General Submarines related discussions

[gabberworld]

33 minutes ago, Fatal_Ramses said:

Dunno how tinfoil-hat stuff this is, but how to make subs seem popular?

By making a spike in random battles right after the patch release.

300 base-exp in coop? easy!

600 base-exp in coop? play well in VIII - X tiers, not everyone can do that.

800 base-exp? not likely in coop.

 

grind base-exp in ops? don't even think about it! not allowed!

choices left are random and ranked.

 

You do want those new german BCs with memestastic secondariies?

right?!

Well step right up and fabricate  stats-data that random battles are even more popular with subs added.

you not need play with one ship only. there no difference if you get 300 or 600 points

also in ranked battle its easier get higer xp than in random battles

[Pikkozoikum]

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

Dude. Do you even understand what are you talking about?

What are you refering to? Maybe there is a misunderstanding.

 

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

How can a Stalin know if you fired torps or not? Even if he waited till they got proxy spotted, there's a good chance (if he was going slowly nose in) that he would not be able to avoid them. In the example I gave you, I repaired that ping after considering the torps are on the way?

-> When you get pinged, you get a hint about the submarines attack angle.

-> You can see them on a distance at 2.2 km or 2.4 km (~10s reaction time)

 

If you use DCP without even seeing the torpedos, then you might get fooled. I would always wait until you see the torpedos. And if it's a single ping, I would maybe not dcp it. Depending on the situation.

 

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

Tell me mr. Pro, how could I counter it when ping reloads around 4 times faster than a DCP. That guy pinged me, launched torps, i DCP'd, he pinged me again.

It sounds like, you used DCP too early, but can't tell. Do you have a replay?

 

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

And pls do not imply i made a misplay,

Hard to say without a replay, but actually it sounds like that.

 

It sounds like, that you dcped the pings, then after a while he pinged you again and shot then all the torpedos. In that case the use of DCP would be misplayed.

 

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

and you talk about misinformation

Yes, I talk about misinformation, or is a player, who said, that Shima torps have 3km detection range, correctly informed? As I said, I read stuff like that often.

 

1 hour ago, st_dasa said:

Also, did you know Stalin and other surface ships can burn like a crisp, and the main counter to that is - brace yourself - a DCP.

So be happy, that with a submarine in your match, there will be one less ship, that can set fires?

 

 

 

[st_dasa]

43 minutes ago, Pikkozoikum said:

Hard to say without a replay, but actually it sounds like that.

 

And you sound like a rather unsharp tool of the shed. You use only the arguments you like to make a statement, disregarding everything I pointed about the speed and why it is almost impossible to evade a dedicated sub as a pushing ship.

 

I suggest hiding your stats if you gonna communicate with me next time, you have 0 credibility to exclaim I made a mistake. I understand you are only tiny bit above the average at surface ships so you gotta ''main up'' in the braindead classes... is there a perk to be annoying as possible? I missed something?

 

 

[MementoMori_6030]

"You cannot win an argument just by being nice... also, you cannot win an argument just by being right."
 

[Deckeru_Maiku]

4 minutes ago, MementoMori_6030 said:

"You cannot win an argument just by being nice... also, you cannot win an argument just by being right."
 

"And never ever can you win an argument with Pikkoclownium"

[bEtHeNs]

Pings, no matter if torps are in range, make BBs to change to scape mode. So they remain behind islands or I think we will see more lemming trains being 100% more lemmings. Top quality lemmings.

[Pikkozoikum]

57 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

And you sound like a rather unsharp tool of the shed.

Sorry, but if you don't show a replay and if I have only to go with your description, then I can only get a view from that, what you decribed.

 

57 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

You use only the arguments you like to make a statement

What are you refering to? I make statements, and use arguments for these statements.

 

57 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

disregarding everything I pointed about the speed and why it is almost impossible to evade a dedicated sub as a pushing ship.

Because it was never about the speed. The initial point was about stealth and misinformed players

Quote here:

3 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

The thing is, there are more people misinformed, than people are informed. Just today I read about, how stealthy submarines attacks are, while the "stealthy Shima" has 3 km detection torpedos.

Then you came up with an example, which sounded like, that the DCP was not optimal used. Which is hard to judge without seeing the replay. Maybe you can find it in the replay folder?

 

 

57 minutes ago, st_dasa said:

exclaim I made a mistake

It's not about me or you, only about what you described. If you cleared the pings with DCP without any threat, then it's a mistake, no matter who did that.

[Pikkozoikum]

7 minutes ago, bEtHeNs said:

Pings, no matter if torps are in range, make BBs to change to scape mode. So they remain behind islands or I think we will see more lemming trains being 100% more lemmings. Top quality lemmings.

Though ping range and torpedo range is the same. I mean, torpedo range can be be a bit lower, because of the curving, but technically it's the same range

[bEtHeNs]

In stats yes, but if I run away and the sub remains behind he wont catch me with his torps range even if it shows double ping in my ship. So that is why the scape mode, or "Run Forrest run!" mode is a alternative to the dcp waste.

[Pikkozoikum]

1 minute ago, bEtHeNs said:

In stats yes, but if I run away and the sub remains behind he wont catch me with his torps range even if it shows double ping in my ship. So that is why the scape mode is a alternative to the dcp waste.

That is true, the torps might run out. But actually the same is done against DDs, if DDs chase, the torps might run out, but the BB has to run away or hide behind islands, no matter if there will be torps or not. It's the way how to deal with torps

[bEtHeNs]

Yes but the pings have a panic effect that dd toprs dont have. DDs torps have damage effect, less efficient than the sub's ones by the way because of the pings. Pings cause terror, not damage and then the torps come to cause the damage yes or yes, unless you waste a dcp or run away. This does not happens with dd torps. It happens with planes. Pings and planes make you do funny things not to be hit, like show your sides or run away from battle, then come the torps, the bombs or the rockets. They have a disrupting, and tiring, effect you can hardly counter.

 

This game, with all mechanics from reworked planes, airstrikes, pinged torps, smoked fire spammers gets tiring very soon unless you are in one of those ships, because you cannot counter them and do not enjoy being the target, at least that is how I feel about it. The day before last patch I was attacked by planes, airstrike and fire spamming all at once, last battle that day.

[st_dasa]

[st_dasa]

54 minutes ago, bEtHeNs said:

This game, with all mechanics from reworked planes, airstrikes, pinged torps, smoked fire spammers gets tiring very soon unless you are in one of those ships, because you cannot counter them and do not enjoy being the target, at least that is how I feel about it. The day before last patch I was attacked by planes, airstrike and fire spamming all at once, last battle that day.

 

It's because you do not understand the core mechanics.

 

 

Wink Wink.

[General_Alexus]

I have to hand it to the BB-Mafia, they won again.

Had some nice sub games in radom today, maximum dmg was about 100k doing big dmg numbers difficult.

One game in perticular, Torps having no problem at all to hit DDs and French CAs, but BBs? nah, 48% players dodge homing torps easyly by just turning a bit short before impact.

I mean yeah, WG cant scare of the paying customer base, but its funny that the nimble small ships have a harder time evading than the big tanker.

 

Also WG, you need to do something about Sub on Sub fights, they are way to inconsistent especially on short range. Half the time you ramm each other, the other half time its just a waste of oxigen or one side gets third partied as everybody has DCPlanes now. Best is to not even get into a Sub on Sub fight.

 

On the plus side: I realy love the German Sub Buff, and single launch torps are fun.

One game I spread out Torps and pinged a DD late, the poor thing had torps comming from 180° from all directions, reaky funny to watch. And before people cry: He didnt get hit once as together with him moving away, spreading torps out so much eats into theire range, so they run out before hitting him.

[SuperDare83]

I really haven't enjoyed subs in random games today...double sub games in particular you notice the lack of surface ships. The double ping mechanic/homing Torps is just too strong.

[Admiral_H_Nelson]

7 hours ago, lovelacebeer said:

Have to give it to WG they are cunning devils. 

As the Reverend Spooner might say: When I thing of Wargaming, I think "Cunning Stunts!".

 

From wikipedia.

A spoonerism is an error in speech in which corresponding consonants, vowels, or morphemes are switched (see metathesis) between two words in a phrase.These are named after the Oxford don and ordained minister William Archibald Spooner, who reputedly did this.

Example, "Three cheers for our queer old dean!" (rather than "dear old queen")

[MementoMori_6030]

Vor 11 Stunden, Fatal_Ramses sagte:

Dunno how tinfoil-hat stuff this is, but how to make subs seem popular?

My first impression of this was "Ah, we are supposed to play randoms at tiers with subs, so the blasted things are not only played by noobs and fanboys."

No problem to get 4-digit BXP in <T5 randoms, but hey, doesn't count.

So I will just be patient, wait for my battlecruisers and give WG the finger.

[st_dasa]

12 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

That is true, the torps might run out. But actually the same is done against DDs, if DDs chase, the torps might run out, but the BB has to run away or hide behind islands, no matter if there will be torps or not. It's the way how to deal with torps

 

https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/q439e6/homing_torps_dev_strike_hindy_from_behind/

 

I guess he misplayed heavily. I know exactly what your reply will be - ''he should've DCP'd when the torps were on him''. Am I right?

 

Its not a bad game design, its player's fault. Obviously.

[Sprockett]

16 hours ago, MementoMori_6030 said:

"You cannot win an argument just by being nice... also, you cannot win an argument just by being right."
 

but you can win an argument by just shooting them! (this is a joke BTW)

 

[Bear__Necessities]

17 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

If you use DCP without even seeing the torpedos, then you might get fooled. I would always wait until you see the torpedos. And if it's a single ping, I would maybe not dcp it. Depending on the situation.

Which is why you ping. Send 1 torp or 2. Wait 15 seconds and send the rest. So when they DCP because they see torps, you can re ping them and slam them with 4/5 more after. 

 

Stop defending stupid broken mechanics. 

 

[Hawker_gb]

One really must be braindead or wg employee to defend subs as they are now.

 

 

[Port_Authority]

They said homing torps are implemented because they reflect the state of real world submarine where she could silently put herself in the best firing solution and launch torps with high probability of hit. Fine, if you want shitty version of historical accuracy in the arcade game, then do it consistently and make it a pain for the sub to get into firing range. Because navigating a sub is 50 times more harder than navigating a surface ship. The external view of the surrounding you enjoy in this game while playing a normal ship, is a situational awareness that comes from the scouting masts IRL.The external view you get while in the sub is a complete fiction and it makes the hardest part of the submarine deployment disappear.

 

And to make things worse, the environment below the sea surface impacts surface ships with pixel stucking, while for subs its just an eye candy (I love how much light is there between operating and full depth, WG seas are obviously devoid of plankton) so they don't experience the real sub which is dark and blind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Pan_Kalich]

I enjoy playing subs and against them. Oxygen/battery mechanics seems to be balanced just on the right spot ... not allowing subs to stay submerged for whole game and yet forcing them to surface occasionaly. I personally spend most of the surfaced ... submerging only when I have to.

What i find somehow strange is:

1/ limited spotting range when in periscope depth - imho this should be same as when surfaced

2/ disparity between T8 USN and KM submarine ... US is better at every aspect apart from worse detection range (200m or something trivial) ... almost like a Daft Punk track ... harder better faster stronger ...

3/ T10 KM sub has something reminiscent of two dual AA mounts, yet in the game those are neither AA nor secondary batery 

Ofc, there are many whiners who hate submarines in a similar fashion that players hate on CV :D ... imho most of them either suck at it or never tried one ... Alas, you guys cant make everyone happy and I get that the game needs to evolve.

[Pan_Kalich]

Před 15 hodinami SuperDare83 řekl/a:

I really haven't enjoyed subs in random games today...double sub games in particular you notice the lack of surface ships. The double ping mechanic/homing Torps is just too strong.

It is not that hard to dodge even homing torps if you change direction in the right moment (ofc there are situation when you cant simply prevent it at all) Today I had wasted 3 full salvos on 10km on Alsace masterfully dodging one salvo after another aimed at her stern. You know that torps stop homing when close to target, you can swing this to your benefit. Imho it works ok-ish (bit of salt because in WW2 era there was nothing like homing torps) 

[Sprockett]

After a a few matches:

 

Subs are easier to kill in a BB than they are in a destroyer

Homing torps and the pressure on DCP is broken

Subs can RAM kill Full HP DDs go figure...

The G spot - is RNG as far as I can make out

the overall feeling of Randoms is that it is a cluster F**K of in- balance - CVs + Subs + Russian Bias - makes for an appalling mess of a game