Alexander Nevsky Line -- IFHE?

[ReverendFlashback]

I've played through Shchors once and unlocked Tallinn first, now working on getting Chapayev.

My first fourth tier skill on my russian light cruiser captain went into ifhe and I wonder if this was a good decision.

Wiki says it's a "three star" skill aka very important on Nevsky, but after some more research I found a thread where everyone was saying it's not worth it on the T10 and will hurt damage output.

The question is, should I keep IFHE until I actually reach T10 or is it already more or less not that usefull on Shchors (and T8 and 9 cruisers in that line)?

Because if it is not, I rather reskill sooner than later since it is getting more costly the higher your captain level is, and I miss CE anyway.

[Latouche_Treville]

Hi,

On the N.A. forum, LittleWhiteMouse made a post about IFHE :
She was one of the best, if not the best CC and a very very competent analyst of game mechanics.

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/213359-ifhe-all-night-long/

[KillStealBoss]

IFHE isn't a must on this ship, you can mount it but you also can play it without IFHE. I personally use it but many others don't. 

[tocqueville8]

33 minutes ago, Latouche_Treville said:

Hi,

On the N.A. forum, LittleWhiteMouse made a post about IFHE :
She was one of the best, if not the best CC and a very very competent analyst of game mechanics. 

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/213359-ifhe-all-night-long/

 

That post suggests taking IFHE on the Nevsky. I say "suggest" because it forgets about 180 mm guns at Tier 10.

 

Then again, it's a deliberately "not nuanced" post, and the whole matter is debatable.

[BLUB__BLUB]

1 hour ago, ReverendFlashback said:

I rather reskill sooner than later since it is getting more costly the higher your captain level is, and I miss CE anyway.

There is the thing, you are missing CE. 

 

CE is life. Also, if you keep your eyes open, you can notice which ship used DCP to put out a fire. 

Reset the fire. Make it THREE perma-fires, and harvest the salt. Sure fire damage is repairable... but up to a point.

Damage from fires is easy, and you do not have to shoot that much, so you do not reveal your position all the time.

 

Nevsky is a floating citadel... the less you have to shoot, the longer you live, and the more influence you have.

 

[MoveZig]

I wouldn't put IFHE on anything with 30mm HE-pen, which is enough to pen just about every cruiser and BB superstructures. Especially since the AP is actually pretty good on Newski. Not worth the skill points and halved fires.

[ReverendFlashback]

Thanks for all the replies.

So it is definitely a No for Nevsky (and so Donskoi).

But I'm still not sure about Shchors and Chapeyev. 

The only time I see a difference is when shooting T7 bbs. Then ifhe is nasty.

But since your low tire at least 2 out of 3 games it is probably not.

[BLUB__BLUB]

39 minutes ago, ReverendFlashback said:

Thanks for all the replies.

So it is definitely a No for Nevsky (and so Donskoi).

But I'm still not sure about Shchors and Chapeyev. 

The only time I see a difference is when shooting T7 bbs. Then ifhe is nasty.

But since your low tire at least 2 out of 3 games it is probably not.

The question is, is it nasty enough... 

I do hate Nevsky and Donskoi... but I like Shchors and Chapayev. 

The best they do is:

- hunt DDs... one-shot, BLAP. You do not need IFHE for that.

- long range, irritating, accurate HE-spam that sets (lots of) fires... also: no IFHE. 

 

You get close to a cap behind a mountain, radar the DD in it, pop out and kill j him,

and after that run and be a nuisance to whatever was behind that DD.

I think Chapayev is just a bit more nimble than the Donkey/Nevsky. 

Which is why you can do 'kiting', at least I can, others may do better in Donkey/Nevsky.

[ReverendFlashback]

15 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

The question is, is it nasty enough... 

I do hate Nevsky and Donskoi... but I like Shchors and Chapayev. 

The best they do is:

- hunt DDs... one-shot, BLAP. You do not need IFHE for that.

- long range, irritating, accurate HE-spam that sets (lots of) fires... also: no IFHE. 

 

You get close to a cap behind a mountain, radar the DD in it, pop out and kill j him,

and after that run and be a nuisance to whatever was behind that DD.

I think Chapayev is just a bit more nimble than the Donkey/Nevsky. 

Which is why you can do 'kiting', at least I can, others may do better in Donkey/Nevsky.

 

I think you're right about this and I'm going to swap ifhe for ce and not getting it afterwards anymore.

Another 100k captain xp down the drain *sigh*

[BLUB__BLUB]

21 minutes ago, ReverendFlashback said:

I think you're right about this and I'm going to swap ifhe for ce and not getting it afterwards anymore.

Another 100k captain xp down the drain *sigh*

If you play Clan Battles and use the boosters they're quickly respecced. 

I can respec at least 1 commander per week... also all my T10 ships have 21pts.

 

But it's allright to try. I even had a IFHE on my T7 King George V (BB). 

[Panocek]

4 hours ago, ReverendFlashback said:

Thanks for all the replies.

So it is definitely a No for Nevsky (and so Donskoi).

But I'm still not sure about Shchors and Chapeyev. 

The only time I see a difference is when shooting T7 bbs. Then ifhe is nasty.

But since your low tire at least 2 out of 3 games it is probably not.

IFHE brings too big of a fire chance hit, coupled with proliferation of battleships armored enough to ignore IFHE-boosted HE shells to make it relevant.

 

tier 7 and below CLs also can't really make use of IFHE, as penetration caps at 31mm, so whenever you see tier 8+ battleship, you can't pen it nor set it on fire, bringing you not only to square one, but two steps back. Quite a number of midtier battleships also happen to be armored all around, rendering IFHE a moot skill.

[Knight_Parn]

I don't use IFHE on my Nevsky line CLs.

 

Like others have said due to the cap on IFHE for t7 and below, it's useless when uptiered against t8+ BBs. And you do not need IFHE to reliably hurt t8 or below cruisers.

 

For the Nevsky 30mm HE pen is enough against all non-BB targets. And when facing BB, setting them on fire or switching to AP (effective up to 15km when aiming for upper belt) are the way to go.

[tocqueville8]

4 hours ago, ReverendFlashback said:

But I'm still not sure about Shchors and Chapeyev. 

 

Even with IFHE, Shchors can't pen Tier 8+ BB extremities, as she caps at 31 mm. It would be useful all the time only in Tier 6-7 Ranked, where passing the 26 mm threshold allows to farm most BBs at least somewhere, which is why I take the skill on Abruzzi and Mahan. But not in Randoms.

 

On the other hand, Chapayev has 30 mm already: good enough for Tier 10 cruisers and lower-tier BBs and cruisers, but it can pass the 32 mm threshold with IFHE. Still, the point is that 32 mm isn't all that common in the grand scheme of things. It specifically does nothing against DDs, subs, CVs, cruisers and many BBs (they're either thicker or thinner than that).

[22cm]

No. IFHE is dead after skill rework.

[ReverendFlashback]

Reskilled Shchors yesterday, and it's been only one game, but I didn't miss ifhe at all.

Thanks to all of you guys again for the explanations.

 

Is there any line where this skill is actually recommended?

Because I've been in a somewhat similar situation with Seattle lately where I spent my first 10 points really terribly.(Got Cleveland when still T6, came back a couple years later to find it on T8, without decent commander or any knowledge how to usn light cruiser and fucked skills up too with heavy He and ifhe over ce when this guy finally was lvl 10...)

[HMS_Kilinowski]

IFHE usually means too much reduction in fire chance. Fire damage is not subject to saturation, while direct damage is. IFHE grants extra damage to a small window of ships within the threshold. Ships below and above take less damage since they are penetrated/not penetrated anyway, but suffer less from fires.

So IFHE is mostly a sidegrade, shifting damage from cruisers and heavily armored BBs to a few CAs and battlecruiser. This sidegrade costs skill points that usually are invested into an upgrade instead. So IFHE is often inferior.

 

The only ships where IFHE imo makes sense are low caliber ones with high rate of fire and low fire chance per shell, such as the IJN-gunboats. For them you can take the fire signals and partially compensate the fire penalty. Doing so however is costly, since it requires both fire signals and the detonation signal to compensate the then issued detonation penalty.

[Darkwhite_SaltyBelfast]

somehow on all light cruisers ifhe I can't get along without them and I'm too stupid for fires anyway

[22cm]

3 hours ago, ReverendFlashback said:

Is there any line where this skill is actually recommended?

 

Not anymore.

[OldschoolGaming_YouTube]

On 12/31/2022 at 12:41 PM, ReverendFlashback said:

I've played through Shchors once and unlocked Tallinn first, now working on getting Chapayev.

My first fourth tier skill on my russian light cruiser captain went into ifhe and I wonder if this was a good decision.

Wiki says it's a "three star" skill aka very important on Nevsky, but after some more research I found a thread where everyone was saying it's not worth it on the T10 and will hurt damage output.

The question is, should I keep IFHE until I actually reach T10 or is it already more or less not that usefull on Shchors (and T8 and 9 cruisers in that line)?

Because if it is not, I rather reskill sooner than later since it is getting more costly the higher your captain level is, and I miss CE anyway.

This is what im running on Nevski

 

 

Radio location because like to be able to hunt/kill enemy DDs early/mid and late game. SE is pretty much standard on all cruisers and DDs these days, extra heal radar. Priority target and incoming fire alert combined with good map awareness gives you a longer life ingame.