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Prophecy82

How would you define "carry".

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Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

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Depends on the situation.

 

  • did you snatch the win from the jaws of defeat?
  • did you do MUCH more than the rest of your team?
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16 minutes ago, Prophecy82 said:

Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

 

The Traditional Definition would be that you Turned a Lost Game into a Victory.

Effectively. Your Team was Losing Badly and You manaed to Turn it around.

 

The more common Definition. Is that you "Carried" an Unproportional Large amount of the Work done to Win.

For example getting a Kraken and High Caliber Award is Generally Accepted as you having Carried. As you have Clearly Contributed Vast amounts of Damage and Kills to your Teams effort.

 

 

Now. A 100% Accurate Definition likely wont Exist. Aside from "You are the one Responsible for Victory" which however is Hard to Define in itself.

For example. I had Games where I got nearly 4 Million Potential Damage because I was effectively Holding Down an Entire Flank alone. Fighting 3-5 Enemies on my Own.

I only got 2 of them Killed and only about 100k Damage. But I did manage to keep the Enemy from Pushing around our Flank. So the Remaining Team after way too long time Won out on the other Flank where they massively Outnumbered the Enemy and thus Finally got around.

If I had not held out there. My Team would be extremely likely to have Lost because they would have been Flanked and Crossfired.

So I could in Theory Claim I Carried there. But that  would likely not really be seen as such. As the more Common Definition really is that you Scored a Large amount of Damage and Several Kills. Thus it being without Doubt that an Unproportional Big Part of the Enemy Casualties was down to You.

 

Other more Specific Cases like my Example. Would likely required a Replay to be Watched for others to Define. As its not really Obvious and would likely not be Accepted as Carry by most.

 

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I define a carry like this:

 

Spoiler

c0b2470060da44e9ce0cf08674ac0323.jpg

 

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I'd say where there is a clear and obvious gap in base exp. Damage and kills like this.

 

unknown-13.thumb.png.dd7193d0e51ce09ae1ed5a558c649bfb.png

unknown-11.thumb.png.c3ee53a8d91bd67445f451416fda433d.png

 

Or where you've made the smart play that secures a game where others have almost cost it. 

 

unknown-15.thumb.png.683704706af15ca08f3392756e459963.png

unknown-24.thumb.png.418419d43daca2ed4c244bd6aa7f10cd.png

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To me, a carry is when you personally turn around a losing game.

 

It's not when you come 1st by xp or do great damage, or you get early, long-lasting caps. That's a strong performance, probably, but I wouldn't call it a carry. You can do that in a fairly even match.

It's not when you get an early Dev Strike and things snowball from there: you might've won that game anyway, just differently.

It's when you are, say, 1 cap, 200 points and 2-3 ships behind, but you pull some heroics and turn it around, and you have to play near-perfectly.

 

For these reasons, I'd say for me a ship with high WR isn't necessarily a "carry" ship.

Example: I have a high (much higher than average) WR in the Plymouth, likely because she's great at contesting caps, sinking DDs early, farming damage from impunity, etc. That stuff wins games, but mostly because it sets them on a nice course from very early on. But with slow speed, bad armor, bad AA, terrible turret angles and not enough torps for yoloing, she's just not good at pulling off heroics in the late game.

Likewise with the Shikishima (until they removed Dead Eye): overmatching a BB in the opening for 15k, making her turn away and cede map control, wins games, so my WR with her is high. But she's not a "clutch" ship: she's slow and clumsy and she can easily be overwhelmed by more numerous enemies.

On the other hand, the Salem is great for carrying: good AA, great heal, good frontal armor, great frontal firepower, radar. All that stuff is great for ambushing the last remaining enemy DD, or winning a bow-tank duel with almost any cruiser...even rushing some BBs, while being a tough nut to crack for the CV (AA is more important in the late game, as CVs have fewer targets among which to choose). Sure, she can't go up against a Vermont, but she can deal with most late-game situations and win isolated fights (it's up to you to create them, using terrain).

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41 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Now. A 100% Accurate Definition likely wont Exist. Aside from "You are the one Responsible for Victory" which however is Hard to Define in itself.

This.. doesn't need to be a lot of sinking or damaging ships, but can be anything from tanking half the opposing team to allow your team to pick them off or going through the channel on Two Brothers, at that one rare moment when it leads to not getting blapped when coming on the other side, to halt the opponents' advance and allows your team to regroup and do the final victorious push...

 

26 minutes ago, Aragathor said:

I define a carry like this:

 

  Hide contents

c0b2470060da44e9ce0cf08674ac0323.jpg

 

 in the case of WoWs that should of course be two sacks of potatoes...

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I would also say that "carry" means "through your actions a lost game became a victory". Getting 2500 XP means nothing (in this context). More often than not 2-3 ships "carry" at the end and sometimes - rarely - one player will be the difference.

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1 hour ago, Prophecy82 said:

Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

Making a move or play that insures the win

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"A term used when one's team does its best to throw, but fail at doing so due to one's effort and struggle"

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41 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

Making a move or play that insures the win

AFK DD getting a solo warrior because his team killed almost the entire enemy team and capped all the caps? "Carry"? No. A move or play the secures the win? Yes.

 

Imo a carry is when someone does way more than the second placed player in a won game. F.e. 50% BXP difference and plenty of kills.

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2 hours ago, Prophecy82 said:

Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

What I try to do every game :cap_like:

But usually it doesnt happen :cap_fainting:

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1 hour ago, Bear__Necessities said:

I'd say where there is a clear and obvious gap in base exp. Damage and kills like this.

We all know first game was Petro doing the lifiting, not you :D

 

But yeah, a clear bxp gap is needed, and ofc a win. Bcp gaps in losses are nice, but can be result of extreme and useless dmg farming.

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its hard to see if someone carried.

 

Base xp and kills can just be farmed or kills secured.

i have seen SOO manny games with someone on Top of the scoreboard but because of his positioning was so horrid we lost the game.

or we won while some dd went for all the objectives but the guy just farmed in the back and outscored him on xp.

Rare occasions are ofc when someone has kills XP and  something like dreadnought or high calliber that u can be sure he was usefull.

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, GarrusBrutus said:

AFK DD getting a solo warrior because his team killed almost the entire enemy team and capped all the caps? "Carry"? No. A move or play the secures the win? Yes.

 

Imo a carry is when someone does way more than the second placed player in a won game. F.e. 50% BXP difference and plenty of kills.

See, I disagree. Even if someone does way more than the second player, it's not necessarily a carry. Good play? Sure. But it might have been a win anyway, or at the very least it's a team effort, a "group carry". Carrying alone means snatching certain victory from the claws of the Reds by some play. Don't even need to be top scorer. That can be some sniping Yamato or something.

 

Also, in your example the DD made no "move", so someone else carried ;) Perhaps the one who got the Flesh Wound kill that allowed the DD to afk-win.

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2 hours ago, SV_Kompresor said:

"A term used when one's team does its best to throw, but fail at doing so due to one's effort and struggle"

I love this definition. The phrase "when one's team does its best to throw" is redundant, though :cap_win:

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4 hours ago, Prophecy82 said:

Everyone speaks about it, but how would you define it? 

 

Winning a battle is a given. 

 

But which metrics would you use to call smth. "a carry". 

Kills? BXP? Caps?.....

easy, you have 7 players only one of them is Bruce Wills who will kill them all, you will eaither die or watch him kill them all.

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The thing that indians put on every food.

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2 hours ago, GarrusBrutus said:

AFK DD getting a solo warrior because his team killed almost the entire enemy team and capped all the caps? "Carry"? No. A move or play the secures the win? Yes.

 

Imo a carry is when someone does way more than the second placed player in a won game. F.e. 50% BXP difference and plenty of kills.

 

But i wasn't afk, and finished second after the cv. So this is not carry?  :Smile_sad:

Ok, how about cv and i carried together? :Smile_coin:

 

Edit: Not only i was the sole survivor but also points were very close and ticking for enemy, and if game was a min longer, they could have won. Because enemy cv was still alive.

 

solo_mannequin.jpg

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Something like at end of the game 1 DD (you) vs 2 BBs 1 CL 1 DD and 1 CV and you manage to sunk 1 DD, 1 CL and land multiple hits to reset caps and get an unxepected victory 1000 - 994 at points

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36 minutes ago, Bindolaf_Werebane said:

Even if someone does way more than the second player, it's not necessarily a carry. Good play? Sure. But it might have been a win anyway, or at the very least it's a team effort, a "group carry".

If someone does way more than the number two in a win its not a carry? The win is never given for free, and if one player did way more than the #2 & #3 than it certainly is a carry. He put himself in a position where he could deal lots of damage for a long period of time. 

 

38 minutes ago, Bindolaf_Werebane said:

Carrying alone means snatching certain victory from the claws of the Reds by some play. Don't even need to be top scorer. That can be some sniping Yamato or something.

That can also be lucky. Being in the right place at the right time. I think of a player who carries as one who makes good decisions for the entirety of the game, not just the final moments. 

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5 minutes ago, MannequinSkywalker said:

 

But i wasn't afk, and finished second after the cv. So this is not carry?  :Smile_sad:

Ok, how about cv and i carried together? :Smile_coin:

 

Edit: Not only i was the sole survivor but also points were very close and ticking for enemy, and if game was a min longer, they could have won. Because enemy cv was still alive.

 

solo_mannequin.jpg

You contributed a lot but I wouldn't necessarily say you carried. Grats on the solo warrior tho. 

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1 minute ago, GarrusBrutus said:

You contributed a lot but I wouldn't necessarily say you carried. Grats on the solo warrior tho. 

 

Fair enough. So, here is an old game from my replays page https://replayswows.com/profile/556427504/sort/uploaded_at.desc/

 

I guess, you consider this one as a carry rather than the solo warrior one?

Imo, it really depends on the game. One doesn't have to be in the first place or necessarily have lots of kills. Smart plays can carry games, too.

 

 

99273_370_1594818958.jpg

99273_810_1594818958.jpg

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Turning an incredibly one-sided match vs more than 4 mostly intact players and winning despite the odds. Requires a lot of skill, planning, fook ups (from the enemy), prediction and luck on yer side (and theres, but the opposite). This is done throughout the match or at least from the middle to the end.

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7 minutes ago, MannequinSkywalker said:

I guess, you consider this one as a carry rather than the solo warrior one?

Most definitely! Cracker of a game! 

8 minutes ago, MannequinSkywalker said:

Imo, it really depends on the game. One doesn't have to be in the first place or necessarily have lots of kills. Smart plays can carry games, too.

True, but that often doesn't show in the end result. We've all played numerous games where afterwards you thought to yourself "well if I hadn't done X than their team would have won." in which case you technically "carried". But you see, everyone's contributions are vital to a team in order to win. But that doesn't mean anyone on the team carried.

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