[TORAZ] El2aZeR Beta Tester 15,786 posts 26,801 battles Report post #1 Posted November 11, 2020 Spoilered for length: Spoiler - Bailing attack wings now need to reach and cruise at the same altitude as bailed main squads. This is actually very significant as it makes them a lot more vulnerable to flak on the way out. - Behavior when attacking over islands has severely changed, planes now keep the higher altitude for much longer resulting in more forward aim. - All planes now have extremely fast mouse aim which previously only Enterprise and KM rocket planes had. This makes them extremely responsive and capable of adjusting without much if any accuracy loss. - Rocket trajectory has been changed to be slightly steeper which makes them a bit less reliable. - There is a noticeably longer delay between TB attack and the torps actually hitting the water, requiring the CV player to aim more forward than before. - RNG for torpedo spacing has been introduced. For squads that drop only 2 it is typically hilariously tight now, making them undodgeable even if bow on. In general the spacing of the outer two torpedoes cannot be higher than it was prior to 0.9.9, it can only be tighter. Where the middle torps go is entirely up to RNG on everything except Midway and FDR as both drop so many packed so tight (when dropped with reasonable accuracy) that they have no choice but to go straight in a fairly "normal" pattern. - IJN DB dive has been changed to be extremely weird. Dispersion has likewise been nerfed, it would seem that the bombs now prefer to go to the edge of the reticle rather than the middle which is a significant nerf to their performance and makes them little different in reliability compared to KM AP DBs. - catapult fighters take off time has been severely increased, meaning that you have to activate them well in advance now if you want them to aggro. This is a significant nerf to the consumable. Note that this does not apply to the CV CAP. - fighter aggro time in general seems to extend well beyond what the game displays, taking about an additional 2 seconds or so to actually start pursuing after the indicator turns red. They also seem to need to get closer to actually engage. This is another significant nerf to all fighters, including catapult launched ones, in their air-to-air role. - fighter DPS has been severely nerfed to the point where a second attack even with fighters aggro'd and dealing damage is typically possible and heal will actually save most, if not all of your planes. Guess what, another nerf to fighters. Fun, no? - catapult and CAP fighters now immediately despawn once the "mothership" has been killed. *Insert "another one" meme here* - the position in which CV consumable fighters fly in from is now random. EDIT 2021: It isn't, but it has been changed. - AA range now seems to take into account the positioning of your planes rather than the median position of your entire squad. Essentially that means if e.g. only your left most plane enters an AA aura, your squad will start taking damage whereas as far as I know previously the "middle of your squad" needed to be in range. This is technically speaking a buff to AA range but in practice kinda negligible. - The first 2 - 3 flak walls no longer seem to really hit high speed squadrons. Yes, that means if you're speeding through flak with a fast squadron it will apparently simply not deal any damage. Don't ask me why. Here's a video to demonstrate: Do please note that I haven't personally trialed this in an actual match, but have heard from others that it works just fine outside of the training room. Also note again that it requires a FAST squadron. Slow planes like Enterprise TBs/DBs don't work. - according to datamining bomb fall speed has been changed to be faster, though in practice I haven't noticed much of a difference. Let me know if I missed anything. Man, would be nice if WG actually gave us a list of what they changed rather than letting us figure it all out for ourselves. ¬_¬ Unless ofc they were confident that they could just rewrite the entire CV code without making any real changes to gameplay, at which point I can only respond with: 50 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[R-M] Isoruku_Yamamoto Players 1,437 posts 16,279 battles Report post #2 Posted November 11, 2020 Well essentially the CVs were playing now are little the same as the ones back in 0.8.2. But great job finding this stuff, some good, some bad- but it needs to be addressed, cant keep going with these stealth changes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[LA_FR] Eikkuu Players 317 posts 6,313 battles Report post #3 Posted November 12, 2020 Il y a 1 heure, El2aZeR a dit : Spoilered for length: Révéler le contenu masqué - Bailing attack wings now need to reach and cruise at the same altitude as bailed main squads. This is actually very significant as it makes them a lot more vulnerable to flak on the way out. - Behavior when attacking over islands has severely changed, planes now keep the higher altitude for much longer resulting in more forward aim. - All planes now have extremely fast mouse aim which previously only Enterprise and KM rocket planes had. This makes them extremely responsive and capable of adjusting without much if any accuracy loss. - Rocket trajectory has been changed to be slightly steeper which makes them a bit less reliable. - There is a noticeably longer delay between TB attack and the torps actually hitting the water, requiring the CV player to aim more forward than before. - RNG for torpedo spacing has been introduced. For squads that drop only 2 it is typically hilariously tight now, making them undodgeable even if bow on. In general the spacing of the outer two torpedoes cannot be higher than it was prior to 0.9.9, it can only be tighter. Where the middle torps go is entirely up to RNG on everything except Midway and FDR as both drop so many packed so tight (when dropped with reasonable accuracy) that they have no choice but to go straight in a fairly "normal" pattern. - IJN DB dive has been changed to be extremely weird. Dispersion has likewise been nerfed, it would seem that the bombs now prefer to go to the edge of the reticle rather than the middle which is a significant nerf to their performance and makes them little different in reliability compared to KM AP DBs. - catapult fighters take off time has been severely increased, meaning that you have to activate them well in advance now if you want them to aggro. This is a significant nerf to the consumable. Note that this does not apply to the CV CAP. - fighter aggro time in general seems to extend well beyond what the game displays, taking about an additional 2 seconds or so to actually start pursuing after the indicator turns red. They also seem to need to get closer to actually engage. This is another significant nerf to all fighters, including catapult launched ones, in their air-to-air role. - fighter DPS has been severely nerfed to the point where a second attack even with fighters aggro'd and dealing damage is typically possible and heal will actually save most, if not all of your planes. Guess what, another nerf to fighters. Fun, no? - catapult and CAP fighters now immediately despawn once the "mothership" has been killed. *Insert "another one" meme here* - the position in which CV consumable fighters fly in from is now random. - AA range now seems to take into account the positioning of your planes rather than the median position of your entire squad. Essentially that means if e.g. only your left most plane enters an AA aura, your squad will start taking damage whereas as far as I know previously the "middle of your squad" needed to be in range. This is technically speaking a buff to AA range but in practice kinda negligible. - The first 2 - 3 flak walls no longer seem to really hit high speed squadrons. Yes, that means if you're speeding through flak with a fast squadron it will apparently simply not deal any damage. Don't ask me why. Here's a video to demonstrate: Do please note that I haven't personally trialed this in an actual match, but have heard from others that it works just fine outside of the training room. Also note again that it requires a FAST squadron. Slow planes like Enterprise TBs/DBs don't work. Let me know if I missed anything. Man, would be nice if WG actually gave us a list of what they changed rather than letting us figure it all out for ourselves. ¬_¬ Unless ofc they were confident that they could just rewrite the entire CV code without making any real changes to gameplay, at which point I can only respond with: WG change only the patern interface, but some nerfs on CV. l saw it when the patch was release, that sad WG lay us "there no undocumented change". Great work for this list ^^ 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[R7S] Wulf_Ace Players 2,179 posts 12,310 battles Report post #4 Posted November 12, 2020 amazing job man, its all true but wargaming kept it under the rug and didnt tell anything from this to keep hiden the cv nerf. this thing about fighters is so true ,at first i thought it was lag that fighters need so much time to attack even if you go into a red zone of them. about flak,that dmg was always weird ,especially now. i think there is also a delay after pressing attack button on most of the planes but i cant confirm it,especially on rocket planes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[THESO] Nov_A Beta Tester 1,292 posts 13,123 battles Report post #5 Posted November 12, 2020 Yeah I suspected something wrong with the wonky dispersion on IJN bombers but never found evident proof. Shokek was just a slot machine and Kaga could not hit anything smaller than a BB. Same for the massive overshooting when flying over islands in KM attack planes. Before the patch the reticle just made a quick jump forward or gave the clear indication you are unable to hit, with correct timing in the first case you could actually land a hit, now the reticle just stays local but your rockets still overshoot. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[R3B3L] HystericalAccuracy Players 1,505 posts 40,428 battles Report post #6 Posted November 12, 2020 Coincidentally, yesterday i was browsing forums and found this: Ah well, let´s have a look then Interesting! Show me how to You don´t say Edit due to double-posted pics 1 35 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[WGP2W] LemonadeWarriorITA [WGP2W] Beta Tester 1,669 posts 8,186 battles Report post #7 Posted November 12, 2020 Funny how the WG's CV department keeps suprising me in a bad way. It feels like it they are just playing in the kiddo pool and everytime they think they got something good they throw a tantrum so that it gets released into the actual game... It is just a badly designed mini game that doesn't fit at all within the real game... Just like subs, probably same pool. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CN_] mcboernester Privateer 6,009 posts 14,314 battles Report post #8 Posted November 12, 2020 The thing is that CV players recognized these things / bugs / whatever back on the test server for 0.9.9, so roughly 1,5-2months back and nobody seems to care. On the other hand wg employees stated multiple times that "we don't do stealth changes" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[HEROZ] GulvkluderGuld Players 3,467 posts 22,114 battles Report post #9 Posted November 12, 2020 10 hours ago, El2aZeR said: Let me know if I missed anything. Rocket attacks over islands: Rockets dont in fact hit the reticle but rather fly above it, causing them to miss the target despite the visible reticle being lined up perfectly. Happens rather consistently with KM RFs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[XTREM] Miragetank90 Players 2,626 posts 18,708 battles Report post #10 Posted November 12, 2020 Undocumented because reasons Good job compiling the list. As far as I can tell you've covered them all. Myself though, the torps hitting water delay and the Fighter despawn on mothership death I did not notice. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[NTT] arquata2019_ Players 2,248 posts 17,480 battles Report post #11 Posted November 12, 2020 10 ore fa, El2aZeR ha scritto: Man, would be nice if WG actually gave us a list of what they changed rather than letting us figure it all out for ourselves. ¬_¬ gotta explore it' all.... really, so wg makes us busy, doesn't it? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[2DQT] rimmer_the Players 407 posts Report post #12 Posted November 12, 2020 10 hours ago, El2aZeR said: Spoilered for length: Reveal hidden contents - Bailing attack wings now need to reach and cruise at the same altitude as bailed main squads. This is actually very significant as it makes them a lot more vulnerable to flak on the way out. - Behavior when attacking over islands has severely changed, planes now keep the higher altitude for much longer resulting in more forward aim. - All planes now have extremely fast mouse aim which previously only Enterprise and KM rocket planes had. This makes them extremely responsive and capable of adjusting without much if any accuracy loss. - Rocket trajectory has been changed to be slightly steeper which makes them a bit less reliable. - There is a noticeably longer delay between TB attack and the torps actually hitting the water, requiring the CV player to aim more forward than before. - RNG for torpedo spacing has been introduced. For squads that drop only 2 it is typically hilariously tight now, making them undodgeable even if bow on. In general the spacing of the outer two torpedoes cannot be higher than it was prior to 0.9.9, it can only be tighter. Where the middle torps go is entirely up to RNG on everything except Midway and FDR as both drop so many packed so tight (when dropped with reasonable accuracy) that they have no choice but to go straight in a fairly "normal" pattern. - IJN DB dive has been changed to be extremely weird. Dispersion has likewise been nerfed, it would seem that the bombs now prefer to go to the edge of the reticle rather than the middle which is a significant nerf to their performance and makes them little different in reliability compared to KM AP DBs. - catapult fighters take off time has been severely increased, meaning that you have to activate them well in advance now if you want them to aggro. This is a significant nerf to the consumable. Note that this does not apply to the CV CAP. - fighter aggro time in general seems to extend well beyond what the game displays, taking about an additional 2 seconds or so to actually start pursuing after the indicator turns red. They also seem to need to get closer to actually engage. This is another significant nerf to all fighters, including catapult launched ones, in their air-to-air role. - fighter DPS has been severely nerfed to the point where a second attack even with fighters aggro'd and dealing damage is typically possible and heal will actually save most, if not all of your planes. Guess what, another nerf to fighters. Fun, no? - catapult and CAP fighters now immediately despawn once the "mothership" has been killed. *Insert "another one" meme here* - the position in which CV consumable fighters fly in from is now random. - AA range now seems to take into account the positioning of your planes rather than the median position of your entire squad. Essentially that means if e.g. only your left most plane enters an AA aura, your squad will start taking damage whereas as far as I know previously the "middle of your squad" needed to be in range. This is technically speaking a buff to AA range but in practice kinda negligible. - The first 2 - 3 flak walls no longer seem to really hit high speed squadrons. Yes, that means if you're speeding through flak with a fast squadron it will apparently simply not deal any damage. Don't ask me why. Here's a video to demonstrate: Do please note that I haven't personally trialed this in an actual match, but have heard from others that it works just fine outside of the training room. Also note again that it requires a FAST squadron. Slow planes like Enterprise TBs/DBs don't work. Let me know if I missed anything. Man, would be nice if WG actually gave us a list of what they changed rather than letting us figure it all out for ourselves. ¬_¬ Unless ofc they were confident that they could just rewrite the entire CV code without making any real changes to gameplay, at which point I can only respond with: How are you not a "Quality Poster" or CC yet ? Toor critical of WG ? @Vladocro: I'm glad whoever built the main WOWS site didnt build the wiki site. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-CC-] Shiplife Players 75 posts 608 battles Report post #13 Posted November 12, 2020 All the rockets have the same shape of the pattern now. Wasn't mentioned either, right? What i mean is: 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[TORAZ] El2aZeR Beta Tester 15,786 posts 26,801 battles Report post #14 Posted November 12, 2020 59 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said: Rocket attacks over islands: Rockets dont in fact hit the reticle but rather fly above it, causing them to miss the target despite the visible reticle being lined up perfectly. Happens rather consistently with KM RFs. This has allegedly been fixed if I remember the patchnotes correctly. Haven't tried it out myself yet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-CC-] Shiplife Players 75 posts 608 battles Report post #15 Posted November 12, 2020 Před 2 minutami El2aZeR řekl/a: This has allegedly been fixed if I remember the patchnotes correctly. Haven't tried it out myself yet. Just played Lexington, TiTs pattern is still horizontal, same as all other rockets. Graff Zeppelin had also vertical ellipse, right? Anyone can confirm how is it looking now? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[TORAZ] El2aZeR Beta Tester 15,786 posts 26,801 battles Report post #16 Posted November 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, Shiplife said: Just played Lexington, TiTs pattern is still horizontal, same as all other rockets. That was changed prior to 0.9.9 and has nothing to do with rockets not lining up with the reticle when flying over islands. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[TOXIC] Kartoffelmos Alpha Tester 2,237 posts 8,884 battles Report post #17 Posted November 12, 2020 I'm not sure what is more sad: the notion that WG is unaware of how their adjustments affect other mechanics, or the appearance that WG had to hide the CV nerfs while also reducing counterplay further in order to not upset the so-called balance between the CV population and the actual game balance. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SCRUB] Leo_Apollo11 Quality Poster 7,146 posts 31,598 battles Report post #18 Posted November 12, 2020 13 hours ago, El2aZeR said: Let me know if I missed anything. Thanks! BTW, did you post it on Reddit as well? Leo "Apollo11" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[TORAZ] El2aZeR Beta Tester 15,786 posts 26,801 battles Report post #19 Posted November 12, 2020 28 minutes ago, Leo_Apollo11 said: BTW, did you post it on Reddit as well? I didn't. Feel free to do so. Added that bomb fall speed has been changed to be faster according to datamining. Apparently KM CVs got the biggest buff out of that which I cannot confirm yet by virtue of not having played one for a while. Noticed pretty much no difference in bomb fall speed when playing US and IJN CVs though. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SCRUB] Leo_Apollo11 Quality Poster 7,146 posts 31,598 battles Report post #20 Posted November 12, 2020 Hi all, 25 minutes ago, El2aZeR said: I didn't. Feel free to do so. Added that bomb fall speed has been changed to be faster according to datamining. Apparently KM CVs got the biggest buff out of that which I cannot confirm yet by virtue of not having played one for a while. Noticed pretty much no difference when playing everything else though. RGR - will do that! Leo "Apollo11" P.S. Done! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[HAKUY] Yosha_AtaIante Players 8,032 posts 19,168 battles Report post #21 Posted November 12, 2020 Now everyone knows how to ignore flak :D Imagine one whole part of the whole AA system just doing nothing Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[HAKUY] Yosha_AtaIante Players 8,032 posts 19,168 battles Report post #22 Posted November 12, 2020 15 hours ago, El2aZeR said: - All planes now have extremely fast mouse aim which previously only Enterprise and KM rocket planes had. This makes them extremely responsive and capable of adjusting without much if any accuracy loss. Also because of this Midway can do what FDR is popular for, do 90° turns with torps fully aimed with the mouse. Only issue Midway is having is that Midway torps CAN NOT ignore flak while in attack run animation, they still eat flak. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[NMA] mantiscore Players 546 posts 14,567 battles Report post #23 Posted November 12, 2020 i hope carriers and the style of their gameplay will suffocate this game eventually 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CHEFT] DFens_666 Players 13,162 posts 11,029 battles Report post #24 Posted November 12, 2020 38 minutes ago, Zuihou_Kai said: Now everyone knows how to ignore flak :D Imagine one whole part of the whole AA system just doing nothing Better this way than it gets swept under the carpet because 20 CV players (who dont need to abuse this in the first place) get to enjoy this mechanic. If everyone uses it, might be a chance that WG does something. Or they did it on purpose - can never be sure 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[JOLLY] UnterSeeBot Players 967 posts Report post #25 Posted November 12, 2020 40 minutes ago, DFens_666 said: Better this way than it gets swept under the carpet because 20 CV players (who dont need to abuse this in the first place) get to enjoy this mechanic. If everyone uses it, might be a chance that WG does something. Or they did it on purpose - can never be sure The speed boost mechanic to ignore flak has been around since the rework was launched, we have had plenty of time to abuse it (18 months +) But it also suggests there is a built in delay between the graphical explosion of flak, and the beginning of dmg. Could this be deliberate to compensate for server-client lag, or low end pcs? 16 hours ago, El2aZeR said: Spoilered for length: Reveal hidden contents - Bailing attack wings now need to reach and cruise at the same altitude as bailed main squads. This is actually very significant as it makes them a lot more vulnerable to flak on the way out. - Behavior when attacking over islands has severely changed, planes now keep the higher altitude for much longer resulting in more forward aim. - All planes now have extremely fast mouse aim which previously only Enterprise and KM rocket planes had. This makes them extremely responsive and capable of adjusting without much if any accuracy loss. - Rocket trajectory has been changed to be slightly steeper which makes them a bit less reliable. - There is a noticeably longer delay between TB attack and the torps actually hitting the water, requiring the CV player to aim more forward than before. - RNG for torpedo spacing has been introduced. For squads that drop only 2 it is typically hilariously tight now, making them undodgeable even if bow on. In general the spacing of the outer two torpedoes cannot be higher than it was prior to 0.9.9, it can only be tighter. Where the middle torps go is entirely up to RNG on everything except Midway and FDR as both drop so many packed so tight (when dropped with reasonable accuracy) that they have no choice but to go straight in a fairly "normal" pattern. - IJN DB dive has been changed to be extremely weird. Dispersion has likewise been nerfed, it would seem that the bombs now prefer to go to the edge of the reticle rather than the middle which is a significant nerf to their performance and makes them little different in reliability compared to KM AP DBs. - catapult fighters take off time has been severely increased, meaning that you have to activate them well in advance now if you want them to aggro. This is a significant nerf to the consumable. Note that this does not apply to the CV CAP. - fighter aggro time in general seems to extend well beyond what the game displays, taking about an additional 2 seconds or so to actually start pursuing after the indicator turns red. They also seem to need to get closer to actually engage. This is another significant nerf to all fighters, including catapult launched ones, in their air-to-air role. - fighter DPS has been severely nerfed to the point where a second attack even with fighters aggro'd and dealing damage is typically possible and heal will actually save most, if not all of your planes. Guess what, another nerf to fighters. Fun, no? - catapult and CAP fighters now immediately despawn once the "mothership" has been killed. *Insert "another one" meme here* - the position in which CV consumable fighters fly in from is now random. - AA range now seems to take into account the positioning of your planes rather than the median position of your entire squad. Essentially that means if e.g. only your left most plane enters an AA aura, your squad will start taking damage whereas as far as I know previously the "middle of your squad" needed to be in range. This is technically speaking a buff to AA range but in practice kinda negligible. - The first 2 - 3 flak walls no longer seem to really hit high speed squadrons. Yes, that means if you're speeding through flak with a fast squadron it will apparently simply not deal any damage. Don't ask me why. Here's a video to demonstrate: Do please note that I haven't personally trialed this in an actual match, but have heard from others that it works just fine outside of the training room. Also note again that it requires a FAST squadron. Slow planes like Enterprise TBs/DBs don't work. - according to datamining bomb fall speed has been changed to be faster, though in practice I haven't noticed much of a difference. Let me know if I missed anything. Man, would be nice if WG actually gave us a list of what they changed rather than letting us figure it all out for ourselves. ¬_¬ Unless ofc they were confident that they could just rewrite the entire CV code without making any real changes to gameplay, at which point I can only respond with: you should post this on the other regional server forums too. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
