Co-Op and Operations improvements needed

[Seanld1_1]

 

Just wanted to spread this so coop and operations can be more fun for ppl.

 

 

Credit to AWT on steam 

https://steamcommunity.com/id/AAWT

[hellhound666]

developers are in piter and i dont think that they visit eu forum often

[Schelfie]

2 minutes ago, hellhound666 said:

developers are in piter and i dont think that they visit eu forum often

Even if they do, they have the opinion that Co-op is dirty and deserves to be pestered for all eternity. Random is their golden child, for some reason...

[WingedHussar_Adler]

26 minutes ago, Schelfie said:

Even if they do, they have the opinion that Co-op is dirty and deserves to be pestered for all eternity. Random is their golden child, for some reason...

they see this game as pvp game and not pve game....i cn not blame them

[Schelfie]

Just now, WingedHussar_Adler said:

they see this game as pvp game and not pve game....i cn not blame them

Why? Why not both?

 

Is it so difficult to give at least some love to the Co-Op players?

[WingedHussar_Adler]

5 minutes ago, Schelfie said:

Why? Why not both?

 

Is it so difficult to give at least some love to the Co-Op players?

i really can not say why.....i am not against it...probably they do not have enought manpower to develop pvp and pve content.....

[Yosha_AtaIante]

26 minutes ago, Schelfie said:

Why? Why not both?

 

Is it so difficult to give at least some love to the Co-Op players?

because pvp makes them more money. its a psychological thing and they will gladly sacrifice a few of the pve only players for it.

[Schelfie]

3 minutes ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

because pvp makes them more money. its a psychological thing and they will gladly sacrifice a few of the pve only players for it.

I what way do they make more money in PVP. 

 

I must use almost premiums only in Co-Op. It's the only way to make a decent buck, XP's and experience in that game mode.

 

Play with researchable ships only and you're broke in less then a week.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

5 minutes ago, Schelfie said:

I what way do they make more money in PVP. 

 

I must use almost premiums only in Co-Op. It's the only way to make a decent buck, XP's and experience in that game mode.

 

Play with researchable ships only and you're broke in less then a week.

im talking about WG earning money due to pvp players.

[Schelfie]

3 minutes ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

im talking about WG earning money due to pvp players.

Yeah, and i want to know in what way they earn more to PVP players.

 

Like i've said: for a Co-op player: Premiumships and bonuscards are the only way to make a "decent" earning in credits, XP and commanderpoints. We have to put a lot of money in it to make some gains.

 

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

16 minutes ago, Schelfie said:

I what way do they make more money in PVP. 

 

I must use almost premiums only in Co-Op. It's the only way to make a decent buck, XP's and experience in that game mode.

 

Play with researchable ships only and you're broke in less then a week.

It's not a revenue issue. There is simply very little demand in WG's perspective weirdly enough, because the majority of players are just hoarders with a very simple demand - grinds without much effort put into it. They just want to collect, not a challange. What that means is that coop for most players is only here to grinding tokens and missions. When Lesta actually tested with bots that were more of a challange there was an uproar. People hated it because it made grinding harder as far as I can remember. Go figure.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

2 minutes ago, Europizza said:

It's not a revenue issue. There is simply very little demand in WG's perspective weirdly enough, because the majority of players are just hoarders with a very simple demand - grinds without much effort put into it. They just want to collect, not a challange. What that means is that coop for most players is only here to grinding tokens and missions. When Lesta actually tested with bots that were more of a challange there was an uproar. People hated it becasue it made grinding harder. Go figure.

And to skip grinding some pay money for boosters, premiums and so on. In every single game with this monetization model it works and there are more games with those models than there are without (currently played games as in live service games). Pvp also helps with exploiting narcissistic people like me who like to compare themselves to others (every one is a bit narcissistic it just varies) and most people use the pressure of a better ship as reason to spend money on a supposedly OP premium, lootboxes ect to get their imaginary edge over other players aka they try to spend money to win easier which thankfully doesn't really work in WOWS however the traps still function as they prey on people who don't know better 

[159Hunter]

3 hours ago, Seanld1_1 said:

 

Just wanted to spread this so coop and operations can be more fun for ppl.

 

 

Credit to AWT on steam 

https://steamcommunity.com/id/AAWT

Coop games are short because everyone rushes in. Do this in randoms and you get the same.

As for not breaking even: I easily break even on all tiers and classes (BBs are a tad harder to do so).

 

I don't wand higher tier ships in OPS, most ppl already struggle in a tier VIII operation. 

God forbid we go to tier XI. No thank you

[Panocek]

Then there's issue of PvP and PvE balance often being exclusive and double work is something WG usually want to avoid. Or rather, what passes in PvE, or is even desirable in "few vs many" environment, would be seen as ridiculously broken in PvP

[cracktrackflak]

All WG have to do with co-op is add in some more ships on the bot team. How complex is that?

[Verblonde]

6 minutes ago, cracktrackflak said:

All WG have to do with co-op is add in some more ships on the bot team. How complex is that?

Presumably, the issue is that - for a decent player in the right ship - that would mean a dramatic increase in potential rewards.

 

WG have a major hard-on for Randoms, and they want to avoid any player exodus which might happen if the potential rewards for Coop increased...

[Schelfie]

6 hours ago, Verblonde said:

Presumably, the issue is that - for a decent player in the right ship - that would mean a dramatic increase in potential rewards.

 

WG have a major hard-on for Randoms, and they want to avoid any player exodus which might happen if the potential rewards for Coop increased...

They still have that disillusioned view that random is their "main game" and all the rest doesn't even need any attention at all, despite they're leaving a huge potential to rot there...

[SurfaceFish]

Anyone getting reported while playing in coop this patch? This never happens few months back, now seems everyday some people are triggered by what other players did in CO-OP?! I don't write anything in chat btw.

[Dutchy_2019]

30 minutes ago, SurfaceFish said:

Anyone getting reported while playing in coop this patch? This never happens few months back, now seems everyday some people are triggered by what other players did in CO-OP?! I don't write anything in chat btw.

 

Yup - seems people are angry when you launch torps, get their torps (while barely deviating from their line), or simply put in longer range shots with your BB.

[invicta2012]

On 1/12/2023 at 4:34 PM, Europizza said:

It's not a revenue issue. There is simply very little demand in WG's perspective weirdly enough, because the majority of players are just hoarders with a very simple demand - grinds without much effort put into it. They just want to collect, not a challange. What that means is that coop for most players is only here to grinding tokens and missions. When Lesta actually tested with bots that were more of a challange there was an uproar. People hated it because it made grinding harder as far as I can remember. Go figure.

I'm not here for challenge, though. I play PVE because I like the game, setting, art, etc and it's a nice way to spend my time. Increasing "challenge" is just an annoyance, imposed on me by a bossy company; it's rather like my Nespresso machine deciding I have to play a game of Simon with the top panel buttons before it gives me my coffee. It's more challenging, but I didn't come here for that. 

 

When I'm in Ops, though, challenge is fine, provided that 

1) they haven't bent the normal rules of the game. I didn't learn all those armour schemes and ammo pen rules just for you to come up with Yamato Super Boss which doesnae follow the laws of physics.

2) I can get gud if I play it a lot. Mastery and repetition, allowing me to use my favourite ships, are a good thing. I don't mean game modes which always run the same way (glad to see the Op updates have largely put paid to spawn camping).

 

Oh, and it wasn't the playerbase who decided the game was a collector fest. That's down to WG's monetisation strategies. This sort of thing.. all looks familiar, doesn't it?

 

 

 

[Karasu_Browarszky]

21 hours ago, Panocek said:

Then there's issue of PvP and PvE balance often being exclusive and double work is something WG usually want to avoid. Or rather, what passes in PvE, or is even desirable in "few vs many" environment, would be seen as ridiculously broken in PvP

 

And now for the million dollar question: why is it so?

[Panocek]

4 minutes ago, Karasu_Browarszky said:

 

And now for the million dollar question: why is it so?

You mean part of not many people liking to do the same job twice or part where ship combines firepower and survivability to take on multiple waves of enemies and not only live to tell the tale, but also pushing against to carry out objectives might be a little bit over the top in PvP?

[Karasu_Browarszky]

32 minutes ago, Panocek said:

You mean part of not many people liking to do the same job twice or part where ship combines firepower and survivability to take on multiple waves of enemies and not only live to tell the tale, but also pushing against to carry out objectives might be a little bit over the top in PvP?

Well, mostly why the balancing for PvP and PvE is different. Logically speaking, it shouldn't IMO be so.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

Just now, Karasu_Browarszky said:

Well, mostly why the balancing for PvP and PvE is different. Logically speaking, it shouldn't IMO be so.

In quite a few games there is actually a purposeful difference in balance between pve and pvp.

 

Its why FFXIV has its own class actions for pvp and pve,

 

world of warcraft has its own pvp gear compared to pve.

 

these are just 2 examples of MMORPGs that do this sort of thing and those are the most popular examples.

[Karasu_Browarszky]

25 minutes ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

In quite a few games there is actually a purposeful difference in balance between pve and pvp.

 

Its why FFXIV has its own class actions for pvp and pve,

 

world of warcraft has its own pvp gear compared to pve.

 

these are just 2 examples of MMORPGs that do this sort of thing and those are the most popular examples.

 

Yes, when it comes to MMORPG's, they also tend to use separate gear for PvP and PvE. Why though? If the reason is that the AI/bots in PvE are clearly weaker than the players in PvP, there has to be a reason why they make them so.