T10 Clan battles - absolute failure

[st_dasa]

I'll try to keep this as short as possible.

 

Clan battles are dead. Everything fun was sucked from them by upping the tier.

 

WG tries to ''balance'' the absolute shits*ow that are CBs in tier 10 by constantly changing the rules, but to be completely honest, it made everything even worse and more RNG dependent. Adding the storm (or whatever it is called) made the meta unpredictable - but NOT in a good way. It is absolutely impossible to predict and make a good composition and strategy if you are constantly put against random event that may or may not occur. For example, one night we got storms 75% of the time. The other, storms were there in less than 25% instances.

 

Storm favors BB comp against CV comp and the effect of clear weather is, obviously, vice versa. And of course, storm makes our dear Petro that more powerful, because f*ck you you useless kiting cruisers, GTFO from the meta.

 

To be completely honest, I do not care about win rate or steel. I farmed enough of it in the last season to buy the stuff I want. My clan is currently between the first and second Storm league and we will probably get in the Typhoon sometimes during the following week (and that is debatable because lots of ppl are getting super tired and bored with the current season). What I do care about is a fun and engaging meta (cringe, I know) where me and my team can improve our strategy and have a learning curve that is not constantly interrupted by, honestly, idiotic meta changes that are the result of WG's incompetence when it comes to balancing their own game.

 

And when it comes to banning ships, dear WG, can you at least do it properly? NO. PETROS. IN. THE. CBs. And this is coming from the guy that is currently in top 20 Petro EU players. Even one is enough to ruin the game. And either BAN ALL CVs OR REMOVE THE STORMS.

 

 

 

 

Thank you for reading this thread, I hope to see your opinion on the matter.

 

 

[Bear__Necessities]

The fact I'm just merc'ing for a clan when I have a bit of spare time rather than playing in my own clan speaks volumes. 

 

CV's made CW's stale. Cyclones only added to an already unfun time. Those 2 things were what broke the camel's back in my clan and pretty much made half stop playing. 

[st_dasa]

3 minutes ago, Bear__Necessities said:

CV's made CW's stale. Cyclones only added to an already unfun time. Those 2 things were what broke the camel's back in my clan and pretty much made half stop playing. 

 

I think the same goes for my clan too.

[Bear__Necessities]

2 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

 

I think the same goes for my clan too.

We came back for a couple of weekend with the T9 season. We played just for fun. We played ships we enjoyed. And it was great. We all got a bit of extra steel and we're happy in the limited time to get where we did. And I didn't have to play the fun police. Which nearly blew my love for this game the 1st season being the main and nearly only CV player. I have not played CV to any sort of good amount due to that 1 soul sapping season. 

[Aragathor]

13 minutes ago, Bear__Necessities said:

The fact I'm just merc'ing for a clan when I have a bit of spare time rather than playing in my own clan speaks volumes. 

 

CV's made CW's stale. Cyclones only added to an already unfun time. Those 2 things were what broke the camel's back in my clan and pretty much made half stop playing. 

Preach it. My clan was aiming for low typhoon every season until CVs were added. We stopped playing after that, a lot of people outright quit the game. The clan leader just transferred ownership and left.

Another great WG success.

[st_dasa]

1 hour ago, Aragathor said:

Preach it. My clan was aiming for low typhoon every season until CVs were added. We stopped playing after that, a lot of people outright quit the game. The clan leader just transferred ownership and left.

Another great WG success.

 

To an extent, same thing is happening in my clan, except we are mostly friends so we won't abandon the clan.

 

We are almost exclusively ''surface'' players and we have a massive deficit when it comes to CVs. In the last season (T9) we managed to comfortably climb up to the higher Typhoon leagues, and if we were tad more ambitious, could even push towards the Hurricane. Current iteration of CBs on the other hand, is an absolute sh*tshow. Too much RNG, individual play is heavily punished and it all comes to fighting in a blob vs. enemy blob - and the blob with the better RNG wins. Two BBs fights are ok, but storm again makes lots of otherwise kiting / flanking strategies unfeasible.

 

Ironically, we have a better WR against the clans that are either on our level or much more skilled, while losing to the ones that are worse but better in a sheep-style flocking and focusing. We cherish individual intuition and unpredictable moves, but with CVs and storms in the game, it all goes out the window.

Blob up or lose.

[MannequinSkywalker]

[Prophecy82]

CVs have no right to be in CB. 

The easy spotting advantage kills pretty much all strategical/tactical aspects. 

 

But I cant give the CV the only blame here: WG released quite some questionable ships over the last year that made older ships  pretty much obsolete. 

Just look at DDs! So much diversity! Sure Halland is a given due to CVs, but even if there were none... why would you pick any DD over Smaland f.e. ?

 

At the moment (at least in higher leagues) I assume only 25% of all T10 Ships are somewhat viable. If there were no CVs it would be about 45%... so still a far cry from diversity. 

Limiting/banning ships helps a bit but in the end I cant help but think that the balance at T10 is completely busted... even without CVs. 

[lovelacebeer]

I will reluctantly help my clan out if they are short of a person, but only out of being helpful and I consider it a chore playing rather than a pleasure and it is entirely a result of CVs. 

[Mr_D1ngle]

 

The same has also happened to my clan. I started the clan in 2017 and we have always played CB. 

 

I have always made a point that CBs are important to the clan for bonding

and group teamplay, and of course a nicely golden clan tag has always been welcomed and we have done fairly good and had fun

in the past.

 

Unfortunately this season has been the end of CB's for us. No one wants to play in CB's with CV's 

My enjoyment is slowing going from this game and I do not log in and play as much as I would love too. 

 

 

 

 

[Fat_Maniac]

1 hour ago, Bear__Necessities said:

CV's made CW's stale. Cyclones only added to an already unfun time. Those 2 things were what broke the camel's back in my clan and pretty much made half stop playing. 

Same here. A shame as CB used to be such a good enjoyable mode.

[159Hunter]

WG numbers will show that CB are a great succes.

 

What bear said, I stopped playing. CB sucked the fun factor out of the game for me.

[st_dasa]

21 minutes ago, Mr_D1ngle said:

 

The same has also happened to my clan. I started the clan in 2017 and we have always played CB. 

 

I have always made a point that CBs are important to the clan for bonding

and group teamplay, and of course a nicely golden clan tag has always been welcomed and we have done fairly good and had fun

in the past.

 

Unfortunately this season has been the end of CB's for us. No one wants to play in CB's with CV's 

My enjoyment is slowing going from this game and I do not log in and play as much as I would love too. 

 

 

 

 

 

Sad to hear it.

 

But what is even more hilarious is the fact WG tried to ''balance'' their own failure of a tier with interventions like bans and storms. It's a hilarious attempt at nerfing CVs. They created the problem in the first place, now they try to fix it and actually managed to make everything even worse. They are so oblivious to the fact that the excrement cannot be made into a cake no matter how much you try to sugarcoat it (in the very literal sense!).

[SV_Kompresor]

54 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

Ironically, we have a better WR against the clans that are either on our level or much more skilled, while losing to the ones that are worse but better in a sheep-style flocking and focusing.

That has been happening to us too lately. We can win against typhoons and unicum clans but lose against a bunch of 52%s

[Port_Authority]

48 minutes ago, Prophecy82 said:

But I cant give the CV the only blame here: WG released quite some questionable ships over the last year that made older ships  pretty much obsolete. 

 

Everything is fixable. At once, without this stupid Excel checking and then banning ships after a good portion of season has been lost.

 

- CVs should be banned from CW because they are gamebreaking.

- Petropavlovsk should be removed from the tech tree. Put a normal heavy cruiser there. Petro gets to be a premium/reward battleship.

- Ships officially declared as OP and hence pulled from the market, such as Smaland, get limits and can't be played in succession. If team uses Smaland, it can't use it for next X matches.

- No weather/visibility modifiers. Detonations off.

- Some maps need fixing, one of the teams gets a better spawn.

 

 

[Animalul2012]

Clan wars has become way to repetitive/monotonic an"inspiration" from the tank game could bring something new+some tweaks. How it should go? well:

-Leagues are abolished

-Global map added. Select whetever teritory to fight on you like,multiple participants, the barrage winner gets to fight the owner. If it results in victory the territory is now yours. 

-Some territories require different tiers. Some t6 ships other t8 and t10. In the future tiers can be changed.

-Each territory under the clan control generates and income per day. It can be either steel,doubloons,coal. The more the clan hold the respectiv territory the more the oportunity to increase its income. The income goes to the clan treasury. Players will be able to earn individual rewards based on wins: lest say 10 wins=flags,20 wins=free xp and commander xp,30 wins=asian camos

40 wins=premium time+credits, 50 wins=7500 steel. 

-Premium and reward ships are banned from clan wars. Those who lose theyre ships in the final standoff for the territory are blocked to use that ship for 24h and even 48h. Players will have to switch bettween ships. 

Aircraft carriers are restricted from clan wars. Restrictions can aplly:no more than 1 kleber/marceau/ no more than 1 ship of the same type. 

More players: t6-5 players, t8-7 players, t10-10 players. 

Bonus:those who have participated to more than 25 battles in the clan wars season will earn adittional coupons to replenish theyre signals and flags. (2 50% coupons for each)

Doubt they will try any of these.

[tocqueville8]

 

43 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

And when it comes to banning ships, dear WG, can you at least do it properly? NO. PETROS. IN. THE. CBs. And this is coming from the guy that is currently in top 20 Petro EU players. Even one is enough to ruin the game. And either BAN ALL CVs OR REMOVE THE STORMS.

 

Can someone explain to me the appeal of the Petro for CBs?

 

I've only played a few dozen matches as a mercenary in Storm League, so my experience is limited, but the standard setup was clearly:

Halland + FDR/Midway + Petro + Ohio/Shikishima/Bourgogne + assorted Stalingrads/Goliaths

 

We did come across a strong clan with a triple Marceau + Bourgogne lineup, and a double Salem on another occasion, but they were by far the exceptions.

 

I don't really see the point in bringing 12 km radar when there's usually only going to be 1 DD, and one that has no smoke and can torp you from 15 km as well, and there's pretty much always a CV for spotting.

Also, Petros and Stalingrads kind of melt during long-range snipefests when faced with a Hindenburg (to which I switched) or a Goliath, don't they? I mean, there are plenty of cyclones, but the visibility is 14 km, so again radar isn't that useful, I guess...

[st_dasa]

1 hour ago, tocqueville8 said:

 

Can someone explain to me the appeal of the Petro for CBs?

 

I've only played a few dozen matches as a mercenary in Storm League, so my experience is limited, but the standard setup was clearly:

Halland + FDR/Midway + Petro + Ohio/Shikishima/Bourgogne + assorted Stalingrads/Goliaths

 

We did come across a strong clan with a triple Marceau + Bourgogne lineup, and a double Salem on another occasion, but they were by far the exceptions.

 

I don't really see the point in bringing 12 km radar when there's usually only going to be 1 DD, and one that has no smoke and can torp you from 15 km as well, and there's pretty much always a CV for spotting.

Also, Petros and Stalingrads kind of melt during long-range snipefests when faced with a Hindenburg (to which I switched) or a Goliath, don't they? I mean, there are plenty of cyclones, but the visibility is 14 km, so again radar isn't that useful, I guess...

 

Petro can hold a position exceptionally well, is way too tanky to kill quickly and is even more powerul in the current storm infested meta where spotting is set to 14 km.

 

Try to dislodge a single Petro (without a CV) when entrenched and you will experience the pain...

[MrWastee]

1 hour ago, Animalul2012 said:

Clan wars has become way to repetitive/monotonic an"inspiration" from the tank game could bring something new+some tweaks. How it should go? well:

-Leagues are abolished

-Global map added. Select whetever teritory to fight on you like,multiple participants, the barrage winner gets to fight the owner. If it results in victory the territory is now yours. 

-Some territories require different tiers. Some t6 ships other t8 and t10. In the future tiers can be changed.

-Each territory under the clan control generates and income per day. It can be either steel,doubloons,coal. The more the clan hold the respectiv territory the more the oportunity to increase its income. The income goes to the clan treasury. Players will be able to earn individual rewards based on wins: lest say 10 wins=flags,20 wins=free xp and commander xp,30 wins=asian camos

40 wins=premium time+credits, 50 wins=7500 steel. 

-Premium and reward ships are banned from clan wars. Those who lose theyre ships in the final standoff for the territory are blocked to use that ship for 24h and even 48h. Players will have to switch bettween ships. 

Aircraft carriers are restricted from clan wars. Restrictions can aplly:no more than 1 kleber/marceau/ no more than 1 ship of the same type. 

More players: t6-5 players, t8-7 players, t10-10 players. 

Bonus:those who have participated to more than 25 battles in the clan wars season will earn adittional coupons to replenish theyre signals and flags. (2 50% coupons for each)

Doubt they will try any of these.

 

 

 

*seriously ^^!

 

 

 

 

 

 

*weegee

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

3 ore fa, Prophecy82 ha scritto:

CVs have no right to be in CB. 

The easy spotting advantage kills pretty much all strategical/tactical aspects. 

 

But I cant give the CV the only blame here: WG released quite some questionable ships over the last year that made older ships  pretty much obsolete. 

Just look at DDs! So much diversity! Sure Halland is a given due to CVs, but even if there were none... why would you pick any DD over Smaland f.e. ?

 

At the moment (at least in higher leagues) I assume only 25% of all T10 Ships are somewhat viable. If there were no CVs it would be about 45%... so still a far cry from diversity. 

Limiting/banning ships helps a bit but in the end I cant help but think that the balance at T10 is completely busted... even without CVs. 

yep, tier X is a sh*tshow of its own, regardless of CVs 

[Port_Authority]

1 hour ago, tocqueville8 said:

Can someone explain to me the appeal of the Petro for CBs?

 

Sure. More often than not, it doesn't take any damage in a situation where another cruiser would've been devstruck. It is an RNG hell if we're talking short to mid range broadsides. If you risk transforming into offensive position by ambushing Petro with, say DM, you risk that same Petro not actually eating citadels at 5 km broadside, retreating back into island cover, denying that position for you after actually being outplayed. Which is horrible. That same broadsiding Petro will consistently knock huge AP damage back to you if you try to open up too much. Even if you're a BB. 

 

On the other hand, the ship itself isn't fun to play, the gunnery is not fair for the player or for his target. Most of the time the ship is played by holding position although you can kite with it, most of the time long and mid range dispersion sucks.

[Adm_Andre]

Vor 5 Stunden, Bear__Necessities sagte:

The fact I'm just merc'ing for a clan when I have a bit of spare time rather than playing in my own clan speaks volumes. 

 

CV's made CW's stale. Cyclones only added to an already unfun time. Those 2 things were what broke the camel's back in my clan and pretty much made half stop playing. 

from this guy

Am 20.6.2021 um 16:38, Bear__Necessities sagte:

Open maps, especially like Ocean sort the good from the bad. If anything this game needs more open maps. Maybe then players might learn about good positioning.

 

Just another post from another player wanting the game to be easier for them rather than learn how to get better. 

[Bear__Necessities]

8 minutes ago, Adm_Andre said:

from this guy

And? What's CW's and not having an active clan any more got to do with wanting open maps (of which there is only 1)??

 

[Camperdown]

WG: thank you for your feedback! Your feedback is important to us and allows us to improve the game 

[Port_Authority]

24 minutes ago, AxisMarine said:

yep, tier X is a sh*tshow of its own, regardless of CVs 

 

Agreed. There are so many layers of feces, shunned underneath bigger turds, which you will unleash if you just remove things from the top.

 

There is no way in hell that a tweak of the random game concept can be turned into a successful 'competitive' mode. The external tournaments shown that system needs to be put in place where the most desirable ships for random are the most undesirable pick for the tournament. If you pick one OP ship you'll have to deal with multiple 'bad' ships in your roster because the ship ate 'balancing points'. This is just a way to mitigate the damage WG has done with its business choices over the last years. So why not kill the concept completely?

 

CW needs to be redrafted. Either into a something completely new, not sourced from random domination, over new maps with new stuff going on, or into WoWs as usual, but a tightly balanced approach. Ships should be excluded by default, included specifically by branch, in modified versions (with modifiers applied only for this mode) if they need to. Start with original 6 surface branches, with removal of USN radar, and repair party addition to all cruisers in both USN and IJN branches. So you can actually play a cruiser on T6. That should be closest to the triangular balance of power this game is supposedly famous for. Add new branches by testing them on PTS first to find out do they need a modifier. Make good rewards for PTS so the people actually do it.