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xxHELIOS

Steel advice

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Bonsoir !
Here we are, time to buy first steel ship so i’ll need some tips from you guys !

 

I got enough steel to get one of them: Plymouth, Stalin,Bourgogne and Somers but it is time already to say goodbye to Somers and Bourgogne because i’m not a dd main and i’m not enjoying to play Alsace (while JB is one of my favorite)

 

So what about the good odd Stalingrad, is she worth it ? I already got the Petro and Moskva so getting her may be questionable? (adding the fact of the thread german’s cvs and the incoming skill rework.. )

 

What about Playmouth ? She looks quite fun but i would to know what owners think after some rounds, is she worth it ?

 

Thanks  :cap_like:

 

 

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5 minutes ago, xxHELIOS said:

Bonsoir !
Here we are, time to buy first steel ship so i’ll need some tips from you guys !

 

I got enough steel to get one of them: Plymouth, Stalin,Bourgogne and Somers but it is time already to say goodbye to Somers and Bourgogne because i’m not a dd main and i’m not enjoying to play Alsace (while JB is one of my favorite)

 

So what about the good odd Stalingrad, is she worth it ? I already got the Petro and Moskva so getting her may be questionable? (adding the fact of the thread german’s cvs and the incoming skill rework.. )

 

What about Playmouth ? She looks quite fun but i would to know what owners think after some rounds, is she worth it ?

 

Thanks  :cap_like:

 

 

G'day there mate.

 

Congrats on the prospect of picking up a steel ship, I am looking at one shortly myself.

 

I am definitely no expert so take my comments with a pinch of salt. I was looking at the Stali as my steel goal but am hanging back on the decision due to the impending skill rework which looks like it will impact on her static playstyle and leave her on fire all match.

 

The decision largely leans upon what you plan for the Steel ship. Are you looking at competitive? or the meme value of the ship. I admit I am a fan of the Yamato so Shika interests me albeit probably not useful in a competitive setting.

 

Good luck!

 

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Bourgogne plays more like the JB than Alsace. If you like the JB you should like the Bourgogne. She’s a fun, fast flanker, a tier higher JB with an extra turret. I would recommend strongly reconsidering, Bourg should be at the top of your list.

 

Stalingrad - undeniably strong ship with excellent guns. Never liked the playstyle though. Due to her size, clumsiness and high vulnerability from her sides, it’s very easy to just get locked in a position bow on. In general I find her very boring to play in randoms.

 

Plymouth: she’s very new, came out today! I did get her, only had one battle in her. It was a win that got turned around thanks in  part to me doing some plays and killing 4 enemy ships near the end, turning it around. She feels like a hybrid between a Mino and Belfast: very fragile, AP only (6,5s reload, not as good as Mino), handles much like a RN CL (accelerates and turns fast, takes ages to brake), and she gets single launch torps torps (4 on each side) as well as smoke, hydro, radar and heal all in separate slots. She seems very strong and a lot of fun, but isn’t necessarily easy to play. Keep in mind I only played her once so far.

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43 minutes ago, xxHELIOS said:

What about Playmouth ? She looks quite fun but i would to know what owners think after some rounds, is she worth it ?

Stalingrad is and as the current trend goes, will always be a 'good choice.'

As for Plymouth? I would really skip this ship.  It is not good enough for Tier 10 games, with her range and hull design.  Her gimmick is truly like the Belfast (original), lots of consumables.

Personally, I would keep the Steel if you can't decide yet.  There will always be more ships included into the Steel category.  

 

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I'm not sure the Bourgogne plays like the JB.

You have an extra turret, and you'd want to use it because your accuracy isn't too good. Otherwise...well, you'd just be a JB with a bit more hp but worse matchmaking, which doesn't sound like a good deal for 30k steel. While the JB can be very powerful around islands, using the speed boost to reverse into cover or to spring out and punish some broadsides, I reckon the Bourgogne has more potential as a stealthy, roaming ship, sort of like the Conqueror, but with better firepower and AA.

Basically, between the extra turret, better secondaries (worth speccing for, despite the 32mm plating which melts under HE spam) and better torpedo protection, she's more versatile than the JB.

 

A similar comparison can be made for the Shikishima, which is more viable than the Yammy as a secondary platform and has much better AA, so again she's more versatile, despite the lower DPM.

 

I took the liberty of checking your stats, and you don't seem to have any experience in high-tier British CLs, so I wouldn't recommend the Plymouth.

Though the smoke+hydro+radar combo is enticing, I believe these ships have the highest skill floor in the game, and I wouldn't spend my steel on her before I reached at least the Edinburgh.

As someone who's still grinding the Neptune, all I can say is that any tactical mistake you make will be brutally punished. You'll eat torps in the smoke despite hydro and good angling, or you'll be forced out and Dev Struck by BBs and supercruisers. Or you'll forget to check where the enemy radars are, they'll light you up and someone will blap you. You'll be spotted by planes, you'll slow down to smoke up, and 10 seconds later BOOM, 4 citadels from a Iowa and back to port. Your bow can be overmatched by 230mm guns, which is saying something. Truly unforgiving.

Also, while the Mino has outstanding AA, the Plymouth seems to be rather mediocre in that regard.

Strategically speaking, as with all British CLs, you rely a lot on your team for spotting, which can be frustrating if playing solo and very challenging if you reach the endgame and have to carry.

 

As for the Somers, I considered it for my steel purchase, as the torps are powerful, but the AA is just garbage, worse than on most T6 DDs. I'd much rather play the Halland.

 

As I'm not that interested in competitive, I will forgo the Stalingrad altogether, but I believe she'll still be a force to be reckoned with whatever the rework brings. The hp pool is huge, the guns are accurate and have improved pen angles. That's enough, really.

 

Personally I'd pick either the FDR, which plays differently than any other CV, or the Shikishima or Bourgogne, both of which can be built for secondaries and have huge carry potential. I'm leaning towards the Shiki, as I enjoy the Yammy but the poor gun handling and AA often make me play too passively, which keeps my win-rate rather low.

 

I hope that was helpful.

 

Cheers :Smile_Default:

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8 hours ago, xxHELIOS said:

So what about the good odd Stalingrad, is she worth it

Defo

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8 hours ago, xxHELIOS said:

Somers

Don't. Halland is better and it's free. Better to get the other options.

Not considering Shikishima? 

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Bourgogne is one of the best bb flanker in game with a insane dpm (thx mrb).

So it's solide choice but its a buffed alsace ,so if you dont like alsace ...

 

About the plymouth it's a okay/good ship but i'm not sur smoke+radar are worth 27k steel.

You dont have the super heal like mino, turret angle are really bad and you have less dpm than mino.

Otherwise it's a fun ship (but hard to play)

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7 hours ago, tocqueville8 said:

I'm not sure the Bourgogne plays like the JB.

You have an extra turret, and you'd want to use it because your accuracy isn't too good. Otherwise...well, you'd just be a JB with a bit more hp but worse matchmaking, which doesn't sound like a good deal for 30k steel. While the JB can be very powerful around islands, using the speed boost to reverse into cover or to spring out and punish some broadsides, I reckon the Bourgogne has more potential as a stealthy, roaming ship, sort of like the Conqueror, but with better firepower and AA.

Basically, between the extra turret, better secondaries (worth speccing for, despite the 32mm plating which melts under HE spam) and better torpedo protection, she's more versatile than the JB.

 

Bourgogne and JB have almost identical accuracy, JB has 0,1 Sigma more, but one turret less. Alsace has 0,2 Sigma less than Bourgogne, so there is a bigger difference.

Bourgogne also has a better speedboost than all other french BBs, +15% instead +8%.

 

Also i wouldnt specc for secondaries, you pretty much dont want to be inside secondary range for extended periods of time. And even the bigger secondaries dont pen anything (25mm) so you can only rely on fires. Which i dont think you need, since you have MBRB to get your fires in a shorter time if necessary.

 

9 hours ago, Captain_Newman said:

Bourgogne plays more like the JB than Alsace. If you like the JB you should like the Bourgogne. She’s a fun, fast flanker, a tier higher JB with an extra turret. I would recommend strongly reconsidering, Bourg should be at the top of your list.

 

Stalingrad - undeniably strong ship with excellent guns. Never liked the playstyle though. Due to her size, clumsiness and high vulnerability from her sides, it’s very easy to just get locked in a position bow on. In general I find her very boring to play in randoms. 

 

100% this

Bourgogne is fun in randoms. Stalingrad is not. At worst, entire enemy teams will focus and angle against you, so you will have a bad time. Not to mention, CVs will just rape you.

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2 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

Also i wouldnt specc for secondaries, you pretty much dont want to be inside secondary range for extended periods of time. And even the bigger secondaries dont pen anything (25mm) so you can only rely on fires. Which i dont think you need, since you have MBRB to get your fires in a shorter time if necessary.

Well I'm not saying going for secondaries is the best option, but my point is it's viable and it's fun. It adds replay value to the ship. It wouldn't be an oddity like a secondary Thunderer or Iowa.

I specced my République for secondaries: I know it's situational, and sometimes the 32mm plating just makes me want to tear my hair out, but when it works it's great, and my WR is just fine. I can always go back to Yamato/Montana if I want something more durable.

French BBs in general melt too easily, but one might want to try secondaries for variety, and out of the bunch the Bourgogne is tied for best with the République (different setup: the Bourg has more of her secondaries at the back, but that's not necessarily a bad thing). 25mm, and even 21mm, is enough for superstructures, unlike for Alsace and JB which need IFHE to get the 100mm guns over the 19mm threshold.

In a match where you get to brawl for a while, the Bourgogne, just like the Georgia (21mm pen on all secondaries, least one gets IFHE), can be expected to do maybe 40-50k between secondaries and fires, about evenly distributed.

The lack of survivability will limit your total damage output during a long game, but the peak DPM might be enough to win a tough fight around a cap, deal with multiple enemies at once, and secure a win. High risk, high reward.

 

3 hours ago, Amiral_Fronche said:

So it's solide choice but its a buffed alsace ,so if you dont like alsace ...

If you don't like Alsace you might still like a buffed Alsace, with better speed boost, better accuracy, much better reload, and the option to go for secondaries without having to take IFHE to pen superstructures.

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4 minutes ago, tocqueville8 said:

I specced my République for secondaries: I know it's situational, and sometimes the 32mm plating just makes me want to tear my hair out, but when it works it's great, and my WR is just fine.

 

While they have the same squishy armor, Repu has almost 25% more HP than Bourgogne. Need to consider that aswell, so you melt even faster (not to fires ofc).

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1 minute ago, DFens_666 said:

While they have the same squishy armor, Repu has almost 25% more HP than Bourgogne. Need to consider that aswell, so you melt even faster (not to fires ofc).

And cruiser popper guns as well... :cap_horn:

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RN cruisers are very unforgiving to inexperienced players, Minotaur was my first tier x and......(you know the rest)

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Just now, xxHELIOS said:

Thanks for all advices guys, chose the Baguette :cap_like:

Good choice, but don't sit at max range! :)

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Il y a 3 minutes, tsounts a dit :

Good choice, but don't sit at max range! :)

Not my playstyle :cap_rambo:

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29 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

While they have the same squishy armor, Repu has almost 25% more HP than Bourgogne. Need to consider that aswell, so you melt even faster (not to fires ofc).

Good point indeed.

 

Then again, the speed boost is also better, and I soon found the République more sluggish than her reputation as a fast flanker had me believe.

Also, the Bourg can go nose-in without sacrificing too much of her firepower, while the Rép is always tempted to show broadside. In my experience, that's often a bigger problem than the plating.

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45 minutes ago, xxHELIOS said:

Thanks for all advices guys, chose the Baguette :cap_like:

Let us know how you get on.

Baguette didnt appeal to me either, only 380mm guns, alasce hull etc.  I thought she would be mediocre and not worth the steel.

Clan leader and deputy talked me into buying it, said its a better ship than the stats would lead you to believe etc.

 

Got her and didnt look back.  I think Baguette is a great boat having played her and have no regrets in buying her; though looking at her stats I can understand people being reluctant.  

Stalingrad is a solid choice, as other have said it is boring to play.  

Baguette however is loads of fun :cap_like:

 

 

 

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Vor 13 Stunden, xxHELIOS sagte:

So what about the good odd Stalingrad, is she worth it ?

Stalingrad is ridiculously OP with excellent, accurate guns. But as a supercruiser, she does get the extended fire duration of BBs, and because everyone knows she is so OP, and because she is a fairly big, unstealthy target that is easy to hit, she gets focused with HE a lot in order to burn her down and take her out. And since she has radar, you will feel compelled to push into HE-Spam range early. Also, she does not take Hydro, making her vulnerable to torpedoes despite the 25% damage reduction.

All these features compound each other. So to enjoy Stalin, you need a BB captain with Fire Prevention, and you need to know how to play around all these issues with superior positioning and tactics.

Otherwise you will be disappointed.

(And of course carriers will drop you left, right and center despite the fairly high continuous AA damage, although you are bound to get a few percent fewer carrier battles than cruisers of those nations that also have aircraft carriers, because of the soft nation mirroring rule in matchmaking.)

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7 minutes ago, FixCVs_Nautical_Metaphor said:

Stalingrad is ridiculously OP with excellent, accurate guns.

 

I don't even think she's OP at all, especially not in randoms. Guns are excellent, yes, but the ship has significant drawbacks which tend to result in extremely boring, static gameplay. Plus it's CV food these days. I do agree with the rest of your statement, I just question it's OP-ness I guess. It's a strong ship, just not something I'd recommend to anyone as their first steel ship. Just get a Petro and enjoy the game's first soviet cruiser-submarine (may as well be one with the ridiculously low amount of ship that actually sticks out of the water, making it difficult to punish from the side).

 

For the first steel ship, out of the ones mentioned here, I'd really recommend the Bourgogne because the ship is actually fun.

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4 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Bourgogne and JB have almost identical accuracy, JB has 0,1 Sigma more, but one turret less. Alsace has 0,2 Sigma less than Bourgogne, so there is a bigger difference.

Bourgogne also has a better speedboost than all other french BBs, +15% instead +8%.

 

Also i wouldnt specc for secondaries, you pretty much dont want to be inside secondary range for extended periods of time. And even the bigger secondaries dont pen anything (25mm) so you can only rely on fires. Which i dont think you need, since you have MBRB to get your fires in a shorter time if necessary.

 

 

100% this

Bourgogne is fun in randoms. Stalingrad is not. At worst, entire enemy teams will focus and angle against you, so you will have a bad time. Not to mention, CVs will just rape you.

 

Seeing the Mandred in action is the reason why, after dreaming for the Stalingrad as my first Steel ship, I bought the Bourgogne.

 

Bourgogne is a great ship, to me it feels like a supercruiser in that you will use HE as well as AP. I've devstruck a few DDs in this thing.

Bourgogne's armour is pretty poor for any kind of brawling as HE will melt you fast.

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13 ore fa, xxHELIOS ha scritto:

Bonsoir !
Here we are, time to buy first steel ship so i’ll need some tips from you guys !

 

I got enough steel to get one of them: Plymouth, Stalin,Bourgogne and Somers but it is time already to say goodbye to Somers and Bourgogne because i’m not a dd main and i’m not enjoying to play Alsace (while JB is one of my favorite)

 

So what about the good odd Stalingrad, is she worth it ? I already got the Petro and Moskva so getting her may be questionable? (adding the fact of the thread german’s cvs and the incoming skill rework.. )

 

What about Playmouth ? She looks quite fun but i would to know what owners think after some rounds, is she worth it ?

 

Thanks  :cap_like:

 

 

 

Plymouth: i got for free the Belfast 43. Smoke does not work well in "Age of Radar" and armor - range are bad. Absollutely NOT a T X ship.

Stalingrad: considered one of the top T X ships for Clan battles. If you don't play Clan battles, don't take it if you already have other T X russian cruisers.

Bourgogne: i just got the JB B, so that would be my first choice.

Somers: I'm bad in DDs, so get a free T X DD could be an idea instead of skilling one.

F D Roosewelt: I hate it because i play against it. But i have seen how many damage it does.

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14 minutes ago, Captain_Newman said:

I don't even think she's OP at all

 

My 2nd worst TX ship by average damage... good it still beats Gearing :cap_haloween: All others are BBs and Cruisers.

You can still get wins with it, by just tanking half the enemy team, but thats super boring. Or take rangemod and sit back where  your BBs are which is... equally boring.

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16 minutes ago, S_h_i_v_a said:

Plymouth: i got for free the Belfast 43. Smoke does not work well in "Age of Radar" and armor - range are bad. Absollutely NOT a T X ship.


Plymouth absolutely is a t10 ship, however, it's a terrible choice for someone relatively new looking to get their first t10 steel ship. She's a swiss army knife of tools, but actually using them correctly without getting one shotted off the map takes a lot of skill and effort. In experienced hands she will excel at contesting caps and killing enemy DD's and generally controlling a flank -  it's a rewarding ship, but not easy to play. Simply do not get this as your first steel ship. Once a player has some other steel t10's, he's grinded the RN CL line and does at least ok in it, then the Plymouth becomes worth a look.

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