As predicted, cheat torps/subs get a boost

[SodaBubbles]

Latest devblog: https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/214

Apparently WG has reacted to the unpopularity of submarines by buffing them.... who could have predicted that? LOL. 

"Submarines can now launch torpedoes one by one — this will make the gameplay more dynamic and will allow you to control the precise number of launched torpedoes. In order to make the submarine still use sonar ping for better accuracy of torpedoes, we increased the width of torpedo launch cone"

 

OMFrickingG. Arent homing torps cheating enough already? 

Meanwhile cruisers w/o depth charges get the flying ASW armament. Poor cruiser drivers, have to manage guns, torps, position, ASW, dodging, sonar/radar, even secondaries.... but CV drivers can't be expected to do anything. 

I am going to LMAO when subs are played by like 4% of the playerbase. Just laugh and laugh. 

[Aethervoxx]

15 minutes ago, SodaBubbles said:

Meanwhile cruisers w/o depth charges get the flying ASW armament. Poor cruiser drivers, have to manage guns, torps, position, ASW, dodging, sonar/radar, even secondaries.... but CV drivers can't be expected to do anything. 

Welcome to the new RTS Cruiser style of play  .  The 'play style' where one has to actually 'think'  (those 'pesky' Devs , still trying to subvert  boring cookie cutter play).

[The_Chiv]

The whole ping mechanic is toxic to gameplay balance.

 

Subs are boring to play and what we have seen in rank their impact is more akin to annoying game delayer then any sort of tactical tool.

[SodaBubbles]

"this will make gameplay more dynamic..."

 

Not for the targets!

[bloodynicknames]

9 hours ago, SodaBubbles said:

Latest devblog: https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/214

Apparently WG has reacted to the unpopularity of submarines by buffing them.... who could have predicted that? LOL. 

"Submarines can now launch torpedoes one by one — this will make the gameplay more dynamic and will allow you to control the precise number of launched torpedoes. In order to make the submarine still use sonar ping for better accuracy of torpedoes, we increased the width of torpedo launch cone"

 

OMFrickingG. Arent homing torps cheating enough already? 

Meanwhile cruisers w/o depth charges get the flying ASW armament. Poor cruiser drivers, have to manage guns, torps, position, ASW, dodging, sonar/radar, even secondaries.... but CV drivers can't be expected to do anything. 

I am going to LMAO when subs are played by like 4% of the playerbase. Just laugh and laugh. 

heres a hint: nobody cares about CV drivers and thats a good thing.

they sit at the back of the map one way or the other so no real threat from subs there. 

cruisers on the other hand are always in range of subs and using regular DCs is suicidal even for a DD 

 

subs are f*cked up ... they should never be introduced to randoms 

[invicta2012]

9 hours ago, SodaBubbles said:

"Submarines can now launch torpedoes one by one — this will make the gameplay more dynamic and will allow you to control the precise number of launched torpedoes. In order to make the submarine still use sonar ping for better accuracy of torpedoes, we increased the width of torpedo launch cone"

I was hoping that was the Royal Navy gimmick, like their Destroyers, allowing for ripple firing fun. 

 

I can't see how WG have made any decision about sub torps as we've been testing them while they were broken. That said, I've played them since the hotfix and I think they are *way* too strong.

[MimosA_A]

Sigh, they really need to start getting some of their people to actually play their own game...

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

Subs are made to make CVs look good and fair. I'm playing ranked with bayern and whenever I'm being chased by a sub I feel helpless, using DCP in order to break the ping is the worst f*cking idea, it is already difficult to optimize the use of it during ordinary brawls... let alone with f*cking subs... cooldown is too long, they have time to f*ck you up long before you have DCP again. This is the worst class, no doubt about it, homing torpedos needs to go !!!

[Yedwy]

Usual WG modus operandi, buff until its popular enough to justify the man hours...

[SodaBubbles]

3 hours ago, bloodynicknames said:

heres a hint: nobody cares about CV drivers and thats a good thing.

they sit at the back of the map one way or the other so no real threat from subs there. 

cruisers on the other hand are always in range of subs and using regular DCs is suicidal even for a DD 

 

subs are f*cked up ... they should never be introduced to randoms 

I dont think the devs are going to take your hint. 

Using DC to stop homing was piling stupid on top of stupid, a drunken tower of idiocy. 

[Pikkozoikum]

13 hours ago, SodaBubbles said:

I am going to LMAO when subs are played by like 4% of the playerbase. Just laugh and laugh. 

It's the common case, that submarines are less popular than other ship types.

Submarines are slow, alone that is often a criterium, that people prefer other ships.

They are not massive and huge like a impressive battle ship.
They don't have the utility of a cruiser

If you do a poll about a favorite ship type (independ of this game), you will see CVs and submarines probably at the bottom and BBs at the top

[SodaBubbles]

3 minutes ago, Pikkozoikum said:

It's the common case, that submarines are less popular than other ship types.

Submarines are slow, alone that is often a criterium, that people prefer other ships.

They are not massive and huge like a impressive battle ship.
They don't have the utility of a cruiser

If you do a poll about a favorite ship type (independ of this game), you will see CVs and submarines probably at the bottom and BBs at the top

I agree. The Devs gave themselves an impossible task, trying to make subs appealing while making players of surface ships accept them. Not possible. 

[Lootboxer]

28 minutes ago, SodaBubbles said:

I agree. The Devs gave themselves an impossible task, trying to make subs appealing while making players of surface ships accept them. Not possible. 

It's the same as with CVs. People hate to be farmed by invisible opposition with practically unavoidable weaponry if they are any good, not being able to retaliate.

[Andrewbassg]

14 hours ago, The_Chiv said:

The whole ping mechanic is toxic to gameplay balance.

Yes. And no. It could have been  a "good' ( read_ balanced) addition if limited in usage. Like now and then a homing torp. But that requires thinking

14 hours ago, The_Chiv said:

Subs are boring to play and what we have seen in rank their impact is more akin to annoying game delayer then any sort of tactical tool.

I would say that T6 is balanced. Subs can do stuff but still can be killed. T8 is slightly imbalanced in favor of subs. But T10.. omg  What is this absolute B"S??.My fully flagged Mino could not catch up with a submerged sub....Who TF come up with this crap?? As a result of my experience I give up going to Gold...

And mind you this is before the latest developments...Jeeez Weegee truly never learns....

 

[guy_incognito79]

I tried a few games in Co-op as a sub and OMG what a boring time it was. They don't bring anything interesting to Co-op, I dread to think how bad they are in ranked or would be in they were in randoms... and don't get me started on the homing torpedo BS!!

 

The sad thing is, if WG had tried the convoy mode using the subs on the attacking team minus the homing torp nonsense and the defenders using corvette/frigate class ships (tier 1's with ASW weaponry) then that could've been rather interesting and dare I say it, fun!

 

As they stand now subs are very bad for gameplay but they are a wonderful cure for insomnia!

 

[lovelacebeer]

WG trying to make their egregious submarine project work: 

[Varian_Dorn]

Looking forward to the full introduction of subs into the game.

 

Also, I fail to see how a game mechanic created and implemented by the developers themselves is considered as "cheating". Might wanna look up your terminology there.

[Redcap375]

11 hours ago, Yedwy said:

Usual WG modus operandi, buff until its popular enough to justify the man hours...

 

This...
 

Nothing more to say on the matter really.  Seen it time, time and time again.

 

Might as well close the thread. 

[Figment]

4 hours ago, guy_incognito79 said:

I tried a few games in Co-op as a sub and OMG what a boring time it was. They don't bring anything interesting to Co-op, I dread to think how bad they are in ranked or would be in they were in randoms... and don't get me started on the homing torpedo BS!!

Coop and interesting is incompatible regardless of what you bring. EVERY ship you bring to coop is boring.

 

 

Plenty wrong with subs, but bringing up coop is just... Yeah. It's a completely irrelevant mode to look at for fun balancing.

[Andrewbassg]

3 hours ago, Varian_Dorn said:

Looking forward to the full introduction of subs into the game.

Weegee model client. Match made in da heavens

 

3 hours ago, Varian_Dorn said:

Also, I fail to see how a game mechanic created and implemented by the developers themselves is considered as "cheating". Might wanna look up your terminology there.

Cheating is profoundly dishonest. Also any mechanic,  condition, individual ship or even  a whole class  can be considered as such. i mean profoundly dishonest.

 

 

[SodaBubbles]

7 hours ago, Varian_Dorn said:

Looking forward to the full introduction of subs into the game.

 

Also, I fail to see how a game mechanic created and implemented by the developers themselves is considered as "cheating". Might wanna look up your terminology there.

Yes, thats true. You do fail to see.

[Yedwy]

8 hours ago, Varian_Dorn said:

Looking forward to the full introduction of subs into the game.

 

Also, I fail to see how a game mechanic created and implemented by the developers themselves is considered as "cheating". Might wanna look up your terminology there.

Ok its not cheating, its an exploit, happy now? 

 

Not that it makes the target feel any better… 

[Figment]

37 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

Ok its not cheating, its an exploit, happy now? 

 

Not that it makes the target feel any better… 

 

Exploits are unintended uses of game features. Like map border hugging/drifting was abused to become harder to hit than intended.

 

Subs and ping are a feature working as intended and used as intended. It's cheap perhaps in certain situations and IMO poorly designed, but that makes it neither cheating or exploiting, when simply using it as intended.

 

I know it is appealing to demonise the opposition by pretending they cheat, exploit or do all sorts of 'dishonest' things, but truth is they don't and you're acting childish in doing so. Making you far less likely to be heard by devs because you act so immature by using degrading words towards others.

 

 

Now, that doesn't mean you can't deem it an unfair advantage and/or a poorly/ridiculous designed feature/mechanic because it leads to a situation that you or someone else doesn't enjoy to the slightest as fair competition. But that gets subjective quickly, as it gets in the range of arguments used by BB players who hate stealth torping and dismiss this as unfair (while absolutely demanding instant kills on DDs "because respect my firepower authority" of course).

 

 

With the announced changes, I don't mind the larger cone of fire per se, but then retaining the ping feature IMO makes it a too powerful combination. I'd rather they could fire one torp at a time on manual aim and get a better indicator for depth of torps at the projected interception range.

[MimosA_A]

1 minute ago, Figment said:

 

Exploits are unintended uses of game features. Like map border hugging/drifting was abused to become harder to hit than intended.

 

Subs and ping are a feature working as intended and used as intended. It's cheap perhaps in certain situations and IMO poorly designed, but that makes it neither cheating or exploiting, when simply using it as intended.

 

I know it is appealing to demonise the opposition by pretending they cheat, exploit or do all sorts of 'dishonest' things, but truth is they don't and you're acting childish in doing so. Making you far less likely to be heard by devs because you act so immature by using degrading words towards others.

 

 

Now, that doesn't mean you can't deem it an unfair advantage and/or a poorly/ridiculous designed feature/mechanic because it leads to a situation that you or someone else doesn't enjoy to the slightest as fair competition. But that gets subjective quickly, as it gets in the range of arguments used by BB players who hate stealth torping and dismiss this as unfair (while absolutely demanding instant kills on DDs "because respect my firepower authority" of course).

 

 

With the announced changes, I don't mind the larger cone of fire per se, but then retaining the ping feature IMO makes it a too powerful combination. I'd rather they could fire one torp at a time on manual aim and get a better indicator for depth of torps at the projected interception range.

I don't think they should waste their time on these small changes tbh. From playing with and against them in ranked, it's pretty obvious this is one of those design-by-committee disasters where loads of ideas have been piled upon them over time and it all results in a mess. The whole current implementation of them now is profoundly unfun to play and play against, and doesn't fit the mechanics of the game in the slightest. It would be a lot better if they just go back to the drawing board and figure out what they actually want subs to be, and then start giving them features to match that concept.

[Andrewbassg]

 

20 minutes ago, Figment said:

 

Exploits are unintended uses of game features. Like map border hugging/drifting was abused to become harder to hit than intended.

 

Subs and ping are a feature working as intended and used as intended. It's cheap perhaps in certain situations and IMO poorly designed, but that makes it neither cheating or exploiting, when simply using it as intended.

 

I know it is appealing to demonise the opposition by pretending they cheat, exploit or do all sorts of 'dishonest' things, but truth is they don't and you're acting childish in doing so. Making you far less likely to be heard by devs because you act so immature by using degrading words towards others.

 

 

Now, that doesn't mean you can't deem it an unfair advantage and/or a poorly/ridiculous designed feature/mechanic because it leads to a situation that you or someone else doesn't enjoy to the slightest as fair competition. But that gets subjective quickly, as it gets in the range of arguments used by BB players who hate stealth torping and dismiss this as unfair (while absolutely demanding instant kills on DDs "because respect my firepower authority" of course).

While the discussion (and the points made) has some obvious merits its a pure academical argument. Because while nazism was an ideology ...it was what it was. Also any description related to any kind of human experience, is, was and will be, by the very definition, subjective. So....

 

And while I understand your concern and from where is stemming, there is not much we can do other than voice our  disagreement and displeasure, because its not a fair.... discussion. So....

20 minutes ago, Figment said:

With the announced changes, I don't mind the larger cone of fire per se, but then retaining the ping feature IMO makes it a too powerful combination. I'd rather they could fire one torp at a time on manual aim and get a better indicator for depth of torps at the projected interception range.

 

I  would not mind subs as per se if genuine and sincere attempts were made to balance and implement them. Which is, just like with Cvs, is simply not the case.

 

Btw it is an exploit. I mean the whole shebang. So......