Japanese and American carrier difference

[_Maou_]

Hello captains!

Now as we all know wg tires do make each country(like in wot) have different characteristics and so this is also present in wows and currently the biggest one is in american and japanese carries.Firstly i will state that i personally don't have much experience handling a carries simply because i lack interest in them BUT in games i did play and games i based on my experience of their confrontations in the game i just think the difference i great and sometimes largly discriminating.

1.FIGHTER PLANES:

• now this in my opinion is the biggest and most problematic difference.Japanese fighter planes simply CANNOT go against american ones even if they are higher,they just get pummeled to bits and after them my torpedo bomber and dive bomber,please fix this i have had many games when one crappy american fighter squadron simply pummels my or my teams japanese planes,IT SHOULD BE BALANCED MORE

2.TORPEDOES

• now i know ameircans have more planes in a squadron but larger reload while the japanese less planes but smaller reload but stil do something about american torpedo concentration it's just much better than japanese and usually so does more damage,and also i have had experience that when fighters attack the squadrons of torpedo bombers and etc the dispersion of those torpedoes then is larger and on japanese carriers is even higher and they just cannot hit effectively at all while the americans still retain some accuracy.

3.AIRPLANE DURABILTY:

• in my exp at attacking planes whetever they are japanese or american,japanese planes get swatted like flies and are killed easier than the american ones,i would like it to be at least more balanced compared to the american ones

Thank you for reading this(if you actually have xD),and this is my opinion based on the experience in the game with aircraft carries.Hope you will like it,and i hope i will hear your opinions about it.

                                                         May the wind be in your favour

 

[fruitnveg]

I can't agree. With the supposed focus on american air superiority, it makes sense that their fighters should beat the IJN ones. The IJN fighters exist soley to tie up the american fighters to stop them (temporarily) from engaging your superior bomber squadrons. Better yet, bait the fighters onto friendly AA and you will actually win, handily. Otherwise it becomes a game of cat and mouse, as it should. the disparity between the two is meant to make for more interesting choices and personally, i think it works well.

 

For torpedo spreads, I can see why you might want them changed. The USN spread is compact while the IJN is not. This is countered by the damage inflicted upon the target (IJN are stronger and faster torpedos) making them a bit more forgiving, there is also the ability to attack from multiple directions simultaneously further negating any attempt at evasion by your target, something the USN do not gain until much higher tiers. I think this is well balanced as it is (CV against CV).

 

I haven't noticed a disparity in the durability of the planes either, but know not the facts without booting up my client (i'm at work, so can't). I'll leave this to others that are.

 

 

[_Maou_]

I can't agree. With the supposed focus on american air superiority, it makes sense that their fighters should beat the IJN ones. The IJN fighters exist soley to tie up the american fighters to stop them (temporarily) from engaging your superior bomber squadrons. Better yet, bait the fighters onto friendly AA and you will actually win, handily. Otherwise it becomes a game of cat and mouse, as it should. the disparity between the two is meant to make for more interesting choices and personally, i think it works well.

 

For torpedo spreads, I can see why you might want them changed. The USN spread is compact while the IJN is not. This is countered by the damage inflicted upon the target (IJN are stronger and faster torpedos) making them a bit more forgiving, there is also the ability to attack from multiple directions simultaneously further negating any attempt at evasion by your target, something the USN do not gain until much higher tiers. I think this is well balanced as it is (CV against CV).

 

I haven't noticed a disparity in the durability of the planes either, but know not the facts without booting up my client (i'm at work, so can't). I'll leave this to others that are.

 

 

 

i get it but as i stated only my opinion,mostly because i have had many games where one lower tier american CV destroys practically all planes from our higher tier japanese and then he gains air superiority.I didn't say we needed a large buff or nerf just so japanese can at lease do something to the american ones or something xd.

[ShockPirat]

Americans are focused on defense, and Japanese on offense. USN CV simply can't sink another CV in one run until they get two torpedo squadrons. IJN CVs can do it since tier 4, and can sink even higher tier CVs if they do it smart -  luring away enemy fighters and waiting with second torp squadron until enemy repairs flooding from the first one.

If they don't manage to sink an USN CV in one run, they might lose a lot of planes. The longer USN CV is allowed to operate, the more planes he will shoot down.

 

So I think they are somewhat balanced.

[kfa]

Carriers are balanced to each other, if you changed them the way you described, all of them would be the same.

I see only 1 problem, the experience is far better in IJN CVs, the damage and frags are way too much rewarded against shooting down planes. In US CVs with fighter setup you have to work your [edited]off to get 1200 base xp, in japanese CVs every second game is a 1800-2000 base xp game.

[Boevebeest]

And again it is a question of what you want?

 

Because CV's only really fight other CV's and are capped at two per team max there are two options.

 

1. Make all CV's the same.

2. Learn to live with a ridiculous imbalance.

 

With CV's there are simply to few in a battle to compensate for differences like other classes of ships can.

[Nimoka]

just had the following constalation. 2 cruisers (in division with the carrier) activated both their special skill as a normal squadron of fighters aproached my fighters squadron. even with support of two cruisers and another fighter squadron the US fighters killed both squadrons of japanese fighters and also the second squadron I have launched seconds later with just loosing 1 plane. and thats not the first time this happens in games I play japanese carriers and if a squadron of US is flying near your carrier you can go watch TV as you are not getting any plane launched. Yes maybe you can lure them away one time but the result is one more launch and all of your planes destroyed so you can drive around your useless chunk of japanese stell for the rest of the game or go on a suicide mission.

[Admiral_Hammerhead]

its a lot of crying... well true usn fighters win in a 1v1 combat situation and even aa help from near ships might not help but there are other ways.. When I was stuck with my tier 4 ijn cv vs 2 usn carriers i managed to defeat 20+ usn fighters. Maybe its because of the other carrier driver where overconfident maybe they were stupid. I was flying a torpedo run on an enemies bb. I saw them coming loaded off the torpedos early to make for a hasty retreat.. they engaged my 2 torpedo squads in a battle with 1 usn fighter squad when my fighter squad popped up at the horizon and shot all 6 planes down without losing a single fighter. Ive lost 1-2 torpedo bomber and he has lost his whole squadron. Yes it might be he was unaware at the moment and turning into the fighters might have saved his airplanes but imho our torpedobomber have some serious selfdefense and you can use that one to your advantage. with your 2 torpedo squads and 1 fighter squad u should crush the usn fighters at least at tier 4 tier 5.. against a bogue with mainly fighters that one might not work but most bogues have no fighters at all..

 

Just my 2 cents..

[Nimoka]

So to make that clear your response is "dont cry there is no imbalance if you get hit by a single US squadron just call 20 of your japanese friends and some AA support and maybe with luck and the sun in your back you still have a 20% chance to win if the other carrier cptn is sleeping...." okay I´ll stop crying and try that during my next battle. seems it is not imbalanced just my bad skills make the difference. I only have 2 questions: 1. whats the button to put the other player at sleep and 2. how do I call the additional air support?

 

I have no problem if there is a difference between both nations if it is clear what the advantage is so I can adapt my playing style to it. If the answer is "the japanese carrier is a little bit faster has 2 AA guns more at tier 10 and a nice blinking flashlight at each corner I still might be not satisfied with the balance."

[Hannibalurg]

CV's are fine. Just let people grind to higher tiers and problem will be solved.

 

Looked up your profiles. Most of you have under 100 games, and are just hitting T4-5. It's hard to balance all on low tiers and high tiers alike.

[The_Shoe_Salesman]

The balance itself is okay, except the Ryujo. The fighters have only disadvantages. Lower DPM and way too few ammunition. You can't kill a squad of bombers of lower USN-Carriers. That's silly. WG should buff the DPM of the fighters for this carrier.

[Broevaharo]

The US line have 1 fighter, 1 TB and 1 DB on stock setup up to tier 7, if they go fighter setup they have two fighters and 1 DB so they have to make a choice between the risk of getting attacked by multiple DB and TB with only one fighter to defend that will take out  one, maybe two TB in an all out assault on him (so he will get hit by  one TB and two DB) or he kills planes and does little damage.

What you want is to have even more imbalance, you already have more TB and DB but on top of that you also want stronger fighters it's just not going to happen.

[Hauptbahnhof]

There needs to be some more choices for specialization IMHO.

I've seen Japanese tier 6 fighters get slaughtered by US tier 4 fighters, and I've seen a single Cruiser floatplane fighter chew up 8 Japanese fighters in a row. That is how bad they are at least on low tier Carriers.

 

The only thing your fighter squadron can do currently as Japan ( before tier 7 anyways ) in the face of a US CV is to get slaughtered twice ( regardless of friendly AA and carrier levels ). After that it's the same as if you had a strike CV with 1 less squadron.

I want to see some more choices so Japanese players that want to do it can choose between focusing more on fighters or bombers ( not talking about squadron amounts here but skill/effectiveness of them ).

 

Otherwise there is no point in even having a "balanced" deck load-out available for Japan. If the entire purpose of Japanese fighters is to die the first 5min of the game if you encounter US fighters while being able to shoot down nothing, then you can just as well bring more bombers, because the bombers have comparable or slightly higher survivability score and will survive just as long as your fighters will. The difference is that the bombers can actually move while engaged, so you can fly them in the wrong direction making it harder for the US fighters to intercept the rest of your bombers.

So my question: Is it intended that more bombers is actually a better protection against US fighters then Japanese fighters are? Because currently that's how it seems to look at low tier.

[SgtTincan]

i use my Hosho Fighters to scout and bait hostile stuff around, thats all theyre good for. Loast a SQ to a CA Plane the other game, that was fun.

[Broevaharo]

If you take a fighter as IJn it would only be for self defence to make torpedobombers panic as they attack you, if you attack fighters with it you are just stupid, period.

[Hauptbahnhof]

If you take a fighter as IJn it would only be for self defence to make torpedobombers panic as they attack you, if you attack fighters with it you are just stupid, period.

 

I always use IJN fighters to defend my bombers from US fighters because I want to be able to do any damage at all. Does that mean I am stupid period?

 

 

Do you recommend instead never using the fighters before I spot enemy bombers approaching me ( which means they would sit idle sometimes for entire games ), and let the US fighters shoot down all my bombers?

 

Do you also think the Japanese were stupid for bringing their fighters to pearl harbor and defending their bombers + shooting down US fighters?

[Nimoka]

We dont ask for stronger we ask for playable. I mean atm it sounds like "he you choose to play japanese stop crying even if you have to invent new tactics to fight against a brain afk noob US carrier and to get something killed in air combat everything is still balanced and fine."

 

If you are so commited to historical how about adding kamikaze to all japanese planes so we can one hit suicide all squads into enemy ships...yeah whats now with historical.. I thought so. (please do not consider this idea being a real request its just an example)

[Hauptbahnhof]

If you are so commited to historical how about adding kamikaze to all japanese planes so we can one hit suicide all squads into enemy ships...yeah whats now with historical.. I thought so.

 

A bad example of what is "historical" since not a single kamikaze that I know of were launched from Carriers, all were launched from land.

[Kais_S012]

For torpedo spreads, I can see why you might want them changed. The USN spread is compact while the IJN is not. This is countered by the damage inflicted upon the target (IJN are stronger and faster torpedos) making them a bit more forgiving, there is also the ability to attack from multiple directions simultaneously further negating any attempt at evasion by your target, something the USN do not gain until much higher tiers. I think this is well balanced as it is (CV against CV).

 

pardon the intrusion but thats not quite right... not since the USN buff shortly before OBT (boostng their torpedo and dive bomb attack power AND fighter ammo capacity). the IJN only had the torp buff they needed to balance the completely unwarrented drop arc nerf for around 2 weeks

at tier 4 fully upgraded both IJN and USN air dropped torpedoes can do a maximum of 8500 damage per strike (excluding the ultra rare magazine hit)

in a typical IJN TB strike a good player will hit the enemy ship (for the sake of argument we will say a myogi) with 2 torpedoes so a max damage of 170k damage.

reverse that to the USN a good player can hit with 6 fish out of 6 on a Myogi thats 510K max damage, tripple what the IJN can do and still exceeds their max strike utilising 2 squadrons

[Nimoka]

damn caught do not destroy my shiny example with your facts thats just mean!

[Tugnut]

All i will say is: Use your surroundings for maximum effect. Your position on the battlefield is vital to success.

[alpmighty]

It's not a bug or an oversight, the difference between IJN and USN carriers are working as intended. It's a feature.

[Nimoka]

thats not the question. ok again more clear:

1. "WHAT EXACTLY IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN US AND IJN?"

2 "IF THE US HAS IMMORTAL FIGHTER PLANES WHAT DID WE GOT IN EXCHANGE?"

 

I would like to adapt my play style to it if I KNOW what exactly I´ve got in exchange for useless fighter planes

 

or is the answer "just accept the fact we made US better and learn to live with that"

 

its a simple question and I am ok if I get a honest answer even if it might be a bad news.

 

 

update...nice matchmaking btw me in a tier 4 against 2 carriers US one tier 6 one tier 5 ^^ thats just fantastic again. I cannot even launch anything guarded by two fighter plane squadrons all the time circling my carrier without bothering about any AA

[GrumpyWorm]

Moved

[iRazgriz]

2 "IF THE US HAS IMMORTAL FIGHTER PLANES WHAT DID WE GOT IN EXCHANGE?"

The ability to perform much more complex and difficult to evade attack thanks to the higher number of available squadrons.