Player Evolution vs. Devolution

[MassiveDYT]

WARNING: may contain abundance of text / confusing references / life stories

 

 

Lately I've been observing the forums and focusing on a very specific scene:

 

Players who genuinely believe that the game is broken, that classes are overpowered which results in them disengaging from the game permanently, quitting.

 

 

Now, I clearly have my 2cents on the matter, which I would like to start with taking Mr. Jackson's advice and looking at the man in the mirror.

 

I'm 26 years old, I've been gaming since I was a wee tyke , I think I've got my first console which was the Sega Mega Drive 2, on my 6th birthday.

I use to spent hours playing games like Mortal Kombat, Battle Toads, Double Dragon, Contra, Robocop vs Terminator, Doom Troopers, Echo The Dolphin, Dune 2, Sonic, Desert/Jungle Strike, Streets of Rage followed by endless tons of similar beat-em-up, like Golden Axe for instance, etc. (There is a point here that I will come back to as I continue)

 

When I got my first PC, I've gotten into strategy games really quickly, and then went back to beat em-ups / slashers like Devil May Cry 3, and survival horror like Resident Evil.

 

The first time I discovered Wargaming, was 2012 in the form of World of Tanks obviously, a mate of mine use to play it religiously, and quickly got me into it as well, I use to come over to smoke weed and observe my mate playing, and eventually I felt like I have enough confidence and knowledge of game mechanics to start driving my first little tank.

 

I'm actually surprised of this myself, but I never really had any real issues with the game, a lot of stuff got changed left and right, stuff got nerfed balanced and removed.

 

I loved the game so much that I focused on playing it, getting good, while these changes were flying over my head without me ever noticing.

 

I have to say straight away, with the risk of being called a fanboy - I love World of Warships just like I use to love World of Tanks, it was a nice welcome change from WoT that rejuvenated my interests in Wargaming (as a company) and war-gaming (in general).

 

That being said, I've been here since the very beginning of beta testing period, and just like when I started WoT, I've barely had any problems with the game to date, except for that one time that I did :

 

http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/8126-torpedos-wont-be-nerfed-because-thats-how-they-worked-in-real-life/page__fromsearch__1 where I was pondering the legitimacy of one shot mechanics not only in a game like this, but in online gaming in general. 

 

This is me today, after 3 moths of playing through all the classes and listening to every single advice that I was given to me by people more competent than me, and all my problems seem to have disappeared, almost as if they never existent outside the boundaries of my own skull.

 

Coming back to where I talked about my first console gaming experience, some of those games (not all, just some like Robocop vs Terminator) to this very day I regard as some of the most rage inducing,

gamepad throwing, table flipping, telly smashing gaming experiences that I probably ever endured.

 

Some of those games back in the day were designed to counter your intuition, and challenge you to find ways to progress, which sometimes consumed ridiculous amounts of hours. (I remember playing Echo the Dolphin with my dad, to the point where we would forget about going to sleep and play till the bloody morning and sometimes still wouldn't be able to beat the level, the sessions would use to end with wild angry mom appearing... )

 

The main thing to note here, is these games are from that era where if you couldn't get past spikes or bottomless pits, or crazy bosses that would obliterate you on sight - you couldn't really go online and complain to developers to remove that bit, you had 2 choices -....

 

.... Evolve as a gamer and find the way eventually through shear patience.

.... Devolve completely and rage quit.

 

When it comes to World of Warships, I honestly believe, that most people fears and complaints come from inexperience with a class, and not enough opportunities to learn to deal with a specific threats efficiently.

 

A lot of players come to the game, choose let's say battleships to start with, because battleships are awesome - they big and they have big loud guns, and who doesn't like that, the problem is when you start getting one shotted in your favourite BB by a DD or a CV - you feel cheated, you feel that you just waisted your time leveling a class that is getting killed so easily and there is no hope at all, people don't understand you, they are telling you to get good making you even sadder which eventually leads you into quitting the game.

 

Seeing all these people struggle with what to me seems like the essence of gaming, this is where and how I would like to conclude my point in a form of suggestion:

 

In order to help beginners evolve, wouldn't it make sense to implement an enforced tutorial of about 15-20 missions / scenarios that look something like:

 

1. You are now in a destroyer, successfully torp a battleship

2. You are now in a cruiser, escort a battleship without it being sunk, with 3 carriers sending torpedo bombers to destroy the bb.

3. You are now in carrier, sink a battleship that is being escorted by a Cleveland class cruiser

4. You are now in a battleship, there are 5 carriers trying to sink you with torpedo bombers, only objective - survive for 5-10 minutes.

 

Giving new players chance to prepare for the real battlefield, where they will encounter these scenarios in one form or another, will in my opinion leave them more equipped to deal with all of them, instead of going to forums to complain.

 

Some of the players probably wouldn't make it through, but those are most likely the players that will not have a good time on the actual battlefield in the first-place.

 

As a final note, I am not a game developer, for me the game is perfect as is, I'm submitting this purely as a conclusion that I made form my own personal observations, your mileage will probably wary as it should, therefore please share your thoughts, I would love to see opinions of both the oldest and newest players to the game.

 

 

*Puts on a blindfold & lights up a cigarette*

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OVanBruce]

Well, IIRC there was tutorial missions being developed. We asked for then for a long time in the alpha. Dunno what has happened to then.

 

And give a me a brofist mate. 26 year old here, first played with a console at 3 years old (it was an SNES though) and have been a fan of shoot em ups for years. Some of the people here would probably rage at the first stage of Sonic Wings, Daioh or Gradius.

[Khul]

WARNING: may contain abundance of text / confusing references / life stories

 

Seeing all these people struggle with what to me seems like the essence of gaming, this is where and how I would like to conclude my point in a form of suggestion:

 

In order to help beginners evolve, wouldn't it make sense to implement an enforced tutorial of about 15-20 missions / scenarios that look something like:

 

1. You are now in a destroyer, successfully torp a battleship

2. You are now in a cruiser, escort a battleship without it being sunk, with 3 carriers sending torpedo bombers to destroy the bb.

3. You are now in carrier, sink a battleship that is being escorted by a Cleveland class cruiser

4. You are now in a battleship, there are 5 carriers trying to sink you with torpedo bombers, only objective - survive for 5-10 minutes.

 

Giving new players chance to prepare for the real battlefield, where they will encounter these scenarios in one form or another, will in my opinion leave them more equipped to deal with all of them, instead of going to forums to complain.

 

Some of the players probably wouldn't make it through, but those are most likely the players that will not have a good time on the actual battlefield in the first-place.

 

As a final note, I am not a game developer, for me the game is perfect as is, I'm submitting this purely as a conclusion that I made form my own personal observations, your mileage will probably wary as it should, therefore please share your thoughts, I would love to see opinions of both the oldest and newest players to the game.

 

 

*Puts on a blindfold & lights up a cigarette*

 

 

 

I have run out of plus-ones, but that is the best fecking suggestion I have ever seen regarding this game. Literally. The single best one. The boost to the overall standard of gameplay would be immeasurable, imo.

 

[NettiWelho]

 

Hear, hear! Ground past Hatsuharu today and boy it was a grind; Out of first 25 games I lost 20, which is pretty much the same experience I had with the ship in closed beta leading to me believe it was cursed.. Now the grind is done and I can see my overall performance with the ship wasn't all that abysmal but the repeated bad luck streak got seated deep in my perception of the boat.

 

But if that bad luck streak was your first impression of the game.. And it got repeated time after time...

 

[rancidpunk]

Well said OP +1

 

Showing my age here but my first experience of gaming was copying the code for Donkey Kong into my Commodore 64 from a magazine while trying to fly on a ZXSpectrum then getting kicked off both for using the only 2 televisions in the house!  

[Xevious_Red]

+1 from me, and making me feel old (31) I started with a megadrive as well, and yeah you either got better or you didnt play. Games like hellfire where if you died you started again. Not restart the boss fight, or restart the level, but restart the game.

[AnuSuaraj]

Can do nothing but commend the OP and his wall of text.

 

Indeed, most new players seem to be battleship players that have no interest in learning how to properly play a battleship but rather would just like to indiscriminately whine at whatever thing is killing them at the moment.

 

And I don't think Darwin can help those people much.

[el_bloom]

Good stuff, nice read. Tutorial, please ! (nice and short like OP suggested, just covering each situation at least one time in every class)

[Del_Mare]

the problem you describe reminds of this:

 

but, yes, maybe the younger generation needs some more tutorials to get shown the possibilites, because they are not used to it anymore to do that by themselves (no offense)

[Vanhal]

Rage? Of course, often. Especially when the reason is true and right.

Quit because of it? No way. Only tedium can do it.

[MassiveDYT]

Well said OP +1

 

Showing my age here but my first experience of gaming was copying the code for Donkey Kong into my Commodore 64 from a magazine while trying to fly on a ZXSpectrum then getting kicked off both for using the only 2 televisions in the house!  

 

Comoddore 64 boxing, space shuttle and soccer under my own belt, I chose not to go that deep in order not to confuse the youth on what a comoddore is

[Phantombeast]

Hey MassivD,

 

a good read and so many parallels...  it's been a C64, the game "Bruce Lee" and me kicking my brothers furniture when I couldn't get to a levels end...

 

I second your suggestion completely !

 

[Crysantos]

True, I never liked the "devolution" as you put it, rage quitting on the forum threads is something utterly hilarious.

 

But I don't think that this means a step backwards when it comes to gaming - we're in an era now where a lot of fanmade projects come alive via crowdfunding, direct feedback allows the developers to design a way better gaming experience than ever before. As usual you have to take into consideration the regular "this is op, that is op, nerf everything" - but I think the devs are pretty well equipped to sift through the tons of feedback and find the constructive feedback they need to improve. The thing that annoys me most isn't devolution but the entitlement of people, feeling like their opinion is the only valid one and it's up to them what should be done.

 

You're the kind of long term player every game designer wants to have, you invest time and money, you're a "healthy" part of the community. I love the game and thus I give my personal feedback as "impartially" as possible, trying to do my part to make it a fun experience for everybody. My personal 2 cents on this is that the whole attitude got a bit more negative with the influx of the open beta gamers, but that was to be expected. I think WG are doing a great job with this game and it's still in beta.

[Aldramelech]

I started on the Atari games console, you know the one, the wooden one!  Playing Defender, as we gazed in wonder at the graphics...........

[MassiveDYT]

the problem you describe reminds of this:

 

but, yes, maybe the younger generation needs some more tutorials to get shown the possibilites, because they are not used to it anymore to do that by themselves (no offense)

 

Oh wow, this video

 

Also made me remember the first time I've seen the trailer for Quake 3 in the local arcade and hearing that insane shiver inducing soundtrack (aye I have to admit I was introduced to Q3 first, then when I got older I chose to go back end play the first 2)... So good.

 

Actually now that I think about it, we use to play Q3DM17 instagib rail only for so long, In fact my greatest gaming achievement to this very day was spawnkilling a guy 10-0 who used an aimbot and occupied a popular room for a bit

[AnuSuaraj]

Commodore ->PC 286->PC IBM 486

 

That's the only way to roll.

[Askorti]

I agree.. But then again, most people don't like tutorials. Most bad players are not aware that they are bad players and thus they will insist that the game/other players are wrong. Tutorials are a good thing, they are needed, but they are not a remedy for bad players who are not willing to become better.

[krismorgan]

c64 jobby for my childhood,+1 from myself op.

[MassiveDYT]

I agree.. But then again, most people don't like tutorials. Most bad players are not aware that they are bad players and thus they will insist that the game/other players are wrong. Tutorials are a good thing, they are needed, but they are not a remedy for bad players who are not willing to become better.

 

I'm not sure it should be in a form of tutorial at all, more like "you are doing these missions either you like it or not in order to get to the main game", in order to introduce players to all the game mechanics and ways to counter them, making them less scary and less complain worthy.

 

I'm speaking from personal experience as well, where in the beggining of CBT I haven't played a single game as a CV or DD but was immediately expert on torpedo mechanics, in my own head that is.

[Nechrom]

Commodore ->PC 286->PC IBM 486

 

That's the only way to roll.

 

Nah, Amiga -> PC (upgrade when required)

[Del_Mare]

amiga 2000 =) first experience with games.. of course all in english and without manual, and i was a 8 year old boy who wasn't able to understand a single word. but it helped a lot to be curios what all this buttons may do

 

guess those experiences got me used to never giving up ;)

[Nechrom]

amiga 2000 =) first experience with games.. of course all in english and without manual, and i was a 8 year old boy who wasn't able to understand a single word. but it helped a lot to be curios what all this buttons may do

 

guess those experiences got me used to never giving up ;)

 

Ah, the old amiga.

Stunt Car Racer, Wings, Onslaught, X-Out and of course Lemmings.

Those were the days.

[Klackon44]

 

Nah, Amiga -> PC (upgrade when required)

Hi everyone - first post on the ships forum

 

Atari 800XL to start with, i hope i dont get too much hate from all the c64 fans

 

Very well said OP, i am seriously missing the times when you were supposed to beat games, not cry for a nerf. Also, they should add similar tutorial stuff to WOT while they are at it...

 

 

[MassiveDYT]

Hi everyone - first post on the ships forum

 

Atari 800XL to start with, i hope i dont get too much hate from all the c64 fans

 

Very well said OP, i am seriously missing the times when you were supposed to beat games, not cry for a nerf. Also, they should add similar tutorial stuff to WOT while they are at it...

 

 

 

They probably should, but it probably wouldn't make a difference, at this point WoT seems to be beyond redemption.

 

We, the gamers, should stand up for WoWs tho, reading all the comments here has touched my heart, true gamers are still amongst us, and our legacy should not be ignored.

[Nethraniel]

Sound maybe a bit bleak... but isn't this some kind of general problem of modern society? Achieve everything without actually working for it? That is true in education, work, etc. ... 

 

Everybody should man up a bit and enjoy challenges...

 

+1 OP