The world is on fire

[JohnHusky]

After i been playing BB's for some time, ive noticed like most ships use HE, not just CA and DD's, but also BB's use it.

 

So i got chance of a 1vs1 with my new mexico vs atlanta and we both where at full health. I got all the skills and modules to help vs fires. But what i noticed, is that, not only does i get set on fire right away with 3 fires, it also does 1-3k dmg per hit.

 

I fired a full broadside and hit the citadel and he was at 40% but the same was i, due to all the fires.

I only managed to fire a second salvo to kill him before i was out as well.

 

So aint this abit much? I mean, when you still are set on fire right way with all the skills to prevent it. Whats the point?
 

Cheers

[Retzore]

Fire can be annoying but What matters the range of your shots, at what range was this atlanta at?

[Pardinas_82]

There is nothing you can do, HE is broken and DEVs doesn´t want to change it.

[kfa]

Theoretically it was worth it. You gave your Tier6 ship to eliminate a Tier7. You fired twice and killed him, he fired 180 times and killed you, thats the way it should be

 

[Jaeger_Bomb_Meister]

After i been playing BB's for some time, ive noticed like most ships use HE, not just CA and DD's, but also BB's use it.

 

So i got chance of a 1vs1 with my new mexico vs atlanta and we both where at full health. I got all the skills and modules to help vs fires. But what i noticed, is that, not only does i get set on fire right away with 3 fires, it also does 1-3k dmg per hit.

 

I fired a full broadside and hit the citadel and he was at 40% but the same was i, due to all the fires.

I only managed to fire a second salvo to kill him before i was out as well.

 

So aint this abit much? I mean, when you still are set on fire right way with all the skills to prevent it. Whats the point?

 

Cheers

 

BB's been neglected.....awaiting major Fixes in next Mini patch.......i suggest you take your Huskies for a long walk, may take a while to fix for balancing purposes

[Broevaharo]

The problem is that an Atlanta has an insane rate of fire so if you get into his range and you don't manage to kill it in 2 salvo's he will eat you alive with HE spam because that is his strength.

If you manage to stay out of his range he doesn't stand a chance because it really isn't a strong ship at all, it's good as an AA cruiser but that's about it.

[Pardinas_82]

 

BB's been neglected.....awaiting major Fixes in next Mini patch.......i suggest you take your Huskies for a long walk, may take a while to fix for balancing purposes

 

They wont rebalance BBs. They are balancing the game arround %, if there is more % of players playing BBs than they wants, they nerf BBs, but at the moment there is more people playing BBs than they want, so they wont balance them.

[JohnHusky]

Fire can be annoying but What matters the range of your shots, at what range was this atlanta at?

 

Within 10km. We where on the map "hotspot" south of the map. After my first salvo i manage to get in cover of a small island and repair. When we meet on the other side again 3 fires right away. But this time we where much closer together 5km.

[Userext]

 

They wont rebalance BBs. They are balancing the game arround %, if there is more % of players playing BBs than they wants, they nerf BBs, but at the moment there is more people playing BBs than they want, so they wont balance them.

 

not exactly in the way you think. They dont use % of players mostly. If %50 of player base play battleships regularly and have overall bad stats they will buff it. But for classes like carriers if player % goes up to %50 they will think the class needs adjustment

 

Normal battle in WG's mind

1 or 2 CV

3-4BB

4-5CA

1-2 DD

[Broevaharo]

 

Within 10km. We where on the map "hotspot" south of the map. After my first salvo i manage to get in cover of a small island and repair. When we meet on the other side again 3 fires right away. But this time we where much closer together 5km.

 

Well there is your problem, you were in his optimum firing range and you weren't, if you had a cruiser with you he would have taken out that Atlanta easily before he ever would get into range but now you were in a disadvantage from the start.

[Blue_Bug]

 

BB's been neglected.....awaiting major Fixes in next Mini patch.......i suggest you take your Huskies for a long walk, may take a while to fix for balancing purposes

 

I'm not saying that BB's are good at the momemt, but they are not neglected. In 0.4.1 is a minor direct buff and a large indirect buff. The minor buff is a accuracy buff till 3 km. The Mayor indirect buff is the MM correction of CV's.

 

The most neglected class is still the DD class. 

[JohnHusky]

The problem is not just the Atlanta. But in general. With all the skills and modules. I would have thought, the fires would be less. But its not from what my experience.

Even adding flags into the mix, doesn't seem to help much at all.

 

The way i see it, if you cant hit a citadel on a ship, just spam HE with any ship and you sure are guaranteed to do insane amount of dmg to any ship without the need for skill.

[Broevaharo]

The problem is not just the Atlanta. But in general. With all the skills and modules. I would have thought, the fires would be less. But its not from what my experience.

Even adding flags into the mix, doesn't seem to help much at all.

 

The way i see it, if you cant hit a citadel on a ship, just spam HE with any ship and you sure are guaranteed to do insane amount of dmg to any ship without the need for skill.

 

The main problem is that you don't have the speed or the manoeuvrability to disengage, in my Kongo I'm not worried about HE spamming because I can take most of the HE spammers out of action while keeping a safe distance, that isn't the case in a US BB.

I also see a lot of BB players hitting repair as soon as 1 fire is started which is a mistake, 1 fire is annoying , 2 fires is a problem, 3 fires is dangerous so you have to think about when you hit the repair key.

[Pardinas_82]

 

not exactly in the way you think. They dont use % of players mostly. If %50 of player base play battleships regularly and have overall bad stats they will buff it. But for classes like carriers if player % goes up to %50 they will think the class needs adjustment

 

Normal battle in WG's mind

1 or 2 CV

3-4BB

4-5CA

1-2 DD

 

No, in fact they have said that the low tiers BBs are so bad because they dont want much people playing the class

[Userext]

 

No, in fact they have said that the low tiers BBs are so bad because they dont want much people playing the class

 

No they said they wanted people to see that battleships arent for everyone so from the start battleships arent easy. They never said they dont want much people playing the class.

[Broevaharo]

 

No they said they wanted people to see that battleships arent for everyone so from the start battleships arent easy. They never said they dont want much people playing the class.

 

BB's on the low tiers aren't very forgiving, same with DD's on the higher tiers, people just think they are strong because they look strong but in fact they are a very hard class to play and players would be wise to get some battles under their belt in cruisers first before starting to play BB's so they'll know what is up against them and how to counter them.

[JohnHusky]

 

BB's been neglected.....awaiting major Fixes in next Mini patch.......i suggest you take your Huskies for a long walk, may take a while to fix for balancing purposes

Good idea and hopefully when i get back, it will be better

 

 

The main problem is that you don't have the speed or the manoeuvrability to disengage, in my Kongo I'm not worried about HE spamming because I can take most of the HE spammers out of action while keeping a safe distance, that isn't the case in a US BB.

I also see a lot of BB players hitting repair as soon as 1 fire is started which is a mistake, 1 fire is annoying , 2 fires is a problem, 3 fires is dangerous so you have to think about when you hit the repair key.

Yeah all you say makes good sense. But what about the skills and modules, that should reduce the amount of fires you get. I for one cant tell the difference if its helping. Because as soon as im hit with HE, i see a fire on my ship.

[Broevaharo]

Good idea and hopefully when i get back, it will be better

 

Yeah all you say makes good sense. But what about the skills and modules, that should reduce the amount of fires you get. I for one cant tell the difference if its helping. Because as soon as im hit with HE, i see a fire on my ship.

 

There is only one way to tell for sure and that is to test it in a training room or PVE with a friend, let him shoot at you with HE without any modules or captain skills on your ship and then repeat the same with all modules and skills on.

I'm pretty sure that the modules and skills do have an effect but I know it doesn't seem that way when you are under fire.

[Userext]

Those modules and skills would be better off if it would reduce fire damage. I think that might need a change. They lower fire chance but not high enough. Also you cant exactly burn a ship much from its stern or bow. Tested with murmansk against multiple battleships. It also reduces the damage you take from explosives because there is not much leftt damage after a while. 

 

Edit: you can burn a ship from its bow or stren but there is not much to burn so less fire chance. And if BB player buts the fire out there is a less chance burning him again. 

[cherry2blost]

As a hardened (mainly) BB player, I too went through the stage of screaming blue murder about HE spam, now just take the fire damage, when it hits 3/4 fires then repair and extinguish fires.... fire damage is low level damage and Repair ability repairs around 90% of it.... it is all in the timing of repairs and fire extinguishing also keep a HE spamming cruiser with you at all times, to deal with rogue DD's, TB's and pesky spamming cruisers... also play the cruisers too that way you know the limnitations of the class and how best to counter them.

 

Never ever get in range of more than one of these beasties though, if you are faced with cruiser and BB then point your nose at BB and kill Cruiser first, then turn back to BB..

 

Little pointer... USN CA's hit them centee mass AT the waterline for major damage also remember that if you are firing at a slight angle walk your volley upwards slightly as you fire as your rearward (furthest away) turrets have a slightly different trajectory... never ever EVER fire salvoes at CA's ALWAYS ALWAYS volley fire...

 

At longer range, fire single turret .... wait for him to begin his avoiding turn THEN release rest of volley at 1 second intervals....

 

If you have taken major damage dont be afraid to disengage, retreat behind team mates and use healing skills to rebuild you HP and THEN re engage.... dont just keep piling in unless you have gotten yourself so ridiculously cornered that there is no way out... but the art of BB is NOT to get into those situations in the first place....

 

Also please please dont just sit back trying to snipe... it dont work!!!!

 

Get up close and personal at the vanguard of a hard team push and the damage will rack up as will the kills.... most teams panic when faced with an aggressive BB as it is such a rare occurance...

 

anyway nuff from me... happy BB'ing.....

[MAD_3R_Marauder]

As for the useful/uselessness of modules and skills, the thing to keep in mind is, that -5% fire-chance doesn´t mean the chance for a fire is reduced [edit: from 12%, for example] by 5% points to 7% but by 5% of 12%, i.e. 12% x 0.05 = 0.6% --> 11.4%

 

I made the table below for a different thread to show the uselessness of the fire prevention module.

 

Ship Class      Base chance of fire       Chance of fire w. module      Fires prevented per 100 HE hits

US DD                        5(6)%                            4.75(4.7)%                                    0.25(0.3)

IJN DD                      10%                                 9.5%                                             0.5

US/IJN CL (6")           12%                               11.4%                                             0.6

US CA (8")                14%                               13.3%                                             0.7

IJN CA (8")                16%                               15.2%                                             0.8

US BB (12")              22%                                20.9%                                            1.1

US BB (14")              30%                                28.5%                                            1.5

US BB (16")              36%                                34.2%                                            1.8

IJN BB (12")              31%                              ~29.5%                                          ~1.5

IJN BB (14")             27%                               ~25.6                                             ~1.4

IJN BB (16")             32%                                 30.4                                               1.6

Yamato                    37%                               ~35.1                                             ~1.9

 

So, in order for this module to prevent _1_ fire, I have to be hit

200 to 400 times with a DD gun

150 times by a CL

100 to 150 times by a CA

and between 50 and 100 times by a BB (which, unless I am a DD, stupidly uses HE ).

 

In pretty much all of the above cases, if I am hit that often, _fires_ are probably the least of my problems

 

 

 

[Merlin851526]

Just came off a string of defeats and a lot of my death were from HE spam. One match in particular in my fully upgraded Fuso I was dive bombed at the start of the match sets two fires on board better put it out I think so I use the repair. almost 30 seconds later a Cleveland Hove's into view and guess what? On fire again this time my repair is in cool down there are THREE fires raging but there's a chance I can kill the Cleveland. Of course I have AP loaded no time to switch, from 5 km or so I put a full broadside in to him with little or no effect. All the while being damaged continuously from the fires raging. I use my health module and repair is still in cool down. Switch to HE fire a salvo into the Cleveland he's joined by a Omaha now get 4 hits Cleveland still alive. In short I die from fire damage. Had almost an identical end with my fully upgraded New Mexico next round.So you spend all that time grinding up the tech tree to improve your Battleship only to discover it's made from some sort of paper material that's being dipped in Petrol. To be fair the HE dynamic in this game certainly appears to be broken with regard to setting fires and their frequency.

[Userext]

Just came off a string of defeats and a lot of my death were from HE spam. One match in particular in my fully upgraded Fuso I was dive bombed at the start of the match sets two fires on board better put it out I think so I use the repair. almost 30 seconds later a Cleveland Hove's into view and guess what? On fire again this time my repair is in cool down there are THREE fires raging but there's a chance I can kill the Cleveland. Of course I have AP loaded no time to switch, from 5 km or so I put a full broadside in to him with little or no effect. All the while being damaged continuously from the fires raging. I use my health module and repair is still in cool down. Switch to HE fire a salvo into the Cleveland he's joined by a Omaha now get 4 hits Cleveland still alive. In short I die from fire damage. Had almost an identical end with my fully upgraded New Mexico next round.So you spend all that time grinding up the tech tree to improve your Battleship only to discover it's made from some sort of paper material that's being dipped in Petrol. To be fair the HE dynamic in this game certainly appears to be broken with regard to setting fires and their frequency.

 

its not broken if you couldnt kill a cleveland from 5km in fuso dont blame the game

[Merlin851526]

 

its not broken if you couldnt kill a cleveland from 5km in fuso dont blame the game

 

Maybe your not familiar with a little thing called dispersion? Then again if your going to spend all your time in Destroyers it's going to be  an alien concept to you I suppose. However if you took the time to read my post carefully you would have understood that the Fuso's guns accuracy or that of any other Battleship wasn't my point. My point was the frequency of fire and damage caused as a result by using HE ammunition.Hope that cleared it up for you.

[Userext]

Maybe your not familiar with a little thing called dispersion? Then again if your going to spend all your time in Destroyers it's going to be  an alien concept to you I suppose. However if you took the time to read my post carefully you would have understood that the Fuso's guns accuracy or that of any other Battleship wasn't my point. My point was the frequency of fire and damage caused as a result by using HE ammunition.Hope that cleared it up for you.

 

Played Fuso in CBT and since CBt they only buffed battleships. No nerfs so yeah

 

I know you are talking about HE and fire damage but its not my job to tell you how to do it. You would be in a better situation if you wouldnt miss due to you not aiming correctly(i am  guessing that way because even i citadel hit cleveland in my arkansas from 8km.) . Your failure doesnt mean HE or fire is powerfull