's how I manage to do some dmg...

[LilJumpa]

Well, as obvious as it is, apparently a lot of people aren't aware of it, so why mock his post?

 

A lot of people are not even aware of the minimap or the clock in the upper right corner.

 

Since the changes to MM and CV loadouts I actually noticed more whine threads from CV players than "CV are OP" threads. Post-4.1, the average battle time has not really changed.

So saying it's the average battle length that lets Carriers get more damage and XP than all  other ship classes is like telling everyone "don't sail in a straight line".

 

 

[allufewig]

Another "class x were not OP if Players did y" - thread.

 

Guys, it doesnt really work that way. Randoms are played in a certain fashion: chaos. You have to balance this game for chaos. You cant adjust your game on strategically acting or thinking teams, because this is not what we have or will ever get. (Clanwars aside maybe). Every try to balance vehicles on imaginary teamplay or shifting the blame to the players that do not do what you think they should, will ultimately fail.

 

 

[Syrchalis]

Problem is, if you balance for chaos, teamwork becomes OP. And not in a good way. Basically a 3 man division can easily stomp everyone else then, because of how OP teamwork is and will win every time. Also some mechanics suddenly will become broken (either because they are useless or because they are so strong with no counter that you can forfeit right at the start).

[True_Winterfeld]

Dont know about the time thingy, but I totaly agree on the "Sniper-BB-BadASS". What a waste of a good BB! But it seams there are a lot of WOT players doing it. Iam not blaming them, but they seem not to grasp that this valid WOT tactic doesnt work in WOWs. In any case not as in WOT. Not only do you need a lot of practice for this long range shots, you must also pray that the target is stupid and RNGesus is with you and that all the time.

 

As a CA skipper I always stick in higher tier games with the aggressiv BBs. Dont care if the skipper is a noob. As long the BB engages! If my BBs are passive, I retreat behind them, let them be the first line of defense. A Myoko is expensive to repair and I am not an XP Pinata for the other team.

[ParEx]

 

A good and smart CV captain will not let his planes go near ships with strong AA, unless he has to...

 

If I have to face a strong AA ship in my US CV, I just sacrifice the fighters squad (let them go above the ship first so it focuses fire on them) and that's how I manage to do some dmg...

 

Works only on stupid players. When I am in a US CA (Usually Cleveland or Atlanta) and I see fighters above my head but I know there are Bombers around, I just focus my AA on the fighters, and let it shoot them down but as soon as the Bombers come in reach of my AA is switch to them and activate the AA-Boost. Planes drop like flies.

 

Thats the best thing about the Atlanta. Almost no CV will attack you if there is anything else to attack

 

 

[Un1eash]

 

A good and smart CV captain will not let his planes go near ships with strong AA, unless he has to...

 

If I have to face a strong AA ship in my US CV, I just sacrifice the fighters squad (let them go above the ship first so it focuses fire on them) and that's how I manage to do some dmg...

 

that absolutely their captain 's fault since they activate it on fighter and plane can be focus fire by clicking at them

[Mangrey]

WG need to make higher reward for Capping !!! , the K/D is not impotent, High win rate and high cap points thats counts.

there a few games out there witch to that, maby use tham as inspiration.

 

 

Mang 

[Seinta]

Another "class x were not OP if Players did y" - thread.

 

A BB cannot one shot a Cruiser if he doesn't show his broadside! - No teamwork needed!

A DD cannot hit a ship if he doesn't sail in a straight line! - No teamwork needed!

A CV cannot sink a ship that is escorted! - Not teemwork needed, because you can just sail next ship!

 

Class X is not OP if the player on the recieving end is competent!

 

[allufewig]

Problem is, if you balance for chaos, teamwork becomes OP. And not in a good way. Basically a 3 man division can easily stomp everyone else then, because of how OP teamwork is and will win every time. Also some mechanics suddenly will become broken (either because they are useless or because they are so strong with no counter that you can forfeit right at the start).

 

 

I dont agree.

 

Classes must be balanced for roughly the same effectiveness in a random environment with people doing random (and stupid) things, but winning because skill and teamwork should never be limited. Divisions are evenly matched on the teams. If one division keeps winning, theyre simply better than their opposing players.

 

You encourage teamplay by giving people the chance to win more. Force them to some sort of gameplay like in "aggressively push to kill the enemy CV" or "babysit your own carriers because they were soooo important IRL", they get pissed. Rightfully so.

[Torpedo42]

But still, how are people supposed to kill a CV quickly? Especially if it's fast and hard to catch for DDs or CAs...

 

+1. Good point. End of discussion.

 

Please, BB, CA, and DD, dont hide behind isles nor map corners. Its so boring for retard torpedo bombers pilots to travel so long. Please, go fast to the middle of the map, thus those pro skilled CVs players can farm tons of kills, cash and exp. easily. With a shorter game duration they can be able to jump to another game and ruin another game quickly.

[allufewig]

Statistics >

 

 

A BB cannot one shot a Cruiser if he doesn't show his broadside! - No teamwork needed!

A DD cannot hit a ship if he doesn't sail in a straight line! - No teamwork needed!

A CV cannot sink a ship that is escorted! - Not teemwork needed, because you can just sail next ship!

 

Class X is not OP if the player on the recieving end is competent!

 

 

If players continuously and on average fail to counter the CVs, it is WGs duty to act on it. This goes not only for CVs but every other class and vehicle. It is that simple.

[Broevaharo]

 

 

I dont agree.

 

Classes must be balanced for roughly the same effectiveness in a random environment with people doing random (and stupid) things, but winning because skill and teamwork should never be limited. Divisions are evenly matched on the teams. If one division keeps winning, theyre simply better than their opposing players.

 

You encourage teamplay by giving people the chance to win more. Force them to some sort of gameplay like in "aggressively push to kill the enemy CV" or "babysit your own carriers because they were soooo important IRL", they get pissed. Rightfully so.

 

Yep that's how I see it as well and that's also why I wasn't against the changes they made to the CV's even though I played them a lot.

A team that works together will always win against a team that doesn't but forcing teamplay because one ship is just too OP (like the  full strike CV's before the latest patch) will never be good for a game just like the under perfomnig of the high tier DD's isn't good for the game.

People want a game that is playable for every class of ship, they want the chance to have some sort of influence on the outcome of a battle and that is the biggest challenge for any game developer, how can you get all classes sort of balanced?

[allufewig]

The Thing is: You can blame individual players for individual mistakes, but for the statistics ( some CV OP, DD UP etc.) you have to blame the devs alone.

 

DDs are underpowered because WG fucked up, but CVs are/were overpowered because players are stupid? Nope, not really.

 

 

@Broevaharo: Agree.

 

[Blue_Bug]

Now, because in most games cruisers and DDs hide behind BBs, and the BBs hide in a corner of the map sailing in circles firing at maximum range. 

 

Can agree with you on almost all points, but this one ? Only at tier 9 and 10 there are CA's on the same line as the BB's. In all other tiers the CA's are in front or try to flank. Till now I have never seen a DD on the same line of the BB's. Hide behind the BB's is imposible as there is no room for it .

 

I liked the CV game play in CBT more.  I have the impression that in CBT the AA of CA's were much better.  As a CV commander you wouldn't fly with your planes over a CA. It took much more planning. At this moment there are only a few vessels were you have to look out for.  I think they shouldn't have nerfed the CV the way they did now (Although I love the mirror MM).  

 

In my opinion they had to buff the AA of CA's. Maybe that will improve the teamplay a litle bit. When I sail in front of BB's I often want to push, The result is that halfway I have to return because the BB's are not following.  What you often see is that the CA's push and die, while in end game only the BB's are fighting each other.

 

In my opinion the loss of your CA's must mean that the BB's loose most of their aircover and should die shortly after the CA's.