Airdropped Torpedoes Are Impossible To Avoid

[Ishiro32]

 

The fact that as the CV you consider a DD as a potential target is broken.

 

Carriers are vultures. They punish mistakes of all classes.

[specialkha]

 

Carriers are vultures. They punish mistakes of all classes.

 

They punish too much.

 

They yield far too much xp/creds, etc... for what they require to play them.

 

Just compare at the same tier average damage of BB/DD/CA/CV. Who is first at all Tier? And we can add to all the utility that a CV has (scout, etc...)

[Ishiro32]

what etc? And scouting is only good in the first 2 minutes of the game. Bombers very rarerly scout DDs.

The only big thing CV is giving it's team is damage. It doesn't have pushing nor tanking power. It isn't really used to screen others with it's AA, it's only for selfdefence, nor it can really cap points.

 

CVs are all about damage. Rewards for other classes for other thing than damage is another topic and is irrelevant here.

 

CV are vultures. We punish those who make mistakes. That's pretty much only thing we do.

[specialkha]

Planes scout DD/CA/BB and torpedoes alike. You can park a fighter squadron on top of a DD all the game.

 

It seems then that pushing power/tanking is not rewarded enough...

 

And it looks like too much ppl makes mistakes...

 

Well, I wonder why I waste my time to argue with a CV captain anyway.

[Ishiro32]

Bombers don't scout most of the time. Only first few minutes and after that with huge detection ranges and fire ranges we have there is really no point in scouting anything other than DD.

 

You said yourself. You park fighters above DDs, not bomber wings.

 

I never actually got anwser from people like you. What do you belive should be the average damage per game of a top CV player for tier VIII full bomber deck in a match without CV and with a match against fighter CV. Considering that top BB players have around 100k on that tier.

[Iron_Gekko]

I don't even get the issue here.

 

The higher the level the less potentate a carrier with torp bombers is, first, players get better at dodging, second, the AA especially on cruisers becomes insane. You cant even manually close on a cruiser or anything protected by a cruiser anymore with out losing you're entire wing. You can only do it from further away and hope a few of you're bombers survive to drop their bombs... carriers therefor become a joke against Cruisers in the later stage of the game...

 

If you play battleship or destroyer and you get wrecked... then it's properly you're own fault or the lack of team-play, the amount of Destroyers that I have sunk because they steamed ahead is what is getting me kills (Scissor approach between torp bombers)... I am level VIII now with my Jap carrier and I am actually doing a lot worse then I did on my first carrier due to the intense AA and dodging that is now being put up, if anything Torp ranges on torp planes needs to be buffed, maybe 7 km instead of 5 so at-least half of the wing makes it back alive...

[specialkha]

Bombers don't scout most of the time. Only first few minutes and after that with huge detection ranges and fire ranges we have there is really no point in scouting anything other than DD.

 

You said yourself. You park fighters above DDs, not bomber wings.

 

I never actually got anwser from people like you. What do you belive should be the average damage per game of a top CV player for tier VIII full bomber deck in a match without CV and with a match against fighter CV. Considering that top BB players have around 100k on that tier.

 

And what about for a CV in a T6 game?

 

CV yield too much Xp/cred for the skill require to play them.

 

They should lower their damage or lower their utility.

 

CV captain should play BB/Ca/DD to see what it is to be at the receiving end.

[Ra97oR]

I don't even get the issue here.

 

The higher the level the less potentate a carrier with torp bombers is, first, players get better at dodging, second, the AA especially on cruisers becomes insane. You cant even manually close on a cruiser or anything protected by a cruiser anymore with out losing you're entire wing. You can only do it from further away and hope a few of you're bombers survive to drop their bombs... carriers therefor become a joke against Cruisers in the later stage of the game...

 

If you play battleship or destroyer and you get wrecked... then it's properly you're own fault or the lack of team-play, the amount of Destroyers that I have sunk because they steamed ahead is what is getting me kills (Scissor approach between torp bombers)... I am level VIII now with my Jap carrier and I am actually doing a lot worse then I did on my first carrier due to the intense AA and dodging that is now being put up, if anything Torp ranges on torp planes needs to be buffed, maybe 7 km instead of 5 so at-least half of the wing makes it back alive...

 

Here let me spell the problem out for you.

 

Your

Tier IV Hosho     68%WR    Damage 65k   Avg air kill  8.82  Avg ship kill  2.05

Tier IV Myogi      40%WR     Damage 19k   Avg air kill  0.13  Avg ship kill  0.54

Tier IV Yuubari   44%WR     Damage 19k   Avg air kill  1.22  Avg ship kill  0.88

Hosho can scout, kill other CV's aircraft, and do other things that the Myogi and Yubari can't do. While doing so clearly does 3x more average damage without being risking direct gunfire.

 

 

If anything that bothers me, long range torp drops are not. It's the close range drop that CV realign until they are perfect that are messed up.

[Ishiro32]

 

And what about for a CV in a T6 game?

 

CV yield too much Xp/cred for the skill require to play them.

 

They should lower their damage or lower their utility.

 

CV captain should play BB/Ca/DD to see what it is to be at the receiving end.

 

What utility? Fighters provide some utility, but it's not something so amazing, also fighters are not something you are complaining about. Bomber wings 95 % of the time are on the move from target to target, they are attack planes, they attack. 

 

If you are complaining just about exp then this is not balance issue just economy one.

 

If you are complaining about damage please state what do you think what damage should top bomber CVs get from tier to tier. Remember that bomber CVs should deal more damage than BBs. 

 

I have played other classes in CBT. Never had problem with TBs. Also we have CV players who play other classes and they do not complain. 

 

Low tier is should be nerfed a bit, but nothing big. This tier is too critical for huge changes.

[specialkha]

TB and DB are not blind as far as I recall. They perfectly spot everything on their way, Torpedoes included.

 

Then again, why should CV, while surviving the more, having the most utilities (even without fighters, even more with them) do the most damage (while taking into account that they survice the most) and should as well not rely on RNG like any others ships?

[Iron_Gekko]

 

Here let me spell the problem out for you.

 

Your

Tier IV Hosho     68%WR    Damage 65k   Avg air kill  8.82  Avg ship kill  2.05

Tier IV Myogi      40%WR     Damage 19k   Avg air kill  0.13  Avg ship kill  0.54

Tier IV Yuubari   44%WR     Damage 19k   Avg air kill  1.22  Avg ship kill  0.88

Hosho can scout, kill other CV's aircraft, and do other things that the Myogi and Yubari can't do. While doing so clearly does 3x more average damage without being risking direct gunfire.

 

 

If anything that bothers me, long range torp drops are not. It's the close range drop that CV realign until they are perfect that are messed up.

 

IV Hosho is easy because you're playing against weak AA and people that dont know how to dodge...

 

What I was refering to, if you bothered reading my post was higher level carriers, ditto VIII where the AA storm becomes so intence that you're stratigic value goes down the pipe.

 

Try short Dropping on a high level crusier or anything being covered with that and you're entire wing will go down before the torps hit the water...

[Ishiro32]

TB and DB are not blind as far as I recall. They perfectly spot everything on their way, Torpedoes included.

 

Then again, why should CV, while surviving the more, having the most utilities (even without fighters, even more with them) do the most damage (while taking into account that they survice the most) and should as well not rely on RNG like any others ships?

 

Detection of torps from air is 2km, so unless DD is firing in the exact moment when planes are above it then he kinda deserves to be spotted.

 

Bomber CV having most utility? Come on, this is just nonsense. 

 

They should have highest damage because they survive most often, why you think they shouldn't. Your logic is kinda backwards. I was running for a long time, so that means I shouldn't be tired. CVs do not tank, if found and exposed they are and killed by any class. At high tier spotted CV is prime target for BBs with 20km+ range.

Bomber CV almost only deal damage and otherwise is not providing much. Fighter CV big issue is exactly very lackluster utility they provide.

 

[Iron_Gekko]

Fighters spotting is good enough, bombers should be good because logically their job is to find an strike but that's beside the point. Even if there are no enemy carriers in the other fleet and you have a fighter set up then you can still be invaluble, spotting destroyers and camping on top of them as you're ships sink them at longer range is one... a fleet with a carrier, even a fighter carrier has a massive advantage over one without since the ability to see what is going on all over the map (if the CV plays correctly) allows you're team to hit home a hell of a lot more shots then the enemy.

[specialkha]

 

Detection of torps from air is 2km, so unless DD is firing in the exact moment when planes are above it then he kinda deserves to be spotted.

 

Bomber CV having most utility? Come on, this is just nonsense. 

 

They should have highest damage because they survive most often, why you think they shouldn't. Your logic is kinda backwards. I was running for a long time, so that means I shouldn't be tired. CVs do not tank, if found and exposed they are and killed by any class. At high tier spotted CV is prime target for BBs with 20km+ range.

Bomber CV almost only deal damage and otherwise is not providing much. Fighter CV big issue is exactly very lackluster utility they provide.

 

 

I am sure we can find videos where a CV get spotted by a lone DD or CA and kill it. CVs are far from defenseless.

 

And Bomber CV have far more utility than any other ship, whatever you say. The only one that provides more is the Fighter CV.

 

So basically, the CV:

 

Survive the most, deal the most damage, more utility than any other class, the easiest to play with (skill ceiling very low), no RNG, etc...

 

What more do you want?

[Iron_Gekko]

You also have to remember that a CV becomes more venomous the closer you get, especially one that's hiding behind an island where you cannot hit it, as the range to carrier comes closer so to will the turn around in bombers.

 

[Ishiro32]

 

I am sure we can find videos where a CV get spotted by a lone DD or CA and kill it. CVs are far from defenseless.

 

And Bomber CV have far more utility than any other ship, whatever you say. The only one that provides more is the Fighter CV.

 

So basically, the CV:

 

Survive the most, deal the most damage, more utility than any other class, the easiest to play with (skill ceiling very low), no RNG, etc...

 

What more do you want?

 

What Utility? Tell me how torpedo bomber has more utility than a DD or Crusier. Explain this, because I am baffled.

 

And actually I have died multiple times because of sneaky DD or CA HE spam.

 

Also you said that CV shouldn't have top damage because they survive most, by that logic DDs should have pretty beastly average damage per game.

[specialkha]

Yeah. 60% surival rate. Life is so harsh.

 

Utility, you know like the abilty to spot at will behind island, to spot torpedoes on the middle on nowhere when you send you planes to attack a target, etc...

 

Due to that utility and the skill requirement to play them (god damn, they are easy), Cvs should not be top damage dealer.

 

And yes, DDs should be buffed as they are truly UP in T6+. And again yes, playing DDs should be more rewarding than playing any other class since they are the hardest to play with currently.

[Ishiro32]

So you think ability to check who is behind and island is more usefull than capping, smoke and consitent scout? Also really 2km range on detecting torps in a water, unless they go right above them then there is no issue and bombers move in 95% just to attack and back. Only fighters were problem for DD.

 

What utility has to do with skill requirement? Shouldn't a lot of utility mean class is harder as there are multiple things you have to consider?

DDs should be buffed, but they should never have huge average damage per game. 

 

 

[specialkha]

Utility is too high and skill to play them is too low. They should not do so much damage, or you need to either nerf utility (makes planes blind) or increase skill requirements.

[Serenissima]

Have you played a carrier?

 

[DDMafiaAssociateMember]

probably not. It's like aiming torps without the white aim assistant while juggling self defence, attacking, avoiding CA/CL and shooting down enemy planes all at the same time

[beastlysun]

what is wrong about airdropped torpedos is manual aim. You can avoid (mostly)when CV not using manual aim. I didn`t know that when i started with CV`s. After i found out how to do it i just cant miss battleships with my TB`s anymore. Yes i always focus BB first, why in the hell would i even try to hunt DD`s. By the way AA is massive dice roll. TB`s and DB`s can fly around CV`s all day. Yes they randomly shot down 1 or 2 planes. 

 

my opinion: remove manual torp aim or increase range for torps to activate from what now looks like 1km to 3km if manual aim is used.

[jonasnee]

3 km for manual aim? do you have any idea of how long a distance that is?

 

also that isn't exactly how torpedos work, they don't magically get a 3 times arming time.

[DtXpwnz]

Yes i always focus BB first, why in the hell would i even try to hunt DD`s.

Because once you become really good CV player, you will realize that hitting DD is easy and you can kill him with 2 torps, or sometimes even 1. And you will get crapload of experience for that.

 

edit: you are playing USN CV (Langley only), that is a bit different due to slower torps, planes and longer arm distance

[Ghoststalker]

It would be good if fighters could not be used to scout.