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Akarinww

just why

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5 minutes ago, Akarinww said:

why is Chesire called a "heavy" cruiser when its bow armor is 25mm?

WG plz fix

Because of i'ts armament, like every other heavy cruiser. You might google this or lookup at wikipedia:

"The heavy cruiser was a type of cruiser, a naval warship designed for long range and high speed, armed generally with naval guns of roughly 203 mm (8 inches) in caliber."

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Adding to previous. The designation "heavy" refers only to guns and DOES NOT have anything to do with ship armor.:cap_book:

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3 hours ago, Akarinww said:

why is Chesire called a "heavy" cruiser when its bow armor is 25mm?

WG plz fix

WG classifys ships as heavy or light by looking at gun calibre. Thats why we have russian t10 "light" cruiser classified as light cruiser although she has stupidly strong armor.

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5 hours ago, Akarinww said:

why is Chesire called a "heavy" cruiser when its bow armor is 25mm?

WG plz fix

25 mm is normal high tier cruiser end plating. T10 CAs like Zao, Henri and Goliath get the same. Moskva, Stalingrad and Petro have their upper bow at 25 mm.

2 hours ago, ghostbuster_ said:

WG classifys ships as heavy or light by looking at gun calibre. Thats why we have russian t10 "light" cruiser classified as light cruiser although she has stupidly strong armor.

I mean, Nevsky is weird, but it's not like the gun caliber is the only thing that makes it kind of inbetween. Most of the ship is just some weird hybrid "medium" cruiser that has strengths and weaknesses of both classes.

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1 hour ago, HaachamaShipping said:

25 mm is normal high tier cruiser end plating. T10 CAs like Zao, Henri and Goliath get the same. Moskva, Stalingrad and Petro have their upper bow at 25 mm.

I mean, Nevsky is weird, but it's not like the gun caliber is the only thing that makes it kind of inbetween. Most of the ship is just some weird hybrid "medium" cruiser that has strengths and weaknesses of both classes.

To be honest, i dont really see any weakness of nevsky. You can argue about the dispercion but fast reload compensates that.

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1 hour ago, ghostbuster_ said:

To be honest, i dont really see any weakness of nevsky. You can argue about the dispercion but fast reload compensates that.

Dispersion is standard dispersion. The issues I see with Nevsky:

  • if you approach it as a light cruiser, the dpm isn't very great (unsurprising, given it has 8 guns), if you approach it as a heavy cruiser, the HE pen is poor, meaning against BBs you either spec IFHE and lose a ton of fire chance or you don't and rely on fires and peppering superstructure/shooting AP into broadside upper belt if the chance presents itself.
  • If you approach it as a heavy cruiser, the armour is not exactly good. It has an icebreaker and 30 mm deck, most of the ship is 25 mm though. 180 mm of citadel protection is cool, but the citadel is quite exposed. If you approach it as a light cruiser, the ship is likely the tankiest light cruiser, but has handling and concealment that is worse than a good few heavies.

I don't consider Nevsky a bad ship, it is a very versatile cruiser, but it combines traits of heavy and light cruisers, positive as well as negative. Especially 12.8 km concealment and the turning on this "light" cruiser can give it quite the issues and even while the ballistics are stellar, if another cruiser doesn't want to fight you at 17 km, you don't need the best ballistics to hit the Nevsky back at short-to-mid range. It's very much the super-Donskoi it should be at T10.

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1 hour ago, HaachamaShipping said:

Dispersion is standard dispersion. The issues I see with Nevsky:

  • if you approach it as a light cruiser, the dpm isn't very great (unsurprising, given it has 8 guns), if you approach it as a heavy cruiser, the HE pen is poor, meaning against BBs you either spec IFHE and lose a ton of fire chance or you don't and rely on fires and peppering superstructure/shooting AP into broadside upper belt if the chance presents itself.

I dont see how this should be an issue tho. AP is just great at any range. Fire change is also decent. with IFHE you can pen as well as other light cruisers.

Quote
  • If you approach it as a heavy cruiser, the armour is not exactly good. It has an icebreaker and 30 mm deck, most of the ship is 25 mm though. 180 mm of citadel protection is cool, but the citadel is quite exposed. If you approach it as a light cruiser, the ship is likely the tankiest light cruiser, but has handling and concealment that is worse than a good few heavies.

armor is just great. if you know how to make use of your armor, meaning baiting the enemy to shoot your belt armor, you can literaly tank whole day long while drinking your beer. since she is super tanky, you dont really need that much handling because you can just tank instead of dodging the shells. 

Quote

I don't consider Nevsky a bad ship, it is a very versatile cruiser, but it combines traits of heavy and light cruisers, positive as well as negative. Especially 12.8 km concealment and the turning on this "light" cruiser can give it quite the issues and even while the ballistics are stellar, if another cruiser doesn't want to fight you at 17 km, you don't need the best ballistics to hit the Nevsky back at short-to-mid range. It's very much the super-Donskoi it should be at T10.

doesnt really matter since you can quite happly trade evenly with most cruisers. 

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1 minute ago, ghostbuster_ said:

I dont see how this should be an issue tho. AP is just great at any range. Fire change is also decent. with IFHE you can pen as well as other light cruisers.

AP can be angled against. And you either have decent fire chance OR decent pen. It's not like Hindenburg that can have both or DesMo or worcester that throw out a lot more shells.

4 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

armor is just great. if you know how to make use of your armor, meaning baiting the enemy to shoot your belt armor, you can literaly tank whole day long while drinking your beer. since she is super tanky, you dont really need that much handling since you can just tank instead of dodging the shells. 

First off, not everyone is always going to shoot your belt. Baiting depends on both sides. Second, you still can get hit by shells in upper belt or stray shots. Third, if belt baiting was a reliable approach, why don't people play open water Mino with its massive side plating that can bounce shells? Lastly, you are still a large target for HE that does not care about your deck. It's tanky... for a light cruiser. Not for a heavy. And you still have the 12.8 km concealment to deal with and the poor handling will limit your maneuvering options as you just cannot take similar risks to some other cruisers.

8 minutes ago, ghostbuster_ said:

doesnt really matter since you can quite happly trade evenly with most cruisers. 

And many cruisers happily can trade with you. DesMo and Salem just don't have to fight at long range and dpm you down. Genuine light cruisers same. Hindenburg has a bit worse dpm but can still hit you comfortably and it's really not a trade you want to engage in, because by the time you might win, you might have lost most of your hp. Zao and Henri you can outtrade. Yoshino and PR you can also trade with, but they are quite tanky as supercruisers, Petro and Stalingrad you have to try burn down, thanks to their decks and while Nevsky outdpms Goliath, the sheer hp advantage of Goliath matters more. Venezia is Venezia, can hit hard or bounce off. And most of these ships get the concealment advantage, so they can just bugger off if they decide they have enough. The Nevsky really isn't some ship that can comfortably outtrade most ships. Maybe when you run into enough potatos in random, but otherwise, no.

 

Frankly, Nevsky having few weaknesses is basically how it is designed. Unlike other Russian T10 cruisers its flaws are more minor (bad concealment, not Moskva levels of 14 km), but its strengths are too. Its dpm is good for a heavy cruiser but with either a severe lack of pen or underwhelming fire chance and the AP is good, but is still just a high pen 180 mm shell that can be negated by angling. It is tanky and has potential for some torpedo plays, but it isn't tankier than most other T10 cruisers, especially not the heavies.

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