Should ability of torpedo and bomber planes to spot removed?

[Mindexe]

So here's the thing. In BB and after finishing last cruiser ship near our base, I was the only left alive in my team (technically there was omaha class cruised left, but he was finished 10 seconds later by torpedo spread that was aimed at me), while other team had 2 aircraft caries left (think both of them where Japanese ones). To get to them I had to cross the entire map, mean time they could use their planes to spot me and launch multiple torpedo runs on me. While I had no means to engage them and was only left with hoping that my AA guns could shoot 1 or 2 planes from the sky. 

 

At this point in the game the only question remaining was "How many torpedo runs would they need to sink me?". This kinda left me with "hopeless" feeling.

 

 

[Hanszeehock]

You really need to think this through properly before posting. If you remove planes ability to spot, they will become completely useless. You cannot change a complete type of game play because you had one frustrating battle. 

[Mindexe]

Why would they be useless? Other team members can spot enemy ships for you.

 

So you are saying I should just accept a defeat when I'm faced with such situation? Can't remove their spotting ability ok, I'm fine with that, but just give me an ability to fight back in this kind of situation, even if I'll lose 90% time.

[specialkha]

Why would they be useless? Other team members can spot enemy ships for you.

 

So you are saying I should just accept a defeat when I'm faced with such situation? Can't remove their spotting ability ok, I'm fine with that, but just give me an ability to fight back in this kind of situation, even if I'll lose 90% time.

 

AA and your skill to evade torps. Here is your solution.

[Mindexe]

With BB? That has top speed of 20 knots? Show me an example where you can doge every single torpedo for 2 mins.

[Hanszeehock]

Why would they be useless? Other team members can spot enemy ships for you.

 

You said there were only CVs left, so in that case they could not spot you. So you are saying only ships should be able to spot ?

[Mindexe]

I only said about torpedo and bomber planes nothing about fighter ones. And no their ships would be able to spot me before I spot them.

[specialkha]

With BB? That has top speed of 20 knots? Show me an example where you can doge every single torpedo for 2 mins.

 

Speed is not the only way to evade torps.

 

And btw, it was 2v1 and CVs is a counter to BB.

[Mindexe]

Cruisers are counter to destroyers, so they should be helpless against them too in this kind of situation?

[specialkha]

Cruisers are counter to destroyers, so they should be helpless against them too in this kind of situation?

 

A good cruiser player will rekt any DD in his vicinity.

 

You got outplayed, why rage about it?

[Kais_S012]

I hate to be rude but nearly WW2 aircraft had this little thing called a radio, Navy Air Arm aircraft especially for relaying course changes to inbound and outbound wings. they in turn are going to report sightings along their flight paths. it was not uncommon to use fighters and light bombers in recon flights when dedicated recon aircraft were unavailable.

 

with most jap carriers having to strip out their useless fighters for more TBs why should they be blind just to keep BB players happy?

[Mindexe]

I'm fine with being outplayed, I'm more than happy to say "Well played!", I just don't like situation where I'm left with no option to even try to fight back. My proposal is wrong? ok, it's wrong.  But give me any alternative,  so when I face this situation agian I would have options and not just "Wonder how many torpedoes will I manage to doge before I die?".

 

Oh forget it, it seems here people's solution to any problem is: "Get Skills!"

 

 

[specialkha]

I'm fine with being outplayed, I'm more than happy to say "Well played!", I just don't like situation where I'm left with no option to even try to fight back. My proposal is wrong? ok, it's wrong.  But give me any alternative,  so when I face this situation agian I would have options and not just "Wonder how many torpedoes will I manage to doge before I die?".

 

Oh forget it, it seems here people's solution to any problem is: "Get Skills!"

 

 

 

BB should have turbo jet to cross the whole map instantly. Here is your solution.

[Mindexe]

 

BB should have turbo jet to cross the whole map instantly. Here is your solution.

If you don't anything to say that crack bad jokes, mount your turbo jet.....

[Takeda92]

You can have done it if it was 1v1 but it wasn't, it was 1v2 against your counter class.

[Figment]

This is one of those topics that makes you lose faith in humanity's capacity to think about consequences to their actions and decision making, isn't it?

[Vogel]

How would a CV ever manage to land hits on a DD then?

[Mindexe]

How would a CV ever manage to land hits on a DD then?

 

DD are counter to CV, so by the logic of people in this treat, CV shouldn't be able to hit DD.

 

Look I already said that I'm fine with admitting that it wasn't the best option to solve this, but are you saying I should just "suck it up" where I'm put in situation where I can't even fight back? Even as arty in WoT you are able to stand your ground and fight back, heck I had even won when it was 1 vs 3 situation with arty. It was hard, it was challenging I got lucky. And even if I'm put in that same situation I would only able to win 1 out of 10 times, but I still I would have the ability to fight back. But here, in this kind of situation you are simply reduced in counting how many torpedo hits you can take before sinking. And you don't see any problem in that?

[Figment]

 

DD are counter to CV, so by the logic of people in this treat, CV shouldn't be able to hit DD.

 

Look I already said that I'm fine with admitting that it wasn't the best option to solve this, but are you saying I should just "suck it up" where I'm put in situation where I can't even fight back? Even as arty in WoT you are able to stand your ground and fight back, heck I had even won when it was 1 vs 3 situation with arty. It was hard, it was challenging I got lucky. And even if I'm put in that same situation I would only able to win 1 out of 10 times, but I still I would have the ability to fight back. But here, in this kind of situation you are simply reduced in counting how many torpedo hits you can take before sinking. And you don't see any problem in that?

 

Nobody should see any problems with that, because you can actually DODGE torpedoes quite easily. If you don't that is entirely your problem. You more or less suggest to make carriers completely defenseless, which is to be quite frank a very retarded suggestion.

 

 

Look at it from the perspective of a CV, most the time they just sit there taking shells without anything they can do about it but trying to run. To win that, they need many torpedo runs on enemy ships, which in many cases means spotting and engaging an enemy under heavy AA fire.

 

You mindlessly proposed to make it a one way fight favouring all but CVs. There are no words to formulate how stupid your suggestion is.

[Mindexe]

 

Nobody should see any problems with that, because you can actually DODGE torpedoes quite easily. If you don't that is entirely your problem. You more or less suggest to make carriers completely defenseless, which is to be quite frank a very retarded suggestion.

 

 

Look at it from the perspective of a CV, most the time they just sit there taking shells without anything they can do about it but trying to run. To win that, they need many torpedo runs on enemy ships, which in many cases means spotting and engaging an enemy under heavy AA fire.

 

You mindlessly proposed to make it a one way fight favouring all but CVs. There are no words to formulate how stupid your suggestion is.

 

If it where that easy to doge torpedoes, that would make carriers completely useless. And when I'm in CV I move before I'm in a spot where I would be under the barrage of enemy ships. And I said before, fine it was a stupid suggestion and I was an idiot for thinking it up. But what's the alternative in this situation? Suck it up? or is it that every one should have unicorn skills that would allow them to easily dodge ~12 torpedoes fallowed by second spread? Why they even bother with balancing if all can get solver with unicorn level skills!

[Sille]

 

A good cruiser player will rekt any DD in his vicinity.

 

You got outplayed, why rage about it?

 

A good destroyer can wreck a CA no problem whit its torps, specially us ones since they are like a small BB, but whitout the amror and guns.

[Plautuskake]

So here's the thing. In BB and after finishing last cruiser ship near our base, I was the only left alive in my team (technically there was omaha class cruised left, but he was finished 10 seconds later by torpedo spread that was aimed at me), while other team had 2 aircraft caries left (think both of them where Japanese ones). To get to them I had to cross the entire map, mean time they could use their planes to spot me and launch multiple torpedo runs on me. While I had no means to engage them and was only left with hoping that my AA guns could shoot 1 or 2 planes from the sky. 

 

At this point in the game the only question remaining was "How many torpedo runs would they need to sink me?". This kinda left me with "hopeless" feeling.

 

 

 

These kind rare situations may happen and will happen also in future. You should think this when you chose what ship you take to the battle. Yes, your situation was bad in that situation but that is one of the BB's characteristics. When I chose to take CV to the battle, there is always risk when I am only one left from my team and enemy team has two destoroyers.  Let's think about WoT, you take 6 tier's stock medium tank to the battle and near end battle there is only left full health IS6 and you. Which one you will bet in that situation? Let's go to back to your situations BB vs 2 CV:s that is difficult situation but not hopeless. There is always change that those CVs are near their reserves and when you shoot couple planes down you may soon see that there is less squadrons on air or you play your best game ever and you dodge all their torpedos.

 

[MudMonkey]

If you take away the spotting ability from planes then you also have to take away spotting planes. As I love to play DDs I would love this, but I think both would be very bad for the game. This looks like another post from an BB player how wants to take out a threat for his beloved BB because someone rekt him.

[Figment]

 

If it where that easy to doge torpedoes, that would make carriers completely useless. And when I'm in CV I move before I'm in a spot where I would be under the barrage of enemy ships. And I said before, fine it was a stupid suggestion and I was an idiot for thinking it up. But what's the alternative in this situation? Suck it up? or is it that every one should have unicorn skills that would allow them to easily dodge ~12 torpedoes fallowed by second spread? Why they even bother with balancing if all can get solver with unicorn level skills!

 

First off, this doesn't require skill. It requires alertness. All you have to do is double tap Q or E, throttle to Full reverse (maybe) and just click on the nearest APPROACHING aircraft squadron with torps to have your AA focus on that squadron (rather than a dive bomber or a torp squadron that dropped its payload).

 

Second? US CV tend to have one squadron of 6 torp bombers (unless Essex), so not 12. Sadly they removed the one way you could virtually guarantee not having wasted over a minute of flight time to do very little damage over time. Let's face it, a duel with any other unit is more dangerous in damage over time unless you mismanagement your repairs or he forces you to mismanage by waiting with the second strike till you repaired. The spread of IJN torp bombers is so wide, you could park Godzilla in between and in fact it literally cannot have 12 torps on target, because the spread is twice as wide as a BB is long (!). And their squadrons of four are easy to kill or at least half with AA, making their spreads be series of two. Even cross-hatching isn't that hard to avoid then.

 

It IS that easy, DDs and cruisers are almost impossible to hit if they are not braindead and I can easily dodge five to six double torp runs in a row (did that yesterday) with an Amagi. All you need to do is keep the torps in front or rear and keep the dive bombers coming from the side. You should start turning towards them at six kilometers distance at the latest. With a DD or cruiser that still works at distances up to two kilometers, even dodged torps launched at 1.5km and often you can nullify those if they are even closer. As a BB you can also dodge at these ranges,, although you risk taking one or two at least if you weren't paying attention.

 

Especially if you allowed a cross hatch, which you should see coming when they come to both sides, in that case, just go full rudder to the side with most space, reduce speed to throw the torp planes of more, at which point the enemy CV is in micromanagement nightmare, since all planning has to be redone, while his aircraft are being lost to AA.

 

And yes, you can suck up and repair a couple torpedoes, once you dodged it will be a minute or more till he can engage you again and if he saw you are alert and took most of his squadrons down he will think twice about engaging you again unless he has to. What do you think a CV has to do when someone spams HE at them and sets them on fire time and time again so aircraft cannot land or take-off? DEAL WITH IT, if you get outplayed, YOU GET OUTPLAYED.

 

 

Honestly, I despise your attitude. Why? Because you think a CV player has no right to hurt you. Your whole appalled "should I suck it up if I cant dodge?" question and attitude just shows you feel entitled to something, where you clearly look down upon your enemy who dared hurt you at a time you couldn't fight back directly. No. But that CV won't be able to fight back at all and hardly even dodge when you get within range with line of sight. It is YOUR job to survive long enough to get within range and set him on fire.

 

Thing is, most people turn too late.

[Mindexe]

Sigh....I play ALL classes BB, CV, DD, cruisers with all nations...I simply like to get and play with every ship or tank there is. And as I said BEFORE, I'm more than happy to admit my defeat and say "Well played!". But it seems people only read one sentence of post and leaves the rest to their imagination...

 

And yes I was on alert, I started to turn even before they where close to me, forcing them to change their attack approach so my AA could have longer time to fire on them, but on this BB, AA is little weak.