Nerfing Thunderer distance has great side effect (Nerf)

[Puffin_]

Main battery firing range reduced from 24.3 to 23 km.

Reducing firing range automatically 

Increases the dispersion of the battleship's main battery shells

 

[EnacheV]

once WG realize you can't nerf special ships because nobody will trust you anymore and your pockets willbe empty

 

there will be no nerf to thunderer, watch and see

 

dead eye removal is enough

[Yedwy]

2 minutes ago, EnacheV said:

dead eye removal is enough

Thats not true, I had Thunderer for quite some time and I dont think I ever actually played her with deadeye but I never thought she was inacurate...

[FatherTorque]

So, a quick CAD drawing shows that right now Thunderer dispersion at 23km is 239m, if dispersion stays the says the same when max range decreases then it will become 252m. Kinda like 5% dispersion nerf.

[ColonelPete]

Who says the max dispersion stays the same?

[thiextar]

24 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Who says the max dispersion stays the same?

even if it chagnes with the range, it does result in a tiny dispersion nerf because of how the math works out, there was a detailed reddit post on it a awhile back.

 

Not noticably, but by a little bit

[EnacheV]

i will bookmark this thread

 

and watch real patch notes when it comes out

 

i can bet there will be no mention of Thunderer

[ColonelPete]

3 minutes ago, thiextar said:

even if it chagnes with the range, it does result in a tiny dispersion nerf because of how the math works out, there was a detailed reddit post on it a awhile back.

 

Not noticably, but by a little bit

No.

Dispersion per distance stays the same. She will have the same dispersion at 23km as before.

[EnacheV]

and as a side note i dont have thunderer,  and will never have it, never played 1 game in this ship

 

however nerfing ships that cost anyhting else than silver without offering a full refund is unacceptable, even if its a 0.001% nerf, not acceptable

 

so either WG settles for "mob balances" while going broke or they decide to come to their senses and announce nerfing premiums was a "communication error" and will never happen

[thiextar]

15 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

No.

Dispersion per distance stays the same. She will have the same dispersion at 23km as before.

Theres a quirk with the way that wargaming did the dispersion formula. basically spotter plane is a dispersion buff at any given distance. i can try to dig up the reddit post later if you want

 

any change to the range changes the dispersion at a given range, without changing the formula

[Fat_Maniac]

6 minutes ago, EnacheV said:

and as a side note i dont have thunderer,  and will never have it, never played 1 game in this ship

 

however nerfing ships that cost anyhting else than silver without offering a full refund is unacceptable, even if its a 0.001% nerf, not acceptable

 

so either WG settles for "mob balances" while going broke or they decide to come to their senses and announce nerfing premiums was a "communication error" and will never happen

Sorry no. It's in the Terms and Conditions we all have to sign up too. By content they mean everything in WoWS, bought or free. We have all agreed that at any time, WG can change anything they please ....

 

6.4.6 we may change, replace, remove access to or update the Content at any time at our sole discretion;

 

 

[ColonelPete]

2 minutes ago, thiextar said:

Theres a quirk with the way that wargaming did the dispersion formula. basically spotter plane is a dispersion buff at any given distance. i can try to dig up the reddit post later if you want

The formula for calculating the dispersion is not changed.

Just the domain of the function is changed. Inside that domain, you get the same results as before.

[MrWastee]

woat nerf?!

[thiextar]

17 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

The formula for calculating the dispersion is not changed.

Just the domain of the function is changed. Inside that domain, you get the same results as before.

one would think thats how it works, but the way the formulas are implemented, its not that straight forwards.

 

this formula is the interesting bit from this reddit post: "radiusOnDelim + (radiusOnMax - radiusOnDelim) * (X - delimDist) / (maxDist - delimDist)"

 

tl;dr: a ships dispersion at any given range is based on two things: its dispersion formula, and weirdly, its current max range

 

 

[ColonelPete]

2 minutes ago, thiextar said:

tl;dr: a ships dispersion at any given range is based on two things: its dispersion formula, and weirdly, its current max range

As you can see in their example, that is not the case:

[thiextar]

9 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

As you can see in their example, that is not the case:

You are misinterpreting his example. Anways if you cant grasp the maths(its quite complicated) just look at his test results gathered by practical tests.

 

Max range affects dispersion. Specifically vertical dispersion

[HMS_Kilinowski]

Even if the dispersion would be disproportionally higher than it would be in terms of a simple intercept theorem, it is still smaller in absolute terms.

 

Also don't forget the nerf is beneficial to the Thunderer as a whole. It forces Thunderer players to play closer to the caps. That itself is a good thing that will help win games that would be lost otherwise. I can remember so many battles that were lost, because there was no pressure on the caps, that another BB could provide.

For me it's a nerf cause I know where to sit in my Thunderer and if I shoot at max range I gotta have a good reason. But for most Thunderers I saw this nerf is a buf that will help them do better in this ship.

[EnacheV]

2 hours ago, Fat_Maniac said:

Sorry no. It's in the Terms and Conditions we all have to sign up too. By content they mean everything in WoWS, bought or free. We have all agreed that at any time, WG can change anything they please ....

 

6.4.6 we may change, replace, remove access to or update the Content at any time at our sole discretion;

 

 

 

theoretically you are right

 

but practically changing the product after you took the money is business suicide. if WG wants to go that way i dont care, theres plenty of games to play and spend on, already enjoying that.

 

[COPlUM]

21 minutes ago, EnacheV said:

changing the product after you took the money is business suicide.

Show receipt and/or credit card bill for thunderer, there was no money involved.

 

On topic

-It is getting the 1.3km range nerf
-It does not change dispersion

-It is going to remain the most busted BB in the game

[ColonelPete]

47 minutes ago, EnacheV said:

 

theoretically you are right

 

but practically changing the product after you took the money is business suicide. if WG wants to go that way i dont care, theres plenty of games to play and spend on, already enjoying that.

 

I wonder how software companies do this legally for over 30 years then...

[EnacheV]

Just now, ColonelPete said:

I wonder how software companies do this legally for over 30 years then...

 

i wonder how would you act if Microoft decides to replace your Windows 10 , after purchase, with a Windows XP

[EnacheV]

23 minutes ago, NikolayKuznetsov said:

Show receipt and/or credit card bill for thunderer, there was no money involved.

 

On topic

-It is getting the 1.3km range nerf
-It does not change dispersion

-It is going to remain the most busted BB in the game

 

tell that to 1000's of people who bought various things for coal to specifically purchase a coal ship

[thiextar]

20 minutes ago, NikolayKuznetsov said:

On topic

-It is getting the 1.3km range nerf
-It does not change dispersion

-It is going to remain the most busted BB in the game

- yes

- it does objectively change the vertical dispersion by a tiny amount

- yes it will indeed

 

My stance on this whole thing? The nerf will barely touch thunderers strength, nor is it illegal since we all agreed to it when buying the ship. BUT it will destroy players trust in premium ships, and will probably lead to less ships being sold, it certainly does for me.

[DFens_666]

2 minutes ago, EnacheV said:

 

tell that to 1000's of people who bought various things for coal to specifically purchase a coal ship

 

- WG always* said they reserve the right to nerf special ships

- Its their own free will to buy something which includes coal to whale a coalship.

 

*atleast since before Thunderer was available.

[ColonelPete]

Just now, EnacheV said:

 

i wonder how would you act if Microoft decides to replace your Windows 10 , after purchase, with a Windows XP

No, they just decided that they do not support my OS, that I paid for, anymore. Which means that using that OS after a certain time is harmful to my computer.

 

They also remove features on a regular basis that are not supported anymore.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/deployment/planning/windows-10-removed-features