Roma/Littorio: This thing burns too easily.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

Why does this ship burn so easily and why doesn't it have SAP? For that matter why doesn't all Italian ships have SAP? I thought having SAP was what made them unique?

 

I got the Littorio and I took Concealment Expert skill but I'm thinking I should have gone for Fire Prevention. I'm trying to use the ship's good concealment to get in and then unleash my guns but this thing just burns too easily and OMG the dispersion. 

 

What exactly is the role of this ship?

[SkipperCH]

They were implemented before the Italian cruisers with SAP came into the game. Thats why there is no SAP. And second - their burning coefficient is exactly the same like with every other T8 vessel. So they don't burn more easily than any other T8.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

8 minutes ago, SkipperCH said:

They were implemented before the Italian cruisers with SAP came into the game. Thats why there is no SAP. And second - their burning coefficient is exactly the same like with every other T8 vessel. So they don't burn more easily than any other T8.

You do know that Wargaming has the ability to implement things after they've been released right? 

[invicta2012]

8 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

What exactly is the role of this ship?

Trolling you with its dispersion. But it's a good, and fun ship. Best revisit your Captain build and go more heavily on Fire Prevention/Mitigation. 

[SkipperCH]

Vor 1 Minute, The_Angry_Admiral sagte:

You do know that Wargaming has the ability to implement things after they've been released right? 

Indeed but it's simply not needed. Just because you want better dispersion and SAP you won't get it. 

[Shirakami_Kon]

Also, to be honest you fell for the bait with getting the AL version of Roma. If you wanted a Roma it would have been way smarter to get the regular version, because while it can be a fun ship you'll be dealing with the most trolling dispersion in the game, so if you put money into getting it, you could at least have gotten the regular Roma, for which you could also get the Kobayashi camo and have some incentive to keep playing the ship while not ripping your hair apart by Roma's dispersion and overpens everywhere.

 

But with AL Littorio you just paid for all the cons without even a choice to get a redeeming point.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

10 minutes ago, SkipperCH said:

Indeed but it's simply not needed. Just because you want better dispersion and SAP you won't get it. 

Why is it not needed? If I'm not mistaken the actual Roma had SAP.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

7 minutes ago, Shirakami_Kon said:

Also, to be honest you fell for the bait with getting the AL version of Roma. If you wanted a Roma it would have been way smarter to get the regular version, because while it can be a fun ship you'll be dealing with the most trolling dispersion in the game, so if you put money into getting it, you could at least have gotten the regular Roma, for which you could also get the Kobayashi camo and have some incentive to keep playing the ship while not ripping your hair apart by Roma's dispersion and overpens everywhere.

 

But with AL Littorio you just paid for all the cons without even a choice to get a redeeming point.

I'm not too worried about the credits as I have the Kii and I could pick up the same camo for it. 

[SkipperCH]

Because both ships perform in their expected range. And historical is no argument here. Otherwise the russian high tier DD's would also be equipped with SAP (their shells are even called SAP).

[Shirakami_Kon]

1 minute ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

I'm not too worried about the credits as I have the Kii and I could pick up the same camo for it. 

Ah, ok, cool then.

 

In any case, honest suggestion, considering what happened with you already getting Chkalov without reading it could be nerfed after purchase (which happened and you had your post complaining about it even though it's clearly announced for any recent premium that if they need nerfs they'll get them, a clear buyer beware) and now your issue with  you not even knowing that Roma and Littorio don't have SAP, you should really inform yourself checking videos with reviews and make certain what you're getting before pulling the trigger and then complaining everytime it wasn't what you expected when it's details that have always been there for these ships since day 1. Because you're not gonna get refund or changes to the ships for something that was there and announced since release of the ships.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

1 minute ago, Shirakami_Kon said:

Ah, ok, cool then.

 

In any case, honest suggestion, considering what happened with you already getting Chkalov without reading it could be nerfed after purchase (which happened and you had your post complaining about it even though it's clearly announced for any recent premium that if they need nerfs they'll get them, a clear buyer beware) and now your issue with  you not even knowing that Roma and Littorio don't have SAP, you should really inform yourself checking videos with reviews and make certain what you're getting before pulling the trigger and then complaining everytime it wasn't what you expected when it's details that have always been there for these ships since day 1. Because you're not gonna get refund or changes to the ships for something that was there and announced since release of the ships.

No I knew they didn't have SAP so not sure where you thought I didn't know it. What I was suggesting is why don't they have SAP when the actual ship did have SAP and most other Italian BB's have it. 

 

You know what they say about assumptions. 

[invicta2012]

8 minutes ago, SkipperCH said:

Because both ships perform in their expected range. And historical is no argument here. Otherwise the russian high tier DD's would also be equipped with SAP (their shells are even called SAP).

And all the French Battleships, too. 

 

10 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

Why is it not needed? If I'm not mistaken the actual Roma had SAP.

SAP wasn't in the game when Roma came out. And she's one of the older Premium ships that can't be changed, so they can't add SAP. Her dispersion issues are well known, the ship has been comprehensively reviewed by LittleWhiteMouse and other reliable reviewers. Caveat Emptor.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

11 minutes ago, SkipperCH said:

Because both ships perform in their expected range. And historical is no argument here. Otherwise the russian high tier DD's would also be equipped with SAP (their shells are even called SAP).

Mmmmm why not?

[The_Angry_Admiral]

1 minute ago, invicta2012 said:

 

SAP wasn't in the game when Roma came out. And she's one of the older Premium ships that can't be changed, so they can't add SAP. Her dispersion issues are well known, the ship has been comprehensively reviewed by LittleWhiteMouse and other reliable reviewers. Caveat Emptor.

Can't be changed? These ships are nothing but code so they can be changed. 

[Chaoskraehe]

Roma/Littorio doesn't need SAP to wreck faces. 

[invicta2012]

6 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

Can't be changed? These ships are nothing but code so they can be changed. 

Older Premium ships did not have the "Balance changes may be applied to..." disclaimer against them, so they can't be changed unless global changes take place. Certainly not in a way like adding SAP, which (as a Roma owner), I don't want them to do. 

[Shirakami_Kon]

7 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

Can't be changed? 

Old premium ships can't be changed, back then it wasn't specified that premium ships could get nerfed or changed (except by global changes to the entire faction, like when Tirpitz got the american battleship dispersion formula when that change was applied to all German battleships).

 

That lead to some premium ships being badly balanced and too overpowered, examples: OG Belfast, Giulio Cesare, Imperator Nikolai... which caused that the only solution, since those ships couldn't be nerfed, was to remove them from sale so at least no more people kept buying them because those ships are absolutely broken. That's why recently while they try not to make balancing mistakes with premiums and having to resort to this, there's the new policy of warning the buyer that your new premium ship nowadays will get the nerfbat if it deserves it to prevent more situations like this from happening.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

3 minutes ago, Shirakami_Kon said:

Old premium ships can't be changed, back then it wasn't specified that premium ships could get nerfed or changed (except by global changes to the entire faction, like when Tirpitz got the american battleship dispersion formula when that change was applied to all German battleships).

 

That lead to some premium ships being badly balanced and too overpowered, examples: OG Belfast, Giulio Cesare, Imperator Nikolai... which caused that the only solution, since those ships couldn't be nerfed, was to remove them from sale so at least no more people kept buying them because those ships are absolutely broken. That's why recently while they try not to make balancing mistakes with premiums and having to resort to this, there's the new policy of warning the buyer that your new premium ship nowadays will get the nerfbat if it deserves it to prevent more situations like this from happening.

But would changing from AP to SAP actually be a nerf?

[SkipperCH]

No more citadels? Yes. It would be.

[Shirakami_Kon]

3 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

But would changing from AP to SAP actually be a nerf?

It's a change, would be a good one maybe, but a change. Also when you paid for Roma or Littorio it was made known that those ships have AP, not SAP, so you knew what you were getting. They aren't going to change Roma and Littorio ammo just because it would be nice if they did.

[invicta2012]

5 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

But would changing from AP to SAP actually be a nerf?

As the man said... huge nerf to citadels. But if they want to make an AL Impero, a Littorio-class with SAP, then fire away - I'd be in provided it's Roma with SAP, not Vittorio Veneto (which I don't like at all). 

[Nibenay78]

28 minutes ago, SkipperCH said:

And historical is no argument here

It's not an argument in any part of the game anymore

[Miragetank90]

Losing AP for SAP? on a BB(with arguably the best 15inch AP on top of that)? No thanks a million times over. 

Losing the HE would be the preferable option, but that won't happen as we all know.

 

And that's alright. There's Veneto instead. 

[ColonelPete]

37 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

Why is it not needed? If I'm not mistaken the actual Roma had SAP.

AP works better and gives the ship better DPM.

I wish all RM BB had AP.

16 minutes ago, The_Angry_Admiral said:

But would changing from AP to SAP actually be a nerf?

Depending on how it is done, yes.

[The_Angry_Admiral]

4 minutes ago, Miragetank90 said:

Losing AP for SAP? on a BB(with arguably the best 15inch AP on top of that)? No thanks a million times over. 

Losing the HE would be the preferable option, but that won't happen as we all know.

 

And that's alright. There's Veneto instead. 

Losing HE for SAP would be even better to be honest. 

 

I also got the Giuseppe Verde and I can't understand why they never gave that ship SAP because it's secondaries have it. That ship needs a total rework because while it's not bad in ranked it's terrible in randoms.