Jump to content
You need to play a total of 1 battles to post in this section.
The_EURL_Guy

Submarine Testing

218 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

[CATS]
Players
31,591 posts
15,876 battles
Just now, Pikkozoikum said:

So the DD goes not closer than 4 km, if he can't manage the spotting state. SS are not known for being high speed boats, epsecially submerged

But Subs can push DD out of the caps that way.

 

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[AOLH]
[AOLH]
Players
30 posts

I remember during the test fase that one sub (last one standing from the other team) could still win a game over 3 BB's, bij killing them easely or just stayed submerged when ahead of caps, till the game was over .... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BHSFL]
Players
646 posts
4 minutes ago, OldDawg said:

I remember during the test fase that one sub (last one standing from the other team) could still win a game over 3 BB's, bij killing them easely or just stayed submerged when ahead of caps, till the game was over .... 

 Oh you mean like a DD can simply stealth torp and outrun the BBs?

  • Cool 1
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NEXT]
Players
6,396 posts
12,351 battles
26 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

But Subs can push DD out of the caps that way.

 

Or the DD rushes and kills the sub. When we talk about 1vs1, then DD will have an easy game. If talk about Teams, well then there is never a "counter".

You can go with the same scenario DD vs Radarcruisers. The DD can spot the Radar cruser and he get nuked. Or the Radar cruiser radars the DD and he get nuked.

I mean a radar cruiser can't just push into a DD just because he is a counter.

 

" The action range of destroyer Hydrophones has been increased to about 7 km. "

  • Bad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[DUXTR]
Alpha Tester
1,043 posts

Some skill was needed to Lock Torps on the target and u removed that and made it easier…….rly?

Why?

Did the tomatoes complain?

U move steadily in the direction where I`ll have no WG games installed om my pc.

Keep it up.

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[CATS]
Players
31,591 posts
15,876 battles
11 minutes ago, WWDragon said:

Really? You pulling that one?

It is ok when you think that a DD can hang around spotted...

 

8 minutes ago, Pikkozoikum said:

Or the DD rushes and kills the sub.

Not really.

What happens is that the DD has to bridge these 4km while being spotted.

If the Sub is halfway competent, he will turn around and increase the time until the DD reaches him by a few seconds, while the Subs teammates have free shots at the DD.

Should the DD survive until he can use depth charges, the Sub will just deep dive and reduce the damage, while the DD gets the finishing touches by the Subs team, since the DD decreased the distance to the shooters.

 

A 1v1 of Sub and DD will happen when the match is mostly over or the Sub player is completly incompetent and leaves his team behind.

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,147 posts
16,419 battles

At the very least get rid of guided torpedoes. In addition, the whole mechanic of two pings = torpedo magically phases through the target's torpedo protection is beyond idiotic and broken as well. What's the use of torpedo protection? Radical thought: to protect against torpedoes? How do you bypass this with two pings?

 

If you must shove this class down our throats, you need to go back to the original concept introduced at halloween - subs get forward and aft tubes from which they can fire unguided torps if they're on the surface or at periscope depth. Time spent below the surface was limited. Doesn't matter by what, oxygen, battery power, whatever, but rationing your underwater time meant you had to think about positioning and timing your attacks. So far this class seems like it'll be both miserable to play, and miserable to play against.

  • Cool 11

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[WG]
[WG]
WG Staff
7,029 posts
4,551 battles
Před 1 hodinou Deckeru_Maiku řekl/a:

So WG really continues this idiocy? Wow... Vodka must have gotten much more expensive, so they have to drop lows to sell new ships...

 

None of the changes announced helps against the problems we all saw during the last testing phase... but go ahead, WG.. you also the CV reee-work even when many skilled CV players told you that it would an idiotic move... nobody expects any logical choices from you anyway nowadays...

That is not true, that the are no changes for main problems, that were highlighted in last season. Mostly players wanted ASW for other ship types, even those planes were often mentioned. So we implemented them.

You can still recharge battery underwater, but only up to 30%, while if you are under 20% the width of the sonar ping will be more narrow. This will make really difficult to actually hit something for submarine, that decide to stay underwater for long time.

Another huge problem was the depth, were in 6.1m submarine was immune to HE shells. Now, you can damage Submarine with HE shells, rockets or bombs in depth of 10m.

Spotting of the submarine also changed, so DDs should have more advantage in fight against Submarines, especially with extended hydrophone.

 

There are much more ways how to fight Submarine. Also as was said here, that last time Submarine was able to hunt down last three remaining BBs, well submerged submarine is slower then slowest BB, so if you know approximately where the submarine is, you can simply run away...

 

 

Před 14 minutami SirAmra řekl/a:

Some skill was needed to Lock Torps on the target and u removed that and made it easier…….rly?

Why?

Did the tomatoes complain?

U move steadily in the direction where I`ll have no WG games installed om my pc.

Keep it up.

Well it won't be that easy. You need to hit the ship so the torpedoes start homing, but if there is no line of sight between Sub and highlighted part, torps will stop home. So agile ships can simply turn to break line of sight.

In order to hit the citadel of the ship with homing torpedoes, you need to hit the highlighted part twice. But this won't be easy as again players can maneouvre.

 

  • Cool 3
  • Boring 2
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[OLEUM]
Players
118 posts
12,545 battles

How long before CVs complain that submarines are stealth spotting them and are getting hit with ships with spotter plane

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[WG]
[WG]
WG Staff
7,029 posts
4,551 battles
Před 5 minutami Kokoblokis řekl/a:

super submarines are coming back to live server?

No, you need to download TST, as it is explained in the article

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[-RNR-]
Players
1,281 posts
14 minutes ago, batch1 said:

How long before CVs complain that submarines are stealth spotting them and are getting hit with ships with spotter plane

Subs and CVs add in the Hybrids create a special Battle mode and throw in those who get turned pink for regular team kills and Chat abuse as punishment... Sorted :crab::dance_turtle::Smile_hiding:

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BHSFL]
Players
646 posts
30 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

It is ok when you think that a DD can hang around spotted...

 

The whole DD must cap is the number one reason why DD get killed, they shouldnt ... going to cap makes then predictable and thats not even going about when there is no cap to begin with, I almost think when there is no cap the DD player simply crawls into a ball and start screaming "NO CAP! NO CAP!".

 

A sub that goes after a DD is a idiot because the DD can just rush it and DC it, if your argument is "DDs should never be spotted" then I am going to point out this is the argument some people like to use against CVs (except CVs are kind enough to tell you when you are about going to eat rockets/bombs/torps with advance notice unlike "suddenly torps"), a sub is going to have more issues after these changes because they going to have their spotting capabilities reduced as noted.

 

I think subs were already unfun to play requiring too much effort and attention to even fire their ONLY weapons without now being put in such a position everyone can just crap on then because in the end, what matters for the score board is damage, YOUR damage and ships with intentionally gimped weapon systems because of their "potential" are not fun to play, this is why KM DDs with 150mm guns are unliked despite their "potential" and why people complain about long reloads on main batteries and I am sure there are players that can use then to their full potential but to most players, they arent enjoyable and a whole class of ships that are unfun to play is going to stay dead.

 

  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NEXT]
Players
6,396 posts
12,351 battles
26 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

It is ok when you think that a DD can hang around spotted...

 

Not really.

What happens is that the DD has to bridge these 4km while being spotted.

If the Sub is halfway competent, he will turn around and increase the time until the DD reaches him by a few seconds, while the Subs teammates have free shots at the DD.

Should the DD survive until he can use depth charges, the Sub will just deep dive and reduce the damage, while the DD gets the finishing touches by the Subs team, since the DD decreased the distance to the shooters.

 

A 1v1 of Sub and DD will happen when the match is mostly over or the Sub player is completly incompetent and leaves his team behind.

And then? The submarine can't cap submerged, nor it is any maneuverable. The DD has 7km passive Hydro and will know about the submarine. The DD outspots him on surface.

The DD will be in advantage, that doesn'T mean that the DD can play brainless because "I'm a counter, I can ignore everything then".

 

As I said earlier, the DD decides everything.

At 7 km the DD gets awareness of the submarine.

-> Approach, when it's save, using islands etc

-> Not safe, stay on 4+ km.

 

The Submarine can do nothing against. It's slow and has limited view. So when a submarine wins over a DD then it's only because the DD was bad or just bad luck. That can always happen. But in general the DD is superior

 

For the case "Submarine just deep dives against DCs, while team shots him." Yes, there is a team then behind. Then don't approach, if a DD can't survive that. As I said, is the same like with a radar cruiser. You can play a radar cruiser and move straight otwards the dd and radar him. Then the Radar cruiser might die with a few salvos. If a DD plays against a SS that dumb, yes, he will lose :D

 

A 1v1 can always happen with any ship type. In this case the DD will be more likely win.

  • Bad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[WG]
[WG]
WG Staff
7,029 posts
4,551 battles
Před 1 minutou Pikkozoikum řekl/a:

@YabbaCoe, sometimes I feel sorry for devs and mods, when it seems, that people don't read more than the headlines :cap_book:

Its fine... Any case, we are here to explain that if needed. Probably we should more push players to watch the video. It explains what is new quite well :cap_like:

  • Cool 1
  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[JOLLY]
Players
557 posts
12,015 battles

allowing subs to stay perma submerged, is really, very very silly.

but perma submerged subs will be very popular among those that use 3rd party bots, among serial afkers, among all those that need regular toilet breaks, among griefers, and worse still/

I am especially worried that devs have not thought about the pitfalls, and unintended consuquences which may arise from the latest changes to sub gameplay. This happened once before on a major scale, Spring 2018, a certain CV rework.

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[RDNT]
Players
170 posts

@YabbaCoe Allow me to bump my Steam inquire once more:

 

Is this test only for WG-client player pool or will it be added for those of us on the Steam-client?

I've been through the news article a few times now but fail to see if it's been addressed elsewhere.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,442 posts
20,723 battles

I still am very pessimistic about the impact of subs on the game but I am conflicted;

 

Participate allowing me to give feedback (which WG will ignore) and WG will take that as proof the number of participants means subs are amazing or

 

Dont participate and all the people who wants subs no matter how badly implemented give only glowing or please buff feedback. 

 

Either way subs are coming WG see $$$ in subs, all I want is for them to be not broken and nothing I saw in that video gives me any confidence. 

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[THESO]
Weekend Tester, In AlfaTesters
4,402 posts
10,077 battles

Thats Dissappointing.

Whole Range of Critics from me here.

 

1.

Back to Seperate Test Server instead of using a proper distribution System this time.

So it will be Bot Fiesta....

 

2.

Subs lose ALL ability to Sneak up on Enemies.

Not only does everyone get Hydrophones.

But Subs will be Outspotted by most DDs which on top get a Hydrophone lock on them.

 

This will lead to Subs basicly becoming long range Torpedo Turrets that will just sit somewhere Bow in to the Enemy and Spam Torps from below their Allies.

Because they have no way to approach the Enemy anymore as they cannot avoid DDs for which they are Fodder.

 

This is basicly as if you gave all Cruisers the Location Skill and Nerfed DD Concealment so that most Cruisers outspot them....

 

3.

Everyone can Kill Subs even if they are Fully Submerged.

As almost all Cruisers get Hydro. This means all Cruisers can now Spot Subs easily even at deepest Dive level and everyone within 10km can Spam Airstrikes on it.

 

Which means a Sub has to stay away 4-5km from even enemy Heavy Cruisers.

 

4.

Test is still in T6 only which means we only get irrelevant Data as you cannot simulate actual capabilities of a Battle.

 

 

 

You could just as well remove Subs at this point.

I want Subs in the Game.

But not if they basicly become Torp Turrets sitting on some corner without moving...

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NEXT]
Players
6,396 posts
12,351 battles
2 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

1.

Back to Seperate Test Server instead of using a proper distribution System this time.

So it will be Bot Fiesta....

It's a normal approach.

Intern Tests -> Small group tests -> Large stress test.

You don't start with live tests ^^

People would cry and complain, when they include bugs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
3,576 posts
3 hours ago, WWDragon said:

I have to comment that my issues with submarines wasnt addressed and they just made then harder to play, in the live server test they seem to be utterly useless because of obtuse UI were the player spends more time trying to get a shoot in that anything else.

 

Someone at WG is deadset in a mechanic that simply doesnt work, pinging is a obtuse and annoying mechanic that in order to force the player to use it forces incredible tiny firing angles on torpedo tubes when in reality torpedoes had wide angles because they (torpedoes) were set to steer into a heading after being launched.

 

As long those wire-guided torpedoes exist I have absolutely no interest in submarines, not because they are broken but because they are unhistorical bullcrap and not because of "balance" reasons but because some developer at WG decided in this gameplay design that simply put, in my opinion is crap.

The ping will probably give away the subs position too so all the enemy fleet will home in on it, quick game for the sub player then, plus their advice is t stay to the flanks, so half the time the sub will try to stay undetected in i's mission to get behind the enemy fleet, how many players will just try to take out the red CV?

That said I look forward to testing them even if I my not do well in them.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×