CV FAN ONLY ( Bring back Enterprise )

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 15 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

You do realiaze that spoting creates crossfires and that most op thing in cvs is spoting? 

Positioning creates crossfires, either by positioning well (you get to fire) or by mispositioning (you get fired at). Spotting on its own is only information.

Il y a 16 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

Thats why i stoped using crusers and play ony dds / bbs. CVs just made entire class usless.

Ah yes, the number one class providing utility is useless...

No it's not. Radar is always good, hydro is always useful, and for those that don't have that, they either tank a lot by attracting fire or deal a lot of damage.

Il y a 36 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

There is no counter play AA dont work, grouping dont work. Only think you can do is stay back and be usless

AA, grouping and strafing all work.

Unless your WASD keys are broken ?

Il y a 37 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

yeah. TBH yeah. i quess you need to have some differenty way of having fun to have fun in cvs.. 

I don't think taking the downsides of RTS CVs (strong AA with all the side effects like panic, squishy planes, slow planes regen) and the downsides of reworked CVs (low alpha strike, only one wing up at time) to make up the "New" CV is making it "fun for everyone."

Yet that's what a lot of suggestions for the class ends up sounding like.

Il y a 43 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

But sad true is that in all things in life people who are good at such thing have better and more imporatant opinion abut it than people who dont know how things work...

I know for a fact that the people that are good at a game are not necessarily (or even ever) the best ones to balance it.

So far, every game that has tried to balance around the highest level have failed to reach any form of balance. It more often causes harm rather than good. Some even died on that hill.

[Pukovnik7]

22 hours ago, Bubba_S said:

He got 37 negative remarks and only 2 positives and a wall of hurt and slander…. Would you like to post more in such a hostile forum?

He made an extremely controversial (to be polite) opinion without providing anything at all to support it or explain why he thinks it would be a good idea.

 

I mean, imagine if I wrote "we should remove main guns from battleships" and left it at that?

 

20 hours ago, GeniusMage said:

Definitely.

BBs can dev strike fairly (barring overpen galore) consistently. CVs can't. A BB strike is far more lethal than a CV one.

Battleship strike is more lethal, but it is also more limited. Battleship can be spotted from Mars, can be hidden from, or avoided, either by using concealment distance or islands. Battleship artillery is limited by spotting and islands, and at sufficient distance even another battleship can avoid battleship's shots if he notices it coming, let alone a cruiser or a destroyer.

 

Carrier aircraft can be spotted, but by the time they are, you cannot avoid them. Carrier doesn't give a crap about terrain and can cover map in a very short time, so you cannot hide from it. Carrier's attacks are not limited by islands, and carrier is perfectly capable of spotting for itself. And if a good carrier player targets you, there is no counterplay and no way to avoid damage - just sit, mitigate damage and pray that he loses interest in you.

 

Carrier is a class for sadists, which is not the case for any other class (in fact, playing a destroyer in a CV game is basically an exercise in masochism, which is why I slowly stopped playing destroyers towards higher tiers, and never really played cruisers beyond low tiers).

[159Hunter]

16 hours ago, GeniusMage said:

Which leads to some quite big irony in the community. People want DDs to hunt subs as they historically did, but they don't want CVs to perform as they did historically.

Good, good. I agree here. I also wants CVs to perform as they historically did:

- limited fuel for their planes;

- a historical hit ratio of their armament;

- CVs operating alone are vulnerable: they need a surface warfare group to defend them;

- CVs who are refueling and rearming planes are very very vulnerable to incoming fire;

- the strike power of ONE CV is next to nothing, as the US and IJN showed you need to mass them to be effective, so let's tone down the CVs to historical levels;

...

 

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 3 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Battleship artillery is limited by spotting and islands, and at sufficient distance even another battleship can avoid battleship's shots if he notices it coming, let alone a cruiser or a destroyer.

Il y a 3 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Carrier aircraft can be spotted, but by the time they are, you cannot avoid them.

So you can dodge a volley in less than 15s but can't dodge a strike in that same time (barring jets shenanigans) ? I don't buy it, are you even trying ?

Do you also continue sailing straight if you're spotted by a Shima ?

Il y a 7 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

you cannot hide from it

A DD with its 20km² of air spotting area is gonna be very hard to find on a map that can reach 2300km².

Il y a 6 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

if a good carrier player targets you, there is no counterplay and no way to avoid damage - just sit, mitigate damage and pray that he loses interest in you.

Most players in this game are potatoes. So good carriers are hard to find.

And yes, a DD can dodge everything a CV throws at it. Even cruisers can make themselves very hard to touch.

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 1 minute, 159Hunter a dit :

the strike power of ONE CV is next to nothing, as the US and IJN showed you need to mass them to be effective, so let's tone down the CVs to historical levels;

Shall we play 48 vs 48 then ? With the same amount of BBs (that hit next to nothing), a lot more CLs and DDs (with no torp reloads and passive hydro/radar), and of course, half a dozen carriers. Add limited ammo and severely increase reload.

Of course, we'll never go that historical. That's not the point of the argument. The point is carriers disrupted the old ways of naval warfare. That is represented ingame. You have to play differently.

[Tanaka_15]

47 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

AA, grouping and strafing all work.

Unless your WASD keys are broken ?

 

 

 

 

 

AA, grouping and strafing all work. - RIGHT. :D

[GarrusBrutus]

13 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

The point is carriers disrupted the old ways of naval warfare. That is represented ingame. You have to play differently.

Which underlines the point that carriers do not fit in this arcade naval shooter game no matter how you balance and tweak the numbers and cv-gameplay. They, as you say yourself, disrupt the old ways of naval warfare, aka shoot guns and torpedoes at each other. 

BuT ThEy bELoNg iN a NaVaL gaMe!!! 

Well, so do subs and we can all see how much joy they bring to the game. 

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 4 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

 

 

 

 

Local person has no arguments, resorts to using examples from controversial content creator.

More at 11 ?

 

First video shows a dead squadron (all planes are destroyed) getting a drop by either luck or skill (or both).

Second video shows AA working. The FDR turned away and its planes are crippled, so whoever gets dropped (if the FDR wants to risk it) will kill a bunch of those just with passive damage.

Third video is literally nothing.

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 3 minutes, GarrusBrutus a dit :

Which underlines the point that carriers do not fit in this arcade naval shooter game no matter how you balance and tweak the numbers and cv-gameplay. They, as you say yourself, disrupt the old ways of naval warfare, aka shoot guns and torpedoes at each other.

This underlines how the main problem of this game is not WG, carriers or any gameplay feature.

It's in the playerbase. People that reject anything that messes with the simple world they completely made up.

 

Il y a 5 minutes, GarrusBrutus a dit :

BuT ThEy bELoNg iN a NaVaL gaMe!!! 

Well, so do subs and we can all see how much joy they bring to the game. 

Subs do belong in the game but I will agree that their current implementation is terrible.

Ping and homing shouldn't be there, and if they're to stay this tanky, make them easier to spot with hydro while under water.

[Tanaka_15]

7 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

Local person has no arguments, resorts to using examples from controversial content creator.

More at 11 ?

 

First video shows a dead squadron (all planes are destroyed) getting a drop by either luck or skill (or both).

Second video shows AA working. The FDR turned away and its planes are crippled, so whoever gets dropped (if the FDR wants to risk it) will kill a bunch of those just with passive damage.

Third video is literally nothing.

lel. so from your pont of view on this viedo AA works? And all is fine. well this is special state od mind. 

 

This just shows you that AA dont work, and groping also dont work CV gets the dmg no matter what you do. CV plays different game not pvp just pve thats why this class is not and never will be balanced. 

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 2 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

CV plays different game not pvp just pve thats why this class is not and never will be balanced. 

Of course if you play like a bot...

[Tanaka_15]

Just now, GeniusMage said:

Of course if you play like a bot...

TBH all players are bots from point of veiew of cv. Just automted over nerfed AA. So yeah be so proud of results :P 

[anonym_cwVecOS6ecVy]

16 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

resorts to using examples from controversial content creator

Flamu is not controversial for being wrong, but for his general attitude. He is the only person with actual reach that actually spots and brings to attention the WG bs without the use of charming words like other active CCs only to keep their benefits.

[NewHorizons_1]

8 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

Ping and homing shouldn't be there

Except for sub vs sub combat where landing a hit with unguided torps would be pretty hard.

[SV_Kompresor]

4 minutes ago, Von_Pruss said:

Flamu is not controversial for being wrong, but for his general attitude. He is the only person with actual reach that actually spots and brings to attention the WG bs without the use of charming words like other active CCs only to keep their benefits.

It's both actually I'd say. He's wrong quite often.

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 7 minutes, Tanaka_15 a dit :

TBH all players are bots from point of veiew of cv.

Nah, most people actually try to play the game.

Of course, there's always that one Shima sailing straight with AA on, taking two or three strikes of torps and dying. But that's 1 in 50 games maybe.

Il y a 4 minutes, Von_Pruss a dit :

Flamu is not controversial for being wrong, but for his general attitude.

His attitude severely lower the value of the things he say while ingame. He's quite salty. Especially about CVs.

Il y a 1 minute, NewHorizons_1 a dit :

Except for sub vs sub combat where landing a hit with unguided torps would be pretty hard.

I can understand that. The sausages are very nimble.

[Pukovnik7]

44 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

So you can dodge a volley in less than 15s but can't dodge a strike in that same time (barring jets shenanigans) ? I don't buy it, are you even trying ?

 Do you also continue sailing straight if you're spotted by a Shima ?

Battleship volley cannot change direction to compensate for your maneuvers. Aircraft can, and they can come from any direction.

45 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

A DD with its 20km² of air spotting area is gonna be very hard to find on a map that can reach 2300km².

Not if carrier player has any brain, like, at all. I was on occasion able to find and run down destroyers in a bloody battleship (Vanguard especially is excellent at that stuff) because I've played destroyers and knew roughly where they will be. You really think a CV player will have any issue? You shouldn't be balancing the game around potatoes.

 

Also, maps are not 2300 km2 but a maximum of 48x48 km. I know it is the same thing, but it matters.

49 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

Most players in this game are potatoes. So good carriers are hard to find.

And yes, a DD can dodge everything a CV throws at it. Even cruisers can make themselves very hard to touch.

Look, I played destroyers, and I know what they can do. I know that a destroyer can dodge mostly everything carrier throws at it if carrier strike is noticed early enough (big exception: skip bombs). But the problem with CV isn't so much damage from the attacks (except for skip bombers) it is the fact that they can permaspot destroyers, and its attacks - even if not very effective - are basically personal harrassment. Doesn't matter what ship you are in or even how effective the attacks are at damaging you, if a carrier locks you down, he will ruin your game.

 

Carriers are boring to play, and bloody annoying to play against.

[SV_Kompresor]

8 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

Look, I played destroyers, and I know what they can do. I know that a destroyer can dodge mostly everything carrier throws at it if carrier strike is noticed early enough (big exception: skip bombs). But the problem with CV isn't so much damage from the attacks (except for skip bombers) it is the fact that they can permaspot destroyers, and its attacks - even if not very effective - are basically personal harrassment. Doesn't matter what ship you are in or even how effective the attacks are at damaging you, if a carrier locks you down, he will ruin your game.

I'm guessing you meant HE dive bombers? Those are the dangerous ones for DDs, skip bombers are useless half the time and a minimal threat the other.

[MixuS]

33 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

People that reject anything that messes with the simple world they completely made up.

Which you obviously are not quilty of, right?

[Skywalker_369]

13 hours ago, Cammo1962 said:

And that is not how they operate in World of Warships mate.

same as other ships

[GarrusBrutus]

42 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

It's in the playerbase. People that reject anything that messes with the simple world they completely made up.

Ehm. No. It is what makes the game unfun for a lot of people. Not because they're dumb, simple or incapable of adapting or whatever nonsense argument I've heard cv apologists use over the years. No, it's because it makes the game unfun. And I don't know about you, but to me a game is supposed to be fun. 

 

44 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

Subs do belong in the game but I will agree that their current implementation is terrible.

And would you say that the current cv implementation is impeccable? 

[GeniusMage]

Il y a 12 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Battleship volley cannot change direction to compensate for your maneuvers. Aircraft can, and they can come from any direction.

There's a limit to how much aircraft can maneuver. Once the strike starts, maneuvering becomes much harder.

Il y a 20 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Not if carrier player has any brain, like, at all.

More like "if the DD is predictable."

Il y a 21 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Also, maps are not 2300 km2 but a maximum of 48x48 km. I know it is the same thing, but it matters.

Il y a 22 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Doesn't matter what ship you are in or even how effective the attacks are at damaging you, if a carrier locks you down, he will ruin your game.

Same can be said for DDs.

Il y a 23 minutes, Pukovnik7 a dit :

Carriers are boring to play, and bloody annoying to play against.

That's your opinion. Personally I'm fine on either side.

Il y a 16 minutes, MixuS a dit :

Which you obviously are not quilty of, right?

If I were, you'd see me pithcforks out against submarines.

But as much as I hate them now, I know it can change. My view of CVs changed without them being changed.

 

Il y a 7 minutes, GarrusBrutus a dit :

cv apologists

This right here, this phrase is exactly my point.

You can't reason with toxic people.

Il y a 8 minutes, GarrusBrutus a dit :

And I don't know about you, but to me a game is supposed to be fun.

I find fun is much more dependant on how balanced matches are via MM, rather than what classes are in the match.

Il y a 9 minutes, GarrusBrutus a dit :

And would you say that the current cv implementation is impeccable?

Is any class impeccably implemented ? No. They all have points which make them annoying on either side at times.

I hate DDs which can't ever be spotted because concealment/smoke, or have long range torps.

I hate cruisers that can go broadside and take full overpen volleys.

I hate BBs when they overmatch my armor.

Carriers ? I only have a problem when there's more than one.

[GarrusBrutus]

16 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

I hate DDs which can't ever be spotted because concealment/smoke, or have long range torps.

I hate cruisers that can go broadside and take full overpen volleys.

I hate BBs when they overmatch my armor.

Carriers ? I only have a problem when there's more than one.

↓

16 minutes ago, GeniusMage said:

This right here, this phrase is exactly my point.

I dont even have to start up wows-numbers to know which one is your best performing class.

[arquata2019_]

Alle 13/5/2022 alle 14:17, Skywalker_369 ha scritto:

Hello Everyone with  respect to all other players but  this Topic is only for CV players and CV fans.

 

as we see first we are removed from Clan battles and now no CV in brawl . 

CVs are part of this game , and i only play this game for playing CV . there is no reason WG remove us from everywhere becuase some kids cry about CVs.  this is disrespect us and an unforgiven insult to CV players.

 

1. we request to bring back Enterprise to premium shop

2. Do not remove CV from Clan battles and brawls

3.Nerf AA guns or make them manual control

4.add more CV supership  

5.make some Buffs to all CV 

As a CV player I'll say this: CVs destroy any sort of teamplay that someone might have; said class must be removed from CVs because it simply doesn't work in the of how is it implemented. Usually who say these are people that straight up suck at playing CVs and request immediate buffs to them because they can't play the probably-strongest-class in the game. CVs are not suited for competitive or any sort of PvP mode at all.

[GarrusBrutus]

39 minutes ago, arquata2019 said:

As a CV player I'll say this: CVs destroy any sort of teamplay that someone might have; said class must be removed from CVs because it simply doesn't work in the of how is it implemented. Usually who say these are people that straight up suck at playing CVs and request immediate buffs to them because they can't play the probably-strongest-class in the game. CVs are not suited for competitive or any sort of PvP mode at all.

@GeniusMage Sir what are your thoughts on this one? Hello sir?... Sir?