How to play T10 radar cruiser and not get blapped

[Camperdown]

Hi,

 

I am currently playing Des Moines quite a bit. I like her, she has decent protection and good, fast firing guns.

As a DD main, I find it my role to try and support DDs at game start with radar around the caps. Of course that requires me to get uncomfortably close to the red team, so I try to use island cover as well as possible.

Still in half my games the second I open fire I get blapped by an 18" gunned BB I had not previously spotted for 3/4 of my health. OC that really reduces my usefulness for the rest of the game. It seems there is a group of 18" players who specialises in this trick.

Now this puts me in a dilemma. I can OC not try to radar caps in the first minutes. That feels lame, because if I blap a DD early on, that is a substantial advantage. But losing much of my health early in the game does not work either.

Any advice?

I have started to collect fxp to buy Alaska, because I hope she will be more resistant to 18" gunfire when properly angled. Do you think that that may work?

[ColonelPete]

• Play her like any other Tier X cruiser that does not get blapped
• after you mastered this, take note of cover on the maps and use it to your advantage
• on most maps it is possible to approach caps under cover, use that
• some of this cover even allows you to fire over
• watch for flanking moves of the enemy

[Beastofwar]

As i understood from the "waifu" joke references of that Cruiser line that such  Cruisers are not supposed to fire guns in open water but scrape along islands. Then stick some guns out, radar the cap, shoot the DD and retreat back to rock cover when retaliating fire is incoming. Or fire over the island when it is low enough on more distant targets like support Cruisers and BB.

 

You can read that in WG's wows wiki too :  https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Des_Moines

 

"While Des Moines has impressive firepower and AA, her maneuverability is mediocre and her armor is terrible. With a standard cruiser speed of 33 kts and fast base rudder shift time of 8.6 seconds, Des Moines can evade incoming shells and torpedoes relatively well. However, while she can turn well, the speed loss on turning is massive enough to make her an easy target for any other ship with their guns loaded and ready. Additionally, with her 27mm armor belt (as opposed to Zao and Hindenburg’s 30mm or Moskva’s 50mm) this makes her very susceptible to most battleship AP shells at most ranges. Additionally, because of how flat her bow is designed in comparison to the other Tier X heavy cruisers, this makes her extremely susceptible to enemy battleship AP shells being able to penetrate her citadel through her bow.

In contrast to her weak points, the Des Moines high shell arc and gun layout gives her a unique advantage that her cruiser colleagues at her tier lack and as such she is capable of weighing anchor behind an island and lob shells over the island at distant targets with relative safety. Should the island be too tall, one can also park the ship around the corner of an island while bow on to act as a deterrent to advancing enemy ships, while presenting a relatively small profile. Exploiting this technique allows one to turn a disadvantage into an advantage. Additionally, firing AP shells at bigger targets such as battleships can deal a surprising amount of damage in such a short time. However, it is recommended to do so only when she is close enough to have the rounds deal maximum penetration or if the target is broadside. Furthermore, given her rate of fire and decent fire chance, this makes Des Moines a deadly flamethrower to battleships within reach."

 

Alaska is different, it has the armour to fight other Cruisers in open water. Dueling non-distracted BB with a Cruiser always seems like a bad idea although some notorious fire breathing Cruisers still can. That may change with the captain skill rework as fire chance will be considerable lowered. After that Cruisers are supposed to fight Cruisers and DD as they should. And use torpedo's ( if they have them ) to kill BB.

 

 

[Allied_Winter]

With regards to Des Moines: How did you play the New Orleans, Baltimore and (to a certain extent) Buffalo?

 

Personally, when I'm on a map like ... let's say Hot Spot, I rush towards the nearest island on the next cap and park there until all enemies are known. Or ... at least all that could be a direct threat to me. However that's a high risk tactic. Sometimes your DDs die out in front of you, leaving you in a rather awkward spot.

 

If it helps you, I found a very old game of mine in the Des Moines:

 

 

Note: I got very, VERY lucky two times during this game. And some of it might no longer apply today (video is from Sep. 2017).

[Camperdown]

I think the answer with a decent team would be: stay silent behind island and let others shoot up the red DD. Now where do I find a decent team in WoWs 

[ghostbuster_]

1 hour ago, Camperdown said:

Hi,

 

I am currently playing Des Moines quite a bit. I like her, she has decent protection and good, fast firing guns.

As a DD main, I find it my role to try and support DDs at game start with radar around the caps. Of course that requires me to get uncomfortably close to the red team, so I try to use island cover as well as possible.

Still in half my games the second I open fire I get blapped by an 18" gunned BB I had not previously spotted for 3/4 of my health. OC that really reduces my usefulness for the rest of the game. It seems there is a group of 18" players who specialises in this trick.

Now this puts me in a dilemma. I can OC not try to radar caps in the first minutes. That feels lame, because if I blap a DD early on, that is a substantial advantage. But losing much of my health early in the game does not work either.

Any advice?

I have started to collect fxp to buy Alaska, because I hope she will be more resistant to 18" gunfire when properly angled. Do you think that that may work?

play baltimore and get better with her to understand how you should play des moines. even playing cleveland would help. radaring caps early on doesnt mean you should put yourself in a risky position. 

[GarrusBrutus]

1 hour ago, Camperdown said:

Still in half my games the second I open fire I get blapped by an 18" gunned BB I had not previously spotted for 3/4 of my health. 

This game is all about risk and reward. If you play this playstyle it works 50% of the time and the other 50% you get punished. It yields better results to play safe at the start of the match. I understand your urge to radar the caps at the start but if the map isn't suitable to do this, please refrain from pushing unnecessary at the start. Then it's better to play safe and preserve your HP. 

 

After the DDs have spotted all BBs, you can position accordingly. This prevents you from getting in positions you cannot get out of. That is the mistake most DM players make: they push straight for a cap and park next to an island to radar the cap. But often they cannot get out of this position anymore. A huge mistake. 

 

[TeaAndTorps]

This thread is definitely making me rethink my approach with Cleveland... There are some maps I'm struggling to grt to grips with in it (Shards and Tears of the Desert especially) and maybe playing a little more cautious at the start would pay off. I think that it often feels that it will only become more difficult to get into a useful position the longer I leave it, but probably I should train myself out of that.

[Allied_Winter]

6 minutes ago, TeaAndTorps said:

I think that it often feels that it will only become more difficult to get into a useful position the longer I leave it

Sometimes it is. As difficult to get out of a island when your DDs died and/or you got no support. If you wait longer you give up on the early cap support but gain information on where the enemy is and how you can proceed towards the next island/safe space.

[ForlornSailor]

2 hours ago, Camperdown said:

I have started to collect fxp to buy Alaska, because I hope she will be more resistant to 18" gunfire when properly angled. Do you think that that may work?

 

Not really. Because positioning is something, that Alaska also needs and profits from, to be really useful. Those heavy US cruisers have a very distinctive playstyle, I like to call them oppotunists. Sometimes you just want to keep your guns silent, especially when you are unsure about whats able to shoot you from where. On the other hand, DM can pick a fight (and win) with any ship in this game, if she can dictate the rules of engagement.

 

Its simply a matter of learning and experiance, where to position, how to position and which fights to pick. But you seem to be on the right track, since you are asking all the right questions and noticed, what gets you killed. I think, to help you improve further, its time to move to be more specific. So throw 2 or 3 replay files in here, so people can analyse your gameplay in detail and point to specific situations where you should do this or that.

[kapnobathrac]

Positioning is key in Des Moines . Often maps or spawnpoints lead to disadvantage. Bowing in will kill you anyway, even if it's not a citadel BBs will blap you in a few consecutive salvos from afar.  Lobbing shells is the best way but you can't always do that.

 

Best way to play des Moines is to play petropavlovsk instead lol

[semiGM]

The glorious DM island everybody knows...apart from me. Imagine finding an island where you camp behind, where you are able to shoot over (but it still hides you) on something somebody else spots for you (good joke) enemies in close range  This is usually the moment planes fly by, spot you through the island and enemy BBs instantly get a salvo off. When you play DM, keep in mind the enemy BBs with big guns (Georgia, Musashi, etc.) that can overmatch you and play passively at the start until they are spotted and then position somewhere where you don’t meet them. Problem with playing passively at the start is, that your teams usually starts sinking in min 18:00. The less ships remain on the map, the stronger DM gets. You want to 1 vs 1 enemy cruisers where you outdpm them. Problem are the usually five enemy BB with „weak longrange dispersion (after 21.7 in Kremlins case)“ that overmatch you. I wish you success  and fun in the DM!