Developer Bulletin for Update 0.10.4

[Catslave]

48 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

 

As usual with dockyard, those missions doesn't give much, but they are mostly to fill the condition to unlock the final reward. You mostly want Shipbuilding phases from Dockyard combat missions and fulfilling these missions will help you reach the final reward this particular section.

 

You left half of my post untouched. Now I can't find a screenshot nor do i have one but what about the italian BB missions that we had just now ? There was no Dockyard involved yet there was missions like 120kills (pretty sure there was an alternate requirements which wasn't that much easier) to gain something like 10 basic flags or similar.

Most of the time the "missions" are along the line of "farm 10mil credits to get a reward of 100k credits" .

 

4 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

 

First, please learn to multiquote.

Second, to answer your question: Yes, everybody from WG Staff plays the game and yes all changes were tested.

 

So what is wrong, that commander skill is boosting ship characteristics? It has been always like that. I personally wouldn't place Swift in Silent to any slow battleship, but to French ones, or Georgia, tempting..

But how this skill can make BBs OP? That they sail faster?

So while it is triggered while not spotted, you actually can't shoot to trigger that. It can mean more passive gameplay, but also it can mean faster change of position. But apart from Dead-eye which gave quite strong addition to potential damage dealt, this one actually is not boosting your potential damage dealth.

 

In future we can also implement new skills or change current ones, so also your suggestions can be placed there...

multi quoting gets hard when you try to quote posts stretched out over multiple pages, tho i do (or try) where i can.

 

 

As to what is wrong ... you read my explanation ? Georgia is already broken since, including speed boost, it moves faster then  most cruiser and even some DD. Considering a BB with vastly improved 2ndary accuracy and 457mm guns (that overmatch up to including 30mm armor)  outrunning ships a 10th of it's weight is neither realistic nor any good in terms of game balance. But ships with already exceptional base stats gain the most from it.

Ships in desperate need (like Daring or Vermont) who not only have abysmal speed for their tier but also compared to their peers are in dire need of such improvement, yet their gain is marginal.

Considering the rather bad concealment of Republique (~14.1km with full build) even on a 40x40 map you basically have to hide in / behind your spawn to ensure you are not detected for the skill to work ...and speed is among the last things the ship needs.

.

 

It can be better displayed using expert marksman. Changing the skill from an absolute value to a % increase meant a buff for Kremlin, who already has better traverse on it's triple 457mm guns then some cruisers have on their double / triple 203mm, while being a downgrade to e.g. Yamato, who can literally fire twice in the time it takes to turn the guns.

Or use torpedo acceleration. the fixed increase was the crutch for ships like USS Black with sea mines while being useless to ships like Halland who already had nearly undodgeable sidewinders as torps. Now with the change, ships with sea mines gain marginal benefits while ships with underwater sidewinders get insane benefits ... resulting in almost 100kt Halland Torpedoes ... honestly those torpedoes would split the ocean like Moses did ...

 

You also missed my points. Dead Eye boosting dmg was never the problem, the problem was it heavily encouraging passive gameplay, sniping from the map border. Regardless of how good (or useless) the replacement skill is, it still has almost the same requirement effectively encouraging exactly the same thing.

 

But if I understand you correctly ,then you are trying to claim that a skill giving +5kts torpedo speed is the same as giving +5% torpedo speed, same for turret traverse (Quote: "It has been always like that") .... in that case there is nothing left to say

 

As for the suggestions .. there have been threadnaughts of suggestions of all kinds ever since  deadeye (or the rework) was announced .... can't see any of the feedback having any effect on the commander rework, nor the current rework rework ... so forgive my lack of faith there... (on a sidenote: still waiting for any of the suggestions concerning the carrier rework being taken into consideration)

[ColonelPete]

37 minutes ago, Catslave said:

As to what is wrong ... you read my explanation ? Georgia is already broken since, including speed boost, it moves faster then  most cruiser and even some DD. Considering a BB with vastly improved 2ndary accuracy and 457mm guns (that overmatch up to including 30mm armor)  outrunning ships a 10th of it's weight is neither realistic nor any good in terms of game balance.

Be glad when such ships take the skill, makes them only weaker in combat.

 

And it is unlikely that many people will take this skill as the skill only helps with positioning, but not with shooting enemies.

[Catslave]

1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

Be glad when such ships take the skill, makes them only weaker in combat.

 

And it is unlikely that many people will take this skill as the skill only helps with positioning, but not with shooting enemies.

"weaker" is rguable. While i agree that the skill is a waste of points, the argument stands that the skill heavily favors ships that don't need it due to already good or above average base values.

While situational, it would allow the BB to repostion faster (it already does ~40kts without swift in silent), outrunning most cruiser and DD to buy time running away or charge from A to D cap to either cap or interrupt capping.

 

Nonetheless, regardless of the actual value, Georgia was merely an example as was Vermont ... the thing that should be discussed and evaluated is that the skill rework heavily favors ships that have the least need for buffs, noticeably increasing the gap between ships with good (or gamebreakingly good) values and those without instead of giving ships with bad base values the option to make the value mediocre to slightly lessen the gap.

[ColonelPete]

4 minutes ago, Catslave said:

"weaker" is rguable. While i agree that the skill is a waste of points, the argument stands that the skill heavily favors ships that don't need it due to already good or above average base values.

While situational, it would allow the BB to repostion faster (it already does ~40kts without swift in silent), outrunning most cruiser and DD to buy time running away or charge from A to D cap to either cap or interrupt capping.

 

Nonetheless, regardless of the actual value, Georgia was merely an example as was Vermont ... the thing that should be discussed and evaluated is that the skill rework heavily favors ships that have the least need for buffs, noticeably increasing the gap between ships with good (or gamebreakingly good) values and those without instead of giving ships with bad base values the option to make the value mediocre to slightly lessen the gap.

The skill is a waste of 4 captain points. That is the only issue I have with the change. Otherwise I see no problems.

 

And yes, skills have a different strength depending in which ships they are used on. That was always the case.

[Cammo1962]

On 4/23/2021 at 10:28 AM, YabbaCoe said:

I personally wouldn't place Swift in Silent to any slow battleship, but to French ones, or Georgia, tempting..

Hi @YabbaCoe you just answered my question on which BBs will benefit from that skill so i was right about you remove a OP skill wit a useless skil cant you not see that something is wrong here ?? 

[qdfl]

Hi,

There is not any mission for dockyard, how should I go further? Only with doubloons? And Beast token what can I buy with this, there is nothing at the armory for buying?!

 

And also wonder why Game center use more memory then normal game (by Steam) there is about 1gb different memory use.

 

[ColonelPete]

12 hours ago, qdfl said:

Hi,

There is not any mission for dockyard, how should I go further? Only with doubloons? And Beast token what can I buy with this, there is nothing at the armory for buying?!

 

And also wonder why Game center use more memory then normal game (by Steam) there is about 1gb different memory use.

 

I suggest to look at the regular server and not at the game test server (screen 4)...

[aagaard130867]

Will update 0.10.4. solve the bug causing problems for lefthanded inverted mousebuttons ?

 

Problem has been reported and recreated.

 

 

[qdfl]

1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

I suggest to look at the regular server and not at the game test server (screen 4)...

Thank you for advise.

 

But I mean for game center, bec you cant buy anythings with Beast token which is available only in game center not for live server, before I completed dockyard in game center too, both has different missions.

 

[Hugh_Ruka]

On 4/22/2021 at 11:20 AM, YabbaCoe said:

" We have disabled the rewards that were previously issued for earning achievements. On the Live Server, they will be replaced by special chains of combat missions for Base XP in victorious battles. "

Which means, that signals won't get dropped immediately, but you will get chains of combat missions instead.

True is, that I don't know exactly, if you can drop more than one chain of missions per day, or you get one for each achievement you earn.

As I mentioned, PT will show us more details about that.

And where's the problem in describing the intended system in a devblog for all of us to evaluate ? Either you (WG) have no clue yet, or the system is even less player friendly than now and you are trying to avoid backlash byt sitting on it.

 

Constructive discussion is something we don't get from WG, so we tend to assume the worst and usually we are correct.

 

So don't expect much excitement from the playerbase about the change.

[Cammo1962]

On 4/23/2021 at 9:33 AM, YabbaCoe said:

Some BBs can benefit from that. But now the most unpopular skill will be gone, so BB commanders can change their setup and it is again very up to them, which skills they will choose and therefore benefit from its characteristics.

Hi again @YabbaCoe so what you are doing is to remove a unpopular skill with at skill that the majority of players wont use great job WG 

[Cammo1962]

On 4/23/2021 at 9:33 AM, YabbaCoe said:

Some BBs can benefit from that. But now the most unpopular skill will be gone, so BB commanders can change their setup and it is again very up to them, which skills they will choose and therefore benefit from its characteristics.

 

[YabbaCoe]

V 23. 4. 2021 v 18:59 Cammo1962 řekl/a:

Hi @YabbaCoe you just answered my question on which BBs will benefit from that skill so i was right about you remove a OP skill wit a useless skil cant you not see that something is wrong here ?? 

Some fast BBs can benefit from that or if a player decide to have it to be able to switch sides easily.

This skill is not useless, it is just different.

 

V 25. 4. 2021 v 3:24 qdfl řekl/a:

Hi,

There is not any mission for dockyard, how should I go further? Only with doubloons? And Beast token what can I buy with this, there is nothing at the armory for buying?!

 

And also wonder why Game center use more memory then normal game (by Steam) there is about 1gb different memory use.

 

Unfortunately those Dockyard missions are not available on PT, as they already started on live server and are ongoing also in 0.10.4.

And nothing will change with those missions.

This PT is also not meant to test dockyard missions, but to test plenty other stuff such as German collection, auctions, changed in achievements etc.

 

Před 16 hodinami aagaard130867 řekl/a:

Will update 0.10.4. solve the bug causing problems for lefthanded inverted mousebuttons ?

 

Problem has been reported and recreated.

 

 

I am not sure, but I will try to ask for that.

[Murqy]

@YabbaCoe

 

Didnt get a reaction earlier so Im trying again.

 

But why not letting us respec for free when you change things? We didnt ask for it and we adapted to what you created for us so far. What do you mean not so much with the changes? All the gunboat DDs now got a new skill that is competitive now. Cruisers dont have to put the skills to counter Deadeye any longer, so concealment and less rudder is going to be important again since now everyone (as you probably intended) will move in closer. This is meta-changing. We glady provide you data with the captain rework but common you got to let us adapt to this...

 

Would it really be so awful to just let the rest of classes get at least 1 day of free reset as a sign of good will?

[YabbaCoe]

Před 14 minutami Murqy řekl/a:

@YabbaCoe

 

Didnt get a reaction earlier so Im trying again.

 

But why not letting us respec for free when you change things? We didnt ask for it and we adapted to what you created for us so far. What do you mean not so much with the changes? All the gunboat DDs now got a new skill that is competitive now. Cruisers dont have to put the skills to counter Deadeye any longer, so concealment and less rudder is going to be important again since now everyone (as you probably intended) will move in closer. This is meta-changing. We glady provide you data with the captain rework but common you got to let us adapt to this...

 

Would it really be so awful to just let the rest of classes get at least 1 day of free reset as a sign of good will?

Because Dead-eye will be removed and therefore all commanders, that use that skill will loose that, therefore are eligible for that free reskill.

Other skills were just changed slightly in parameters, but not removed completely. So for gunboats or any other DDs, there are still same skills offered for them. With removal of dead-eye players probably will move closer, or will still stay away, as they were before the Commander Skills Rework.

It is definitely uncertain, which exact impact of removal of this skill will have to other classes and battles in total. Also removal of this skill doesn't force you to completely change setup of other classes.

[Murqy]

48 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

Because Dead-eye will be removed and therefore all commanders, that use that skill will loose that, therefore are eligible for that free reskill.

Other skills were just changed slightly in parameters, but not removed completely. So for gunboats or any other DDs, there are still same skills offered for them. With removal of dead-eye players probably will move closer, or will still stay away, as they were before the Commander Skills Rework.

It is definitely uncertain, which exact impact of removal of this skill will have to other classes and battles in total. Also removal of this skill doesn't force you to completely change setup of other classes.

But you are changing Fearless Brawler for a reason. If it was good and balanced the players would be using it more already (which I assume they don’t and that’s the reason you improve it). It came with a costly downside earlier which is removed now. So, it’s safe to say that a lot of players would have wanted to have that skill, if it was released in that way to begin with.

 

 

A lot of dedicated players warned you about dead eye and the consequences, and once it was released a lot of cruisers needed to rethink strategies. To invest more in rudder and distances, rather than concealment. Now if the meta is going back to how it was before, wouldn’t it be fair to let the cruisers reset back to their earlier build? Why run a build to counter sniping battleships if that’s no longer a thing?

 

 

In these two examples you let the players pay (in time or dubloons) for your mistakes of not testing things out properly. Even the enthusiastic guineapigs (who tried to get onboard and adapt to the new changes and make the best of it) is getting punished here. Great way of rewarding the people supporting you here.

 

 

[jimtank3]

I SEE A LOT OF SHIPS HAVE VERY HIGH SPEED AND YOU STOP ME TO BE AN EASY TARGET FOR THE OPPONENTS. YOU DON'T LET ME PLAY EQUAL RULES. TIS IS A SCAM. 

[Cammo1962]

23 hours ago, YabbaCoe said:

Some fast BBs can benefit from that or if a player decide to have it to be able to switch sides easily.

This skill is not useless, it is just different.

There is only the French BBs with engine boost and Georgia there will benefit from that skill and they are already fast so why waste 4 skill point on that skill ??

[YabbaCoe]

Před 20 hodinami Murqy řekl/a:

But you are changing Fearless Brawler for a reason. If it was good and balanced the players would be using it more already (which I assume they don’t and that’s the reason you improve it). It came with a costly downside earlier which is removed now. So, it’s safe to say that a lot of players would have wanted to have that skill, if it was released in that way to begin with.

 

 

 

 

A lot of dedicated players warned you about dead eye and the consequences, and once it was released a lot of cruisers needed to rethink strategies. To invest more in rudder and distances, rather than concealment. Now if the meta is going back to how it was before, wouldn’t it be fair to let the cruisers reset back to their earlier build? Why run a build to counter sniping battleships if that’s no longer a thing?

 

 

 

 

In these two examples you let the players pay (in time or dubloons) for your mistakes of not testing things out properly. Even the enthusiastic guineapigs (who tried to get onboard and adapt to the new changes and make the best of it) is getting punished here. Great way of rewarding the people supporting you here.

 

 

The question here is, how the removal of dead-eye will change the gameplay in every battle. Do you think that those players, that prefer to play in distance will play in close quarters now?

What was exactly the "build to counter sniping battleships" that will be now ineffective?

 

Před 16 minutami Cammo1962 řekl/a:

There is only the French BBs with engine boost and Georgia there will benefit from that skill and they are already fast so why waste 4 skill point on that skill ??

Well, for fast BBs, like French ones or Georgia it is one of the good one skills. Also other BBs can benefit from that, if they want to. So why it is 4 point skill? Well, it directly replaced Dead-eye, which was 4 point skill.

Also for DDs it is for 4 points, so there was no real reason to think about to place that skill somewhere else.

[Cammo1962]

7 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

The question here is, how the removal of dead-eye will change the gameplay in every battle. Do you think that those players, that prefer to play in distance will play in close quarters now?

What was exactly the "build to counter sniping battleships" that will be now ineffective?

 

Well, for fast BBs, like French ones or Georgia it is one of the good one skills. Also other BBs can benefit from that, if they want to. So why it is 4 point skill? Well, it directly replaced Dead-eye, which was 4 point skill.

Also for DDs it is for 4 points, so there was no real reason to think about to place that skill somewhere else.

Well @YabbaCoe i have had my calculater up and running and the only BBs that benefits from that skill are those i have mentioned the others even with a speed flag wont go undeteced if a DD stay outside spotting range and just keeps spotting the BB

[YabbaCoe]

Před 15 minutami Cammo1962 řekl/a:

Well @YabbaCoe i have had my calculater up and running and the only BBs that benefits from that skill are those i have mentioned the others even with a speed flag wont go undeteced if a DD stay outside spotting range and just keeps spotting the BB

Well, it also depends on the situation. DD can smoke up and therefore won't spot, or if you have IT BB, you can smoke up and disappear. This always comes with "conditional" skills...

[Cammo1962]

16 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

Well, it also depends on the situation. DD can smoke up and therefore won't spot, or if you have IT BB, you can smoke up and disappear. This always comes with "conditional" skills...

Well again it is not a skill i would waste 4 points there are others i can use those points at instead of and i guarantee you that there is not a lot that would use that skill @YabbaCoe

[WWDragon]

20 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

This always comes with "conditional" skills...

And this is why they are often terrible, especially when the condition is outside the player control.

 

Anyone with some experience playing a DD knows how to maintain spotting without being detected, smoke is only used when its going loud and the target is being spotted or the DD is spotted and to escape.

 

As for Italian BBs ... one line, one single line and the cost is 4 whole points, if it was 2 points then maybe but its well overpriced for what it does and it reeks of placeholder.

[YabbaCoe]

Před 11 minutami Cammo1962 řekl/a:

Well again it is not a skill i would waste 4 points there are others i can use those points at instead of and i guarantee you that there is not a lot that would use that skill @YabbaCoe

Sure, well it is your decision where to spend your skill points. Like with other skills, it gives you an option.

 

Před 4 minutami WWDragon řekl/a:

And this is why they are often terrible, especially when the condition is outside the player control.

 

Anyone with some experience playing a DD knows how to maintain spotting without being detected, smoke is only used when its going loud and the target is being spotted or the DD is spotted and to escape.

 

As for Italian BBs ... one line, one single line and the cost is 4 whole points, if it was 2 points then maybe but its well overpriced for what it does and it reeks of placeholder.

Well, as mentioned, IT BBs and also French BBs + some fast ones like Georgia can benefit from that. Honestly, we have there some skills, that are not very popular by any class...

[Cammo1962]

9 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

Well, as mentioned, IT BBs and also French BBs + some fast ones like Georgia can benefit from that. Honestly, we have there some skills, that are not very popular by any class...

There is only one BB that is fast beside the Italian BBs with smoke and the French BBs and Georgia and BTW i have been calculating about the IT BBs. With a speed flag it runs 31 knots and wit the skill it will run 34,2 knots it is not worth it @YabbaCoe so cant you and WG not see that there is someting totally wrong here ?? And i have been playing daily since december 2016 so i would call myself a experienced player and a main BB and DD player.