Are you f*cking kidding me ?

[bloodynicknames]

So, imagine this scenario, you're in a minotaur, full health, chasing down U-2501 who is at 1/3 health 

You're exactly above him and drop depth charges and the guy surfaces below you and just 1-shots you with a ram.

That's right, 43300 damage from a sub ramming the Minotaur, are you f*cking kidding me WG ? What is this crap ? 

Wheres the limit here ? If this is intetional, does it work for BBs ? would be a nice trade, when you're almost dead just come up below somebody and boom, oneshot

 

 

[Aragathor]

6 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said:

Wheres the limit here ?

Sky is the limit. Expect Sub buffs soon, because they aren't yet as broken as T11 CVs.

[black_falcon120]

ramming is based on max hp + X% iirc. You can get a flag to boost this %.  But this does seem suspect...

[tocqueville8]

I doubt it was a "one-shot".

 

As I understand, with the ramming flag and at "normal" speed, the sub should survive a first ram at 20% hp, while doing 50% more damage than its own hp, so over 20k, but less than 30k.

Then with the second ram, instants later, he'll do the same damage again (unless the two of you got stuck or something), and sink himself.

 

If it was a one-shot, without even a small interval in between, then I guess the videos I saw explaining the ram mechanics were wrong, or subs make an exception

[Verblonde]

8 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said:

You're exactly above him and drop depth charges and the guy surfaces below you and just 1-shots you with a ram.

This happens to cruisers too?! <insert deity of choice's name>! It was bad enough when it was DDs (I had it happen twice), but at least a DD (sort of) makes intuitive sense...

[bloodynicknames]

6 minutes ago, tocqueville8 said:

I doubt it was a "one-shot".

 

As I understand, with the ramming flag and at "normal" speed, the sub should survive a first ram at 20% hp, while doing 50% more damage than its own hp, so over 20k, but less than 30k.

Then with the second ram, instants later, he'll do the same damage again (unless the two of you got stuck or something), and sink himself.

 

If it was a one-shot, without even a small interval in between, then I guess the videos I saw explaining the ram mechanics were wrong, or subs make an exception

i guess you didnt look at the screenshot then smart guy, he came up, boom, from 100% to 0 in 1 sec

[ghostbuster_]

Just now, bloodynicknames said:

i guess you didnt look at the screenshot then smart guy, he came up, boom, from 100% to 0 in 1 sec

can you please share a replay?

[ReDiR20]

sub uses ramming flag? 

[Maris_Piper]

WeeGee/Festa would as soon break the game than admit they've ed Up Big Time with Subs 

[bloodynicknames]

So, I guess ramming doesnt work for subs as it does for everyone else cause, y'know, cant have anything playing by the rules here when you try to shoehorn it in.

 

wiki says 

Damage from a collision is not determined by a ship's current hit points (HP). Rather, a ship's total HP pool determines the maximum amount of damage that it can inflict to an enemy ship. In a high-speed collision, a ship with a large HP pool has the potential to inflict heavy damage. Ships with small HP pools, such as destroyers, have a reduced maximum damage output in a collision.

 

So theoretically a Sub should be able to do 18900 damage at the utter max. I've now looked at fraps footage at .25 speed ... on first impact he does 28350 damage to me while I do 16715 to him(read that quote above now and roll your eyes). 2nd time it triggers he dies and I die. 

this is some serious [edited], I'm going to hop in a training room now and see what I can accomplish ... 

 

[tocqueville8]

42 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said:

So theoretically a Sub should be able to do 18900 damage at the utter max. I've now looked at fraps footage at .25 speed ... on first impact he does 28350 damage to me while I do 16715 to him(read that quote above now and roll your eyes). 2nd time it triggers he dies and I die. 

this is some serious [edited], I'm going to hop in a training room now and see what I can accomplish ... 

 

So that's what I said, right?

 

1st ram: his own hp + 50% of it, thanks to the flag. He barely survives, thanks to the flag again.

2nd ram ("instants later"): you both go down.

 

It wasn't from 100% to 0 in one go, there were two rams, but you had to call me a "smart guy" before bothering to watch the replay...

 

Did you even know about the flag? You don't mention it...

[lup3s]

1 hour ago, bloodynicknames said:

chasing down U-2501 who is at 1/3 health

 

17.3k ramming damage .. and the U-boat was at 1/3 health.

So the U-boat has 52k HP ? 

[bloodynicknames]

3 minutes ago, tocqueville8 said:

 

So that's what I said, right?

 

1st ram: his own hp + 50% of it, thanks to the flag. He barely survives,, thanks to the flag again.

2nd ram ("instants later"): you both go down.

 

It wasn't from 100% to 0 in one go, there were two rams, but you had to call me a "smart guy" before bothering to watch the replay...

 

actually, and I just tested this out, it has nothing to do with that and it's a lot more screwed up than I thought it was. 

Underwater ramming works A LOT different than surface ramming. 

 

If you surface ram a Mino with a sub it takes 8k damage, thats consistent give or take 100 damage, i've tried that a couple times now. The sub ALWAYS takes its full health in damage on impact. 

even with ramming flag the mino will do a lot more damage to the sub than to survive the initial impact(~12k damage to mino with flag but the sub still instantly dies)

 

but underwater things dont work that way and whats written in the wiki doesnt apply. 

The sub takes a lot less damage and you can actually see the "ticks" of the ramming damage being deducted from the health pool before you die. this is roughly 3-5k per tick from a mino(again, tried this a couple of times). 

that being said, the damage the sub does to the mino is extremely inconsistent. I've had results as close the mino only having ~4k health left to only doing 2k damage to it in total. 

 

all that being said it's still utter [edited] a 18.9k hp ship can do 44.3k ramming damage no matter the situation. 

for comparisons sake, the only time I managed to do actual full HP damage to a mino when ramming was with the marceau going 55knts and hitting it dead center, that did 21.9k

 

so yeah, I dont know what that was but that certainly cant be by design rather i'm assuming it's some sort of weird glitch 

[NewHorizons_1]

10 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said:

... certainly cant be by design

I wouldn't put money on that

[guy_incognito79]

1 hour ago, Aragathor said:

Sky is the limit. Expect Sub buffs soon, because they aren't yet as broken as T11 CVs.

Don't use that term along with sub buffs in the same sentance ever again pls!!!

 

WG will think it's a suggestion and the next buff will be an additional consumable that lets the sub briefly fly. 

[BanzaiPiluso]

Oh, another exquisite feature.

[Maris_Piper]

57 minutes ago, guy_incognito79 said:

WG will think it's a suggestion and the next buff will be an additional consumable that lets the sub briefly fly.

I gave the post a laughing face, Then I thought Oh  we're talking WG,, omg it's possible 

 

 

[Wulf_Ace]

maybe sub had nuclear warheads and they exploded on hit

[nlegolass]

Ah yes, the classic Type XXI U-boat kamikaze WW2 attacks.

 

Everything working as intended nothing to see here.

[Yedwy]

Yees lets ram the citadel with the muh underwater spalsh damage reduction...

 

Only WG

 

 

[SolanumTuberosumRex]

2 hours ago, bloodynicknames said:

So, imagine this scenario, you're in a minotaur, full health, chasing down U-2501 who is at 1/3 health 

You're exactly above him and drop depth charges and the guy surfaces below you and just 1-shots you with a ram.

That's right, 43300 damage from a sub ramming the Minotaur, are you f*cking kidding me WG ? What is this crap ? 

Wheres the limit here ? If this is intetional, does it work for BBs ? would be a nice trade, when you're almost dead just come up below somebody and boom, oneshot

 

 

This is a well known tactic in real life, and there are strong rumors that it was not the hundreds of bombs and dozens of torpedoes that sunk the Yamato but Balao accidentally trying to surface right underneath the Japanese behemoth.

[Karasu_Browarszky]

3 hours ago, Aragathor said:

Sky is the limit. Expect Sub buffs soon, because they aren't yet as broken as T11 CVs.

 

They gonna buff them right out of the water?!

[Aragathor]

3 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said:

 

They gonna buff them right out of the water?!

There are plans for that.

 

Not a joke:

 

Spoiler

 

[Estaca_de_Bares]

Leaving aside the fact that @bloodynicknames can't even remember properly how much HP the submarine had at the moment, at first glance it's still a pretty rare, almost fishy happenstance. I concur with @ghostbuster_ that having the replay would be ideal so others can watch what happened by themselves.

 

From my understanding of the mechanic, there would've been two theoretical ways:

• A detonation. If none appears in the replay, it would indicate that detonations have less importance than ramming in the server's algorithm. What I mean by it is that the ramming provokes a detonation and its damage, but due to the flow of code it also overrides the assignment of the Detonation achievement and other visual clues (like the "player detonates player" icon or the message in chat).
• A double collision: first a low-speed one draining health, then a high-speed one that takes away the remainder at once.

The first option (detonation) implies either a single high-speed collision or a double one, so the calculations that follow for the latter case also apply. Since damage would've been "proportional to healthpools", I've run some numbers:

• Without Hotel Yankee, it should've been impossible for the submarine to do such a feat without a detonation: a full-health sub scratching until almost dead (18.9k HP) would've dealt at most 8.25k (since the submarine's healthpool is about 43.65% of Minotaur's 43.3k) in exchange for a total of 27.15k damage when combining both rammings. 8.25k damage from scratching means 19.05% of Minotaur's health, so the detonation could only trigger (if it actually did happen) because of/after the high-speed phase (no detonations while above 75% HP).
• With Hotel Yankee (-20% damage received, +50% damage dealt), in order to scratch 14.95k from Minotaur at the bare minimum, the sub should still have had at the very least 9.97k HP remaining (52.73% of its healthpool) for the following high-speed hit to finally do the killing. In return, Minotaur would've dealt 80% of 52.73% of its own pool, so 18.27k damage, i.e. the submarine had to be almost full HP to survive the scratching. In this case, the detonation threshold could be reached during this phase.

Looking at the numbers in the provided screenshot, not even the Hotel Yankee scenario seems to suffice unless a detonation is in place. Who knows, maybe some cosmic rays just went through the server...

 

Salute.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

I dont know this physics engine but I do remember vertical colliosion between player avatars being quite a challenge for our coders in ue3 (lol yes im old). Vertical collisions could result in the engine crashing due to the primitives intersecting. This could lead to invalid results creating the engine to wig out. Our coders had to use tricks to force controllable solutions, which in this case could be damage ticking for as long as collision is detected to force a solution. Who knows.