Developer Bulletin for Update 0.10.4

[Carandraug]

1 hour ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

 

What we actually do get is a little ambiguous though. How many "More Signal" and "Gift" containers we could earn in a month won't be clearer until we see them on the PTS, if that is even representative at all. Also, "More Signals" container is unknown to us, we have a "More Signals and Camoflagues" container we can claim daily at the moment, but that can contain camos. Will these containers have 4x Standard Signal 3 times? The gift containers pressumably contain 5x Special Signal.

 

Still, this method of distribution provides more types of signal and makes them available to people playing more modes. All that remains is to learn how many we can earn...

Well if you think you will earn more flags than before, then you are up for a rude awakening :P Everything we have seen from WG in the past let's say 2 years is heavily hinting towards lesser and worse rewards. All the talk from our WG PR spin doctor is reminding me more and more about the now famous "more diversity in commander builds" explanation. Sounds great on paper and then in reality (suprise, surprise) turned out to be a blatant lie.

 

I just don't understand the reasoning behind this change, because we already have daily containers for XP. So now we will have another container for base XP, but i seriously doubt it will be on daily basis. Achievement rewards are currently working fairly well and there is zero reason to change it. Unless... You want to screw the economy, because nobody is buying your signals in the Armory. I would bet diamonds against nutshells we will be worse off in the new system.

[JiksTBS]

Perhaps I'm being overly simple here but ... what exactly was the problem with rewarding acheivements this change is supposed to solve?

 

The cynic in me suspects this is some kind of disguised nerf to the rewards. Also, I hope these missions to get some reward later will not be time limited as while I might have time to play the match I got HC, FB in or whatever I might not have time to farm XK BXP in Y days ...

 

 

[Benser33]

1 hour ago, Carandraug said:

I just don't understand the reasoning behind this change, because we already have daily containers for XP.

We don't know how often the mission chains will be but it would make sense they are not daily for this exact reason.

It also means you can continue to get signals without having to choose the signal container if you would prefer the other.

This also provides a method to get the 2 new signals, the Victor Lima signal which wasnt obtained by achievements before anyway, special signals on a regular basis.

 

Also, WG change stuff like the new daily shipments thing that guaranteed 1 SC a month plus more, and realistically rewards about 3x more than the old daily shipments did.

Plus the daily trails that also rewards all types of resources, totalling more than the older daily missions used to give plus additional resources like steel, research bureau points, special signals and port slots, even though the daily missions are the same.

Plus all of the rewards you get along the reward track while doing the increasingly frequent dockyards.

Plus the new division star thing that they added that gave more containers and signals and cxp, even though that only appeared in 10.2 and didn't come back with 10.3, so maybe that got dropped.

Plus twitch drops, twitch codes, and the never ending events like the currently simultaneous ITA BB, GER DD and April special event that also give bundles of camos and resources and other stuff like the free permacamo for the new t8 german DD if you complete all the missions.

The new ranked format may not give as many rewards as the old format and I don't really like how the higher leagues require such exponentially increased time investment but you can still earn the majority of the rewards now without having to reach rank 1 and those that do reach gold can earn 800 dubloons and 1000 steel a week once they hit gold and you don't even need to reach gold 1 for that.

 

So I'm not sure I fully agree with the assessment that they are providing lesser and worse rewards. It's hard to compare to two years ago because the game economy wasn't the same back then, both the amount of resources awarded and the costs of things generally has increased.

[Carandraug]

2 minutes ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

We don't know how often the mission chains will be but it would make sense they are not daily for this exact reason.

It also means you can continue to get signals without having to choose the signal container if you would prefer the other.

This also provides a method to get the 2 new signals, the Victor Lima signal which wasnt obtained by achievements before anyway, special signals on a regular basis.

 

Also, WG change stuff like the new daily shipments thing that guaranteed 1 SC a month plus more, and realistically rewards about 3x more than the old daily shipments did.

Plus the daily trails that also rewards all types of resources, totalling more than the older daily missions used to give plus additional resources like steel, research bureau points, special signals and port slots, even though the daily missions are the same.

Plus all of the rewards you get along the reward track while doing the increasingly frequent dockyards.

Plus the new division star thing that they added that gave more containers and signals and cxp, even though that only appeared in 10.2 and didn't come back with 10.3, so maybe that got dropped.

Plus twitch drops, twitch codes, and the never ending events like the currently simultaneous ITA BB, GER DD and April special event that also give bundles of camos and resources and other stuff like the free permacamo for the new t8 german DD if you complete all the missions.

The new ranked format may not give as many rewards as the old format and I don't really like how the higher leagues require such exponentially increased time investment but you can still earn the majority of the rewards now without having to reach rank 1 and those that do reach gold 1 as often as possible are earning 800 dubloons and 1000 steel a week once they hit gold and you don't even need to reach gold 1 for that.

 

So I'm not sure I fully agree with the assessment that they are providing lesser and worse rewards. It's hard to compare to two years ago because the game economy wasn't the same back then, both the amount of resources awarded and the costs of things generally has increased.

I would love to have your optimism. I can see the exact opposite trend, just remember the old Early Access events with RN heavy cruisers or even Soviet cruisers to the current ones. Thats a pretty sad comparison. Dockyard prices are rising, while the rewards for ranks are again significantly worse, the ZF-6 milestones are trash even compared to Hizen ones. Commander rework brought insane cost increase for retrainings all across the board with crazy grind to get the previous levels. Ranked rewards are also worse in the new system and the actual grind is backbreaking.

 

But the worst in this Achievement reward change for me is the rng factor again, because even IF you end up theoretically with more flags on average, you have absolutely no control over their types. Need specific ones ? Tough luck, go buy some. WG with latest patches always takes one step forward and two steps back in terms of milking us dry, so i'm really not optimistic at all. I wish you are right, but i seriously doubt that.

[powerverde]

4 hours ago, YabbaCoe said:

I am here speaking just for myself, as this is suprising for me, personally. I wouldn't put those flags on lower tiers, but still I wouldn't play any battle to "get detonated" asap.

You have 46 detonations in your 3k+ battles. True is, that I have just half of those.

Honestly I would like to see anyone with hundreds of detonations, let's say having 10% average of battles when detonated...

111, not a record but...

[Cheeky_chappie]

7 hours ago, Wulf_Ace said:

Auction, let me guess, who has more money wins. Beacouse hey almost all resources you can buy with money, except steel, but that reasurce is rare so people wont even put it into auction. More money, more doublons more wins into auction. Just another cash grabbing thing from wargaming, what a surprise.

This event under pretty much the same rules exists in another WG title, World of Tanks, as the "Black market" and it is pretty successful and popular with the playerbase of the game, it is designed to syphon away resources from the game and make whales fork out for extremely rare items, that is true.
But the reason this event is so popular in WoT is that you can actually buy premiums, even good tier 8 ones, for credits, if they sell some premium ships in the WoWs version it will be a nice event, on my WoT account i've been able to pick at least one tier 8 premium tank every time this event was held(once a year for 3 years now), and i'm not a megawhale sitting on mountains of cash.

But i guess we should wait and see what the WoWs version will be, could be only cosmetics and no ships at all. 

[powerverde]

why cant we delete our own posts?...

[Rubytwo]

7 minutes ago, powerverde said:

111, not a record but...

dear mate,

 

could you please remove 10 of your 11 posts are they are hurting my eyes......

 

one post with your achievements is sufficient, don't you think so?

 

ty

[powerverde]

6 minutes ago, powerverde said:

why cant we delete our own posts?...

 

2 minutes ago, Rubytwo said:

dear mate,

 

could you please remove 10 of your 11 posts are they are hurting my eyes......

 

one post with your achievements is sufficient, don't you think so?

 

ty

see above...

[Rubytwo]

5 minutes ago, Cheeky_chappie said:

This event under pretty much the same rules exists in another WG title, World of Tanks, as the "Black market" and it is pretty successful and popular with the playerbase of the game, it is designed to syphon away resources from the game and make whales fork out for extremely rare items, that is true.
But the reason this event is so popular in WoT is that you can actually buy premiums, even good tier 8 ones, for credits, if they sell some premium ships in the WoWs version it will be a nice event, on my WoT account i've been able to pick at least one tier 8 premium tank every time this event was held(once a year for 3 years now), and i'm not a megawhale sitting on mountains of cash.

But i guess we should wait and see what the WoWs version will be, could be only cosmetics and no ships at all. 

you know the vid of Dezgamez where he presented the amounts cannibalized by WeeGee through this type of event?

 

if you missed it, follow the link below

 

 

1 minute ago, powerverde said:

 

see above...

you can't remove your post, but you can delete the contents of the post

[powerverde]

4 minutes ago, Rubytwo said:

you can't remove your post, but you can delete the contents of the post

and that takes time...

[Benser33]

1 minute ago, Carandraug said:

old Early Access events with RN heavy cruisers or even Soviet cruisers to the current ones

I'm not going to sit and try to compare 1:1 the entire early access events. But I do not miss the older days of early access events before that, like the RN DD one, where your early access to a ship relied entirely on you luckily getting a mission out of a container.

 

The RN CA early access event also featured access to tier 5-8 cruisers randomly, via bundles you could buy with even currency but no guarantee you would get any of them, although you could pay 1,000 to 13,000 dubloons to buy bundles from the armory that would contain them, so you could guarantee the ships up to tier 8 for 13k dubloons max.

The german DD early access by comparison guarantees the tier 7 and 8 ships for free if you simply do the missions and get the daily bundles from the armory.

 

Quote

Dockyard prices are rising

Dockyard prices are not rising but the amount of rewards included are down for ZF-6 compared to past dockyards like Hizen and Odin. The full price of ZF-6 is awful, but frankly the minimum price of 5k dubloons for a t9 DD is pretty good, that's like the price of a t6. Unfortunately...

 

Quote

The ZF-6 milestones are trash even compared to Hizen ones

This is true. The 8 categories of missions compared to Hizens 7 is more work and the final ZF-6 mission category is mostly the same as Hizen but higher requirements.

 

Quote

Commander rework brought insane cost increase for retrainings all across the board with crazy grind to get the previous levels.

This is a pretty gross generalisation of the rework. I have 160 commanders over 350 ships and have not experienced any insane costs. I respecialised them all for free and have hardly needed to retrain any as a result of the rework itself. Even if I did, you now get the old credit retraining for free, so how is that an increase? I have also not noticed any loss in performance from 19pt commanders except gunboat DDs and the lost secondary cruiser spec. The cxp needed for 21 points is absurd, but my 19pt commanders dont feel any less competitive than they did before generally and I find myself using a wider variety of builds than I did before because less skills are so mandatory and after getting the most important skills there are more points left over and more skills to choose from.

 

38 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Ranked rewards are also worse in the new system and the actual grind is backbreaking.

The new ranked rewards aren't worse, they are actually pretty good, 9000 steel over 8 weeks is comparable to the 5500 you could earn from the 5-6 week ranked previously, but the old ranked you could complete in much less than that. Now you have to play each week. People hitting gold 1 each week are earning 1200 steel, 12.5k coal, 32k fxp, 95k cxp, 21 special signals, 20 good quality camos and 800 dubs every week and you can do that 6 weeks in a row.

But yes, that grind is a lot, it's frustrating that they split the rewards out over the time period so that it actually takes like 4x longer. If I had that sort of time it would be worth doing though.

 

1 hour ago, Carandraug said:

But the worst in this Achievement reward change for me is the rng factor again, because even IF you end up theoretically with more flags on average, you have absolutely no control over their types.

Did you go out and earn specific achievements once per day to grind signals? I don't know anyone that does that. I don't really see the current achievement awards as a consistent or reliable way to earn many signals except perhaps the secondary signals. But until we see actual numbers theres no way to know for sure. Realistically they should give more than you would expect on average befored due to the unspecified types, but there is no way to know for now. Guess we find out tomorrow.

[Carandraug]

2 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

I'm not going to sit and try to compare 1:1 the entire early access events. But I do not miss the older days of early access events before that, like the RN DD one, where your early access to a ship relied entirely on you luckily getting a mission out of a container.

 

The RN CA early access event also featured access to tier 5-8 cruisers randomly, via bundles you could buy with even currency but no guarantee you would get any of them, although you could pay 1,000 to 13,000 dubloons to buy bundles from the armory that would contain them, so you could guarantee the ships up to tier 8 for 13k dubloons max.

The german DD early access by comparison guarantees the tier 7 and 8 ships for free if you simply do the missions and get the daily bundles from the armory.

You are wrong with the current event, only T7 is "free" with the guaranteed tokens during the german joke DD event. But the regressive rewards in events are undeniable, not just in the actual event chains and everything. Look for example at the italian containers from the previous event. The drops from these containers were absolutely disgraceful and historically the worst from ANY previous ones. Not that long ago we had event containers (like Kriegsmarine ones), when even the non-premium version could drops premium ships. Extremely miniscule chance, but still. Now with italians, not even the PREMIUM containers have that. The price/performance ratio is abysmal.

 

2 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Dockyard prices are not rising but the amount of rewards included are down for ZF-6 compared to past dockyards like Hizen and Odin. The full price of ZF-6 is awful, but frankly the minimum price of 5k dubloons for a t9 DD is pretty good, that's like the price of a t6. Unfortunately...

Again not completely true, the prices of individual phases was lower (1750 dubs for Odin/Anchorage, 1950 dubs for Hizen). And if we accept the WG's reasoning that last two were T9 premiums, then we have to also take in account BBs are more expensive than DDs in their same logic and quick glance at the shop. So even with their artificial value estimation the ZF-6 is more expensive than Hizen.

 

2 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

This is a pretty gross generalisation of the rework. I have 160 commanders over 350 ships and have not experienced any insane costs. I respecialised them all for free and have hardly needed to retrain any as a result of the rework itself. Even if I did, you now get the old credit retraining for free, so how is that an increase? I have also not noticed any loss in performance from 19pt commanders except gunboat DDs and the lost secondary cruiser spec. The cxp needed for 21 points is absurd, but my 19pt commanders dont feel any less competitive than they did before generally and I find myself using a wider variety of builds than I did before because less skills are so mandatory and after getting the most important skills there are more points left over and more skills to choose from.

Completely disagree. The costs of retraining your commanders for tech tree ships went insanely up, because of the artificial boost to 21 points. Also now you HAVE to spend elite commander exp (375k for 21pt retrain is absolutely mental) or fork out 500 dubs (which is the sole goal of the whole rework). Before that you spent 200k credits to get at least half way and then grind the rest on some premium ship. Good luck doing that now. BB and DD builds are comparatively worse with "just" 19 point commanders, you have to get to 21 points to reach the old level of skills. Once again due to artificial inflation and making the mandatory stuff more expensive (eg. AR). And if you feel the builds are more diverse then im very happy for you, but you are one in a million. BB build diversity is dead and after Deadeye is gone there will be ONE build, period. DDs are more or less stuck with 10 mandatory points just as before and the rest is absolutely cookie cutter with changes in 1-2 places. Whole Commander rework is an absolute disaster and cynical cash grab, that's being very generous and mild in judging this dumpster fire.

 

2 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

The new ranked rewards aren't worse, they are actually pretty good, 9000 steel over 8 weeks is comparable to the 5500 you could earn from the 5-6 week ranked previously, but the old ranked you could complete in much less than that. Now you have to play each week. People hitting gold 1 each week are earning 1200 steel, 12.5k coal, 32k fxp, 95k cxp, 21 special signals, 20 good quality camos and 800 dubs every week and you can do that 6 weeks in a row.

But yes, that grind is a lot, it's frustrating that they split the rewards out over the time period so that it actually takes like 4x longer. If I had that sort of time it would be worth doing though..

Just like you are saying, old ranked was grindy, but you could do it once and be done for quite a while. Now if you want to maximize the gain and reach roughly the previous levels you have to put more grind more consistently over and over without reprieve. The Bronze tactic of "9 wins and go home" is more forgiving for the casual players, but if you look at the overall rewards, numbers are down. Is that better ? Maybe, but gold is reserved for masochists, who will get burned out in 2-3 seasons. Nobody can sustain the full gold grind every sprint.

2 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Did you go out and earn specific achievements once per day to grind signals? I don't know anyone that does that. I don't really see the current achievement awards as a consistent or reliable way to earn many signals except perhaps the secondary signals. But until we see actual numbers theres no way to know for sure. Realistically they should give more than you would expect on average befored due to the unspecified types, but there is no way to know for now. Guess we find out tomorrow.

Well yes indeed i did, for example the targetted grind of secondary kill achievement rewards was just so easy. That said before WG pissed on the burning fire of secondary viability. But still you roughly had some estimation, that you will be getting stuff like Dreadnaught, Confederate and High Caliber on consistent basis. In the proposed new system there will be total rng for everything again and im really extremely sceptical about their planned "generosity". Like one poster above mentioned, why change something that works for years without real hiccup ? The game has giant issues to solve and they spend time reworking achievement rewards ? There must a motive behind that and WG's recent run of debacles will tell you it's surely not the jolly idea of rewarding the playerbase or making their life better. It's the very same plan as behind the Commander rework, thin down the reserves of valuable commodities in order to force ppl to spend, spend and spend. I bet buying most flags in Armory is not that popular, because you can quite effectively rotate them with achievement rewards. 

[Benser33]

3 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

You are wrong with the current event, only T7 is "free" with the guaranteed tokens during the german joke DD event.

You are correct, my mistake, I keep forgetting that Z-31 is the tier 7, not the tier 8. Though the tier 8s permacamo is free with part 2 of the event.

 

3 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Again not completely true, the prices of individual phases was lower (1750 dubs for Odin/Anchorage, 1950 dubs for Hizen). And if we accept the WG's reasoning that last two were T9 premiums, then we have to also take in account BBs are more expensive than DDs in their same logic and quick glance at the shop. So even with their artificial value estimation the ZF-6 is more expensive than Hizen.

Despite the phases prices, the number of phases is lower. The total cost of Hizen in dubloons was 38,350, ZF-6 is 38,150. They are basically the same. The minimum price for both, by buying the minimal starter pack was also 5000 for both.

But as I said, even if the cost is the same, what you get for your dubloons is worse with ZF-6 than it was with Hizen, Hizen even came with two more premium ships within that price.

 

7 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Before that you spent 200k credits to get at least half way and then grind the rest on some premium ship. Good luck doing that now.

This option was removed and the exp needed for retraining was halved. If you choose the free option now you are getting the same as when you paid 200k credits before the rework.

 

10 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

BB and DD builds are comparatively worse with "just" 19 point commanders, you have to get to 21 points to reach the old level of skills.

Part of this is because, as part of the rework, overpowered commander skills were nerfed with increased costs. PT and AR now cost an extra 1 point each. Balancing skills was a necessary and welcome part of the rework, unless you expected the rework to leave skills that were far better than their old value untouched, then people would be complaining that skills were not balanced instead of complaining that they are more expensive.

 

14 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

That said before WG pissed on the burning fire of secondary viability.

Secondary specs for cruisers was wrongly removed, yes. Secondaries are 25% less accurate than before (10% for germans), yes, but secondaries now have longer range and cheaper builds with more flexibility in their builds partly thanks to some skills having their AA components removed and being made cheaper, making the AA portion an optional investment. With cheaper skills you can also take more survivability than you could before. Furthermore, secondary spec is now viable at all tiers, not just tiers 7-10. Particularly for German BBs who only lost 10% acccuracy it is hard to argue that they are overall worse off than they were before.

 

Gunboat DDs should have gotten the same treatment, DD gunnery skills should have been split so that some skills boosted guns and some skills boosted AA, not being forced to invest extra points into skills that boost both, especially on the DDs that don't have effective AA either way. Instead of having AA DPS and gun reload on one skill and Flak Dmg and gun range on another they could have had a gun range/reload skill and an AA DPS/flak skill separate and then you wouldn't have to invest 7 whole points for 20% range and 5% reload just because you're also being forced to gain 10% AA DPS and 15% flak.

 

15 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Like one poster above mentioned, why change something that works for years without real hiccup ?

Probably because awarding signals in a more even method of distribution is easier for scalability in the future. The achievement distribution system immediately failed as soon as two new signals were added to the game which you could only obtain by buying them manually or being gifted them by events. Now all signals will be obtainable on a regular basis for those who play on a regular basis and long term it may even prove a better solution than achievement distribution, but that depends entirely on the specifics of what is given.

 

26 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

I bet buying most flags in Armory is not that popular, because you can quite effectively rotate them with achievement rewards.  

Yes, and their cost varies wildly. 240k for 20 ramming flags but 3.8m for 20 fire flags never made sense to me. It also raises the issue that evenly distributing all signals through all methods of distribution will not match with the rate they are consumed. If I get 100 of every signals I'm going to run out of some signals long before I run out of others.

[Carandraug]

29 minutes ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Secondary specs for cruisers was wrongly removed, yes. Secondaries are 25% less accurate than before (10% for germans), yes, but secondaries now have longer range and cheaper builds with more flexibility in their builds partly thanks to some skills having their AA components removed and being made cheaper, making the AA portion an optional investment. With cheaper skills you can also take more survivability than you could before. Furthermore, secondary spec is now viable at all tiers, not just tiers 7-10. Particularly for German BBs who only lost 10% acccuracy it is hard to argue that they are overall worse off than they were before.

Sorry mate, your other reasoning can be contentious and questionable, but still valid. But this is pure fantasy and hilarious nonsense. If you think the difference in German secondary accuracy is really only 10% and that secondary builds are viable, then it's hard to take you seriously. Full secondary builds have trouble hitting a stationary target at 5km nowadays, not to mention a moving one. Secondaries are nice looking fireworks and waste of points, claiming anything else is delusion "level WG developer". 

[Benser33]

5 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Sorry mate, your other reasoning can be contentious and questionable, but still valid. But this is pure fantasy and hilarious nonsense. If you think the difference in German secondary accuracy is really only 10% and that secondary builds are viable, then it's hard to take you seriously.

Do the math yourself then.

[Carandraug]

10 minutes ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Do the math yourself then.

Secondaries lost roughly 40-50% effective damage and you will be hitting roughly close to 10% shells after the rework with full secondary builds. That will of course fluctuate a bit, depending on the range, because the buff to max range is pointless, you won't be hitting anything. 

 

The actual math is very misleading, because dispersion is not equal to actual accuracy. Just like with Deadeye, the vaunted "its just 10%" is not true, because both vertical and horizontal dispersion is affected. Meaning the actual area where shells will land is much much larger with secondary dispersion nerf. There are plenty of thorough tests for secondary performance pre/post rework and the result is absolutely crushing. 

[Benser33]

9 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

Secondaries lost roughly 40-50% effective damage and you will be hitting roughly close to 10% shells after the rework with full secondary builds. That will of course fluctuate a bit, depending on the range, because the buff to max range is pointless, you won't be hitting anything.

But this is purely anecdotal and not supported by any data. When alternatively I can see from speculatively checking one or two friends of mine who I know prefer secondary BBs that over the last 2 weeks they've had on average 25% secondary dispersion on tirpitz, pommern and gk. And further a single example from another thread here 2 days ago of pommern with 23% accuracy. And this is despite the uncontrollable secondaries that fire wildly at anything that gets in range since the rework, negatively affecting hit rate statistics. Of course, skilled players in secondary BBs know how to engage with secondaries properly to improve the hit rate of the secondaries, hit rate can be as much of an indication of skill and experience than merely gun performance but it can help indicate an average.

Spoiler

 

25 minutes ago, Carandraug said:

The actual math is very misleading, because dispersion is not equal to actual accuracy. Just like with Deadeye, the vaunted "its just 10%" is not true, because both vertical and horizontal dispersion is affected. Meaning the actual area where shells will land is much much larger with secondary dispersion nerf. There are plenty of thorough tests for secondary performance pre/post rework and the result is absolutely crushing. 

Of course, but the value is still relative. German BBs lost the least accuracy of all BBs as a result of the commander rework, and BBs below t7 only benefitted from the rework, Bayern secondary spec seems to work nicely. I would be interested to see these tests and their crushing results though. I feel like I would have heard from the various unicum wehraboos I know if the ships theyve played thousands of games in were suddenly no longer viable secondary ships but the only tears I've seen have been for the lost IFHE of GZ, but I'll check with them tomorrow and run some tests of my own.

[Carandraug]

25 minutes ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Of course, skilled players in secondary BBs know how to engage with secondaries properly to improve the hit rate of the secondaries, hit rate can be as much of an indication of skill and experience than merely gun performance but it can help indicate an average.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Yeah that's common knowledge. If you play on second Monday of an odd month in a leap year wearing red socks and straw hat, then you secondary hit rate will improve. 

 

Or there is a new recommended way to double your secondary hit rate. Drink a bottle of vodka and almost magically your double vision will start reporting double the results on the screen. Recommends 11 out of 10 WG developers. 

[Hugh_Ruka]

6 hours ago, Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu said:

Part of this is because, as part of the rework, overpowered commander skills were nerfed with increased costs. PT and AR now cost an extra 1 point each. Balancing skills was a necessary and welcome part of the rework, unless you expected the rework to leave skills that were far better than their old value untouched, then people would be complaining that skills were not balanced instead of complaining that they are more expensive.

Yeah. Like BFT was nerfed to 5% and stayed at the same point cost. Demo Expert was nerfed into being useless. Expert Marksman was nerfed into being useless on ships needing it the most as it change to a % value instead of flat value. And that's just DDs. RN light cruisers have only a few skills worth taking now. DDs HAVE to get AR now to get any kind of DPM. Previously you had the choice of going AR + something else or BFT ... now that's not usable anymore.

 

Smokescreen expert was removed while it was usefull for some types of smokes etc.

[Hugh_Ruka]

5 hours ago, Carandraug said:

Secondaries lost roughly 40-50% effective damage and you will be hitting roughly close to 10% shells after the rework with full secondary builds. That will of course fluctuate a bit, depending on the range, because the buff to max range is pointless, you won't be hitting anything. 

 

The actual math is very misleading, because dispersion is not equal to actual accuracy. Just like with Deadeye, the vaunted "its just 10%" is not true, because both vertical and horizontal dispersion is affected. Meaning the actual area where shells will land is much much larger with secondary dispersion nerf. There are plenty of thorough tests for secondary performance pre/post rework and the result is absolutely crushing. 

On top of that, secondaries work with 1.0 sigma so their shells are evenly distributed across the entire dispersion ellipse. Just compare ships with 1.6 sigma to 1.8 sigma on main guns and the difference is HUGE.

[deathsadow]

The only thing i seen in this patch is finally the removal of that game killer Dead Eye .  Maybe the game will be worth playing again with ship classes other than CV and BB. 

 

As for the auction patches and flags probably only pulll resources form "collectors" but prem ships ... those would easily pull 20.000.000 credit+ for a medicore to bad T8 premium ...like in WOT even the crappier T8 tanks went for a price of a fully equiped T10.

[YabbaCoe]

Před 15 hodinami Carandraug řekl/a:

Well for starters it's yet AGAIN another move towards the "gacha" casino rng system. With rewards for achievements you knew exactly what you are getting for exact conditions met. Now you will get a container... 

 

Also even though we don't know the exact info about the mission chains, it's fairly obvious you will get t LESS rewards on average. Why do I think so? Every recent change is towards more predatory monetization, commander rework, worse dockyard rewards, less early access rewards and everything can go on. 

 

And why it's a cash grab? Less rewards of often very important flags means harder push towards buying them. Add the rng element to the system and you will get less and even totally random things, instead targeted and "farmable" achievements like Secondary kills, Dreadnaughts and such. 

So, lets try to calculate. Now you 10 signals for those rewards listed by @Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu below. But only once per day. So mostly you got some Zulu, India Bravo Terrathree, India Delta, Mike Yankee Soxisix, but not much of other flags.

Now for every achievement you can get a container, where you get 2x 4 of any of those signals, also including new ones + coal or some camos. Also there is a chance to get those special signals flags from Gift containers, which you basically can't earn by playing until now (only by some missions, or PT rewards etc.)

But what is more important, you can get those for every achievement you get. So you won't stack up the same signal, but you will get all others, you might need.

 

Před 14 hodinami Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu řekl/a:

Since the new mission chain only requires bxp it possible you could actually earn more signals over time on average by regularly completing missions than by trying to get the once-per-day signal rewards of each achievement.

 

Currently only 17 signals can be earned via achievements, I believe you get 10 signals from each achievement.;

 

Combat Signals

 

Arsonist Reward: India X-Ray

AA Defense Expert Reward: November Echo Setteseven

Close Quarters Expert Reward: Mike Yankee Soxisix

Detonation Reward: Juliet Charlie

Devastating Strike None

Die Hard Reward: Hotel Yankee

Double Strike Reward: Sierra Mike

Dreadnought Reward: India Delta

Fireproof Reward: India Yankee

High Caliber Reward: November Foxtrot

Unsinkable Reward: Juliet Yankee Bissotwo

Witherer Reward: Victor Lima

Economy Signals;

First Blood Reward: Zulu

It's Just a Flesh Wound! Reward: India Bravo Terrathree

Kraken Unleashed Reward: Equal Speed Charlie London

Confederate Reward: Zulu Hotel

Solo Warrior Reward: Papa Papa

 

That is all 5 of the basic economy signal and every combat signal except for Victor Lima (Flood chance signal) and the two new signals, X-ray Papa Unaone and Sierra Bravo, but none of the special signals.

 

You could earn each of these achievements once per day every day for a month if you were some sort of superhuman who intentionally went out of their way to do so, but you still wouldn't earn any of the 11 signals mentioned above.

 

What we actually do get is a little ambiguous though. How many "More Signal" and "Gift" containers we could earn in a month won't be clearer until we see them on the PTS, if that is even representative at all. Also, "More Signals" container is unknown to us, we have a "More Signals and Camoflagues" container we can claim daily at the moment, but that can contain camos. Will these containers have 4x Standard Signal 3 times? The gift containers pressumably contain 5x Special Signal.

 

Still, this method of distribution provides more types of signal and makes them available to people playing more modes. All that remains is to learn how many we can earn...

Btw it is the same container... More Signals means the same one as you can see on container ship as More Signals and Camouflages"

 

Před 13 hodinami S_h_i_v_a řekl/a:

Just to be sure: NO premium / Special ships?

Nothing was confirmed or refused with this.

So maybe in future...

 

Před 11 hodinami powerverde řekl/a:

111, not a record but...

Well done, I guess. But still you have 111 detonations over more than 21k battles. Which doesn't kinda give a proof of intentional low tier playing to get detonation signals in purpose.

 

Před 11 hodinami powerverde řekl/a:

why cant we delete our own posts?...

Everything that is posted can't be deleted, even moderators can't delete that.

But atleast I've hidden your posts, which you obviously posted by some lag or something like that.

[ColonelPete]

7 minutes ago, YabbaCoe said:

So, lets try to calculate. Now you 10 signals for those rewards listed by @Astolfo_Is_My_Waifu below. But only once per day. So mostly you got some Zulu, India Bravo Terrathree, India Delta, Mike Yankee Soxisix, but not much of other flags.

Now for every achievement you can get a container, where you get 2x 4 of any of those signals, also including new ones + coal or some camos. Also there is a chance to get those special signals flags from Gift containers, which you basically can't earn by playing until now (only by some missions, or PT rewards etc.)

But what is more important, you can get those for every achievement you get. So you won't stack up the same signal, but you will get all others, you might need.

It sounds like it is more difficult to get signals with the new system.

Until we know how exactly this will work, we can only speculate based on what information you give us and it does sound worse than the current system.

[YabbaCoe]

Před 9 minutami ColonelPete řekl/a:

It sounds like it is more difficult to get signals with the new system.

Until we know how exactly this will work, we can only speculate based on what information you give us and it does sound worse than the current system.

Technically you are correct. Now you have to play to earn those rewards, as achivements won't drop you signals directly anymore, but will drop you combat mission.

But indeed we will see after PT will be live. Also PT actually give us the option to adjust that for live server.