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Pukovnik7

Mode suggestion: Convoy

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Watching Greyhound (again), and it occured to me - if subs are going to make an appearance, what about the convoy escort mode? Basically, one would have a convoy (comprised of AI merchantmen) which would have to be defended against submarine attacks. Both destroyers and submarines would be human-controlled (Random) or with one side being AI-controlled-only (COOP).

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1 hour ago, Pukovnik7 said:

Watching Greyhound (again), and it occured to me - if subs are going to make an appearance, what about the convoy escort mode? Basically, one would have a convoy (comprised of AI merchantmen) which would have to be defended against submarine attacks. Both destroyers and submarines would be human-controlled (Random) or with one side being AI-controlled-only (COOP).

 

Thanks. But no Thanks.

I want my Subs in proper Randoms.

Not in some Extra Mode.

 

Otherwise lets just end the Facade and lets remove Randoms Completely. Only making Seperate Modes.

BBs and CVs in one Mode.

Cruisers and DDs in the other. No more Unrealistic rubbish like DDs Sinking Heavy Cruisers with Artillery Fire. No more Unrealistic bullcrab like a Light Cruiser Sitting in Smoke and killing Battleships by Spamming its Superstructure with 150mm Shells....

 

 

Submarines will come. And they will come to Randoms.

Anything else would be meaningless.

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WG did propose a convoy escort mode they appear to have abandoned the project and gone quiet on the topic. They are also clearly against developing any more PvE content outside of the special events like big hunt. A pity though I think it could be fun to play either as the convoy escort or as one of the subs hunting it. 

 

As for subs well well we have seen the plan is to just shove them into randoms and see what happens, although at least they testing how it will work but the focus has always been subs will be dumped into randoms. 

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7 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 

Thanks. But no Thanks.

I want my Subs in proper Randoms.

Not in some Extra Mode.

 

Otherwise lets just end the Facade and lets remove Randoms Completely. Only making Seperate Modes.

BBs and CVs in one Mode.

Cruisers and DDs in the other. No more Unrealistic rubbish like DDs Sinking Heavy Cruisers with Artillery Fire. No more Unrealistic bullcrab like a Light Cruiser Sitting in Smoke and killing Battleships by Spamming its Superstructure with 150mm Shells....

 

 

Submarines will come. And they will come to Randoms.

Anything else would be meaningless.

And when exactly have I suggested for subs to not be implemented in randoms?

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9 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

Was tested. Is now in dev hell. Unlikely to ever see the light of day.

 

https://forum.worldofwarships.eu/topic/121707-st-games-modes/

Probably because like operations WG can't grab lots of cash from the player whilst playing these modes. A real shame from a gameplay and player enjoyment perspective.

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Sounds like a cool idea. If not as a whole mode what about as an Operation? Trying to defend a convoy against a U-boat wolfpack, or being in the wolfpack trying to take out the convoy, either could be cool.

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5 hours ago, Fat_Maniac said:

Probably because like operations WG can't grab lots of cash from the player whilst playing these modes. A real shame from a gameplay and player enjoyment perspective.

Operations and Co-ops are all I play now, and I bought 30 days of premium to make it worthwhile. So some cash has indeed been grabbed.

 

 

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There's several operations that include both intercepting an enemy convoy and protecting a friendly convoy. Once submarines are added to the game, I'd love to see them appear in operations as well. Perhaps even a new operation. Some more PvE content would be nice. 

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9 minutes ago, Pametrada said:

Operations and Co-ops are all I play now, and I bought 30 days of premium to make it worthwhile. So some cash has indeed been grabbed.

 

 

I bought some premium ships specifically to use in operations, and my next considered purchase (once -25%coupon is available again) is another tier 6 ship to use in operations. 

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28 minutes ago, Purnylla said:

I bought some premium ships specifically to use in operations, and my next considered purchase (once -25%coupon is available again) is another tier 6 ship to use in operations. 

 

Yes, that's pretty much my line of thinking too. If I were to buy another Premium ( one paid for in real world money, not FXP or coal ) it would be at T6 or T7. If it can't do Ops, then I'm not having it.

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1 hour ago, Purnylla said:

There's several operations that include both intercepting an enemy convoy and protecting a friendly convoy. Once submarines are added to the game, I'd love to see them appear in operations as well. Perhaps even a new operation. Some more PvE content would be nice. 

Unfortunately, those of us who enjoy the occasional Operation seem to in the minority - or at least too few for Wargaming to deem it worth their while to polish up and properly maintain the Operations game mode. Which is their decision to make, of course, but I for one would welcome some more Operations into the game.

 

As for submarines, they should only ever appear in PvE scenarios, if at all. They will not bring balance to the game.

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9 minutes ago, Procrastes said:

They will not bring balance to the game.

You could say they are the Anakin Skywalker of vessels, waga waga.......I'll get my coat

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48 minutes ago, Gebbly said:

You could say they are the Anakin Skywalker of vessels, waga waga.......I'll get my coat

Strong, your quote lore is. :Smile_Default:

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15 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 

I want my Subs in proper Randoms.

 

 

I don't want your Subs anywhere near my Randoms.

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3 hours ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said:

 

I don't want your Subs anywhere near my Randoms.

 

Its not Your Randoms *gg*

And if you dont like it you can go play another mode yourself :P

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On topic, an actual mode/Convoy Operations, or certain types of other scenario battles are pretty much the only way I can see how something like submarines could be fitted into this game. Especially with convoys they would form an absolutely essential component of the scenario.

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On 3/23/2021 at 2:47 AM, Sunleader said:

 

Thanks. But no Thanks.

I want my Subs in proper Randoms.

Not in some Extra Mode.

 

Otherwise lets just end the Facade and lets remove Randoms Completely. Only making Seperate Modes.

BBs and CVs in one Mode.

Cruisers and DDs in the other. No more Unrealistic rubbish like DDs Sinking Heavy Cruisers with Artillery Fire. No more Unrealistic bullcrab like a Light Cruiser Sitting in Smoke and killing Battleships by Spamming its Superstructure with 150mm Shells....

 

 

Submarines will come. And they will come to Randoms.

Anything else would be meaningless.

what you fail to see is that subs being broken as hell. i really want them to have in game. i would like to play them and i would like to play against them if only they were balanced ofc. the fundamental problem with subs is them being too stealthy. i mean, ofc they are gonna be stealthy but this game has been shaped around 3 main classes which are DDs Cruisers and BBs. i dont count CVs because you know, they do whatever they want, whenever they want without having any counter whatsoever. 

 

Anyway. Subs being too stealthy. Why is this a problem? There is one advantage that DDs have over other classes. and its concealment. Subs takes that one advantage of DDs, crew it and spit it out. thats why and sadly subs dont fit in any gamemode besides operations right now. and i dont belive they will ever fit as long as they outspot DDs.

 

so, maybe try to stay objective instead of defending a new toy like a kid without thinking at all. 

 

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Hi all,

 

On 3/23/2021 at 12:45 AM, Pukovnik7 said:

Watching Greyhound (again), and it occured to me - if subs are going to make an appearance, what about the convoy escort mode? Basically, one would have a convoy (comprised of AI merchantmen) which would have to be defended against submarine attacks. Both destroyers and submarines would be human-controlled (Random) or with one side being AI-controlled-only (COOP).

 

We had convoy escort in now long-gone :Smile_sad::Smile-angry: Operation "Dynamo" - it was my favorite operation!

 

 

Leo "Apollo11"

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4 hours ago, ghostbuster_ said:

what you fail to see is that subs being broken as hell. i really want them to have in game. i would like to play them and i would like to play against them if only they were balanced ofc. the fundamental problem with subs is them being too stealthy. i mean, ofc they are gonna be stealthy but this game has been shaped around 3 main classes which are DDs Cruisers and BBs. i dont count CVs because you know, they do whatever they want, whenever they want without having any counter whatsoever. 

 

Anyway. Subs being too stealthy. Why is this a problem? There is one advantage that DDs have over other classes. and its concealment. Subs takes that one advantage of DDs, crew it and spit it out. thats why and sadly subs dont fit in any gamemode besides operations right now. and i dont belive they will ever fit as long as they outspot DDs.

 

so, maybe try to stay objective instead of defending a new toy like a kid without thinking at all. 

 

Unless DDs are given ASDOC or similar sensor. So DDs counter subs (unless captain is inattentive enough to get torpedoed from outside ASDOC range), subs counter carriers, carriers counter DDs. And CVs get useful in game as a bait that DDs can dangle for subs to bite.

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Just now, Pukovnik7 said:

Unless DDs are given ASDOC or similar sensor.

Doesnt matter, you gotta get on the top of the sub to kill it. And DD is gonna be spotted while doing this. Spotted DD=dead DD.

Just now, Pukovnik7 said:

 

So DDs counter subs (unless captain is inattentive enough to get torpedoed from outside ASDOC range),

Again, as long as sub has the spotting advantagr, DD is not gonna be able to counter the sub.

Just now, Pukovnik7 said:

subs counter carriers, carriers counter DDs. And CVs get useful in game as a bait that DDs can dangle for subs to bite.

How is sub supposed to counted carrier?  By sailing all the way around to enemy spawn and find the CV? Nice gameplay right there. 

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6 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

Doesnt matter, you gotta get on the top of the sub to kill it. And DD is gonna be spotted while doing this. Spotted DD=dead DD.

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Not really.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedgehog_(weapon)

 

DDs can attack submarines from a distance - Hedgehog has range of 300 meters and fires directly forward, which is more than enough to slip in between torpedo spread.

Getting spotted would be a problem, but that could be solved by limiting submarine's vision and requiring it to use other ships for spotting.

10 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

Again, as long as sub has the spotting advantagr, DD is not gonna be able to counter the sub.

Quote

Subs had speed of 20 knots surfaced and maybe 10 knots submerged. That means that, even against early dreadnoughts, submarines would be more of tripmines than anything else. Of course, issue here is that maps have large amounts of islands, which would channel ships towards subs. But give DDs ASDOC (maybe constant passive + active consumable?), and you could justify submarines no longer having spotting advantage, against destroyers at least.

12 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

How is sub supposed to counted carrier?  By sailing all the way around to enemy spawn and find the CV? Nice gameplay right there. 

Carriers tend to sit in the spawn and spam aircraft. That would actually make them easy to sneak up on (a cruiser or a destroyer can do it easily enough - problem isn't carrier, problem are battleships that often hang around with it). And if destroyers are properly outfitted, doing so would actually be preferable for submarines.

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57 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

Not really.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedgehog_(weapon)

 

DDs can attack submarines from a distance - Hedgehog has range of 300 meters and fires directly forward, which is more than enough to slip in between torpedo spread.

dude you notice that before DDs get into 300m, they get stopped, right?

57 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

Getting spotted would be a problem, but that could be solved by limiting submarine's vision and requiring it to use other ships for spotting.

Subs had speed of 20 knots surfaced and maybe 10 knots submerged. That means that, even against early dreadnoughts, submarines would be more of tripmines than anything else. Of course, issue here is that maps have large amounts of islands, which would channel ships towards subs. But give DDs ASDOC (maybe constant passive + active consumable?), and you could justify submarines no longer having spotting advantage, against destroyers at least.

you didnt test them, did you? 

57 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

Carriers tend to sit in the spawn and spam aircraft. That would actually make them easy to sneak up on (a cruiser or a destroyer can do it easily enough - problem isn't carrier, problem are battleships that often hang around with it). And if destroyers are properly outfitted, doing so would actually be preferable for submarines.

first of all, this is waste of time because you can literally be much more useful by fighting for caps and spotting enemy DDs while spamming homing torps to enemy ships in the same time. :Smile_facepalm:

second of all, what if CV doesnt sit?

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1 hour ago, ghostbuster_ said:

 dude you notice that before DDs get into 300m, they get stopped, right?

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At low tiers where I am playing, getting within 10 meters is hardly a problem, at least if the enemy has no torpedoes... at higher tiers, from what I have noticed, main problem for destroyers are aircraft and, to an extent, secondary guns on cruisers and battleships. Submarine has neither of those.

1 hour ago, ghostbuster_ said:

you didnt test them, did you? 

Quote

No, I am talking about historical submarines here and how they could be implemented in game.

1 hour ago, ghostbuster_ said:

first of all, this is waste of time because you can literally be much more useful by fighting for caps and spotting enemy DDs while spamming homing torps to enemy ships in the same time. :Smile_facepalm:

 second of all, what if CV doesnt sit?

1. Submarines should not be able to spot at least, and I am not certain they would / should be able to cap. Fact that they are invisible should come with disadvantages as well.

2. This is World War II. Homing torpedoes do not exist.

3. Idea is to try and force CV to go with escort, because he wouldn't know if there is a submarine around without a destroyer escorting it.

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