shimakaze players

[HMS_Edinburgh_C16]

 

[GarrusBrutus]

Whenever I see Shimakaze's with 17900 hp, I immediately assume they're bad.

[Hirohito]

3 minutes ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Whenever I see Shimakaze's with 17900 hp, I immediately assume they're bad.

Lots of those around.
Had a 4 shima ranked game the other day (in gold even), all 17900.
In fact I'd say roughly about 2/3 are 17900, on average.

[lafeel]

What are they going to try and run without next? Last stand?

[GarrusBrutus]

1 minute ago, Hirohito said:

Lots of those around.
Had a 4 shima ranked game the other day (in gold even), all 17900.

Yeah insane. Was playing as Ragnar in ranked and 17900HP-shima's were mostly snacks.

At the end of this clip I encounter one of them while i am on 2k hp. Still trade (ok granted, with some help from teammates ).

 

[Hirohito]

4 minutes ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Yeah insane. Was playing as Ragnar in ranked and 17900HP-shima's were mostly snacks.

At the end of this clip I encounter one of them while i am on 2k hp. Still trade (ok granted, with some help from teammates ).

 

Same, my two most favourite ships are Daring and Småland, and these are my bread and butter to maintain quick rankout times.
Sometimes I feel a little dirty running these, but on the other hand, someone has to keep evolution going by doing some occasional culling on the local potato species.

[bloodynicknames]

8 hours ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Yeah insane. Was playing as Ragnar in ranked and 17900HP-shima's were mostly snacks.

At the end of this clip I encounter one of them while i am on 2k hp. Still trade (ok granted, with some help from teammates ).

 

Shima vs. Ragnar and you think the shimas healthpool makes any difference ? 
I mean c'mon, no matter what build a Shima is running thats an uneven battle for the least to say. The Ragnar is as broken as it gets.

I hardly touch my Shima these days since she's simply outdated and suffers a lot from the combination of only torpedos being even remotely usable being the F3s in combination with Radar and Hydro everywhere. 

When I do I dont fight DDs at all, I just avoid them, some awareness of whats around and RPF give me a good enough idea.

That Video shows pure potato play on the Shimas part, if he actually accelerates and doesnt just sit there ragnar is dead. 

[arttuperkunas]

2 hours ago, bloodynicknames said:

Shima vs. Ragnar and you think the shimas healthpool makes any difference ? 
I mean c'mon, no matter what build a Shima is running thats an uneven battle for the least to say. The Ragnar is as broken as it gets.

I hardly touch my Shima these days since she's simply outdated and suffers a lot from the combination of only torpedos being even remotely usable being the F3s in combination with Radar and Hydro everywhere. 

When I do I dont fight DDs at all, I just avoid them, some awareness of whats around and RPF give me a good enough idea.

That Video shows pure potato play on the Shimas part, if he actually accelerates and doesnt just sit there ragnar is dead. 

Eh.

 

If a ragnar is at 2k hitpoints, that's basically 1-2 well aimed shima salvoes. Shima has a relatively small profile, good shell ballistics, hard hitting alpha, and most of its guns positioned in the rear. You go towards the ragnar's expected/known position at an angle (not head on), turn immediately when you spot him. Kite, kill.

 

The problem is not the ship, but the average Shima players. I'm honestly not that afraid of Ragnar when I play Shima. They are mostly focused on farming BBs and eat torpedoes easily, especially if their speedboost is not active. You just don't enter the cap but wait outside it, and once the Ragnar has revealed himself set up a torpedo trap, or wait for your support to whittle him down before finishing him with guns.

[Animalul2012]

There are some kind of ships in this game that attract the most special of the special people and shima is one of those ships.

[Lootboxer]

What? Shima obsolete?

For ranked maybe, but she never was good in this mode, for randoms with our playerbase she is still strong and 12km torps are a good compromise. 2 hits will do more then a whole lot from Halland. Best concealment, guns (if used correctly) are not as bad as some say either.

Problem is that shima is a very popular ship and a huge potato magnet attracting the worse DD players.

She has no chance against well played radar gunboat, but not mamy dds have.

I'm barely good player but I have nearly 58%WR (10 less then balanced Småland) and still I like to play her for those all devstrikes, while for example other old dds like Gearing, Z, or YY are now just a port queens.

CVs are a problem if they really want to spoil your fun.

 

[General_Alexus]

16 minutes ago, arttuperkunas said:

Eh.

 

If a ragnar is at 2k hitpoints, that's basically 1-2 well aimed shima salvoes.

Shima does not pen 25mm, so lots of opportunity too potatoe, ofc he could have loaded AP and oneshoot the 2k Ragnar, but that is the thing about #17900 shimas, they dont know thouse things.

[Hirohito]

2 hours ago, bloodynicknames said:

Shima vs. Ragnar and you think the shimas healthpool makes any difference ? 
I mean c'mon, no matter what build a Shima is running thats an uneven battle for the least to say. The Ragnar is as broken as it gets.

I hardly touch my Shima these days since she's simply outdated and suffers a lot from the combination of only torpedos being even remotely usable being the F3s in combination with Radar and Hydro everywhere. 

When I do I dont fight DDs at all, I just avoid them, some awareness of whats around and RPF give me a good enough idea.

That Video shows pure potato play on the Shimas part, if he actually accelerates and doesnt just sit there ragnar is dead. 

You're missing the point completely here.
He wasn't implying that a shima could outgun a Ragnar, or that these were great players.
But in the case of the second shima in that clip, he was at 17900 hp and would have survived the fight with the Ragnar if he had specced into SE.
Which is the whole point of this discussion - spec SE.

[arttuperkunas]

6 minutes ago, General_Alexus said:

Shima does not pen 25mm, so lots of opportunity too potatoe, ofc he could have loaded AP and oneshoot the 2k Ragnar, but that is the thing about #17900 shimas, they dont know thouse things.

This is true, but Ragnar does not have a 25 mm bow, superstructure or aft. So I emphasise "well aimed". I would probably not shoot AP at ragnar when looking for a quick kill, it will just bounce if he wiggles. And if you do what I said above (kite away), the Ragnar may need to go bow in to keep you in radar range/go towards you.

 

 

[Itwastuesday]

Shimakaze players are the worst, even worse than all the Kriegsmarine stormtroopers. A Shimakaze should always live unless something extraordinary happens like a CV + 2x triangle DD hunting division or whatever. Agile, stealthier than it's opponent, fast, capable of striking far, got little use for smoke other than self-peel... A Shimakaze has only a few excuses for dying early. 

 

Yet like 50% of them do. 

 

Plz replace Shimakaze and Halland with... anything and make those steel ships you don't even get if you previously owned them. You just can't give players ships like this for low effort.

[Bear__Necessities]

Never even needed to use my guns

 

 

[tsounts]

Too much generalization, my Shima thinks otherwise.... (and I was reluctant when I first got her because of all the complaints I was reading....)
 

[RuruushuVuiBuritania]

Shimakaze is a great DD. A bit less so in Ranked for me but very good in Randoms. (Stats not representative due to small sample size)

[tocqueville8]

Might be a bit of a non-sequitur, but I'd rather have a bad Shima on my team than a good Ragnar on the enemy team.

[Verblonde]

4 hours ago, Lootboxer said:

Problem is that shima is a very popular ship and a huge potato magnet attracting the worse DD players.

My suspicion is that it's more than just Shima herself being a potato magnet; my feeling is the whole line - more or less - is.

 

Thinking back to when I first started playing, I was (of course) spectacularly hopeless; about the only way I could reliably do damage with DDs was via torps and the IJN line was about the only one that got a decent stealth launch window at low tiers. I'd read about the ferocious gunboat DDs, but whenever I tried to play them, I usually died horribly (mainly due to having not yet fully grasped basics like vision mechanics etc.). In that sort of situation, I tended towards playing the IJN torp line more.

 

What I did next was make the effort to learn about vision mechanics, how/when to use guns, captain skills, and so on; although I'm still pretty rubbish, I can now do tolerably in - maybe - more than half of the DD lines in the game. Thing is, that took quite a bit of time (and, as my stats clearly demonstrate, is a long way from being completed even now), and a more casual player may not be prepared to put in that time, or even know that they need to - in which case, the whole IJN torp line becomes the path of least resistance.

 

So, I suggest it's not merely the potatoes making a definite "by George, I fancy me some of that Shima!" type decision, but rather more that the way the game works, in the context of effort required, that inexorably pushes them in that direction because of the fundamental nature of the whole line.

 

Basically, the Shima line is the DD equivalent of playing BBs for the average farty.

[Bear__Necessities]

1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

My suspicion is that it's more than just Shima herself being a potato magnet; my feeling is the whole line - more or less - is.

 

Thinking back to when I first started playing, I was (of course) spectacularly hopeless; about the only way I could reliably do damage with DDs was via torps and the IJN line was about the only one that got a decent stealth launch window at low tiers. I'd read about the ferocious gunboat DDs, but whenever I tried to play them, I usually died horribly (mainly due to having not yet fully grasped basics like vision mechanics etc.). In that sort of situation, I tended towards playing the IJN torp line more.

 

What I did next was make the effort to learn about vision mechanics, how/when to use guns, captain skills, and so on; although I'm still pretty rubbish, I can now do tolerably in - maybe - more than half of the DD lines in the game. Thing is, that took quite a bit of time (and, as my stats clearly demonstrate, is a long way from being completed even now), and a more casual player may not be prepared to put in that time, or even know that they need to - in which case, the whole IJN torp line becomes the path of least resistance.

 

So, I suggest it's not merely the potatoes making a definite "by George, I fancy me some of that Shima!" type decision, but rather more that the way the game works, in the context of effort required, that inexorably pushes them in that direction because of the fundamental nature of the whole line.

 

Basically, the Shima line is the DD equivalent of playing BBs for the average farty.

Ohhhh no. I'd say the IJN DD line to shima requires a LOT more than most realise to get the best out of them. I mean Playing none smoke Kagero and Yugumo is an instant upgrade with a massive skill jump attached. Playing the line as intended also require more skill than the average player that sits at the back spamming torps. I'll add another replay that although is a loss, shows how much map coverage and effort is needed to get the best out of the classic girl. 

 

https://replayswows.com/replay/143829#stats

 

 

 

(This would have been a win if not for the BS... that a cap can be stopped on the 0:00 and not actually count as fully capped.....)

[Verblonde]

7 minutes ago, Bear__Necessities said:

Ohhhh no. I'd say the IJN DD line to shima requires a LOT more than most realise to get the best out of them.

I agree with you entirely (learning to shoot straight, and when, made quite a positive difference to my results), but my point wasn't about what the peak output of a line might be, but rather what the profoundly tuberous can do with it.

 

A hopeless newbie will get more satisfying results (big damage numbers on BBs look splendid, if all you worry about is hp damage done) from torps than with guns, and it's easier to get those results with the Shima line - all of it.

 

An expert such as yourself will wreak havoc with a Shima, but that's not why so many potatoes play them (in my view) - I suspect it's more to do with the comparative ease for a poorer player of getting to Shima, compared to most of the other top tier DDs.

[Migantium_Mashum]

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need more than 17,900 especially with their 5.6km concealment...

 

A good Shimakaze player does not get detected (CV Exclusion applies)... A good Shimakaze player knows just how to plant his torpedoes.

 

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need SE... Last time I played my Shima in ranked I had almost 250,000k damage all with 17,900.

 

The extra HP doesn't make you a good Shimakaze player.

 

 

[Hirohito]

11 minutes ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need more than 17,900 especially with their 5.6km concealment...

 

A good Shimakaze player does not get detected

Lol.

[Bear__Necessities]

1 hour ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need more than 17,900 especially with their 5.6km concealment...

 

A good Shimakaze player does not get detected (CV Exclusion applies)... A good Shimakaze player knows just how to plant his torpedoes.

 

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need SE... Last time I played my Shima in ranked I had almost 250,000k damage all with 17,900.

 

The extra HP doesn't make you a good Shimakaze player.

 

 

A GREAT shima player knows that taking SE is the difference between being able to take a needed engagement or not and being able to utilise maximum HP for maximum reward. 

[arttuperkunas]

5 hours ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need more than 17,900 especially with their 5.6km concealment...

 

A good Shimakaze player does not get detected (CV Exclusion applies)... A good Shimakaze player knows just how to plant his torpedoes.

 

A good Shimakaze player doesn't need SE... Last time I played my Shima in ranked I had almost 250,000k damage all with 17,900.

 

The extra HP doesn't make you a good Shimakaze player.

 

 

 

 

lulwhut