No subs in training rooms?

[CapnGebs]

During the course of playing last night I completed some combat mission that gave me 2 subs. (I was disappointed to then find out the mission reward was the "rental" of 2 subs).

 

Subs havent been fun to play against but I was curious how they worked. So rather than subject anyone to me floundering about trying to figure them out I created a training room. Only to then find that the subs are classed as "special" ships and cannot be used in a training room.

 

Surely when you introduce ships with completely new mechanics like aircraft in carriers or diving and pinging in subs the most sensible thing for a new captain to do is take them into a training room first to get the hang of the controls. Blocking the ship type from training rooms is such a bizarre idea. If someone wants to experiment having never sailed them before they are forced to at least take them into a co-op battle and spoil a teams fun for 20 minutes.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

No training room access, I was surprised as well, since this is supposed to be a 'testing phase' ^^

 

Then again I keep forgetting we are not the testers, we are the hamsters being tested.

[FooFaFie]

They had a COOP testing phase. It seems you missed that period. Was a great time to earn some free commander slots.

 

 

[Prophecy82]

Its pretty odd, that they are not allowed in the testing room. 

@YabbaCoe care to explain?

[_DemonGuard_]

6 minutes ago, Europizza said:

No training room access, I was surprised as well, since this is supposed to be a 'testing phase' ^^

 

Then again I keep forgetting we are not the testers, we are the hamsters being tested.

You are supposed to take them into the testing grounds a.k.a. ranked battles.

[MementoMori_6030]

I think training room battles are not counted on the "submarines success" spreadsheet.

And I guess the majority of the players would not take submarines into PVP battles if they had the option to test them in training rooms, do a little underwater sightseeing and discover how boring and broken submarines are.

Can't have that, comrades.

Submarines must look popular.

 

[PaP_Mentoles]

10 minutes ago, Prophecy82 said:

care to explain?

Because reasons... 

You really expect them to give an honest answer?

[RenamedUser_92906789]

Training room.. no money in that.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

3 minutes ago, nambr9 said:

Training room.. no money in that.

Their QA needs actual players to test their bugs for them since they seem to be understaffed or nonexistant ^^

[RenamedUser_92906789]

As a dev ... I feel the same. Testing my code is somewhat "an insult" to me. We slavs dont take insults lightly.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

6 minutes ago, nambr9 said:

As a dev ... I feel the same. Testing my code is somewhat "an insult" to me. We slavs dont take insults lightly.

Lol, I remember an incident where our test lead and two of our testers dared to enter the code lead's office, trying to verbally explain that tanks seemed to have become invulnourable to AT rifle rounds all of a sudden. The coding lead had been flagging their reports to resolved/not an issue without even checking the issue. He told them: "That can't happen becasue it wasn't coded that way."

 

He had to eat his own shoe after we found that it actually did happen ^^

[Camperdown]

In the training room players could seriously test subs which would lead to serious feedback.

This is not desirable for WG because it would disturb their echo chamber and would lead to impossible to answer questions. To which they would have to give disingenuous and dishonest answers.

[CapnGebs]

16 minutes ago, nambr9 said:

Training room.. no money in that.

Surely if people take ships into training rooms and enjoy them they are more likely to buy things for them? For example I wouldnt spend credits or dubloons on ship components or camos if I couldnt even test out a ship.

 

Which makes me think WG are missing an opportunity. If every account were able to play every premium ship in 2 battles (or some number) people could try them out. Some people might try a ship and like it enough to then purchase it from the store.

 

[Us devs should always embrace testers. Far easier to chat to a tester and see the problem first hand and fix the bug whilst in development than wait until after release and try and reproduce via a report from a customer in an email or forum posting.]

 

 

[lovelacebeer]

WG evidently feel the need to force submarines into the game, if they allowed players the choice to use training rooms that could potentially lead to less Submarines in random battles and WG don’t want that. 
 

From a gameplay/ player perspective their decisions might not make much sense, but from a marketing and business perspective (where subs were no doubt deemed an unrivalled success even before testing) its perfectly logical. 

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

1 minute ago, lovelacebeer said:

WG evidently feel the need to force submarines into the game, if they allowed players the choice to use training rooms that could potentially lead to less Submarines in random battles and WG don’t want that. 
 

From a gameplay/ player perspective their decisions might not make much sense, but from a marketing and business perspective (where subs were no doubt deemed an unrivalled success even before testing) its perfectly logical. 

I'm really starting to doubt that mantra since I learned that WG has failed to make at least 5 new IP's a success. ^^

[Seraphice]

2 hours ago, CapnGebs said:

During the course of playing last night I completed some combat mission that gave me 2 subs. (I was disappointed to then find out the mission reward was the "rental" of 2 subs).

 

Subs havent been fun to play against but I was curious how they worked. So rather than subject anyone to me floundering about trying to figure them out I created a training room. Only to then find that the subs are classed as "special" ships and cannot be used in a training room.

 

Surely when you introduce ships with completely new mechanics like aircraft in carriers or diving and pinging in subs the most sensible thing for a new captain to do is take them into a training room first to get the hang of the controls. Blocking the ship type from training rooms is such a bizarre idea. If someone wants to experiment having never sailed them before they are forced to at least take them into a co-op battle and spoil a teams fun for 20 minutes.

I totally agree with you that it sucks not to be able to test them in training rooms, and I completely understand that you are not able to test their mechanics to the fullest extent. However we have to keep this limitation for now, as it is not possible on a technical level, because not all of our maps are fit for submarines, meaning we could run into some serious issues, and disabling subs on those maps specifically is unfortunately not an option right now. However when this is possible, or when they have been given an underwater model, we will definitely enable submarines in training rooms!
For now, if you have any questions, I will try my best to get you answers for them ;)

So TLDR; it is simply a technical limitation due to all the maps available in the training room, and it isn't as easy as just disabling subs on those maps unfortunately.

 

 

2 hours ago, Europizza said:

No training room access, I was surprised as well, since this is supposed to be a 'testing phase' ^^

Unfortunately for now, such testing will have to take place in Co-op :/
 

1 hour ago, nambr9 said:

Training room.. no money in that. 

The training room does indeed have it's fair share of improvements that could be made, but especially since the last King of the Sea tournament there was work put in to make sure they are more stable. However it is true that the training room could be more than what it is now, but unfortunately it is not the highest of priorities as of right now.

 

 

1 hour ago, Europizza said:

Their QA needs actual players to test their bugs for them since they seem to be understaffed or nonexistant ^^

While we do internal QA and have things such as Supertest and Publictest, the amount of people that participate in such activities is still only an extremely small fraction of the playerbase, and they could never find as many bugs as the combined playerbase ever could. However our supertesters do amazing work in their bug-catching, and we are very grateful for it, but even the best sometimes miss something.

 

1 hour ago, lovelacebeer said:

WG evidently feel the need to force submarines into the game, if they allowed players the choice to use training rooms that could potentially lead to less Submarines in random battles and WG don’t want that. 
 

From a gameplay/ player perspective their decisions might not make much sense, but from a marketing and business perspective (where subs were no doubt deemed an unrivalled success even before testing) its perfectly logical. 

As I explained before, this is only due to a technical limitation. We would encourage players to test them to their fullest extent in training rooms if it were possible, but unfortunately, it's not for now :(
 

[BrusilovX]

2 hours ago, Camperdown said:

In the training room players could seriously test subs which would lead to serious feedback.

All the feedback WG need is already in the spreadsheet (probably before subs were added to co-op).

[ColonelPete]

40 minutes ago, Seraphice said:

...

When can we expect WG to open the API for Subs, that external sites can fetch their performance data?

[CapnGebs]

1 hour ago, Seraphice said:

it is not possible on a technical level, because not all of our maps are fit for submarines

Thanks for the clarification Seraphice. Its always good to understand the reasoning behind a limitation. It is a shame that the training maps couldnt be updated in time for release of the subs.

 

I did give a sub one go in a co-op hoping I could pull my weight but getting the hang of the torps and pings was a little tricky and I think I was lucky and managed to get a single torp hit. I'll have to wait until I get a sub in the training room before trying again as it cant have been fun for the other players having a sub on their team that couldnt contribute.

[PaP_Mentoles]

2 hours ago, Seraphice said:

such testing will have to take place in Co-op  and Randoms:/

Well I added randoms too, that you forgot to mention.

On the other hand, we are your customers and not WeeGreedy's testers. So are we gonna get paid for that (acting as WeeGreedy's testers who none of us asked to be)?

[kremlyncek]

29 minutes ago, PaP_Mentoles said:

On the other hand, we are your customers and not WeeGreedy's testers. So are we gonna get paid for that (acting as WeeGreedy's testers who none of us asked to be)?

whenever someone curses wargaming that they are greedy, I wonder if he has looked in the mirror before :D

[RenamedUser_92906789]

3 hours ago, Seraphice said:

The training room does indeed have it's fair share of improvements that could be made, but especially since the last King of the Sea tournament there was work put in to make sure they are more stable. However it is true that the training room could be more than what it is now, but unfortunately it is not the highest of priorities as of right now.

 

Never is... same as ops... or ingame chat system... or bugs that have been present for years now. I mean I get it, I know how business is run, but the excuse is the same for years now: Not the highest priority.

 

I asked in 2016 if we can get premium ships in training toom .. was told exactly the same thing. Not a priority. 

 

Sad thing is... that time will never come.

[PaP_Mentoles]

2 minutes ago, kremlyncek said:

whenever someone curses wargaming that they are greedy, I wonder if he has looked in the mirror before :D

Nice respond.

Now take a screenshot and open a ticket to get your payment.

[Seraphice]

20 minutes ago, nambr9 said:

Never is... same as ops... or ingame chat system... or bugs that have been present for years now. I mean I get it, I know how business is run, but the excuse is the same for years now: Not the highest priority.

 

I asked in 2016 if we can get premium ships in training toom .. was told exactly the same thing. Not a priority. 

 

Sad thing is... that time will never come.

Changes to the UI and training room will come in due time, and for some parts of it even sooner than later.

Regarding premium ships in the training room, unfortunately, the only way to do this currently, is only if you own the premium ship and mirror the teams when you are readied up in a premium ship.

While operations have not been a focal point since they were first introduced, we did recently reset operations rewards and we will be bringing back some of the old operations in 2022.
Aside from operations we have introduced several other event modes that have included PvE and PvPvE such as Big Hunt / Key Battles and Halloween modes.

^.^

[RenamedUser_92906789]

Key battles were nice, I liked how different the armaments can be.