How would you define "carry".

[MannequinSkywalker]

1 minute ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Most definitely! Cracker of a game! 

True, but that often doesn't show in the end result. We've all played numerous games where afterwards you thought to yourself "well if I hadn't done X than their team would have won." in which case you technically "carried". But you see, everyone's contributions are vital to a team in order to win. But that doesn't mean anyone on the team carried.

Yea, i agree but sometimes there can be more than one player that carry the game. For instance, top 2 players each have 2.5K xp, both have 5 kills. Now what? We got double strike. Or top 3, each has 3 kills and over 2K base xp. Who carried who, who made who AC/DC? That's why i wrote depends on the game.

[The_Chiv]

Carry is such a subjective term. There were times when hard flanking dds would get behind the enemy bb lines and wreck them and we would call that a carry. There were times when CV's would kill another cv and we would call that a carry. There was a time when a Kraken could be seen as a carry. 

 

For myself I look at 2 things. End of game score and what I was attacking. If at the end of the game, I see a player or myself at the top of the score I then look to see the difference between them and the next 4 players. If there is a huge gap then Yeah CARRY. The other factor I look for an this is again subjective, I look to see what they were targeting. Any cruiser can farm damage on a BB, but when I see one actively focusing on a DD that to me is putting in the effort to ensure a victory and thus allow their team to win. That to me is a carry. 

 

Now some will say my points of reference are not carries. Again Carry is a subjective term and my logic for my personal definition is simple. They put in the most effort to ensure a win.

[GarrusBrutus]

13 minutes ago, MannequinSkywalker said:

Yea, i agree but sometimes there can be more than one player that carry the game. For instance, top 2 players each have 2.5K xp, both have 5 kills. Now what?

Hahaha well than they both get to brag about how they carried. ;) Such a scenario is extremely rare though and often those two players are in a division or something. Atleast the times ive seen that happen, that was the case. Since it was me and a buddy ghehe.

 

But for example for myself: if i did 2500bxp and the second guy did 2200 bxp and the third guy did 2000 bxp, I wouldnt say I carried the game. I simply had a good game. But just as with all other things in this game, that depends on your own perspective. For some players 2500 bxp at TX seems unreachable, for me anything below is just an average game.

[MannequinSkywalker]

3 minutes ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Hahaha well than they both get to brag about how they carried. ;) Such a scenario is extremely rare though and often those two players are in a division or something. Atleast the times ive seen that happen, that was the case. Since it was me and a buddy ghehe.

 

But for example for myself: if i did 2500bxp and the second guy did 2200 bxp and the third guy did 2000 bxp, I wouldnt say I carried the game. I simply had a good game. But just as with all other things in this game, that depends on your own perspective. For some players 2500 bxp at TX seems unreachable, for me anything below is just an average game.

Yep, agreed.

[Bear__Necessities]

Hummm so people opinions vary.

 

I'd call some of these carries without question.

 

Spoiler

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

What's consistent is being able to influence a game positively in all situations you put yourself in and make the correct calls that can be the win or lose a game. 

[Camperdown]

I would start like this: when you are the determining factor in securing victory on your flank or cap, and this turns out to be decisive for the entire battle.

[Deckeru_Maiku]

2 hours ago, Bear__Necessities said:

Hummm so people opinions vary.

 

I'd call some of these carries without question.

 

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What's consistent is being able to influence a game positively in all situations you put yourself in and make the correct calls that can be the win or lose a game. 

Only watched the first two, but, dude, why don't I don't get such potato enemies?

Okay, as the CV you slaughtered some innocent T6 enemies, frustrated that BB that you kinda charged at and then the DD saved the day with his CV kill...

And in the Harry's Gummi you encountered the masters of potatoes it seems, letting do "DD things" nearly unmolested. Add to that a shipload of luck in form of missed shots against you and the result isn't unexpected...

But yes, managing a win while you teammates compete for the "most innovative way to get sunk award" is carrying... but you also got a shipload of luck

[The_Chiv]

To me this is a carry. 

 

Mind you this is also playing my ship to it's role. Pan Asian before t9 are a rough. Your torps lack the range to be an effective torp boat but you got close enough conceal to be effective, You really cant use them for anti dd warfare due to shell arcs and horrible turret traverse as well as deep water torps. So I played this as a hard flank pusher, wrapped around the enemy bb line and kept them spotted while constantly putting torp walls in their path and ducking the CV. Was a fun game. 

[_Kokushibo_]

2 hours ago, The_Chiv said:

To me this is a carry steamroll. 

 

[The_Chiv]

18 minutes ago, Whrrrrr said:

 

was not a steamroll.

[Bear__Necessities]

9 hours ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

Only watched the first two, but, dude, why don't I don't get such potato enemies?

Okay, as the CV you slaughtered some innocent T6 enemies, frustrated that BB that you kinda charged at and then the DD saved the day with his CV kill...

And in the Harry's Gummi you encountered the masters of potatoes it seems, letting do "DD things" nearly unmolested. Add to that a shipload of luck in form of missed shots against you and the result isn't unexpected...

But yes, managing a win while you teammates compete for the "most innovative way to get sunk award" is carrying... but you also got a shipload of luck

I make my own luck :P

[MrWastee]

8 minutes ago, Bear__Necessities said:

I make my own luck :P

 

[Pikkozoikum]

21 hours ago, Prophecy82 said:

Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

Overall the term for someone, you contributes the most to a win, or who is more or less the winning condition.

 

That can be damage, that can be capping. it depends on the win. If you win a match, because of the cap you took, then you carried

If you win, because you depeleted their HP pools so much, that it's easy to kill them all, then you carried.

Technically you could also carry a team by not dying. But that's a bit weird view, because something happend before, what actually carried the game

[Bear__Necessities]

1 hour ago, MrWastee said:

 

4t0O.txt

[HMS_Kilinowski]

I wouldn't call a high end result an obvious carry. I somewhat subscribe to Sunleader's idea about a carry having many potential causes.

 

Especially being high on the team board is not necessarily a carry. I think about the classic Thunderer example, a player who hides behind his team in a ship well better armored than most of the ships on his flank. Being in the back, he is shot less and takes way less damage. While his team mates, all fulfilling important roles, die one after another, he has time to accumulate damage and it puts him on top, tho his presence in the team would have made many ships survive longer and meant more guns firing for longer time, making it an easier victory. So at some point he is the last ship on his flank and now even the CV starts burning his planes on him and he gets some plane kills and more baseXP. Maybe the other flank than turns around what would have been a loss and suddenly our Thunderer can even turn around and at some point move through the cap, getting a solo cap ribbon.

 

On the other side, as already described by Sunleader, if you are the driving force behind a successful flanking, either by stalling the enemy way longer than humanly possible or by keeping the momentum on the pushing flank, you may well be the reason for a victory. I also think you don't need to explicitly turn around a game. You can carry a game very continuously, so the opponent never gets the upper hand, but still continuously keep the game in balance, effectively fighting against the stupidity of your suiciding team mates rather than against the red team.

 

My minimum definition of a carry is that game where I cap the base just in time to win a lost battle.

[Saltface]

It is a team game. By definition all contribute to victory. Even by a small margin.

However, there are those exceptional games that one or two players contribute significantly more to victory. This is where our discussion starts. And you must see the game to be sure if ones game was a carry.

In my humble opinion, it is a carry if you were instrumental to victory. If you hadn't done what you did it would be a loss. I do not believe that achievements big scores etc. can define accurately a carry. End screens can be misleading.

Let me illustrate with examples.

Game 1

According to some definitions posted above it would be a carry. A Kraken, First Blood, High Caliber. Oh my. This dude killed 5 out of 7 reds. What a performance! Well, not according to me.

The game would have been won all the same even if I did half of what I did. Someone else on my team would have done it. Replay in the spoiler.

Spoiler

 

 

 

Game 2

This one is a carry.  Score is high, but I come only second in the end. However, If I did not do what I did ... it would be a loss. Well, maybe...you never know.

Replay in the spoiler.

Spoiler

 

 

To conclude. You have to watch the game. 

[SodaBubbles]

22 hours ago, tocqueville8 said:

To me, a carry is when you personally turn around a losing game.

 

 

That's how I look at it too. The issue is in doubt, you step forward and your actions are decisive. There might be other players who finished ahead of you in Base XP, but something you did swung the tide.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

7 hours ago, The_Chiv said:

was not a steamroll.

Lol 2-12 not a steamroll.

You managed to carry a steamroll.

[anonym_cwVecOS6ecVy]

11 minutes ago, Europizza said:

Lol 2-12 not a steamroll.

You managed to carry a steamroll.

Players get more and more delusional... It is basically the same as surviving until the end game, snacking a couple of low hp targets, losing, blaming it on the team and then bragging about your skill, because you had the most kills and survived the game. Omegalul.

[Prophecy82]

Can you guys look at this one. It was one of the strangest battles I ever had.  

 

What would you call this? A carry is it not (all surviving ships had about 2000BXP with me at first with 2200BXP) i think by definition.

 

Was it a counter-throw? 

20210725_190028_PFSB510-Bourgogne_19_OC_prey.wowsreplay

[Saltface]

@Prophecy82 mega throw... I blame the red Halland.

 

Why on earth - with no DD on your side - he had to lose concealment?

If he picked you out with torps (not stupid bow on torps) they would most probably win.

If you had sunk they would most probably save the Shiki. That is 200 points. You would not have taken the cap.

 

MHO

 

[Prophecy82]

28 minutes ago, Saltface said:

@Prophecy82 mega throw... I blame the red Halland.

 

Why on earth - with no DD on your side - he had to lose concealment?

If he picked you out with torps (not stupid bow on torps) they would most probably win.

If you had sunk they would most probably save the Shiki. That is 200 points. You would not have taken the cap.

 

MHO

 

 

I guess he got suprised by Burgers speed. But yea, it was quite the counter-throw. 

Same is true for the Burger rushing into B... wth did he do that? 

As I said, it was one of the strangest battles I ever had. 

[The_Chiv]

6 hours ago, Prophecy82 said:

Can you guys look at this one. It was one of the strangest battles I ever had.  

 

What would you call this? A carry is it not (all surviving ships had about 2000BXP with me at first with 2200BXP) i think by definition.

 

Was it a counter-throw? 

20210725_190028_PFSB510-Bourgogne_19_OC_prey.wowsreplay

Throw.