General Submarines related discussions

[FloatingTarget]

1 hour ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

Are you not aware how easy it is to deal with homing torps and that the most dangerous sub players don't even ping you? You just die to them.
 

Ah, I see! You must have access to one of those new light speed Battleships? You know the ones that can stop and start on a dime and have the turning circle of a spinning nickel?

 

Turn into them or away and you take a nose or stern full, stay broadside and you get a side full. If they were so fantastically easy to dodge their wouldn't be so many people with issues. They are on easy mode and do the work for you. Yes, I understand not everyone is fantastic and super like you, but if there were no issues then their wouldn't be such a sour mood to Subs.

 

But if the best players are the ones who do not use homing, then surely you agree that they are not needed and are holding sub players back? :P

[Yosha_AtaIante]

41 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

Ah, I see! You must have access to one of those new light speed Battleships? You know the ones that can stop and start on a dime and have the turning circle of a spinning nickel?

 

Turn into them or away and you take a nose or stern full, stay broadside and you get a side full. If they were so fantastically easy to dodge their wouldn't be so many people with issues. They are on easy mode and do the work for you. Yes, I understand not everyone is fantastic and super like you, but if there were no issues then their wouldn't be such a sour mood to Subs.

 

But if the best players are the ones who do not use homing, then surely you agree that they are not needed and are holding sub players back? :P

I would love to demonstrate it for you, we can do it in a training room. If you are up for it feel free to pm me.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

41 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

But if the best players are the ones who do not use homing, then surely you agree that they are not needed and are holding sub players back?

Of course I do. I find them unnecessary and the wrong way to play sub as you surrender your position to the enemy. If they were removed sub players would shotgun more which is much more difficult to deal with and then WG would actually have a need to take measures. As it is now most sub players who ping die rather easily holding the stats of subs overall down.

[FloatingTarget]

1 hour ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

I would love to demonstrate it for you, we can do it in a training room. If you are up for it feel free to pm me.

Ah I see I and everyone else have been doing it wrong and need training by an elite player such as you? I got an idea, why not get a friend and make a video on how to avoid them and post it here so everyone can see?

1 hour ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

Of course I do. I find them unnecessary and the wrong way to play sub as you surrender your position to the enemy. If they were removed sub players would shotgun more which is much more difficult to deal with and then WG would actually have a need to take measures. As it is now most sub players who ping die rather easily holding the stats of subs overall down.

So you agree that homing torps should be removed? In order to shotgun a player a sub has to put itself in a very dangerous position, I doubt it would become the default. Most likely Subs would be treated as more stealthy destroyers that have to use their stealth and torps as opposed to main guns. Maintaining distance while lining up their shots as opposed to pinging someone a million times and getting a guaranteed hit.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

46 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

Ah I see I and everyone else have been doing it wrong and need training by an elite player such as you? I got an idea, why not get a friend and make a video on how to avoid them and post it here so everyone can see?

I can do that if you want. Will try to have it done during the weekend.

 

46 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

So you agree that homing torps should be removed?

Yes, they are not needed.

 

46 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

In order to shotgun a player a sub has to put itself in a very dangerous position

Wrong, it really doesn't. The position is never dangerous unless you misplay.

 

46 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

Maintaining distance while lining up their shots as opposed to pinging someone a million times and getting a guaranteed hit.

You can't play it like that because the torps are spotted from the moon and simply don't have enough alpha. You might aswell just play 8km shima at that point as it will be faster, with more torps and far harder hitting. Much easier to devstrike people with it compared to a sub that doesnt shotgun. And yes I know what I'm talking about with the shima reference as I play her with 8km torps exclusively very successfully

Why take a sub when this is just much better?

Sub is only good because you can shotgun with it. They are inferior in everything else.

 

Here is an example of how to use shotgunning correctly against even some of the best players

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1060554072073179186/1064299998835130398/subhumarine1.mp4

 

just download the little video clip and see how "dangerous" this position was or rather, how easy it was to get to this Unicum and oneshot him

 

And yes, I escaped and killed their CV too

[Sunleader]

7 hours ago, plain_average said:

Tell me o wise one - unicum - how as a tier 3 ship can i defend against a carrier?

 

And also - how will I detect a sub and protect against it in a tier 5 BB that turns in 1 minute, with no detection skills and with only a single skill to cause the "magic" torps to lose their lock.

 

If you cannot see that is a problem, and have nothing with learning game mechanics to do, you sir are just stirring crap up and are part of the problem.

 

1.

The Same Way You Defend against a BBs Shells.

You Dont.

You try to minimize damage and close the Distance faster than he can kill You and then kill him.

 

2.

You dont.

If that Happens You already messed up.

Why Are You in a Position where the Sub can Torp You while so far away that You cant Find it but so Close that there is no DDs or Cruisers in between ?

 

This is a 12 vs 12 not a 1 vs 1.

If You Position a Rearline Unit in the Frontline You already Failed.

 

3.

Then Why Can I deal with Subs but You cant ?

Why Can others Deal with Subs but You cant ?

 

You Refuse to Learn and Demand the Game to be Changed so you dont have to Learn Mate.

 

 

5 hours ago, SmegTheNoob said:

Isn't it funny that it is always the Super Unicum players that turn round and say its easy to deal with homing torpedoes?

How many times do I have to state how hard I find avoiding homing torps in a slow BB.

Just because you think its easy to avoid the torps, doesn't mean its the same for the rest of us.

 

Oh and don't bother coming back with the "it's a skill issue" comment.

 

I am not even Unicum tough.

 

 

 

 

[SmegTheNoob]

7 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 

I am not even Unicum tough.

 

 

 

 

Did you even check my Unicum comment?

It wasn't even directed at you.

 

[Cuddly_Spider]

13 hours ago, SmegTheNoob said:

Isn't it funny that it is always the Super Unicum players that turn round and say its easy to deal with homing torpedoes?

 

I suck.

 

It's easy to deal with homing torpedoes.

[SmegTheNoob]

32 minutes ago, Cuddly_Spider said:

I suck.

 

It's easy to deal with homing torpedoes.

Not far off a 52% win rate.

No, you don't suck.

[Sunleader]

3 hours ago, SmegTheNoob said:

Did you even check my Unicum comment?

It wasn't even directed at you.

 

 

Your Comment was this.

 

16 hours ago, SmegTheNoob said:

Isn't it funny that it is always the Super Unicum players that turn round and say its easy to deal with homing torpedoes?

How many times do I have to state how hard I find avoiding homing torps in a slow BB.

Just because you think its easy to avoid the torps, doesn't mean its the same for the rest of us.

 

Oh and don't bother coming back with the "it's a skill issue" comment.

 

And this is clearly Addressing me.

Because I as well Say its easy to deal with homing Torpedoes.

 

But I am not even Unicum. Much less Super Unicum.

So why can I deal with Homing Torpedoes but You cant ?

 

Its not even Difficult either.

 

 

 

And well.

I would still Say its a Skill Issue.

But the Underlying Problem for most Skill Issues is Effort.

Which leads to the Question why You dont make the Effort.

 

And well.

Putting it Bluntly. Its not that You or anyone else cannot Acquire the Skills to Deal with Homing Torps because its in any way Difficult.

Rather than that there is 2 Primary Reasons why You cant Deal with Homing Torps.

 

The First is Simple Lazyness. You Dont want to Bother Learning anything. So You Refuse to even bother Trying. Hence when Homing Torps are Aimed at You. You just Surrender Yourself to your Fate and dont even bother to try to Deal with it or Learning anything from it.

 

Second is old Fashined Pigheaded Stubborness. You dont Like Subs. So You Refuse to Believe that there is any Possibility of Your Opinion being Wrong. And well. If You learned how to Dodge Homing Torps then Your Opinion would be Wrong.

So You Refuse to even try.

Thats also why you dont Play Sub Yourself.

If You did. You would Quickly be Forced to Realize that your Results with Subs are no Better than Your Results with other Ships. You would constantly be Faced with the Reality that Subs are not Invulnearble at all and get Killed easily all the Time. You would constantly be Faced with the Reality that these Homing Torps which you claim cannot be Dodged unless You are some Super Unicum are Constantly Dodged by others and keep Missing.

 

 

[plain_average]

11 hours ago, Sunleader said:

You dont.

If that Happens You already messed up.

Why Are You in a Position where the Sub can Torp You while so far away that You cant Find it but so Close that there is no DDs or Cruisers in between ?

I think you have a hard time reading and comprehending.

There are games where there a 0 ships with any detection gear on one side, if you discount the subs. I was in a game with a tier 5 BB and 3 SUBS on each side - no ships in the game with any detection gear - so subs on both sides proceeded to kill everyone and turned their greedy eyes on the big juicy ships, i.e. BB's and getting pinged by multiple ships and also having to protect against the lone carrier on each team is impossible.

 

If no ships have any skills to detect subs, how are the ships reliably going to survice in the long run?

 

Against carriers, we can pretend we can survice by dodging and shooting down planes with our AA, but its just a matter of time before the carrier will whittle you down.

 

Against any other ship you can at least in theory dodge or hide behind an island.

 

Against subs you have very few options, you can dodge if you detect the torps in time and manage to break the homing and if you do that, the sub just pings you again and chances are torps are on the way before your repair skill is ready to break the lock again.

 

I have never said its easy to play subs, but the current mechanics makes it near impossible to reliably protect against them in certain ships, simply because of "agility" and the lack of detection - and if you try to close the distance to the sub, so you get into range with your bombers, the subs just stay submerged and shotgun you from extreme close range, where dodgning is impossible.

 

I hate carriers, but I can live with them since you can dodge and most ships have some kind of AA, subs in the current form breaks the game when there are multiple of them in the game simply because not all ships have detection possibility.

 

And if wargaming refuse to give all ships the possibility to detect subs - at least allow the bombers that drop depth charges to have a range that matches the range where subs can ping you from, so you can send bombers to at least try to bomb the sub.

 

And you saying because you dont think there is a problem=No problem - is just plain wrong - there needs a counter to subs and the current mechanics are not really a counter - its a piss poor implementation because wargaming rushed subs into the game without considering the implications for all ship types.

 

 

[SmegTheNoob]

20 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Your Comment was this.

 

 

And this is clearly Addressing me.

Because I as well Say its easy to deal with homing Torpedoes.

 

But I am not even Unicum. Much less Super Unicum.

So why can I deal with Homing Torpedoes but You cant ?

 

Its not even Difficult either.

 

 

 

And well.

I would still Say its a Skill Issue.

But the Underlying Problem for most Skill Issues is Effort.

Which leads to the Question why You dont make the Effort.

 

And well.

Putting it Bluntly. Its not that You or anyone else cannot Acquire the Skills to Deal with Homing Torps because its in any way Difficult.

Rather than that there is 2 Primary Reasons why You cant Deal with Homing Torps.

 

The First is Simple Lazyness. You Dont want to Bother Learning anything. So You Refuse to even bother Trying. Hence when Homing Torps are Aimed at You. You just Surrender Yourself to your Fate and dont even bother to try to Deal with it or Learning anything from it.

 

Second is old Fashined Pigheaded Stubborness. You dont Like Subs. So You Refuse to Believe that there is any Possibility of Your Opinion being Wrong. And well. If You learned how to Dodge Homing Torps then Your Opinion would be Wrong.

So You Refuse to even try.

Thats also why you dont Play Sub Yourself.

If You did. You would Quickly be Forced to Realize that your Results with Subs are no Better than Your Results with other Ships. You would constantly be Faced with the Reality that Subs are not Invulnearble at all and get Killed easily all the Time. You would constantly be Faced with the Reality that these Homing Torps which you claim cannot be Dodged unless You are some Super Unicum are Constantly Dodged by others and keep Missing.

 

 

I wasn't directly addressing you. It was a general comment meant to address Zuihou_Kai_Ni.

 

But I will attempt to answer your arrogant, and frankly insulting comments.

 

1. I have tried many times in a slow BB to avoid homing torps. Probably 75% of the time I fail. Is that a skill issue? I would say it is not. You seem to forget that a very slow BB such as any of the mid tier US BB's are hard to turn. They are sluggish to respond to rudder imput, and they are slow as hell. So I and many other players find it hard to avoid the homing torps. It is a waste of time using your Damage Control to mitigate the sonar ping lock. The sub just pings you again.

 

2. The reason I don't play Subs has got nothing to do with my pigheaded stubbornness. I have no interest in playing Subs. I knew right from the start, that Wargaming will NEVER be able to balance them fairly. If they did, they would never have come up with the stupid homing torps mechanic in the first place. But Wargaming knew they would have to give Subs a gimmick to get people to actually play them. If I wanted to play a far better Submarine game, then I would go and play U-Boat or the Silent Hunter games. I have Silent Hunter 3, 4 & 5, and U-boat.

 

3. I can count on one hand, how many Subs I have killed with Air Dropped Depth Charges. Is that a skill issue? No it F_____g isn't. There is the silly banana thing on the surface that is never that accurate a location. There is also a big chance that you don't even spot the banana thing. Then there is the time it takes the planes to arrive and the time for the bomb to go off. The Sub can easily turn away to avoid this attack. But I am sorry, I thought you said that it was easy to kill Subs.

 

[Sunleader]

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

I think you have a hard time reading and comprehending.

 

Pls dont Project your own Inabilities on others.

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

There are games where there a 0 ships with any detection gear on one side, if you discount the subs. I was in a game with a tier 5 BB and 3 SUBS on each side - no ships in the game with any detection gear - so subs on both sides proceeded to kill everyone and turned their greedy eyes on the big juicy ships, i.e. BB's and getting pinged by multiple ships and also having to protect against the lone carrier on each team is impossible.

 

And why do you need Detection Gear ?

Subs 90% of the Time get Killed without being in Range of Hydro. They get Spotted by a DD or get Spammed by Depth Charges from BBs without being Spotted at all.

 

You keep Saying its Impossible its Impossible. But the Fact is that others are Dealing with it without any Problems.

The Fact is Also that You cannot even be bothered to Play Subs and Prove Your Point.

 

 

 

Needless to mention that 3 Torpedo DDs on each Side would have been even Worse. Because they not only Outspot everything except each other but also are Fast enough to make it Completely Impossible for BBs to even try Fighting them.

Yet You dont seem to Cry about that.

 

 

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

If no ships have any skills to detect subs, how are the ships reliably going to survice in the long run?

 

Well. How do Cruisers without Torps Fight BBs ?

How do Torpedo DDs Fight Gun DDs without Friendly Radar Cruisers Helping them ?

How do CVs Fight in Battles where there is no Ships with Weak AA ?

How do BBs Fight Torpedo DDs when they dont have DDs or CVs Spotting for them ?

 

The Answer is Simple.

If You are at a Disadvantage.

Its a 12 vs 12 Game Mate. You cant always be the Top Tier and be the Shipclass that got Lucky thanks to Matchmaking not giving any Hardcounters to it.

Sometimes You have to Fight as the Bottom Tier in the Shipclass that MM disadvantaged in this Battle.

 

This is True for All Ships in the Game.

Sometimes MM is Nice and sometimes it not.

A Sub may Run into a Game where all Enemy DDs are Big Gun DDs and where all Enemy Cruisers are Heavy Torpedo Cruisers that are Spotted far beyond Hydro Range and dont have much way of Dealing with Subs.

Likewise a Sub can Run Into a Game where most of the Enemy DDs Outspot it on the Surface. Where the Enemy got Several Radar Cruisers that can Stealth Radar and thus the moment they get Spotted use their Radar to Reveal the Sub and have Depth Charges Rain on it.

 

Such is Life in the Game Mate.

 

 

As I said before.

If You cant Deal with that go Play Tier 1 where You dont have any Real Asymetric Balancing.

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

Against carriers, we can pretend we can survice by dodging and shooting down planes with our AA, but its just a matter of time before the carrier will whittle you down.

 

Except that an AA Cruiser or two Random Cruisers can Whittle down most CVs way faster than the CV can Whittle Down him.

If a Unicum CV tries to Kill a Unicum Surface Ship in a Random Battle.

If the Surface Ship Prioritizes Survival. The CV will not manage to Kill it before the Match Ends. Because he will Spend too much Time just Flying long Distance and lose too many Planes trying to Hit the Ship.

If the Surface Ship Prioritizes doing his Job the CV might Kill it after 5-10 Minutes. But in that Time he basicly did nothing of Value for his Team and the Match will likely already be Over.

 

Its no Different than if a Tier 10 BB were to try the Same.

Sure if that Tier 10 BB Constantly Only Focuses on that Surface Ship and keeps Firing at it from 25km away.

And the Enemy Ship Prioritizes doing its Job instead of just Running away. The BB may Kill that Ship. But he wasted 5-10 Minutes just Chipping Away at that Ship and by the Time he Killed it. The Battle will be Over.

 

 

Fun Fact for You.

Unicum Players will often Completely Ignore Targets that Attack them.

Because for a Unicum Player this is Irrelevant. He Identifies the Targets he Needs to Kill based on these Targets Importance to the Match.

And some Potato BB Firing at him from the Rear Line and doing 1-5k Damage per Minute is just a Relevant Target for the Match.

That Enemy Radar Cruiser behind the Island blocking his own DDs and Enabling the Enemy Team of doing 30-50k Damage to his Team every Minute its Alive due to Spotting. Is a much Bigger Priority.

 

 

Again Mate.

This is not a 1 vs 1

Stop thinking of the Game in Terms of it being all about 1 Ship Fighting 1 other Ship.

You are not Winning the Match by trying to Manfight a Single Enemy You want Dead.

You Win by creating Tactical and Strategic Advantages that cause the Enemy Teams Positioning to Break Apart and get Killed by Focused Fire from Several Allies.

 

So the CV Bombed You and You cant Shoot him ?

Well Yes and now ?

Do You go after every Enemy BB that Fired a Salvo at You from 20km away ???

 

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

Against any other ship you can at least in theory dodge or hide behind an island.

 

Theory vs Realtiy.

You are well aware that in Reality You cant.

 

Its the same as the CV Lovers claiming that DDs are Better than CVs and that DDs are Unkillable for CVs because they can just Hide with their Fleet.

Because Yeah Sure. A DD can do that. He can just Sit in between his BBs. No CV is ever gonna mange to Kill him there cause his Planes will just keep being Killed by the BBs without him landing any Effective Hits on the DD.

But by staying there the DD does nothing either. Its just a Waste of Time. Any Good CV Player would never bother Targeting a Useless DD like that anyways.

 

So Yeah Sure. In Theory You can just Hide behind an Island or Run Away.

But lets Face it. You could just as well not Play then because You are going to be useless Yourself.

 

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

Against subs you have very few options, you can dodge if you detect the torps in time and manage to break the homing and if you do that, the sub just pings you again and chances are torps are on the way before your repair skill is ready to break the lock again.

 

Again. You keep Obsessing with this But Refuse to Try it for Yourself.

Try Playing a Submarine and See just how Easily Others Dodge your Homing Torps without ever Bothering to Damage Con your Ping.

 

If I notice that I am Targeted by a Sub I never Damage Con a Ping at all. Because the Homing Effect is so Easy to Abuse to make the Torps easy to Dodge that removing it would actually Increase the Risk of being Hit by the Torps as then I cant Steer them to miss me.

 

Homing Torps Always Home for an Virtual Point in Front of Your Ship so that when they come within 1km of You and Lose the Homing Effect they will Hit You.

But this also means that if You can Super Easily Dodge them by just not Removing the Ping and then Just Avoid the Point they are Aiming For once they are closer than 1km.

 

The Easiest Way is to Turn out and Drive Away from the Sub at a Slight Diagonal Line.

Then when the Torps are about 1km behind You. You just Shift Your Nose to one Side and then to the Other. Driving a Mini S Curve so that Your Line no Longer Intersects with the Homing Torps that Now will just keep going in a Straight Line to the Position You are no longer Heading for.

On Broadside its Harder because You need to use your Acceleration and Time it Right. Because you need to Start Turning Out before the Torps Lose Homing and then the Moment they Lose Homing You need to Slow down so that they Pass by In front of You as they Aimed for a Point in Front of You. (You must Turn out because if You Turn in the Virtual Point they Choose is Closer to Your real Position making it more likely that You cant Slow down Fast enough.)

 

 

 

Again. Just Play Subs Yourself.

You will very Quickly Realize that the Majority of Your Torps will Hit nothing.

 

 

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

I have never said its easy to play subs, but the current mechanics makes it near impossible to reliably protect against them in certain ships, simply because of "agility" and the lack of detection - and if you try to close the distance to the sub, so you get into range with your bombers, the subs just stay submerged and shotgun you from extreme close range, where dodgning is impossible.

 

And how do they do that ?

They are Slow and have only a few Minutes of Dive Capacity.

They cant See anything underwater either.

Shotgunning is something they can only do with Spotting Support from a CV or DD or when the Enemy is too close to their Team and thus Exposed.

 

Worse. Shotgunning is the same as Yoloing with a Torpedo DD.

Yeah Sure You might take the other Guy Along. But You are extremely Likely to Die in the Process Too.

 

If a Shima Yoloes Your Cruiser or BB only being Spotted 5.6km away and then Easily Closing in to 3-4km before You have any Serious Chance of Killing it. Then You wont be Evading its 15 Torps either.

But why should the Shima do that ? Its much more effective to Just keep Launching Torps without Killing itself in such a Suicide Move.

 

Its no Different for a Sub.

Shotgunning is a Last Ditch Attempt of Desperation to take down the Enemy that is about to Kill You.

Its basicly nothing else than a Shima being Corner by a Radar Cruiser and going for Desperate Yolo hoping he Can Shotgun the Radar Cruiser before the Shima is Killed.

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

I hate carriers, but I can live with them since you can dodge and most ships have some kind of AA, subs in the current form breaks the game when there are multiple of them in the game simply because not all ships have detection possibility.

 

Just saying. But Submarine Torps can be Dodged ALOT Easier than CV Attacks lol.

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

And if wargaming refuse to give all ships the possibility to detect subs - at least allow the bombers that drop depth charges to have a range that matches the range where subs can ping you from, so you can send bombers to at least try to bomb the sub.

 

And why does my Cruiser not get the Range to Match all BBs Range ?

Why can my DD Torps not all go 20 or more Kilometers ?

Why dont all Ships have Radar to Detect DDs that keep Spamming Torps at them ?

 

Range is an Importand Factor in the Game Mate.

Its an Importand Tool of Balancing for the Ship Inferior in a Direct Confrontation.

Submarines are currently the Weakest Ships in the Game in a Direct Fight.

If they get Detected they Stand no Chance.

 

If All Ships had the Tools to Detect Subs at Range then Subs could just as well be Removed because they would never do anything.

They would be like a DD in a Match Full of Radar Cruisers.

 

Of Course that would not happen.

In that Case WG would then be forced to Balance the Game. Meaning if all Ships had the Tools to Detect Subs. Subs would Suddenly be very Hard to Kill and would Do Insane Damage so they can Win a Direct Fight if Detected.

 

44 minutes ago, plain_average said:

And you saying because you dont think there is a problem=No problem - is just plain wrong - there needs a counter to subs and the current mechanics are not really a counter - its a piss poor implementation because wargaming rushed subs into the game without considering the implications for all ship types.

 

There is already Tons of Counters to Subs.

In Fact there is already Too many Counters to Subs. Subs are Currently one of the Weakest Shipclasses in the Game. Generally being extremely Easy to Counter for Skilled Players.

 

You just Refuse to Learn the Counters Mate.

 

 

 

 

28 minutes ago, SmegTheNoob said:

I wasn't directly addressing you. It was a general comment meant to address Zuihou_Kai_Ni.

 

But I will attempt to answer your arrogant, and frankly insulting comments.

 

1. I have tried many times in a slow BB to avoid homing torps. Probably 75% of the time I fail. Is that a skill issue? I would say it is not. You seem to forget that a very slow BB such as any of the mid tier US BB's are hard to turn. They are sluggish to respond to rudder imput, and they are slow as hell. So I and many other players find it hard to avoid the homing torps. It is a waste of time using your Damage Control to mitigate the sonar ping lock. The sub just pings you again.

 

2. The reason I don't play Subs has got nothing to do with my pigheaded stubbornness. I have no interest in playing Subs. I knew right from the start, that Wargaming will NEVER be able to balance them fairly. If they did, they would never have come up with the stupid homing torps mechanic in the first place. But Wargaming knew they would have to give Subs a gimmick to get people to actually play them. If I wanted to play a far better Submarine game, then I would go and play U-Boat or the Silent Hunter games. I have Silent Hunter 3, 4 & 5, and U-boat.

 

3. I can count on one hand, how many Subs I have killed with Air Dropped Depth Charges. Is that a skill issue? No it F_____g isn't. There is the silly banana thing on the surface that is never that accurate a location. There is also a big chance that you don't even spot the banana thing. Then there is the time it takes the planes to arrive and the time for the bomb to go off. The Sub can easily turn away to avoid this attack. But I am sorry, I thought you said that it was easy to kill Subs.

 

 

Thanks for the Compliment *gg*

 

But Sorry.

General Comments are Never Addressed at a Single Person.

If You make a Comment that Challenges others. Dont Expect others to Ignore that Challenge just because You did not Directly Mention them.

 

 

1.

No You havnt.

You just keep Playing BBs and get Killed by Subs so You have been Crying here for Months. Long Past the Time almost All others have Long Stopped Caring.

 

Needless to Mention that Now You are already Running Away from the Argument by going from "Submarine Homing Torps cannot be Dodged and Submarines are Invulnearble if Submerged" to "If You as an Average Player use the Slowest BBs in the Game You can only Dodge 25% of the Homing Torps Fired At You."

 

Thats Quite the Jump Mate lol

 

 

I also Dont get why You guys are So Focused on Using Your Damage Control.

Using Damage Con on Submarine Pings is the same as Using it on a Single Fire.

Its an Idiotic Noob Mistake that only makes You an Easier Target.

WG even Allowing to Remove the Ping using Damage Con is a Noobtrap to begin with.

They Should just Remove that Function and make the Ping Unremovable.

 

The Ping is Your Free Card to Guarantee Dodging the Torps. Because that way they will Always Home in on that Virtual Point in Front of Your Ship.

Allowing You to Guide the Torps to a Point and then Evade that Point once they Lose the Homing once they get Close to You.

 

Read above for a more Detailed Explanation or Wait for Zuiho´s Video on it.

 

 

2.

And Yet You keep Claiming stuff about Subs. A Class that You have no Idea how it Works and Refuse to Play.

 

You are Like an Armchair General trying to Explain Real War Tactics to Active Military Personnel Mate.

If You Refuse to Play Subs and Learn about them thats Fine.

But then Dont make Claims on what they can do etc.

Because You have no Idea about them.

 

Otherwise You just make a Clown of Yourself.

 

 

3.

Meanwhile I cant Count on 1 Hand how many Times I got Killed by a Sub in a BB.

But thats just Personal Bias.

 

Problem is Mate. You Refuse to Learn how to Deal with the Problem.

But the Problem wont go away.

 

You either Learn to Deal with it. Or You can keep Crying Uselessly Forever.

 

 

 

I am just telling You the Easiest Way to Learn how to Deal with the Problem.

And that is to Simply Play Submarines for a while.

Because that way Other Players Will Demonstrate to You the Methods that can Easily Kill Subs and the Maneuvers that can Easily Evade Homing Torps etc.

 

But as Long as You just Refuse to make the Effort. All You can do is Cry, Cry and Cry some more even tough Nobody will ever Hear You.

 

 

 

15 minutes ago, plain_average said:

Sunleader is just a troll that likes to stir crap up, he has not grasp on reality or are playing high tier exclusively where ships are better and potentially better to handle subs.

 

 

 

[SmegTheNoob]

9 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Pls dont Project your own Inabilities on others.

 

 

And why do you need Detection Gear ?

Subs 90% of the Time get Killed without being in Range of Hydro. They get Spotted by a DD or get Spammed by Depth Charges from BBs without being Spotted at all.

 

You keep Saying its Impossible its Impossible. But the Fact is that others are Dealing with it without any Problems.

The Fact is Also that You cannot even be bothered to Play Subs and Prove Your Point.

 

 

 

Needless to mention that 3 Torpedo DDs on each Side would have been even Worse. Because they not only Outspot everything except each other but also are Fast enough to make it Completely Impossible for BBs to even try Fighting them.

Yet You dont seem to Cry about that.

 

 

 

 

Well. How do Cruisers without Torps Fight BBs ?

How do Torpedo DDs Fight Gun DDs without Friendly Radar Cruisers Helping them ?

How do CVs Fight in Battles where there is no Ships with Weak AA ?

How do BBs Fight Torpedo DDs when they dont have DDs or CVs Spotting for them ?

 

The Answer is Simple.

If You are at a Disadvantage.

Its a 12 vs 12 Game Mate. You cant always be the Top Tier and be the Shipclass that got Lucky thanks to Matchmaking not giving any Hardcounters to it.

Sometimes You have to Fight as the Bottom Tier in the Shipclass that MM disadvantaged in this Battle.

 

This is True for All Ships in the Game.

Sometimes MM is Nice and sometimes it not.

A Sub may Run into a Game where all Enemy DDs are Big Gun DDs and where all Enemy Cruisers are Heavy Torpedo Cruisers that are Spotted far beyond Hydro Range and dont have much way of Dealing with Subs.

Likewise a Sub can Run Into a Game where most of the Enemy DDs Outspot it on the Surface. Where the Enemy got Several Radar Cruisers that can Stealth Radar and thus the moment they get Spotted use their Radar to Reveal the Sub and have Depth Charges Rain on it.

 

Such is Life in the Game Mate.

 

 

As I said before.

If You cant Deal with that go Play Tier 1 where You dont have any Real Asymetric Balancing.

 

 

Except that an AA Cruiser or two Random Cruisers can Whittle down most CVs way faster than the CV can Whittle Down him.

If a Unicum CV tries to Kill a Unicum Surface Ship in a Random Battle.

If the Surface Ship Prioritizes Survival. The CV will not manage to Kill it before the Match Ends. Because he will Spend too much Time just Flying long Distance and lose too many Planes trying to Hit the Ship.

If the Surface Ship Prioritizes doing his Job the CV might Kill it after 5-10 Minutes. But in that Time he basicly did nothing of Value for his Team and the Match will likely already be Over.

 

Its no Different than if a Tier 10 BB were to try the Same.

Sure if that Tier 10 BB Constantly Only Focuses on that Surface Ship and keeps Firing at it from 25km away.

And the Enemy Ship Prioritizes doing its Job instead of just Running away. The BB may Kill that Ship. But he wasted 5-10 Minutes just Chipping Away at that Ship and by the Time he Killed it. The Battle will be Over.

 

 

Fun Fact for You.

Unicum Players will often Completely Ignore Targets that Attack them.

Because for a Unicum Player this is Irrelevant. He Identifies the Targets he Needs to Kill based on these Targets Importance to the Match.

And some Potato BB Firing at him from the Rear Line and doing 1-5k Damage per Minute is just a Relevant Target for the Match.

That Enemy Radar Cruiser behind the Island blocking his own DDs and Enabling the Enemy Team of doing 30-50k Damage to his Team every Minute its Alive due to Spotting. Is a much Bigger Priority.

 

 

Again Mate.

This is not a 1 vs 1

Stop thinking of the Game in Terms of it being all about 1 Ship Fighting 1 other Ship.

You are not Winning the Match by trying to Manfight a Single Enemy You want Dead.

You Win by creating Tactical and Strategic Advantages that cause the Enemy Teams Positioning to Break Apart and get Killed by Focused Fire from Several Allies.

 

So the CV Bombed You and You cant Shoot him ?

Well Yes and now ?

Do You go after every Enemy BB that Fired a Salvo at You from 20km away ???

 

 

 

Theory vs Realtiy.

You are well aware that in Reality You cant.

 

Its the same as the CV Lovers claiming that DDs are Better than CVs and that DDs are Unkillable for CVs because they can just Hide with their Fleet.

Because Yeah Sure. A DD can do that. He can just Sit in between his BBs. No CV is ever gonna mange to Kill him there cause his Planes will just keep being Killed by the BBs without him landing any Effective Hits on the DD.

But by staying there the DD does nothing either. Its just a Waste of Time. Any Good CV Player would never bother Targeting a Useless DD like that anyways.

 

So Yeah Sure. In Theory You can just Hide behind an Island or Run Away.

But lets Face it. You could just as well not Play then because You are going to be useless Yourself.

 

 

 

Again. You keep Obsessing with this But Refuse to Try it for Yourself.

Try Playing a Submarine and See just how Easily Others Dodge your Homing Torps without ever Bothering to Damage Con your Ping.

 

If I notice that I am Targeted by a Sub I never Damage Con a Ping at all. Because the Homing Effect is so Easy to Abuse to make the Torps easy to Dodge that removing it would actually Increase the Risk of being Hit by the Torps as then I cant Steer them to miss me.

 

Homing Torps Always Home for an Virtual Point in Front of Your Ship so that when they come within 1km of You and Lose the Homing Effect they will Hit You.

But this also means that if You can Super Easily Dodge them by just not Removing the Ping and then Just Avoid the Point they are Aiming For once they are closer than 1km.

 

The Easiest Way is to Turn out and Drive Away from the Sub at a Slight Diagonal Line.

Then when the Torps are about 1km behind You. You just Shift Your Nose to one Side and then to the Other. Driving a Mini S Curve so that Your Line no Longer Intersects with the Homing Torps that Now will just keep going in a Straight Line to the Position You are no longer Heading for.

On Broadside its Harder because You need to use your Acceleration and Time it Right. Because you need to Start Turning Out before the Torps Lose Homing and then the Moment they Lose Homing You need to Slow down so that they Pass by In front of You as they Aimed for a Point in Front of You. (You must Turn out because if You Turn in the Virtual Point they Choose is Closer to Your real Position making it more likely that You cant Slow down Fast enough.)

 

 

 

Again. Just Play Subs Yourself.

You will very Quickly Realize that the Majority of Your Torps will Hit nothing.

 

 

 

 

And how do they do that ?

They are Slow and have only a few Minutes of Dive Capacity.

They cant See anything underwater either.

Shotgunning is something they can only do with Spotting Support from a CV or DD or when the Enemy is too close to their Team and thus Exposed.

 

Worse. Shotgunning is the same as Yoloing with a Torpedo DD.

Yeah Sure You might take the other Guy Along. But You are extremely Likely to Die in the Process Too.

 

If a Shima Yoloes Your Cruiser or BB only being Spotted 5.6km away and then Easily Closing in to 3-4km before You have any Serious Chance of Killing it. Then You wont be Evading its 15 Torps either.

But why should the Shima do that ? Its much more effective to Just keep Launching Torps without Killing itself in such a Suicide Move.

 

Its no Different for a Sub.

Shotgunning is a Last Ditch Attempt of Desperation to take down the Enemy that is about to Kill You.

Its basicly nothing else than a Shima being Corner by a Radar Cruiser and going for Desperate Yolo hoping he Can Shotgun the Radar Cruiser before the Shima is Killed.

 

 

Just saying. But Submarine Torps can be Dodged ALOT Easier than CV Attacks lol.

 

 

And why does my Cruiser not get the Range to Match all BBs Range ?

Why can my DD Torps not all go 20 or more Kilometers ?

Why dont all Ships have Radar to Detect DDs that keep Spamming Torps at them ?

 

Range is an Importand Factor in the Game Mate.

Its an Importand Tool of Balancing for the Ship Inferior in a Direct Confrontation.

Submarines are currently the Weakest Ships in the Game in a Direct Fight.

If they get Detected they Stand no Chance.

 

If All Ships had the Tools to Detect Subs at Range then Subs could just as well be Removed because they would never do anything.

They would be like a DD in a Match Full of Radar Cruisers.

 

Of Course that would not happen.

In that Case WG would then be forced to Balance the Game. Meaning if all Ships had the Tools to Detect Subs. Subs would Suddenly be very Hard to Kill and would Do Insane Damage so they can Win a Direct Fight if Detected.

 

 

There is already Tons of Counters to Subs.

In Fact there is already Too many Counters to Subs. Subs are Currently one of the Weakest Shipclasses in the Game. Generally being extremely Easy to Counter for Skilled Players.

 

You just Refuse to Learn the Counters Mate.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the Compliment *gg*

 

But Sorry.

General Comments are Never Addressed at a Single Person.

If You make a Comment that Challenges others. Dont Expect others to Ignore that Challenge just because You did not Directly Mention them.

 

 

1.

No You havnt.

You just keep Playing BBs and get Killed by Subs so You have been Crying here for Months. Long Past the Time almost All others have Long Stopped Caring.

 

Needless to Mention that Now You are already Running Away from the Argument by going from "Submarine Homing Torps cannot be Dodged and Submarines are Invulnearble if Submerged" to "If You as an Average Player use the Slowest BBs in the Game You can only Dodge 25% of the Homing Torps Fired At You."

 

Thats Quite the Jump Mate lol

 

 

I also Dont get why You guys are So Focused on Using Your Damage Control.

Using Damage Con on Submarine Pings is the same as Using it on a Single Fire.

Its an Idiotic Noob Mistake that only makes You an Easier Target.

WG even Allowing to Remove the Ping using Damage Con is a Noobtrap to begin with.

They Should just Remove that Function and make the Ping Unremovable.

 

The Ping is Your Free Card to Guarantee Dodging the Torps. Because that way they will Always Home in on that Virtual Point in Front of Your Ship.

Allowing You to Guide the Torps to a Point and then Evade that Point once they Lose the Homing once they get Close to You.

 

Read above for a more Detailed Explanation or Wait for Zuiho´s Video on it.

 

 

2.

And Yet You keep Claiming stuff about Subs. A Class that You have no Idea how it Works and Refuse to Play.

 

You are Like an Armchair General trying to Explain Real War Tactics to Active Military Personnel Mate.

If You Refuse to Play Subs and Learn about them thats Fine.

But then Dont make Claims on what they can do etc.

Because You have no Idea about them.

 

Otherwise You just make a Clown of Yourself.

 

 

3.

Meanwhile I cant Count on 1 Hand how many Times I got Killed by a Sub in a BB.

But thats just Personal Bias.

 

Problem is Mate. You Refuse to Learn how to Deal with the Problem.

But the Problem wont go away.

 

You either Learn to Deal with it. Or You can keep Crying Uselessly Forever.

 

 

 

I am just telling You the Easiest Way to Learn how to Deal with the Problem.

And that is to Simply Play Submarines for a while.

Because that way Other Players Will Demonstrate to You the Methods that can Easily Kill Subs and the Maneuvers that can Easily Evade Homing Torps etc.

 

But as Long as You just Refuse to make the Effort. All You can do is Cry, Cry and Cry some more even tough Nobody will ever Hear You.

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. Stop calling me mate. I am not your mate. Never will be your mate. So stop it with the pathetic patronising.

 

2. You keep telling players like me to just go play Subs to find out.

WELL HOW MANY FFING TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU I HAVE NO INTEREST IN EVER PLAYING ANY SUBMARINE IN  THIS GAME.

Get that fact, lodged, and stop telling us to go play Subs.

[Sunleader]

1 hour ago, SmegTheNoob said:

1. Stop calling me mate. I am not your mate. Never will be your mate. So stop it with the pathetic patronising.

 

2. You keep telling players like me to just go play Subs to find out.

WELL HOW MANY FFING TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU I HAVE NO INTEREST IN EVER PLAYING ANY SUBMARINE IN  THIS GAME.

Get that fact, lodged, and stop telling us to go play Subs.

 

Well Mate.

Then get the Fact that People will just Tell You to Shut up because You got no Idea what You are Talking about into that Hard Skull of Yours :)

Because as Long as You keep Talking about Submarines without having any Idea how they Work. Others will keep Telling You to Actually Play them.

Thats the Logical thing to Tell Ya Mate.

 

Its Like You are Screaming at others "I am Thirsty. I am Thirsty" Well. Others will keep telling You "Then Drink something"

You can tell us a Million Times that You dont want to Drink something. But as long as You go around Screaming You are Thirsty. People will always keep telling You to Drink something.

[SmegTheNoob]

12 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Well Mate.

Then get the Fact that People will just Tell You to Shut up because You got no Idea what You are Talking about into that Hard Skull of Yours :)

Because as Long as You keep Talking about Submarines without having any Idea how they Work. Others will keep Telling You to Actually Play them.

Thats the Logical thing to Tell Ya Mate.

 

Its Like You are Screaming at others "I am Thirsty. I am Thirsty" Well. Others will keep telling You "Then Drink something"

You can tell us a Million Times that You dont want to Drink something. But as long as You go around Screaming You are Thirsty. People will always keep telling You to Drink something.

You know what I find hilarious?

It's the fact that you bang on telling players like me to "GO PLAY SUBS".

Yet you have hardly played them yourself.

So, lets take a look shall we?

Total games played in Submarines since full release = 41, HMM, that's not much lol.

Total games in Submarines before full release = 100, that's not much considering you have over 6800 random battles played.

Oh and apart from 1 battle in a Cahelot and a U-2501, all the rest of your Sub games since release have been in the U-190, a massive 39 battles.

You haven't even bothered to play the U-69 either. I guess that one is far too low a tier for you eh?

 

So, I think you are hardly qualified to state that you know how Subs work because you have played them a lot.

Funny that isn't it?

[Sunleader]

1 hour ago, SmegTheNoob said:

You know what I find hilarious?

It's the fact that you bang on telling players like me to "GO PLAY SUBS".

Yet you have hardly played them yourself.

So, lets take a look shall we?

Total games played in Submarines since full release = 41, HMM, that's not much lol.

Total games in Submarines before full release = 100, that's not much considering you have over 6800 random battles played.

Oh and apart from 1 battle in a Cahelot and a U-2501, all the rest of your Sub games since release have been in the U-190, a massive 39 battles.

You haven't even bothered to play the U-69 either. I guess that one is far too low a tier for you eh?

 

So, I think you are hardly qualified to state that you know how Subs work because you have played them a lot.

Funny that isn't it?

 

Hahahaha ^^

I guess You dont know how Statistics Work either.

But Nice Try at Misleading Others.

 

 

Now then there is 2 Major Issues with Your little Rant there.

 

 

A.

I am not a Main Submarine Player.  lol

I Played Submarines to Learn the mechanics so I can Counter them and make their Lifes Hell *gg*

And while I Play all Classes fairly Equally. I am a BB Main and like to Play BB most of the Time.

I got no Intention to become a Submarine Main.

(By the way. I like DDs Least of all Classes.)

 

 

B.

Sorry. But Your Statistics Are Completely False.

Which is not Surprising because it Seems You dont really know how they work.

Statistics only Track Coop, Random and Ranked Battles.

 

 

So:

 

1.

Yes I got 6800 Battles in Randoms. And only 41 of these are on Subs.

But I barely ever Play Randoms anymore nowdays lol

Usually I Play the Active Events.

Right now I play the Zepplin Mode all the Time.

I think the last Time I actually Played Randoms Actively was like Last Year around Halloween. Because I didnt like the Halloween Event Mode but wanted to Play Warships.

 

For Example.

I have Played over 50 Battles in the last 2 Days.

But You wont See these. Because the Last Random Battles I Played were Last Week with a few Friends :)

 

2.

Its Nice that You Point out I only got 41 Sub Battles since Release and then make a Big Deal of the 6800 Battles in Total.

But You dont even bother Mentioning that I have been around here for over 10 Years Now. While Subs have been Released less than a Year Ago.

So Yeah.

Fun Fact for You.

Out of the about 160 Battles Random Battles I Played in 2022.  41 were Battles in Submarines :)

As I said. I Play ALL Classes lol

Sorry for not being a Potato like You that only Plays One Class.

 

3.

Uhm. No Offense to You.

But why Should I play the Tier 6 German Sub when I got the Tier 8 German Sub from a Crate ?

And Yes. I have not Yet really Played the US Subs. The Zeppelin Event is not for T6 unfortunately.

And I got more than enough T8 and T9 Ships whose Lines I am Grinding Currently.

So I am not going to Switch Gamemodes just to Level the US Submarine Line.

 

 

 

So Yeah.

Again Mate.

 

Maybe Actually Try Learning the Mechanics and Stuff You Talk about.

If You try to Argue on a Topic which You dont Understand You will always just end up Looking like a Clown.

 

[FloatingTarget]

22 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Hahahaha ^^

I guess You dont know how Statistics Work either.

But Nice Try at Misleading Others.

 

 

Now then there is 2 Major Issues with Your little Rant there.

 

 

A.

I am not a Main Submarine Player.  lol

I Played Submarines to Learn the mechanics so I can Counter them and make their Lifes Hell *gg*

And while I Play all Classes fairly Equally. I am a BB Main and like to Play BB most of the Time.

I got no Intention to become a Submarine Main.

(By the way. I like DDs Least of all Classes.)

 

 

B.

Sorry. But Your Statistics Are Completely False.

Which is not Surprising because it Seems You dont really know how they work.

Statistics only Track Coop, Random and Ranked Battles.

 

 

So:

 

1.

Yes I got 6800 Battles in Randoms. And only 41 of these are on Subs.

But I barely ever Play Randoms anymore nowdays lol

Usually I Play the Active Events.

Right now I play the Zepplin Mode all the Time.

I think the last Time I actually Played Randoms Actively was like Last Year around Halloween. Because I didnt like the Halloween Event Mode but wanted to Play Warships.

 

For Example.

I have Played over 50 Battles in the last 2 Days.

But You wont See these. Because the Last Random Battles I Played were Last Week with a few Friends :)

 

2.

Its Nice that You Point out I only got 41 Sub Battles since Release and then make a Big Deal of the 6800 Battles in Total.

But You dont even bother Mentioning that I have been around here for over 10 Years Now. While Subs have been Released less than a Year Ago.

So Yeah.

Fun Fact for You.

Out of the about 160 Battles Random Battles I Played in 2022.  41 were Battles in Submarines :)

As I said. I Play ALL Classes lol

Sorry for not being a Potato like You that only Plays One Class.

 

3.

Uhm. No Offense to You.

But why Should I play the Tier 6 German Sub when I got the Tier 8 German Sub from a Crate ?

And Yes. I have not Yet really Played the US Subs. The Zeppelin Event is not for T6 unfortunately.

And I got more than enough T8 and T9 Ships whose Lines I am Grinding Currently.

So I am not going to Switch Gamemodes just to Level the US Submarine Line.

 

 

 

So Yeah.

Again Mate.

 

Maybe Actually Try Learning the Mechanics and Stuff You Talk about.

If You try to Argue on a Topic which You dont Understand You will always just end up Looking like a Clown.

 

You are the one trying to convince others that subs are wonderful, handy dandy and anyone that has a complaint is a noob that needs to learn to play because you are such an elite gamer that can teach everyone. Not sure if you have noticed but you are in a minority here, most people don't like subs and no amount of "stop sucking" is going to change their opinion until Wargaming takes their eyes away from their spreadsheets and our wallets and tries to address the issue. Even the simple act of removing homing torps could alleviate a lot of this, but that would make it less cheesy and easy for sub players because that's what they want, free damage.

 

I think you are the one looking like a clown "Maybe Actually Try Learning the Mechanics and Stuff You Talk about." as you decide to accuse people of knowing nothing despite these people having first hand experience of the matter. Your argument is "you suck, learn to play", as you can imagine, you are not endearing anyone to subs.

 

These issues with Subs and CVs didn't just magically appear, people wouldn't be complaining if they worked. Wargaming, wanting to rush out something to make money decided to implement something that was unbalanced and broken and yoiu are trying to tell us it's fine. If it was fine, their would be no-one with issues, I would not be posting this and you would not be trying to convince everyone it's fine.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

13 minutes ago, FloatingTarget said:

Your argument is "you suck, learn to play"

I mean honestly I tried my best to try to get you to see it from my viewpoint. Do you seriously believe I'm lying to you when I say that I don't have issues against subs?

I already agreed that homing torps are unnecessary simply because they are so easy to mitigate. I even offered to walk you through it personally (waiting for my friend to be ready for the recording that was requested.)

Why is it okay for you to make claims that things are impossible but you neither provide replays of how subs are torturing you but you expect me to use my and a friends time to make a recording?

I could also simply ignore you and leave you at sucking against homing torps. Why is it my business anyway that you can't deal with them? So I'll make you decide for me.

Are you interested as to why I claim that I have no issues against subs and want to learn how you also won't have issues against them or do you want me to just leave you alone in your belief?

[SmegTheNoob]

13 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Hahahaha ^^

I guess You dont know how Statistics Work either.

But Nice Try at Misleading Others.

 

 

Now then there is 2 Major Issues with Your little Rant there.

 

 

A.

I am not a Main Submarine Player.  lol

I Played Submarines to Learn the mechanics so I can Counter them and make their Lifes Hell *gg*

And while I Play all Classes fairly Equally. I am a BB Main and like to Play BB most of the Time.

I got no Intention to become a Submarine Main.

(By the way. I like DDs Least of all Classes.)

 

 

B.

Sorry. But Your Statistics Are Completely False.

Which is not Surprising because it Seems You dont really know how they work.

Statistics only Track Coop, Random and Ranked Battles.

 

 

So:

 

1.

Yes I got 6800 Battles in Randoms. And only 41 of these are on Subs.

But I barely ever Play Randoms anymore nowdays lol

Usually I Play the Active Events.

Right now I play the Zepplin Mode all the Time.

I think the last Time I actually Played Randoms Actively was like Last Year around Halloween. Because I didnt like the Halloween Event Mode but wanted to Play Warships.

 

For Example.

I have Played over 50 Battles in the last 2 Days.

But You wont See these. Because the Last Random Battles I Played were Last Week with a few Friends :)

 

2.

Its Nice that You Point out I only got 41 Sub Battles since Release and then make a Big Deal of the 6800 Battles in Total.

But You dont even bother Mentioning that I have been around here for over 10 Years Now. While Subs have been Released less than a Year Ago.

So Yeah.

Fun Fact for You.

Out of the about 160 Battles Random Battles I Played in 2022.  41 were Battles in Submarines :)

As I said. I Play ALL Classes lol

Sorry for not being a Potato like You that only Plays One Class.

 

3.

Uhm. No Offense to You.

But why Should I play the Tier 6 German Sub when I got the Tier 8 German Sub from a Crate ?

And Yes. I have not Yet really Played the US Subs. The Zeppelin Event is not for T6 unfortunately.

And I got more than enough T8 and T9 Ships whose Lines I am Grinding Currently.

So I am not going to Switch Gamemodes just to Level the US Submarine Line.

 

 

 

So Yeah.

Again Mate.

 

Maybe Actually Try Learning the Mechanics and Stuff You Talk about.

If You try to Argue on a Topic which You dont Understand You will always just end up Looking like a Clown.

 

God you are so full of your own importance.

 

I know exactly how the stats work.

They are on Wargamings web site for all to see.

The fact of the matter is that you do not have the battles in Subs to justify your claims.

Oh and how long have Subs been in early access testing? 2 years at least maybe? Its been over 3 years since Subs were announced by Wargaming.

Yet YOU have only played 100 battles in testing and a big fat 41 battles since release (randoms).

 

Oh and did you even bother to look at what ships I play?

Cruisers, BB's and DD's is the answer, no Subs or CV's.

So, no I am not a potato and I do not just play BB's.

But feel free to make fool out of yourself, and continue to spout your crap on the forums.

I shall be sure to add your name to my ever growing Black List.

 

[Yosha_AtaIante]

2 minutes ago, SmegTheNoob said:

The fact of the matter is that you do not have the battles in Subs to justify your claims.

You didn't even play them so how do you justify any of your claims?

But look, by the amount of battles I played I should have plenty of credibility about subs

I pretty much share his opinions. That should suffice for what he says to be pretty much on point?

 

[FloatingTarget]

1 minute ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

I mean honestly I tried my best to try to get you to see it from my viewpoint. Do you seriously believe I'm lying to you when I say that I don't have issues against subs?

I already agreed that homing torps are unnecessary simply because they are so easy to mitigate. I even offered to walk you through it personally (waiting for my friend to be ready for the recording that was requested.)

Why is it okay for you to make claims that thinks are impossible but you neither provide replays of how subs are torturing you but you expect me to use my and a friends time to make a recording?

I could also simply ignore you and leave you at sucking against homing torps. Why is it my business anyway that you can't deal with them? So I'll make you decide for me.

Are you interested as to why I claim that I have no issues against subs and want to learn how you also won't have issues against them or do you want me to just leave you alone in your belief?

You yourself have said their are issues with homing torpedoes, you yourself have stated they are unnecessary, we both agree they should not be a thing but for different reasons. When you say "I'm trying to help you" it comes of condescending implying that I have not though of ways to avoid them, for example, being at an angle and swinging the body of the ship around them, well it does not work in a BB. But as you say I guess I suck against homing torps, but I feel fine as it appears that most people do, funny that?

 

"homing torps are unnecessary simply because they are so easy to mitigate" I'm afraid you live in a parallel world, because most players would disagree. I also don't expect you to make a recording, nor should you expect replays, I'm pretty bad at the game and there is much I can learn, but I assume you want a replay from the hordes of people who are suffering from homing torps so you can tell them they are doing it wrong.

 

"Are you interested as to why I claim that I have no issues against subs" you literally said that you don't think they should having homing torps, that's an issue.

[FloatingTarget]

1 minute ago, Zuihou_Kai_Ni said:

You didn't even play them so how do you justify any of your claims?

But look, by the amount of battles I played I should have plenty of credibility about subs

I pretty much share his opinions. That should suffice for what he says to be pretty much on point?

 

Yes yes, you are an elite awesome sub player, he's not talking about playing as subs is he though? He's talking about playing against them. A person doesn't need to punch someone in the face to have an opinion on being punched in the face if they have been punched in the face.

[Yosha_AtaIante]

1 minute ago, FloatingTarget said:

I'm pretty bad at the game and there is much I can learn

If you agree on this, then why dont you let me teach you and you will never have a problem against homing torps again? I literally want to give you the solution...

[Yosha_AtaIante]

Just now, FloatingTarget said:

he's not talking about playing as subs is he though?

He actually is, just read his post again, he claimed that sunleader barely plays subs therefore has no idea how they work.

There it is in his post. It seems like you really really aggressively are trying to make what I say out to be nonsense. Can you please try to view this topic more objectively again?