Low tier Jap carriers are unstoppable

[KillSlim]

I play CV's primarily and I did back in CBT. The problem with low tier ships in genera is that they all lack AA capability apart from a few exceptions, and when there are 1 or 2 Jap carriers on the enemy team they're unstoppable, their primary tactic is to go straight for the enemy carrier so they have no resistance for the rest of the game. I once had several cruisers (1 x Cleveland and something else) escort me through the start of a game with a Jap carrier on the enemy team. Predictably he went straight for me but even with 2 x cruisers hitting the panic button and my fighters engaging, I couldn't stop them, and I sunk. 

 

What exactly is the counter to this? Cruiser escorts don't work, and you can't hide from planes. I can't dodge torps well because I'm in a CV. Do I try to sink the enemy carrier before they sink me? If so that's a pretty stale meta.

[Orlunu]

Uh, what CV are you in?

 

If you're also in a Japanese CV and are getting facemunched by Japanese CVs, just do whatever they do that seems so OP.

If you're in a US CV, you should be running fighter setup, and your fighters can fend off two equal-tier Japanese CVs because balance.

[KillSlim]

Uh, what CV are you in?

 

If you're also in a Japanese CV and are getting facemunched by Japanese CVs, just do whatever they do that seems so OP.

If you're in a US CV, you should be running fighter setup, and your fighters can fend off two equal-tier Japanese CVs because balance.

 

Independence, I had the same problems I illustrated in my post in Bogue and to a lesser extent Langley. Also, going full fighter is too dependent on MM, but is it he only solution?

[Outlawz0111]

WW1 Ships & Pre WW2 ships where always poorly equipped with AA except some rare instances of course due to the fact that air superiority tactics where used later in world war 2, that is when ships began refits and housed more AA onto them. Carriers are working as intended, well..., most of them are. If you really do have an issue with them i suggest you provide feedback in the appropriate section but be warned ectar will not take a whine as feedback in all due respects so you will need to word it better.

 

From the games i have personally played the carriers are not unstoppable i think thats a bit exaggerated on your part sir. Games that are chucked together giving one team 2 carriers and the other 1 needs to stop though that part if you where trying to say that i fully agree. I would want a limit on other classes if CV's get that treatment though theirs plenty other instances at hand not just CV MM issues.

[Orlunu]

Independence, I had the same problems I illustrated in my post in Bogue and to a lesser extent Langley. Also, going full fighter is too dependent on MM, but is it he only solution?

 

If you go full fighter you can still use your fighters to counter enemy DDs and so on, and a single TB squad is no good against a competent player anyway.  Yeah, US carriers are set up as fighter platforms at the moment.  RIP carrier balance.

[Karolus_V]

-Nah, it's more dangerous a Shokaku in a battle full of Tier V and VI. 

 

-But your team also had 4 US tier VI and VII cruisers!

 

-Yeah, we had. For a short time. Until Torpedo Bombers appeared en masse.

[Outlawz0111]

Did i misread the thread because sometimes i can do that unintentionally ?. Well anyway good night all carrier fans and see you all in morning im sure ectar will have fun tomorrow waking up to 1 thousand whines hehe.

[Compass_Rose]

At tier 4 I agree there's very little AA at that tier.  Unless you're in a Yubari or fully upgraded Wyoming.

 

The best strategy is the team strategy of playing aggressively and deciding the match early.  CVs are a game timer.  You give them enough time and they'll whallop a whole fleet.  It's up to the team in general to make an effort to knock the enemy out before the carriers become too great a factor.

[Orlunu]

At tier 4 I agree there's very little AA at that tier.  Unless you're in a Yubari or fully upgraded Wyoming.

 

Last game I played (enemy planes came from a Zuiho):

 

That's with significantly worse AA than the Myogi, the Wyoming, or Yubari, and pretty much the same as the Hosho.  Sure, it isn't shutting down an enemy carrier single handedly through your passive defences alone, but it does seriously thin out the number of torpedoes coming your way.

 

Basically, the only ship that's not nimble enough to just dance around torps at this tier which doesn't have that kind of AA armament is the Langley, which has fighter planes which are vastly better at the job anyway.

[Kirasa]

 

Last game I played (enemy planes came from a Zuiho):

 

That's with significantly worse AA than the Myogi, the Wyoming, or Yubari, and pretty much the same as the Hosho.  Sure, it isn't shutting down an enemy carrier single handedly through your passive defences alone, but it does seriously thin out the number of torpedoes coming your way.

 

Basically, the only ship that's not nimble enough to just dance around torps at this tier which doesn't have that kind of AA armament is the Langley, which has fighter planes which are vastly better at the job anyway.

 

But that would mean they have to put effort into evading torps...

[Broevaharo]

The problem is not so much that IJn are unstoppable, the problem is that fighter setup on US is just not a viable option, if you are the only CV in the game you are just one useless ship with the dpm of a peanut while the other team has a cruiser or BB filling that slot.

If you are lucky and you are against another CV you shoot down his planes and still get less XP than with a full strike setup.

[Takeda92]

Well they gave Kuma a fighter plane and Myougi what could be the 2nd best AA of tier 4?

[ttchip]

The problem is not so much that IJn are unstoppable, the problem is that fighter setup on US is just not a viable option, if you are the only CV in the game you are just one useless ship with the dpm of a peanut while the other team has a cruiser or BB filling that slot.

If you are lucky and you are against another CV you shoot down his planes and still get less XP than with a full strike setup.

 

Also, intercepting and destroying planes doesn't pay jack s**t.

[CherryWood]

Pure fighter setups are a broken concept. Atm its basically a trolling setup where you decided to sacrifice most of your reward to do the same for some other CV player.

[Sixpack]

Well they gave Kuma a fighter plane and Myougi what could be the 2nd best AA of tier 4?

 

The Myogi AA is too short ranged to be truley effective.

[Sharana]

Pure fighter setups are a broken concept. Atm its basically a trolling setup where you decided to sacrifice most of your reward to do the same for some other CV player.

 

The russians are joking that only butthurted BB captains use them 

[Broevaharo]

Pure fighter setups are a broken concept. Atm its basically a trolling setup where you decided to sacrifice most of your reward to do the same for some other CV player.

 

Exactly plus there is zero skill or fun in clicking on a plane and than wait for 30 seconds untill they destroy something (or not)

[Unintentional_submarine]

 

The russians are joking the only butthurted BB captains use them 

 

Heh...

 

But honestly I don't even see them at all in OBT. Not once yet personally, and only twice in streams. It should say something about what people think about fighter loadouts. They are not fun and they barely impact the game. The result is naturally that people gravitate away from them. I have however noticed a lot more people going with stock loadouts. it might be so they don't need to research the other loudouts, but it might also be because it generally provides both fighters and TBs.

 

Lexington stock is arguably better than either fighter or strike.

[Takeda92]

 

The Myogi AA is too short ranged to be truley effective.

 

5km for the 120mm and 4km for the 40mm, don't forget biplanes are slow. For self defense and if you turn toward the lanes and keep them turning it will help. AA is not an automatic plane deleter, you have to maneuver and keep the planes in your radius for it to be effective.

[DtXpwnz]

 

5km for the 120mm and 4km for the 40mm, don't forget biplanes are slow. For self defense and if you turn toward the lanes and keep them turning it will help. AA is not an automatic plane deleter, you have to maneuver and keep the planes in your radius for it to be effective.

 

Myogi top hull:

5km aura, 12dps

2km aura, 48dps

0,9km aura, 48dps

 

--> don't fly over the ship, just fly around it and no plane will ever die

[Takeda92]

 

Myogi top hull:

5km aura, 12dps

2km aura, 48dps

0,9km aura, 48dps

 

--> don't fly over the ship, just fly around it and no plane will ever die

I mistook 2km for 4km.. anyway you can force them to be longer in our aura by keep turning toward the planes, at tier 4 they are not fast enough to overrun you. Your AA is not for escort, it's for self-defense only and remember that tier 4 carriers have barely 10 planes in reserve!

[DtXpwnz]

I mistook 2km for 4km.. anyway you can force them to be longer in our aura by keep turning toward the planes, at tier 4 they are not fast enough to overrun you. Your AA is not for escort, it's for self-defense only and remember that tier 4 carriers have barely 10 planes in reserve!

 

You are right ofcourse and it might throw off majority of CV players and even make them screw up their attack. But really against good CV player, Myogi will never shoot down a single plane and will eat 2 torps per squadron (IJN ofcourse) no matter what he does.

[Takeda92]

 

You are right ofcourse and it might throw off majority of CV players and even make them screw up their attack. But really against good CV player, Myogi will never shoot down a single plane and will eat 2 torps per squadron (IJN ofcourse) no matter what he does.

 

and why is it wrong to take torp hits? you know those CV players are playing to have fun too you know.. imagine if you play a class and not manage to do a single hit.

[DtXpwnz]

Im a CV player myself...

I am just saying... lets be realistic, do not pretend that BB can outplay good CV. The only thing that can help at these lower tiers is more Yubaris and acting more like a fleet (sticking together). AA is bad on these tiers, but 2-3 T4 cruisers and your planes cannot loiter around the battleships anymore.

[Orlunu]

I am just saying... lets be realistic, do not pretend that BB can outplay good CV. The only thing that can help at these lower tiers is more Yubaris and acting more like a fleet (sticking together). AA is bad on these tiers, but 2-3 T4 cruisers and your planes cannot loiter around the battleships anymore.

 

A BB player can outplay a good CV, simply by sticking near his cruisers and evading to minimise torp damage.  Yes, he can't entirely avoid damage, but he shouldn't be able to.