overeffective AA guns

[Goatman]

I was playing in my Zuiho, and had 4 Squads out together, closing on a carrier when a Cleveland came Close. The Cleveland shot Down hole Squads... not one and one planes... i lost all my Squads before i could  turn around... its just insane.

 

 

 

So i had to check this and sent another 4 Squads Torps and bombers against the Cleveland just to check, and again, i wasnt remotley Close enogh to even launch anything before all my 4 sqauds was killed,,,, either some of the AA guns are way to effective or someone is cheating, cuz i refuse to belive their AA can be that effective

[Siagor]

My Cleveland can't do that. Really.

[simonmd]

They can be upgraded and they have a fighter too. I suggest not flying over floating AA batteries, its not wise.

[SENAdmiral]

Haha ! Just lovely !

 

Maybe because guys like you can park 3 squads over my N Mexico not once but twice and 44 AA guns are able to get ONLY A PLANE on the process ? And I get, on exchange, 4 x db runs (one of them taking OVER 20 k heath at once & heavy fire ! ) and, to be more fun, 2 tb attacks with that exploit of manual drops at 2-300m ? best case scenario I "eat" only 2 torpedo from each 6 !

 

Yeah, from 18 planes x 2  waiting over my N Mexico, at a range of 2-3 km, my AA was able only to get one of them !

 

Worth to mention I close in with a Nagato, BOTH bb.s AA where unable to stop the cv attack ? Worth to mention he (cv guy) was able to perform an triple attack in 2-3 min time space (return, reload, coming back & killing g us) in some 5 min only ?

 

 

At least are, on this game, a ship able to stop the cv players abuses !

[Adrian1914]

  Maybe they had their AA ability off cooldown so it gave them a boost. Also bare in mind that the Cleveland, although it's a ship with a very strong AA on it's own, might have had both ship upgrades as well as captain skills for even more AA fire and all that combined with the fact that he was 1 tier above you might be the reason that this has happened. 

 

  As a CV player you need to respect the tier differences in ships, because their AA gets increased quite a bit with the higher tiers, which is somewhat countered by the increase in survivability of your planes as you get to higher tiers. However if you attack a high tier ship with low tier planes it is normal that you will lose many planes due to the simple fact that the high tier has high DPS of their AA and you planes have low survivability in proportion to that. It's just how the game works, that's why we have tiers.

[SENAdmiral]

My Cleveland can't do that. Really.

 

not so sure... My Clevy, with AA ability activated, can erase a full Japo wing in 2-3 sec....

I got games with 30-36 air kills with no big troubles...  If I choose to stick near our cv on that lovely games when a team got ONE cv and the reds got two of them, its granted I have over 30 air kills, easily. Sadly, on other hand, the XP reward are near to nothing...

[SENAdmiral]

  Maybe they had their AA ability off cooldown so it gave them a boost. Also bare in mind that the Cleveland, although it's a ship with a very strong AA on it's own, might have had both ship upgrades as well as captain skills for even more AA fire and all that combined with the fact that he was 1 tier above you might be the reason that this has happened. 

 

  As a CV player you need to respect the tier differences in ships, because their AA gets increased quite a bit with the higher tiers, which is somewhat countered by the increase in survivability of your planes as you get to higher tiers. However if you attack a high tier ship with low tier planes it is normal that you will lose many planes due to the simple fact that the high tier has high DPS of their AA and you planes have low survivability in proportion to that. It's just how the game works, that's why we have tiers.

 

true, if a Clevi skipper "work" his skills & ship upgrades with the AA capability on his mind, the results are amazing... Clevi its, from what I see / experienced, one (if not THE ) most effective ships , on this game, against planes...

 

Sad, on other hand, bb from the same tier, are simply just *edited* by a decent cv player, since on some of those bb.s the AA guns are pure decorative... (N Mexico on mind...)

[N00b32]

I was playing in my Zuiho, and had 4 Squads out together, closing on a carrier when a Cleveland came Close. The Cleveland shot Down hole Squads... not one and one planes... i lost all my Squads before i could  turn around... its just insane.

 

How I read this post:

 

"Oh no, he has a counter measure, kill it, eh I mean nerf it." Don't get me wrong, I play both Cleveland and Zuiho but I don't really get this post. DDs have a much more hard time and it is really not too much to expect to avoid AA ships. It is not that hard, just fly around or search for other target. 

[AgarwaenME]

Hopefully after the incoming changes to CVs, they can go back and do a balance pass for AAA. Currently there are BBs that are more or less immune to air attacks that aren't of the "full strike setup spam" variety, with USN CVs being hurt twice as hard by float plane fighters. The reduction in lower tier CV strike capability (combined with the MM fixes and the far heavier overall fighter presence) should make those tiers balanced. But twice as many fighters in the air at higher tiers, combined with CAs generating airplane death zones and float planes rooting full squadrons is just going to make CVs pointless.

 

Though I guess nothing will be enough for the BB mafia.

[Adrian1914]

 

true, if a Clevi skipper "work" his skills & ship upgrades with the AA capability on his mind, the results are amazing... Clevi its, from what I see / experienced, one (if not THE ) most effective ships , on this game, against planes...

 

Sad, on other hand, bb from the same tier, are simply just RAPED by a decent cv player, since on some of those bb.s the AA guns are pure decorative... (N Mexico on mind...)

 

  N Mexico has okay AA - it's actually pretty good against low tier CVs, but mediocre against equal or higher but that is just how AA works. I think from the bad experience you've mentioned with your ship where you shot down only one plane was because you were facing a higher tier CV ( there is RNG in AA still though! ). As a CV captain I respect their AA as I've had planes shot down by N Mexico and have shot down quite a lot in my own N Mexico, but for a reliable anti-air defence you have to rely on cruisers that they will use AA ability, or at least launch fighters to panic the planes. An advice I can give you though is to ALWAYS ctrl+click air groups as not only do they get focused, but you actually do x1.5 more damage with your AA and that way you could shred planes. 

[ironhammer500]

The sad part is WG will listen to CV captains complain AA is to op cause it shoots down 1 of their planes when they attack...incomming AA nerfs!

[AgarwaenME]

The sad part is WG will listen to CV captains complain AA is to op cause it shoots down 1 of their planes when they attack...incomming AA nerfs!

 

Strawman much?

 

Doubly laughable given the endless crying from the BB mafia.

[marcmad]

I never experimented with it myself but maybe you should try launching your torpedos from further range away. I heard there is multiple zone of increasing AA power as you get closer to the ship. So maybe from launching from further away he has a higher chance to dodge but you lose a lot less planes.

[AgarwaenME]

I never experimented with it myself but maybe you should try launching your torpedos from further range away. I heard there is multiple zone of increasing AA power as you get closer to the ship. So maybe from launching from further away he has a higher chance to dodge but you lose a lot less planes.

 

That would be the "zones of you're not going to hit anything ever".

[SENAdmiral]

 

  N Mexico has okay AA - it's actually pretty good against low tier CVs, but mediocre against equal or higher but that is just how AA works. I think from the bad experience you've mentioned with your ship where you shot down only one plane was because you were facing a higher tier CV ( there is RNG in AA still though! ). As a CV captain I respect their AA as I've had planes shot down by N Mexico and have shot down quite a lot in my own N Mexico, but for a reliable anti-air defence you have to rely on cruisers that they will use AA ability, or at least launch fighters to panic the planes. An advice I can give you though is to ALWAYS ctrl+click air groups as not only do they get focused, but you actually do x1.5 more damage with your AA and that way you could shred planes. 

 

well my friend I ALWAYS do that (select a target for my secondary & AA) BUT on my case, was sad to watch 2 wings parked at 2 km of my BB waiting for me to use the rep consumables after the first db set me on fire - and my crap AA was unable to get a single kill from 12 planes there, not to count with other wing who just bomb be and escape intact ( we talk about 18 planes here) ;

 

2-3 min the same scenario,  my rep consumable still recharging ( got hit by 2 of 6 tb) and now I get another 12 planes bombing me & running away intact, then the tb come, manual drop at 2-300m, I kill ONE - AFTER () he drop, then another 2 torpedo hits = I am dead...

Making the counting, from 18 x 3 = 36 planes = 1 kill, its a really really bad AA, I think you agree... ALWAYS putting the target marker on the tb, who are waiting at 2-3 km... ONLY got a kill after they drop...

 

Not to comment on the fact a db attack take some 20 k heath on me at once...

[ironhammer500]

 

That would be the "zones of you're not going to hit anything ever".

 

So then don't aim the for AA fortress? And pick on the IJN ships instead...cant help if the US ships got more AA then anything ever...i find the AA is balanced at the higher tiers right now, Carriers can still come in and drop their torps but now they will lose some planes...its not like tier 4 - 5 where u can freely drop and never lose a single plane. You have about a 100 spare planes for a reason at tier 8.

 

Hint to Carrier captains, know your targets AA, the OP decided to attack a well known AA cruiser..

[Mangrey]

 

well my friend I ALWAYS do that (select a target for my secondary & AA) BUT on my case, was sad to watch 2 wings parked at 2 km of my BB waiting for me to use the rep consumables after the first db set me on fire - and my crap AA was unable to get a single kill from 12 planes there, not to count with other wing who just bomb be and escape intact ( we talk about 18 planes here) ;

 

2-3 min the same scenario,  my rep consumable still recharging ( got hit by 2 of 6 tb) and now I get another 12 planes bombing me & running away intact, then the tb come, manual drop at 2-300m, I kill ONE - AFTER () he drop, then another 2 torpedo hits = I am dead...

Making the counting, from 18 x 3 = 36 planes = 1 kill, its a really really bad AA, I think you agree... ALWAYS putting the target marker on the tb, who are waiting at 2-3 km... ONLY got a kill after they drop...

 

Not to comment on the fact a db attack take some 20 k heath on me at once...

 

mate stop using the Word BB ....... give us a Ship..... BB have the best AA rating in the game at higher tir.... but you would know that if you where there ......

High´tir you can chancel two carriers with AA with you work as a team (witch is a problem in lower tir)

and yes AA is weak in tir 4-5

 

 

Mang

[SENAdmiral]

 

mate stop using the Word BB ....... give us a Ship..... BB have the best AA rating in the game at higher tir.... but you would know that if you where there ......

High´tir you can chancel two carriers with AA with you work as a team (witch is a problem in lower tir)

and yes AA is weak in tir 4-5

 

 

Mang

 

 

my sorrow bb  was / are the N Mexico .... 18 planes hit him on two runs = 36 planes; scored a single kill. Tier ViI CV.

[MuppetBait]

Seriously, a Cleve or Atlanta with the "prem" AA consumable, the right captain skills and with the correct modules will chew up pretty much anything a CV throws at it, beginning at 7.2km (or something like that).

 

How about BB's actually engaging CA's first in order to open up opportunities for CV's? It's a team game after all. CV's that think that they are supposed to be able to just drive in and delete whatever they want, whenever they want, is stupidity at best. Bombers can relocate from one place to another in a way AA-ships cannot, so why insist on going trough them and then wondering why planes are dropping.

[Seafort]

So CV captain wants to take away part of what makes the CA a support ship just so he can rake up even more xp and credits when he has no more threats from AA. How about we take away the TBs from CVs. I think that's fair compromise.

 

All ships whether it be CV, CA, BB or DD need a hard counter to keep each other in line. Without it the game would be a complete unbalanced mess and not much fun at all. It's not perfectly balanced now as some ships especially CVs are tipping the balance in their favour a bit more than any other ship in the game.

 

Circle of counters - -->DD -> CV -> BB -> CA -->

 

There is also CA -> CV planes and DD -> BB

 

Any ship can kill any of the others but all have a counter. Removing or nerfing AA on CAs is not the way to balance this game unless you're biased and want an easy ride of course

[Reaver2145]

Lets see.

 

Stupid carrier pilot flies his planes over a AA cruiser and then wonders why they get shot down.

 

AA is not over effective, you are just mind numbingly stupid.

[allufewig]

The AA is basically the only thing that US CAs after the Cleveland are *really* good at. In average dmg done and even winrate they already fall behind IJN cruisers.

 

Take their famous AA away and theyre useless.

 

 

[Torpedo42]

I was playing in my Myogi, and had full health, closing on a carrier when a Torpedo plane came Close. The Torpedo plane wipe Down hole my health... not one and one HP... i lost all my health before i could  turn around... its just insane.

 

 

 

So i had to check this and sent another Myogi against the Torpedo plane just to check, and again, i wasnt remotley Close enogh to even launch anything before all my Myogi was killed,,,, either some of the Torpedo plane are way to effective or someone is cheating, cuz i refuse to belive their Torpedo plane can be that effective

 

Just corrected your text. Now, I think people can understand you properly.

[LooneyBin]

awwww, someone flew over a floating AA batterie, lost loads of planes, and then attacked the same ship AGAIN, just to loose loads of planes again...

 

why don't I get those CV captains in my Cleveland? 

[Kenliero]

I avoid Cleve like plague in my CV. How ever, lonely Cleve can be taken out, but you need a lot of room and all your fleets to do that. You need to approach it from several angles at the same time. You can not start adjusting on top of it, or you lose all your ships, fast. If possible, use your fighters/divebombers as cannonfodder. Sacrifice them to make room for torpedoes