Cleveland is soooooo OP

[piritskenyer]

The definition of an OP something is that it does well no matter what. Well guess what: I find this ship to be the single worse part of the US CA line so far. I can't hit jack sh1t with the guns because the shells fall wherever they feel like, but the return fire will hurt every single time. Armour piercing? Boom, citadel pen. HE? Boom on fire and my steering is gone.

 

OP when fighting against it? Not really. My Omaha laughs at Clevelands as I can wiggle way better to avoid their fire than they can when they come close. When I keep switching ammunition between HE and AP, the Cleveland melts away like butter on a stove. Yesterday I got into a gunnery duel with a Kuma (a Kuma for god's sake!) at mid range (8-10 klicks) and while I managed to hit him once with scattered shots, he managed to set me on fire twice and knock out one of my turrets. I decided to disengage, because the ship is completely ineffective.

[xiaobaozha]

 

This. For Tier VI it's quite op, it pretty much out performs US ships two tiers higher than him. And before people are gonna complain it's not a heavy cruiser, with it's armor and small citadel it's even tougher then most.

 

Disagree entirely. I have a 6 wins in 21 so far in the Cleveland. Completely out of step with my other cruisers thus far. Shell ark and travel time is crippling in many situations.

[HidesHisFace]

Clevelands ARE OP, no argument here - in every battle they land as top tier, they are guaranteed to win a game, scoring 2-3 kills each. The team with more Cleves usually wins.

 

Direct competitor, Aoba is a fine ship, very versatile but in direct combat it simply has no chance against raw DPM of Cleveland - Aoba's trademark citadel sniping is worthless against Cleveland because it has virtually no citadel - only two small boiler rooms that are insanely hard to hit at any reasonable (that is NOT point blank) range. That means that Cleve is not only very good in terms of firepower but also way more durable than it should be.

 

Now, does it need a nerf? No, it does not, it simply has NO PLACE on tier VI, it belongs to tier VII or VIII with current stats. It massacres destroyers in no time - 2-3 salvos is all you need. It will win against Aoba in gunnery duel and it can cripple battleships quite reliably with constant barrage of fire - it is not only the matter of being set on fire - such a barrage that Cleve can perform simply causes people to panic in many cases - when you get hit by 12 guns every 7 seconds or so you don't care about shooting back, you think of getting out of there instead. There is simply nothing on equal tier that can counter it.

Even with Omaha that is FAR superior to Furutaka such problem does not exist - why? Furutaka is horrible, true, but counters Omaha in direct confrontation quite easily. 

[OnboardG1]

No, and it doesn't belong uptiered any more either. It has a high skill floor: even the worst meathead can do well in it. However it's a) fragile (trust me on this, once you know where to shoot it you can kill it very quickly indeed) and b) has a terrible AP shell which is one of the most important factors in determining skill ceiling. It bullies lower tier cruisers just fine, but against a battleship or 8" cruiser that knows what he's doing you aren't winning.

[HidesHisFace]

That is the thing, I prefer 203mm guns and still see Cleveland as OP.

 

"trust me on this, once you know where to shoot it you can kill it very quickly indeed"

That applies to every single ship in the game and does not prove Cleveland to be fragile at all - even a destroyer can easily survive a full BB salvo to the face if the BB player has no idea what he's doing.

Every ship goes down easily once you start hitting the citadel, but in case of Clevelands, citadel consists of two rather small boxes, and only one of those boxes lies directly under smokestack - in other words, weak spots on this ship are hard to hit, even with accurate guns. And no, don't even think about advising getting close to hit more reliably - the last thing you want is to get close to Cleveland, where its abysmal shell velocity does not matter.

 

The only problem one in Cleveland might have is that due to the fact that this ship is so absurdly OP for tier VI, you ARE going to get focused by almost everything that has you in range.

[Mr_Burke]

Can't wait to get the Cleveland.

But first I have to grind the Omaha like crazy. I need like 39k to start researching the Cleveland. Thats gotta be like more than 30 matches in a row

[Riithi]

Got both the Aoba and the Cleveland.

 

I perform much better in the Aoba, simply because I am actually able to land shots at longer ranges.

Also the torpedoes really are a nice premium when you find a Battleship who got himself in a stupid position so you can torp him.

 

Everything but the long range gun performance the cleveland is better, but well, current meta for me seems to be that max range firing performance is one of the most important things.

[tw53]

the Cleveland should STAY where it is .  One of the few ships worth the grind for the moment. So LEAVE it alone

[GulvkluderGuld]

I heard all about this OP ship but I have to say it is the first USN cruiser i don't like. Omaha have faster shells, dodge better and have torpedoes that lets it go toe to toe with BBs.

 

Cleve on the other hand......

-can't hit anything > 10 km (shell velocity & firing arc makes it very easy to doge shell flight times of 10-17s),

-it's guns are very prone to take damage

- even its AA gets outclassed by the Atlanta premium cruiser (IChaseGaming tested it, check his youtube channel)

- untill WG buffs the XP/credits for shooting planes down, there is very little xp and money to be had from performing this function.

 

Cleveland does not need a nerf. It is bad enough already. 

Omaha and Phoenix were way better at XP / credit farm and carrying game. 

[xiaobaozha]

Got both the Aoba and the Cleveland.

 

I perform much better in the Aoba, simply because I am actually able to land shots at longer ranges.

Also the torpedoes really are a nice premium when you find a Battleship who got himself in a stupid position so you can torp him.

 

Everything but the long range gun performance the cleveland is better, but well, current meta for me seems to be that max range firing performance is one of the most important things.

 

I heard all about this OP ship but I have to say it is the first USN cruiser i don't like. Omaha have faster shells, dodge better and have torpedoes that lets it go toe to toe with BBs.

 

Cleve on the other hand......

-can't hit anything > 10 km (shell velocity & firing arc makes it very easy to doge shell flight times of 10-17s),

-it's guns are very prone to take damage

- even its AA gets outclassed by the Atlanta premium cruiser (IChaseGaming tested it, check his youtube channel)

- untill WG buffs the XP/credits for shooting planes down, there is very little xp and money to be had from performing this function.

 

Cleveland does not need a nerf. It is bad enough already. 

Omaha and Phoenix were way better at XP / credit farm and carrying game. 

 

My experience so far exactly. Cleveland is currently outclassed by Aoba and even by Omaha. Try hitting a Furutaka from distance, no chance. It can hit BBS who sail in straight lines and defend close quarters versus Destroyers. The AA is unreliable at best. Am now 8 wins in 28 games to date. A lovely ship to look at....and at present...that is all...

[Nienazwany]

If it were to stay in tier 6 (lt least for now) it need a rate of fire nerf and reverse shell velocity nerf.. With such low shell velocity it is simply not enjoyable to play. With so many guns and high RoF it can easly set ablaze with HE and it can wreck cruisers at tier 6 because you don't need 203mm guns of IJN which have 2 times longer reload.

 

AA is quite enjoyable on a Cleveland because it's a first US cruiser with defensive aa fire ability and AA worth mentioning in a first place.

[_Conan_Librarian_]

this crap eats so much damage its just retarded, turning like retarded turtle, and arc of your shots its just bad, bad , Omaha was much better imo, cleveland is step back

[Panocek]

I heard all about this OP ship but I have to say it is the first USN cruiser i don't like. Omaha have faster shells, dodge better and have torpedoes that lets it go toe to toe with BBs.

 

Cleve on the other hand......

-can't hit anything > 10 km (shell velocity & firing arc makes it very easy to doge shell flight times of 10-17s),

-it's guns are very prone to take damage

- even its AA gets outclassed by the Atlanta premium cruiser (IChaseGaming tested it, check his youtube channel)

- untill WG buffs the XP/credits for shooting planes down, there is very little xp and money to be had from performing this function.

 

Cleveland does not need a nerf. It is bad enough already. 

Omaha and Phoenix were way better at XP / credit farm and carrying game. 

 

Considering Atlanta is tier higher its no wonder its better at AA. And IMO is more handicapped with its short range than Cleveland with its shell velocity, up close its nasty ship tho.

[FaceFisted]

it doesn't need a nerf, it needs a citadel 

 

It has a citadel, but it is not exactly under the chimneys but a bit on each side of them.

 

[Acvila_RO]

I don't understand how people claim Cleveland is op. I have to aim so far before a ship that I don't even see it on the damn enemy ship on the screen above 9km. So far I don't like it!

[UndoCTRLz]

Playing in the Phoenix (upgraded) and the Omaha gave me the false sense that i was semi-decent player when I was fighting against Clevelands and pounding the crap out of them.  Only to finally get my hands on one and no bloody wonder I was, it's like playing in a paper Mache boat that has 13th century extended range trebuchets on top.  Although I have a feeling the trebuchet would reach the target faster than the Cleveland. 

Kind of a sick joke really,  I wouldn't mind getting close to them so my secondary armaments can take a pop but I’m scared of getting pounded into the ocean by the enemy sailors spitting and shouting harsh and offensive words at me. 

 

The AA on the other hand seems pretty decent so far, in one battle i literally looked away for a couple of seconds to get my lighter that i dropped and suddenly i had 6 planes downed. The only thing i have found so far i can do better in this ship is fire from behind islands at distant targets much easier. Albeit trying to hit someone who isn’t afk or watching a movie is a different story though. 

 

Guess it's going to be quite a large learning curve. 

 

Edit: Spelling and stuff

[Sub_Eleven]

An omaha can easily kill a cleveland if it keeps her at 13k range. Can't hit crap at that range on moving targets. If you let a cleveland close the distance so it can hit all their shots you are dead meat.

[damo74]

Cleveland and Pensacola need to swap tiers. That's in my opinion.

[Napalm_354]

It needs a nerf, compared to jap cruisers the risk of being citadeled is quite low. Rapid rof mitigates the high arc, keep in mind that jap cruiser of the same tier has pretty substantial turret turn rate. You force that guy to turn, half the battle is won already, so you won't hit with every salvo and? The other guy won't be able to point his guns at you half the time. And if you are within effective range to shoot AP at Japanese cruiser, it's game over for the other guy.

[AnuSuaraj]

It's not OP as much as it is broken.

 

WG has basically crammed a tier 7/8 light cruiser into the heavy cruiser line at tier 6.

 

Naturally, they had to give it the slower shells in order to compensate for the accuracy/DPM/god mode AA and everything else that such an (overly) modern warship implies..

 

The end result is a ship that although interesting to people who can't be bothered to aim and would just like to spam shittones of HE in hopes of hitting something, the ship is extremely annoying to everyone else.

 

As far as I can see it is the most popular tier 6 ship in general which would suggest balance issues.

 

Unfortunately, these balance issues cannot be remedied with Wargaming's usual half-a*sed soultions of the "let's nerf AA a little bit and see what happens..." but with a more profound rethinking of the whole US CA line.

 

One thing is certain though. Cleveland is out of place, much to the disdain of any ship that isn't a Cleveland, and has to be repositioned.

 

Or removed.

 

Gracias.

[MatJan]

Tier 8 after that you get Fargo at 9 and Worcester at 10. At tier 7 with anything close to her original gun performance it still going to be a bit to OP while at tier 8 it will be just at it's place.

Additionally WG could give cross to tier 9 Baltimore since they were partially based on Cleveland.

[Mr_Burke]

Cleveland is fine IMO. The slow hitting shells is a fine tradeoff for better AA. Without Cleveland at its current tier, we wouldnt have any decent AA support against planes.

 

[AnuSuaraj]

Cleveland is fine IMO. The slow hitting shells is a fine tradeoff for better AA. Without Cleveland at its current tier, we wouldnt have any decent AA support against planes.

 

 

Well, we could take the tier 10 cruiser Des Moines and put in tier 6 instead of the Cleveland.

 

We would have to nerf the shell travel time to 2 minutes at 5 km range to justify the huge guns and lots of DPM but at least we would have monster AA and apparently that's all that matters.

 

Cleveland is not fine IMO. It's out of place and therefore broken.

[Ragoutrabbit]

Cleveland sucks worst ship in the US CA line.

[Mr_Burke]

 

Well, we could take the tier 10 crusier Des Moines and put in tier 6 instead of the Cleveland.

 

We would have to nerf the shell travel time to 2 minutes at 5 km range but at least we would have monster AA and that's all that matters.

 

Cleveland is not fine IMO. It's out of place and therefore broken.

 

Cleveland is my highest tier ship in the entire game. Without the cleveland at its current tier (and counting every single other ships at same tier and below) we dont have any decent AA against enemy planes. The shel ltravel time is a fine nerf. I fear Omaha ships more than I fear Cleveland ships. I hope WG dont mess with Cleveland.