bloodynicknames Players 557 posts 16,816 battles Report post #1 Posted May 24, 2021 I've been seeing 3-4 every match now but this one really took the piss. and they're all the same basically, smaller version of the thunderer, sit at 19-20km, spam he, occasionally WASD. 1 9 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SHAD] Miscommunication_dept Players 5,512 posts 24,438 battles Report post #2 Posted May 24, 2021 At least they aren't in Conquerors! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #3 Posted May 24, 2021 16 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said: I've been seeing 3-4 every match now but this one really took the piss. and they're all the same basically, smaller version of the thunderer, sit at 19-20km, spam he, occasionally WASD. I see only one Conq.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CHEFT] DFens_666 Players 13,162 posts 11,029 battles Report post #4 Posted May 24, 2021 Guess we have to check next saturday see the numbers for this week on maplesyrup. Week prior to the 15th Week prior to the 22nd So a slight increase maybe? But next saturday will paint a better picture. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloodynicknames Players 557 posts 16,816 battles Report post #5 Posted May 24, 2021 9 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: I see only one Conq.... ill take 7 conquerors every day of the week over 7 hindenburgs, that things is just annoying af Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[I-J-N] Karasu_Browarszky [I-J-N] Players 13,025 posts Report post #6 Posted May 24, 2021 15 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said: ill take 7 conquerors every day of the week over 7 hindenburgs, that things is just annoying af At least it's shifting the queue from BBs to cruisers. If... you wanna look at the bright side... 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #7 Posted May 24, 2021 23 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said: ill take 7 conquerors every day of the week over 7 hindenburgs, that things is just annoying af Really? Hindenburgs are a problem for you? Spoiler It looks more like the more Hindenburgs the enemy team has, the better the chances of your team winning. I recommend free Hindenburgs for everyone on the enemy team 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[I-J-N] Karasu_Browarszky [I-J-N] Players 13,025 posts Report post #8 Posted May 24, 2021 15 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Really? Hindenburgs are a problem for you? Hide contents It looks more like the more Hindenburgs the enemy team has, the better the chances of your team winning. I recommend free Hindenburgs for everyone on the enemy team Though, the problem is with HE spamming, not with the enemy actually winning. If so, there's not really a problem here if the enemy gets punished for HE spamming and for being bloody annoying. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloodynicknames Players 557 posts 16,816 battles Report post #9 Posted May 24, 2021 14 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Really? Hindenburgs are a problem for you? Reveal hidden contents It looks more like the more Hindenburgs the enemy team has, the better the chances of your team winning. I recommend free Hindenburgs for everyone on the enemy team They are annoying af. generally sitting at max range and nigh impossible to hit if the driver even remotely knows what hes doing. Hindenburg imo is the Thunderer of cruisers encouraging passive, campy gameplay that contributes nothing to the actual outcome. the really sad part is that hindenburg used to be multitool that could do "everything" in an okayish sort of way but with the commander rework they just turned it into yet another HE spammer. but apparently thats what WG wants, simple gameplay so they can attract new customers(not even gonna use the word players here) that bring in more $$$ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[COSA] Aitvars Players 4,332 posts 19,097 battles Report post #10 Posted May 24, 2021 With dead eye gone it's natural people Start playing their cruisers again. I myself stopped grinding cruisers for the time, the skill was active. And in my opinion a dedicated BB Player will not become a CA Player so fast. He most likely will chose a different BB or Stick to thunderer. It's still a strong Ship. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #11 Posted May 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: Though, the problem is with HE spamming, not with the enemy actually winning. If so, there's not really a problem here if the enemy gets punished for HE spamming and for being bloody annoying. Then take a look at Venezia. She does even more damage and mostly penetration damage, that can only be healed for 50%. And Venezia tanks around the same amount of damage as Hindeburg and survives more. 3 minutes ago, bloodynicknames said: They are annoying af. generally sitting at max range and nigh impossible to hit if the driver even remotely knows what hes doing. Hindenburg imo is the Thunderer of cruisers encouraging passive, campy gameplay that contributes nothing to the actual outcome. the really sad part is that hindenburg used to be multitool that could do "everything" in an okayish sort of way but with the commander rework they just turned it into yet another HE spammer. but apparently thats what WG wants, simple gameplay so they can attract new customers(not even gonna use the word players here) that bring in more $$$ And still they get sunk more often than many other ships. The problem is not with Hindenburg, but with the captain who does not know how to mitigate damage. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[I-J-N] Karasu_Browarszky [I-J-N] Players 13,025 posts Report post #12 Posted May 24, 2021 1 minute ago, ColonelPete said: The problem is not with Hindenburg, but with the captain who does not know how to mitigate damage. We often hear that, 'damage mitigation', but what exactly does it entail? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #13 Posted May 24, 2021 Just now, Karasu_Hidesuke said: We often hear that, 'damage mitigation', but what exactly does it entail? positioning angling proper fire control proper captain setup positioning 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[I-J-N] Karasu_Browarszky [I-J-N] Players 13,025 posts Report post #14 Posted May 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: positioning angling proper fire control proper captain setup positioning You said positioning twice though. Now, by positioning I would understand two things, 1) avoid being in crossfire, 2) keeping your distance from the enemy ships, and 3) focusing on the enemy ship that presents the most immediate threat. 1) and 2) will directly reduce your incoming damage, the 3) one will allow you to counter it, if not actually reduce it. By angling I think most people mean not being bow on or broadsiding for that matter. The difficulty with this is two-fold, IMO. You can only effectively angle against one enemy ship. By angling against one, you potentially expose too much of your broadside against an other enemy ship, possible further away from you but capable of implementing massive damage to you even at longer ranges. Secondly, you have to keep moving, because if you are too slow you can't do WASD and become way too easy to hit. This makes it hard to maintain the proper angle. Thirdly, angling does nothing to help against HE spamming. Proper 'fire control'... you talking about actual fire control or fire prevention? For that we have the R for repair, and the heal consumable (when applicable). Under captain setup there are some of those damage mitigating skills, but which ones would be critical, because even when going for full defensive captain build you can't pick them all, not to mention if you want to have a 'balanced' captain build. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CHEFT] DFens_666 Players 13,162 posts 11,029 battles Report post #15 Posted May 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: Thirdly, angling does nothing to help against HE spamming. Less hits = less damage. If you are broadside, more shells will hit, especially the weaker parts like the superstructure then you will take more damage than if you would be bow/stern towards him. One could also make the arguement, that on a broadside target, AP should be the ammo of choice. So if you are broadside to a Hindy spamming AP at you for 8-10k, its damage migitation if you are angled and he has to use HE for 3-4k. 10 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: Proper 'fire control'... you talking about actual fire control or fire prevention? Not DCPing one fire while being farmed by HE would be a start. If you DCP one fire, what is there to gain from it? Nothing really. If you keep getting farmed, you might get 2-4 fires after that, and then it will really hurt. You should only DCP one fire if there is no risk of getting more damage from DoT within the cooldown of the DCP. F.e. you kill the last ship on your flank and he gets a fire while dying. Ofc you should DCP that, when there is no more enemies to shoot HE at you in the next minute. In general, people are getting too angry while being spammed from 20km from a Hindi (or many other Cruisers). If you shoot him a couple of times, and he dodges, then stop bothering with it. Go dark, reposition, let him look for another target and you should focus on targets closer to you. Or help get the objective and then disengage. If you get HE farmed for a moment while closing the distance to an island, thats usually fine, because a Cruiser will not get that many fires in that time (RNG/luck can make exceptions ofc, but in general it doesnt happen). If you play on someone elses terms, expect to lose the engagement. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #16 Posted May 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: You said positioning twice though. Now, by positioning I would understand two things, 1) avoid being in crossfire, 2) keeping your distance from the enemy ships, and 3) focusing on the enemy ship that presents the most immediate threat. 1) and 2) will directly reduce your incoming damage, the 3) one will allow you to counter it, if not actually reduce it. By angling I think most people mean not being bow on or broadsiding for that matter. The difficulty with this is two-fold, IMO. You can only effectively angle against one enemy ship. By angling against one, you potentially expose too much of your broadside against an other enemy ship, possible further away from you but capable of implementing massive damage to you even at longer ranges. Secondly, you have to keep moving, because if you are too slow you can't do WASD and become way too easy to hit. This makes it hard to maintain the proper angle. Thirdly, angling does nothing to help against HE spamming. Proper 'fire control'... you talking about actual fire control or fire prevention? For that we have the R for repair, and the heal consumable (when applicable). Under captain setup there are some of those damage mitigating skills, but which ones would be critical, because even when going for full defensive captain build you can't pick them all, not to mention if you want to have a 'balanced' captain build. Because it is important... Avoiding crossfire is the key, but reducing the number of ships that can shoot at you is also important. Distance is secondary. You can be 8km to the closest enemy, when the others cannot shoot at you. And you can be 15km to the closest enemy, but 8 enemies can shoot at you, not a good idea. Positioning helps you to angle vs enemies and protect your sides. When you are too close to the enemies to angle vs all of them, but there is an island that can cover your exposed broadside, use that. And yes, as explained multiple times, angling also helps vs HE. (smaller target, better armor profile - remember your turret armor). And managing Damage Control and Heal is proper fire control. And when someone complains about fires and he has not taken the appropriate skills and instead has chosen something different, then fires cannot be so bad. 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[I-J-N] Karasu_Browarszky [I-J-N] Players 13,025 posts Report post #17 Posted May 24, 2021 19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said: Less hits = less damage. If you are broadside, more shells will hit, especially the weaker parts like the superstructure then you will take more damage than if you would be bow/stern towards him. One could also make the arguement, that on a broadside target, AP should be the ammo of choice. So if you are broadside to a Hindy spamming AP at you for 8-10k, its damage migitation if you are angled and he has to use HE for 3-4k. Lol. Almost like if I hate HE spam I should broadside to encourage them to use AP. Almost... I think bow on would help more against HE spam then based on what you are saying. I often wonder about that btw, it is much easier for me to hit ships that are bow (or stern) on than ships that are broadsiding. Not exactly sure why for other players it seems to be the exact opposite... 19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said: Not DCPing one fire while being farmed by HE would be a start. If you DCP one fire, what is there to gain from it? Nothing really. If you keep getting farmed, you might get 2-4 fires after that, and then it will really hurt. You should only DCP one fire if there is no risk of getting more damage from DoT within the cooldown of the DCP. F.e. you kill the last ship on your flank and he gets a fire while dying. Ofc you should DCP that, when there is no more enemies to shoot HE at you in the next minute. Yeah, that is the smart way. At times I get the 'wrong' reaction though and instinctively put down the fire too quickly. 19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said: In general, people are getting too angry while being spammed from 20km from a Hindi (or many other Cruisers). If you shoot him a couple of times, and he dodges, then stop bothering with it. Go dark, reposition, let him look for another target and you should focus on targets closer to you. Or help get the objective and then disengage. If you get HE farmed for a moment while closing the distance to an island, thats usually fine, because a Cruiser will not get that many fires in that time (RNG/luck can make exceptions ofc, but in general it doesnt happen). If you play on someone elses terms, expect to lose the engagement. Going dark does not always work though, because there can be either planes or DD's that keep you permaspotted. Otherwise it is a good idea to always position yourself so that you can disengage. Or try... at least. 18 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Because it is important... Avoiding crossfire is the key, but reducing the number of ships that can shoot at you is also important. Distance is secondary. You can be 8km to the closest enemy, when the others cannot shoot at you. And you can be 15km to the closest enemy, but 8 enemies can shoot at you, not a good idea. Avoid crossfire, check. 18 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Positioning helps you to angle vs enemies and protect your sides. When you are too close to the enemies to angle vs all of them, but there is an island that can cover your exposed broadside, use that. And yes, as explained multiple times, angling also helps vs HE. (smaller target, better armor profile - remember your turret armor). Ee.. uhm... I usually tend to stear clear of islands for a couple of reasons. I get often stuck if I get too close, and I hate surprises, especially when there is a BB behind the rock, though usually there's only a DD, cruiser (or two) and a BB. 18 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: And managing Damage Control and Heal is proper fire control. And when someone complains about fires and he has not taken the appropriate skills and instead has chosen something different, then fires cannot be so bad. One problem, at least for me, is that the benefit you get from those skills does not really be worth the points you have to use. Especially, if those are more effectively used on other skills. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #18 Posted May 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: Ee.. uhm... I usually tend to stear clear of islands for a couple of reasons. I get often stuck if I get too close, and I hate surprises, especially when there is a BB behind the rock, though usually there's only a DD, cruiser (or two) and a BB. One problem, at least for me, is that the benefit you get from those skills does not really be worth the points you have to use. Especially, if those are more effectively used on other skills. When you prefer broadsiding to an enemy, go ahead. When you are afraid of a DD lurking behind the rock, then you should not have moved so far ahead in the first place. It is just an option you can use in that situation. When you think that other skills are more effective, then you are saying that fire is of a secondary concern to you. If it really were the big problem for BB, then players would use everything to counter it. I personally do not use Fire Prevention on any BB right now, because I do not need it. At the moment I rarely use Signals for the reduction of fire duration, because I want to save them up and I do not really need them. That is how much fire bothers me. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Humorpalanta ∞ Players 2,025 posts 13,785 battles Report post #19 Posted May 24, 2021 Wait last week I was told Hindenburg is a crappy weak ship. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[URUC] S_h_i_v_a Players 674 posts Report post #20 Posted May 24, 2021 Thunderer was nerfed, but Republique and Yamato still have cruise missiles. Snipers simply have to switch ship. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CHEFT] DFens_666 Players 13,162 posts 11,029 battles Report post #21 Posted May 24, 2021 21 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: Lol. Almost like if I hate HE spam I should broadside to encourage them to use AP. Too many wont ever use AP tho, and they will just keep farming you with HE... You dont want to get AP farmed either Its funny, when some people show broadside, and you start chunking them with AP, they start to angle pretty fast... 21 minutes ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said: I often wonder about that btw, it is much easier for me to hit ships that are bow (or stern) on than ships that are broadsiding. Not exactly sure why for other players it seems to be the exact opposite... Aiming badly doesnt count in this case. But the dispersion will produce more hits on broadsiding targets than on angled ones. Ontop of that, turrets will eat HE shells and result in 0 damage hits. In some cases, you will also hit the deck/side armor, which can be non-pens depending on HE pen/Armor thickness. If the target is broadside, it will take more hits in the superstructure. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[DEFR] SolanumTuberosumRex Players 799 posts Report post #22 Posted May 24, 2021 4 hours ago, bloodynicknames said: I've been seeing 3-4 every match now but this one really took the piss. and they're all the same basically, smaller version of the thunderer, sit at 19-20km, spam he, occasionally WASD. This post should have been titled "Dead Eye is gone and Thunderer's been nerfed, NOW what are we gonna b*tch and whine about??" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[HPF] Ocsimano18 Players 3,476 posts 13,949 battles Report post #23 Posted May 24, 2021 There is a dockyard mission to cause 100 fires with a cruiser. Co-op is full with Smollies, while Hindies flocked into randoms. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Padds01 Players 855 posts 7,546 battles Report post #24 Posted May 24, 2021 6 hours ago, ColonelPete said: positioning angling proper fire control proper captain setup positioning hiding camping spamming paying running just for lols Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,178 battles Report post #25 Posted May 24, 2021 16 minutes ago, Padds01 said: hiding camping ... paying running just for lols When one has no clue how to play a ship, that is an option, but I have no idea how paying helps with damage... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
