Pasta BBs - how I would have balanced them

[Humorpalanta]

Sup guys!

 

I just saw Trenlass test Lepanto and I have some thoughts. SAP is crazy. Nukes cruisers and DDs but barely touches BBs. Meanwhile with Roma we have seen that they should have good pen on AP and very fast shells.

Crawling smoke with 40ish second. Kinda crazy... And a plane. And 37 sec reload on main battery. Yaaaay....

 

I personally think this is just stupid. They should be AP focused ships. Good pen, fast shells with the godlike armor scheme Roma has. In exchange I would take away SAP and give a weak HE. I would take away this stupid smoke, too.

 

BUT

 

In order to keep them interesting I would give them long range secondaries which would fire SAP with high rate of fire.

 

So:

- SAP from main battery

- Smoke

+ SAP secondaries

+ high range secondaries

+ good AP pen

 

What do you think? Do you think adding them with their current build is okay? Or would you balance them some other way?

[ColonelPete]

Just making them normal BB would have been enough for most. They have decent armor layouts and are quick.

 

Even if one is stuck with the SAP gimmick, the obvious solution should be to reduce SAP Alpha below AP Alpha, until you can give the ships a normal reload.

[Jethro_Grey]

I'd make them more like Roma.

 

Good against BBs, weak against the other classes.

Put SAP in the trash bin, keep the short range guns, make them brawler type BBs.

 

Keep the smoke to either push or disengage.

 

Atm, they are badly designed. 

[CptBarney]

Also give them slightly worse accel than most BB's, with maybe higher top speeds, worse horizontal dispersion compared to vertical, weak HE and fast shell velocity (maybe out of all the BB's they could have the fastest).

[SkollUlfr]

make their sap bounce.

remove their overmatch.

[Chaos_Umbra]

4 hours ago, Jethro_Grey said:

I'd make them more like Roma.

 

Good against BBs, weak against the other classes.

Put SAP in the trash bin, keep the short range guns, make them brawler type BBs.

 

Keep the smoke to either push or disengage.

 

Atm, they are badly designed. 

I would agree mostly with this, except I did think that SAP would be good on the Roma (this was before WG even added SAP to the game). So I was thinking along the lines of a short fuse AP shell with a lower alpha than the AP to make up for one of Roma's main issues, damaging broadside cruisers within 12km as you just get overpens. You would still maintain the HE for angled ships and DDs but you will have an in between shell to deal with cruisers up close but at the expense of a lower citadel alpha capability on them. Unfortunately WG got it into their heads as gospel that SAP MUST always have a higher alpha than AP...

 

The Exhaust smoke should have always been a disengagement tool, so none of this 45s + duration smokes on the cruisers, 10s with more charges would have been more than enough...

[Maris_Piper]

I really could not be less exited about the whole sorry batch, WG's now trade mark up  reload on most of them, the real Italian ships had style and flair, these things are about as stimulating as a visit to the Dentist. I would not trade my Roma for any single one of these at any tier., if I can't get the reload down to at least 30s you are not selling the bl**dy thing to me as simple as that, After the cruisers I had hoped WG would seek redemption frpm the Italian players not put the other boot in 

[Yedwy]

What we dont need is a line od Romas that give you a choice between pathetic HE and constant overpens, SAP was the correct way to go IMHO and AP in the light of this should be anti BB only ammo choice and that basically makes sense...

 

Oh btw just so we are clear I love my Roma to bits, she is my fav T8 BB which probs means fav BB overall as I dont really like T9/10 ships that much BUT she is a troll ship and she trolls in both directions...

[jupp3]

So another way to remove cruisers and DD from this game?

just what we needed.

 

24 bb's sitting behind islands is so much fun.

[Communist_Loli]

 

51 minutes ago, jupp3 said:

So another way to remove cruisers and DD from this game?

just what we needed.

 

24 bb's sitting behind islands is so much fun.

Last I heard, Italian BB SAP is virtually useless against DD's since they share the same 1/10th damage value along with AP. If anything, shooting AP would be better since SAP has lower alpha. 

[jupp3]

17 minutes ago, Communist_Loli said:

 

Last I heard, Italian BB SAP is virtually useless against DD's since they share the same 1/10th damage value along with AP. If anything, shooting AP would be better since SAP has lower alpha. 

I hope thats true.

[st_dasa]

16 hours ago, Humorpalanta said:

SAP is crazy. Nukes cruisers and DDs but barely touches BBs.

 

Then we watched some really, REALLY different ships from different games, because from what I've seen, SAP is, along with the whole line, utter trash. Especially against DDs.

[Ronchabale]

What I have seen of them so far I´d say they are poorly balanced

[Chaos_Umbra]

8 hours ago, Communist_Loli said:

 

Last I heard, Italian BB SAP is virtually useless against DD's since they share the same 1/10th damage value along with AP. If anything, shooting AP would be better since SAP has lower alpha. 

Only the low tier ships have a higher SAP alpha than AP alpha, and it is only by like 1k damage lower, SAP is still a far more reliable damage dealer against all targets (Except DDs with the low tier ships) as it can't overpen. Only the low tier ships benefit from loading AP as a lot of low tier BBs are covered in thick armour, at high tier this is much less so.

[DinkyDi]

less overpens ? That would be great

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

WG fucked up, as always since 2019 

[CptBarney]

9 hours ago, Communist_Loli said:

 

Last I heard, Italian BB SAP is virtually useless against DD's since they share the same 1/10th damage value along with AP. If anything, shooting AP would be better since SAP has lower alpha. 

Burnt pizzas im afraid.

Atm i rate them 3/10 barnehs.

[Ashardalon_Dragnipur]

On 2/13/2021 at 5:30 PM, Humorpalanta said:

In order to keep them interesting I would give them long range secondaries which would fire SAP with high rate of fire.

why add the pointless lightshow

it might hit a BB every 50 shots

having a smoked secondary BB used to be a fun idea, now its just nothing 

[Dampfboot]

The German Huge DD branch also looks crap, so they have two crap branches in a row planned ....that would be a first even for WG.

[Ronchabale]

On 2/13/2021 at 5:30 PM, Humorpalanta said:

Sup guys!

What do you think? Do you think adding them with their current build is okay? Or would you balance them some other way?

Give them same as Roma wonky guns with SAP and AP

Get rid of the smoke, smoke on a tanky BB is too much , like why should any BB need a smoke, just makes too much utility having a "get out of jail free card" when they have over extended or misplayed

And yes they get a spotter, so do away with the spotter and compensate with a bit more range

[Yedwy]

1 hour ago, Dampfboot said:

The German Huge DD branch also looks crap, so they have two crap branches in a row planned ....that would be a first even for WG.

Need to pave the road for the subs m8 

[RossijskijAxisFlot]

14 ore fa, Dampfboot ha scritto:

The German Huge DD branch also looks crap, so they have two crap branches in a row planned ....that would be a first even for WG.

We might need to do a coup d'état against WG and make WoWs great again.

[ghostbuster_]

On 2/13/2021 at 5:30 PM, Humorpalanta said:

Sup guys!

 

I just saw Trenlass test Lepanto and I have some thoughts. SAP is crazy. Nukes cruisers and DDs but barely touches BBs.

you saw it wrong then. SAP does the same damage to DDs as AP. its 1/10 of the max shell damage. they balanced those ships in that way.

[Humorpalanta]

5 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

you saw it wrong then. SAP does the same damage to DDs as AP. its 1/10 of the max shell damage. they balanced those ships in that way.

I understand. However a guaranteed damage is there and with 12 shells even 1,4k damage just hurts. Comparatively a BB would suffer like 4-5k damage mostly as many shells don't even pen as it is a torp protection hit, a ricochet or non pen. I wrote it as to which classes they are dangerous. And we could see that SAP wasn't that good against BBs as if he was shooting AP.

[ghostbuster_]

2 minutes ago, Humorpalanta said:

I understand. However a guaranteed damage is there and with 12 shells even 1,4k damage just hurts. Comparatively a BB would suffer like 4-5k damage mostly as many shells don't even pen as it is a torp protection hit, a ricochet or non pen. I wrote it as to which classes they are dangerous. And we could see that SAP wasn't that good against BBs as if he was shooting AP.

it hurts indeed but same goes for AP. what you wrote can also be said for BB AP. 1,5k per shell from vermount hurts DDs but if you shoot an angled BBs hull, you are gonna bounce. 

you need to shoot superstructure with SAP which means you gotta aim higher. just like you do in venezia.