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CapApollo

Does Moskva worth coal

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[IVAN]
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Hello everyone, I was kinda a newbie when Moskva became a premium so I don’t have it. I’m grinding for Stalingrad but it will take some months considering I’ve got 1k steel rn. Does Moskva worth that coal? I’ve seen some videos of it on YouTube but it’s auto bounce angles aren’t as good as Stalingrad and her HE alpha damage seems kinda low. I can also grind for some special coal captains instead of Moskva as well. (Ive already got Thunderer and Georgia)

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[LAFIE]
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She's still the same ole Moskva. Only you can really answer whether or not she is worth it for you, but for me the answer is "Yes, emphatically"

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As a DD main she is one of the few Ships I treat very carefully, however with a switched on team she can draw attention like a Light draws the Moth.

 

If you can understand her strengths, if you can play her to her maximum, she will likely make you an excellent Cruiser and in the games I have played where we are targeting an enemy Moskva she isn't an easy ship to sink either.

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[WGP2W]
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Moskva is a good ship, but difficult to play.

You cannot compare her with a Stalingrad, since they are too different imo.

 

Worth the coal? Yes.

 

Petropavlovsk is somewhat the same, but easier to play. You could also look into getting this ship and use the coal for captains :)

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[LAFIE]
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19 minutes ago, LemonadeWarriorITA said:

Petropavlovsk is somewhat the same, but easier to play. You could also look into getting this ship and use the coal for captains :)

Should be noted however that Moskva makes for a perfect Petropavlovsk trainer. The skills that work for one should work just as well for the other.

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[ADRIA]
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1 minute ago, lafeel said:

Should be noted however that Moskva makes for a perfect Petropavlovsk trainer. The skills that work for one should work just as well for the other.

Nope, Moskva and Petro play very differently.

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[LAFIE]
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Just now, Gebe_ said:

Nope, Moskva and Petro play very differently.

I said skills, as in the CAPTAIN SKILLS, not anything about the skills involved in playing them.

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[CZSL]
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12 minutes ago, Gebe_ said:

Nope, Moskva and Petro play very differently.

I played only a few games in Moskva... what is the different?

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23 minutes ago, lafeel said:

Should be noted however that Moskva makes for a perfect Petropavlovsk trainer. The skills that work for one should work just as well for the other.

Moskva, Stalin, Kremlin and Petro have surprisingly good captain synergy in general:cap_hmm:

 

6 minutes ago, Admirality said:

I played only a few games in Moskva... what is the different?

Moskva sheds concealment completely and her citadel sticks out like sore thumb, making any glimpses at broadside very noticeable.

 

AP pen is worse so she can't reliably threaten broadside BBs outside what can be considered "short range", HE shells and reload are better, thus she is bit more suitable for bow on standoffs

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[THESO]
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7 minutes ago, Admirality said:

I played only a few games in Moskva... what is the different?

It has worse concealment, much worse broadside armor, longer lasting radar, more accurate guns with better HE, extremely fast shell velocity, doesn't have 360 ° turrets. Basically everything is different.

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[RONIN]
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Forgot to say cross your fingers each time you click « battle » there wont be any Richtoffen, if that’s the case.. :Smile_trollface:83D5986C-7951-49AE-B5AB-4968CC040F22.gif.c921772fd507c4a22a2851de6f729a68.gif

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[MIAO]
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1 minuto fa, xxHELIOS ha scritto:

Forgot to say cross your fingers each time you click « battle » there wont be any Richtoffen, if that’s the case.. :Smile_trollface:83D5986C-7951-49AE-B5AB-4968CC040F22.gif.c921772fd507c4a22a2851de6f729a68.gif

cvs are worse than sniper jackals

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It has a similar bow in style like other Russian heavy cruisers, because she is very easy to get citadelled from the side. For the same reason, she has very weak protection against AP rockets from the side (Manfred and Roosie). You have to angle against them, which is difficult if you already angle against BBs, Petros and the likes. Also, you have to sneak to the cap and stay there to be able to radar, making you a primary target for HE spammers and loads of torps. This somewhat static and exposed position is usually boring and can be borderline frustrating. The good thing is that your HE DPM is good, you can kill DDs with some help, and set a fire here and there. I played her a lot recently, and like her a bit more than in the beginning, but my general impression is that she's somewhat boring and powercrept.

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[-IAN-]
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I really like the Moskva and I think it's a very strong Cruiser, but the new Petropavlovsk T10 Cruiser (the Moskva's replacement) does performs the same role but has better AP performance, is harder to citadel etc and is also free, so although I have both, I now find myself wanting to play the Petro far more than the Moskva.

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Also a question for you guys already having the Moskva. Do you use the legendary mod on her? Because if it's required for good performance, then it's an additional Research Bureau grind to consider for the OP.

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[UA-NF]
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No, Moskva isn't worth the coal. Not good for competitive play, be it ranked or clan battles. She isn't unique is her role, which is nose in tanking plus 12km radar, there are Stalingrad and Petropavlovsk as well. Biggest threat to Moskva are CVs, especially Richthofen, and Moskva doesn't have AA of Petropavlovsk. And there are many other good ships for coal. I'd rather take Kuznetsov for Petropavlovsk then Moskva.

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[_MIA_]
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Every russian ship its worth its coal ^^

 

Nah seriously: When you are that limited on coal and have that many other options... Id go for something else. The russian coal captain is awesome but it depends if you have enough russian premium ships to make the best out of it. Cycling around is really the best, when you have Kremlin/Lenin/Kronshtadt/Stalingrad and yes, even Moskva. But captain first, then the Moskva, my 0,05$

 

 

 

 

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[KAKE]
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Only played mine twice so far and.... I find it a bit boring? Maybe it'll click with me eventually, but I'm kind of glad I didn't spend anything except some Type 59 camos and signals to get her.

 

Of the coal ships I have that are still available I'd pick Yoshino as my favourite, but maybe that's just me being weird.

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2 hours ago, Panocek said:

Moskva, Stalin, Kremlin and Petro have surprisingly good captain synergy in general:cap_hmm:

Alternatively, you can also slap a Nevsky captain on the ship with DE instead of BoS and you aren't exactly worse off either.

 

Overall, on the main question, Moskva as a ship is still good, when played right. Would I pay the coal they ask for? Likely not, but that is because I prefer other playstyles than Russian CA/BC. Got Moskva when it was a tech tree ship though, so no regrets. If you dig the Russian cruisers, the Moskva basically is some weird cross between the Nevsky, Petro and Stalingrad, taking strengths and weaknesses from them. Compared to Stalingrad, Moskva shares the armour profile, but with less belt armour (155 mm instead of 180, neither is great these days), same high citadel, same deck and bow (though Moskva has more 50 mm coverage on the bow), Moskva being slightly smaller with a bit less hp. Still very healthy at 65k hp though. Moskva also shares the absolute trash concealment. It does not share the guns though and burns for 30s like a cruiser. Moskva has far less AP utility, being more in line with something like Nevsky as a cruiser that can use AP to smack cruiser broadsides even at range if they are properly broadside, but in return it gets an HE shell that is actually quite potent and accuracy that is worth a damn (compared to Petro). This also means that compared to Petro, Moskva is not just tankier when angled (because of more hp), but also a far bigger HE threat and a bigger radar threat, as yes, you can see Moskva coming, but its radar isn't a 15s situation update, it's a proper duration radar that the Moskva itself can use to punish you if you stray in with its excellent guns and which allies can use. Unlike Nevsky, the HE, while having a bit less dpm, does have better pen, so you aren't entirely reliant on fires on BBs if you don't have IFHE.

 

One has to give credit to WG, despite now having created 5 Soviet T10 cruisers, each of them is its own experience.

10 minutes ago, Perekotypole said:

No, Moskva isn't worth the coal. Not good for competitive play, be it ranked or clan battles.

And other coal ships are? Coal captains don't work in CB either. For randoms, Moskva is no worse pick than Stalingrad, imo.

18 minutes ago, Perekotypole said:

She isn't unique is her role, which is nose in tanking plus 12km radar, there are Stalingrad and Petropavlovsk as well.

Neither Stalingrad nor Petro are anywhere near the radar threat of a Moskva. Only Nevsky compares and Nevsky is way less tanky. The only thing the Petro really provides is less window for a DD to turn before it runs into radar range, but the duration and Petros pathetic HE (if they don't just shoot AP that can bounce off a DDs hull) and accuracy combo make it just poor as a DD hunter, while the Moskva when it gets the DD can nail it. What Petro and Stalin provide is far more ability to punish broadsides, but Moskva can actually go and do HE slugfests and not look absolutely silly. Stalingrad outperforms Petro even when it comes to goddamn HE performance and as much as people like to praise the Russian AP, as soon as you run into things that don't just broadside you for easy cits, the HE actually matters.

24 minutes ago, Perekotypole said:

Biggest threat to Moskva are CVs, especially Richthofen, and Moskva doesn't have AA of Petropavlovsk.

Petro AA is nothing special except the AA range being 6.6 km on long range, meaning you throw flak earlier, which Moskva does too however (as do Stalingrad and Nevsky) and they all have pretty crap air detection thanks to that too. For self-defense, the mid range on Russian cruisers at T10 is almost universally mediocre and short range often nonexisting, meaning that when a CV tries to strike a Petro, Nevsky or Moskva, unless they fly into a flak cloud, you are actually an easier target than most cruisers, also because turning is not a Russian strength. Zao and Yoshino have better combined dps than most Russians, a Cleveland at T8 has better self-defense capability before it hits the free defAA button.

 

If you want reasons to get Petro over Moskva, there are a good few (way more forgiving, less visible, easier to play), but AA is certainly not a point. Only thing Petro provides against MvR that Moskva doesn't is way less side to rocket, but then, why play Stalingrad either? Or most cruisers at T10. And no, Petro isn't even the best cruiser to survive the MvR either. That distinction would likely go either to Goliath (can take some beating and heal it back, also might get away with getting rocketted while turning without still eating cits) or Venezia (Petro levels of freeboard, almost Petro levels of midships citadel protection, lolsmoke and lolturning). Both obviously also sport better self-protection AA dps, because even pasta cruiser at that level has some actual dps numbers.

40 minutes ago, Perekotypole said:

And there are many other good ships for coal. I'd rather take Kuznetsov for Petropavlovsk then Moskva.

There are other ships, but when you already got Thunderer and Georgia, frankly, the other options aren't exactly better than Moskva. At most they are more enjoyable for some players. I know personally I enjoy Yoshino a lot more. But I also know that many people would absolutely rather play a Petro or Stalingrad than play Yoshino or Goliath or such ships I enjoy. And in terms of pure performance, Salem, Yoshino, Marceau and Pommern aren't exactly the ships I'd consider superior to Moskva. Similarly, Kuznetsov is reliant on having a Russian ship you play a lot to get proper value. Not everyone will dig Petro, and you can still get Kuznetsov later if you actually find yourself playing Moskva a lot.

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31 minutes ago, Uglesett said:

Of the coal ships I have that are still available I'd pick Yoshino as my favourite, but maybe that's just me being weird.

Comfy supercruiser, quite forgiving when properly angled, stand-off range + spotter plane, reliable ammo, easy damage, no radar to get you killed around a cap circle. Contermeta pick when you want to go out there and show shiny new RU cruiser and BB captains that you do not believe in the Russian bias. There's many reasons why one can like Yoshino.

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2 hours ago, xxHELIOS said:

Forgot to say cross your fingers each time you click « battle » there wont be any Richtoffen, if that’s the case.. :Smile_trollface:83D5986C-7951-49AE-B5AB-4968CC040F22.gif.c921772fd507c4a22a2851de6f729a68.gif

Well, that goes for pretty much every cruiser:Smile_trollface:

Petro isn't better off than moskva due to it's lower hp pool.

1 hour ago, Ocsimano18 said:

Also a question for you guys already having the Moskva. Do you use the legendary mod on her? Because if it's required for good performance, then it's an additional Research Bureau grind to consider for the OP.

I prefer reload.

You'll miss out on some truly long range shots, but rangemod was only ever viable in high league CB play afaik and the difference between that and LU is slight imo.

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[SKRUB]
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For me the main problem with Moskva is to have also her sister ship. #Stalingrad

But her space camo is nice. :fish_cute_2:

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[WGP2W]
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1 hour ago, Lebedjev said:

For me the main problem with Moskva is to have also her sister ship. #Stalingrad

But her space camo is nice. :fish_cute_2:

But they are completely different ships.

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