Recommendations for Agir Builds, Secondaries or not?

[DaBung]

What’s the best build for Agir these days? Most of the guides seem to be from before the secondary nerfs. They still worth building into with modules or should I just go main battery? Also range mode or reload if main battery is the way? 
 

Thanks.

[Atorpad]

secondary builds never worked  will never work in my opinion....

[Miscommunication_dept]

They have some range now, up to 10km but their accuracy is terrible and cannot be buffed.

 

Stick with main guns and reload.

 

Tier 2 AP skill is very good for this ship as you will be firing AP 90% of the time.

 

I used to run Siegfried with a secondary build but you just cannot make them accurate enough now to be anything but fireworks !

 

 

[Chaoskraehe]

Do CA/CL also get the new secondary captain skill with the next rework or only BB's?

[Samyuel]

1 hour ago, Chaoskraehe said:

Do CA/CL also get the new secondary captain skill with the next rework or only BB's?

WG removed almost all all secondary skill from the cruiser tree because "we don't want skill available for only 1 or 2 ships"
meanwhile they made a tons of torpedo related skill because.... reasons.

[Chaoskraehe]

Vor 6 Minuten, Samyuel sagte:

WG removed almost all all secondary skill from the cruiser tree because "we don't want skill available for only 1 or 2 ships"
meanwhile they made a tons of torpedo related skill because.... reasons.

Yes, but we get a new Captain skill rework soon. I'm just not sure if the new announced secondary skill is only for Battleships or also for cruisers. 

The more torpedo damage skill is neat. 

[tocqueville8]

5 hours ago, gopher31 said:

Tier 2 AP skill is very good for this ship as you will be firing AP 90% of the time.

I think it's a 3-point skill.

 

DDs have a 2-point skill that gives +7.5% AP damage, which is excellent on the new German line, but 3 points for only +5% is just a bad deal imho.

[tocqueville8]

6 hours ago, DaBung said:

What’s the best build for Agir these days? Most of the guides seem to be from before the secondary nerfs. They still worth building into with modules or should I just go main battery? Also range mode or reload if main battery is the way? 

I reckon this is fairly standard:

 

 

Steering and double concealment help in early-mid game standoffs, while RPF, Top Grade Gunner and extra hydro help in brawls and when pushing DDs.

Imho acceleration in Slot #4 is best used on bow-tanking BBs like the Soviet line: the Agir is tougher than some cruisers, but she's not *especially* tough when nose-in, given she lacks an icebreaker.

 

It wouldn't be crazy to take Dmg Con Mod 2 instead of steering, as Fire Prevention has been taken out of the cruiser skill tree.

 

You could also go double steering, but the loss in concealment might actually prove more dangerous.

I use it on the Azuma, but sometimes it's a problem, as I get spotted before I can get behind cover and I have trouble extricating myself.

 

Basically, this captain build is also very reasonable: you get more quality of life with Gun Feeder, Incoming Fire Alert and some extra AA, at the expense of RPF, which can be tricky to use.

 

 

Cheers 

[Samyuel]

4 hours ago, Chaoskraehe said:

Yes, but we get a new Captain skill rework soon. I'm just not sure if the new announced secondary skill is only for Battleships or also for cruisers. 

The more torpedo damage skill is neat. 

Its improved fire for secondary skill that change. ANd because WG in their wisdom decided to not give it to cruiser, they wont get it.

Please WG give back this skill for cruiser !

[Miscommunication_dept]

2 hours ago, Samyuel said:

Its improved fire for secondary skill that change. ANd because WG in their wisdom decided to not give it to cruiser, they wont get it.

Please WG give back this skill for cruiser !

I would love if supercruisers could use battleship skills.

 

Unfortunately, WG decided that Supercruisers were supposed to be vulnerable to fires in exchange for their good armour. 

 

Of course, they didn't decide this until after we had already bought them!

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

[Miscommunication_dept]

9 hours ago, tocqueville8 said:

I think it's a 3-point skill.

 

DDs have a 2-point skill that gives +7.5% AP damage, which is excellent on the new German line, but 3 points for only +5% is just a bad deal imho.

You are correct, I was thinking of my Druid that uses that skill very nicely indeed!

 

5% for 3 points probably isn't worth it, as you say. However, there is quite a dearth of skills for supercruisers in the cruiser skill tree so it could easily be taken.

Supercruisers are effectively lower tier battleships with better reload and accuracy. They would do much better with battleship skills. I would love to see more tanking skills in the cruiser commander tree

[Miscommunication_dept]

My current Agir build:

 

[DaBung]

Does anyone think the range mode is worth it? I tried it briefly at first and found I caught a few cruisers who weren’t expecting me to have 21.5km range, but I decided that wasn’t really playing to the ships strengths… seems most people agree? All the same 3 secs off the reload seems weaker than 18 -> 21.5km range in some situations. 

[Miscommunication_dept]

12 minutes ago, DaBung said:

Does anyone think the range mode is worth it? I tried it briefly at first and found I caught a few cruisers who weren’t expecting me to have 21.5km range, but I decided that wasn’t really playing to the ships strengths… seems most people agree? All the same 3 secs off the reload seems weaker than 18 -> 21.5km range in some situations. 

No, the accuracy is not good enough. 18km is plenty for most situations in battle and that reload is always useful. 

[Panocek]

11 minutes ago, DaBung said:

Does anyone think the range mode is worth it? I tried it briefly at first and found I caught a few cruisers who weren’t expecting me to have 21.5km range, but I decided that wasn’t really playing to the ships strengths… seems most people agree? All the same 3 secs off the reload seems weaker than 18 -> 21.5km range in some situations. 

Its case of grass being greener on other side. Whenever you have Range mod equipped, notice smaller maps or battles unfolding the way this extra range is nigh useless, while with Reload mod, you get the opposite

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

43 minuti fa, DaBung ha scritto:

Does anyone think the range mode is worth it? I tried it briefly at first and found I caught a few cruisers who weren’t expecting me to have 21.5km range, but I decided that wasn’t really playing to the ships strengths… seems most people agree? All the same 3 secs off the reload seems weaker than 18 -> 21.5km range in some situations. 

I thought about this, but I think you have enough range and 3s better reload is important 

[Figment]

16 hours ago, tocqueville8 said:

I think it's a 3-point skill.

 

DDs have a 2-point skill that gives +7.5% AP damage, which is excellent on the new German line, but 3 points for only +5% is just a bad deal imho.

Depends on the amount of cannons and frequency of fire perhaps. For an Austin this could do a lot of damage for instance.

[Miscommunication_dept]

1 minute ago, Figment said:

Depends on the amount of cannons and frequency of fire perhaps. For an Austin this could do a lot of damage for instance.

Austin doesn't have AP?

[Figment]

1 minute ago, gopher31 said:

Austin doesn't have AP?

I don't have an Austin! D:

 

We should fix one of those issues.

 

 

 

_{(But yeah, point was more fast firing cruisers and Austin came to mind having been utterly destroyed by one while in a tier X BB the other day. It just melted my hp away. )}

[Miscommunication_dept]

3 minutes ago, Figment said:

I don't have an Austin! D:

 

We should fix one of those issues.

 

 

 

_{(But yeah, point was more fast firing cruisers and Austin came to mind having been utterly destroyed by one while in a tier X BB the other day. It just melted my hp away. )}

I've been there!

 

Came out in front of Flambass of all people in his Austin, me in my Bourgogne, he melted me!

[tocqueville8]

15 minutes ago, Figment said:

Depends on the amount of cannons and frequency of fire perhaps. For an Austin this could do a lot of damage for instance.

Doing +5% damage with each hit is the same improvement whether we're talking about big guns, small guns, torps, bombs or anything else.

 

Whatever the armament, there are going to be times when even just +1% dmg would make a difference, allowing you to finish off a wounded enemy, and there are going to be times when +20% wouldn't make any difference, as you have no trouble landing a couple of extra volleys.

[Figment]

1 minute ago, tocqueville8 said:

Doing +5% damage with each hit is the same improvement whether we're talking about big guns, small guns, torps, bombs or anything else.

 

Whatever the armament, there are going to be times when even just +1% dmg would make a difference, allowing you to finish off a wounded enemy, and there are going to be times when +20% wouldn't make any difference, as you have no trouble landing a couple of extra volleys.

Technically yes, but with fast firing and accurate ships you’ll have more chance to monetize this 5%. A Kansas for instance is going to waste much of its potential with every miss, so it won’t add up as easily.

[tocqueville8]

1 hour ago, Figment said:

Technically yes, but with fast firing and accurate ships you’ll have more chance to monetize this 5%. A Kansas for instance is going to waste much of its potential with every miss, so it won’t add up as easily.

Why?

I think you're thinking about better reload: a Kansas might miss her chance to fire a second salvo even if the reload is quicker, but +5% damage per shell will stick anyway.

[Figment]

Just now, tocqueville8 said:

Why?

I think you're thinking about better reload: a Kansas might miss her chance to fire a second salvo even if the reload is quicker, but +5% damage per shell will stick anyway.

No. If you are more likely to hit and hit often, that 5% extra damage will stack up quickly in a short time period. With Kansas or so, once every 40s +5% would be relatively meaningless. For hit and run tactics, doing that bit extra damage in short time is useful.