The Fun has gone out of the game.....

[Marrant]

I was really enjoying the game and was having a blast with my friends, right up to Tier IV when we started to encounter Carriers. After a few weeks now, I'm the only one left of the group of us that started playing WoW, the rest have gone back to another game, but within the forum rules I'm not allowed to say which one. Here's the main negative points that were the most frustrating and annoying aspects:

 

MAPS - Way, way way too small. Start a Tier IV or V match on a CC or a BB and half the zone is within your Main Gun range. After about 15 seconds of the start of the match, you can rest assured that some aircraft is going to fly near you, Detect you, and in comes the Main Gunfire from the enemy BBs. It's basically impossible to do a sneak attack because everyone, by Tier IV, knows all the maps, where to go, where the enemy is likely to go and where not to go. I have never, ever managed to get a DD half way across the zone without being detected by aircraft, no matter what speed or route I try to take. Two CVs per side in a match can do a detection run on the whole zone in about 25 seconds or less. Need bigger and more varied maps.

 

DETECTION RANGES - are a joke. No matter how many Camouflages and appropriate Flags you equip, you WILL be detected, usually by aircraft, within 30 seconds of the match starting, and if you are on a DD you WILL get focussed. Please check, usually the first ship to die is a DD because within 30 seconds of the map, the CVs aircraft have detected you and everyone on the enemy team has focussed you. Gone are the days when a DD could sneak up on a CV and give him the good news, it's a rarity nowadays. Detection ranges need to be reduced, a lot.

 

CAMOUFLAGES AND FLAGS - Camouflages are a joke now. We used to see loads of ships in Camo in the low tiers, but now it's a rarity. Everyone knows that Camo is no use whatsoever because you will ALWAYS be detected soon after the start of the match by enemy aircraft. I still have hundreds of Camos to equip, but found out very quickly at Tier IV and above that they are not worth equipping. Some Flags are worth the effort, but the ones that reduce detection range aren't worth it. I tried equipping a DD with a Camo and the Flags that reduce detection ranges, but over several matches, there was no noticeable difference in the time I was detected whether I had Camo and Flags on or not. 

 

AIRCRAFT CARRIERS - I cannot remember playing a match where one or both CVs aren't usually the last men standing on a team. They usually head to the back wall of the start zone, and send in wave after wave of UNLIMITED aircraft. I was so intrigued that I researched the Tier IV Langley to see how they play. Horrible is a word that springs to mind. Using Bombers means having to line up precisely on a target because as soon as you start your bomb run and the enemy makes even a slight course correction, it's almost impossible to re position your bomber for a successful drop. I don't use bombers any more, my hit ratio with them is appalling. Rocket equipped aircraft are good, my hit ratio with them is fine, but their damage is laughable. I've actually attacked ships that don't even bother to change course when I attack them with Rockets because the damage is so small that the ships can tank the damage easily, and even on a perfect attack run, I still rarely get more than a couple of hits. I only use Rockets against DDs just to harass them, but never on CCs or BBs because the damage is so small. Torpedo planes are fine, I've little negative statements about them, it's all about gaining the experience in lining up your attack run and knowing exactly when to start your dive, but again, even a small course correction by an enemy that your are attacking with Torps can mean the difference between a hit and completely missing due to the problem of realigning your aircraft after you start your dive. Actually attacking an enemy CV is a horrendous experience and I just don't bother trying any more. No matter whether you use Bombers, Rockets or Torp planes, if the Anti Aircraft Fire coming from the CV doesn't get you, then the fighters that the CV launches definitely will. In one match, I sent in 11 waves of aircraft towards an enemy CV, and didn't get a SINGLE plane on a full attack run before they were shot down by CV AAA or Fighters. I just don't attack a CV with planes any more, you are just wasting time.

 

Those are the main points, but certainly not the total. I've asked around my University and friends who are employed and play WoW, and most, if not all, when asked, "What is the least fun experience in WoW", and usually they will reply, "Get rid of Aircraft Carriers to make the game fun again".

 

Sorry about the long post, it's not a rant, although it may come across as one, just empirically collected evidence as to why people that I specifically know have left the game because of the reasons above. I agree with them that CVs should be removed from the game entirely, or a rework of the system is needed because, as I stated in the Title, the fun has gone out of the game due to CVs as they stand at the moment.

[kfa]

Every point you made is false. If you learn the game mechanics it will be more enjoyable. It takes time. 

If you dont have patience to educate yourself, play coop, operations or another game. 

 

[Altsak]

11 minutes ago, Marrant said:

I was really enjoying the game and was having a blast with my friends, right up to Tier IV when we started to encounter Carriers.

 

Unfortunately that's the way it is. You either get used to the constant beating or adapt by quitting.

[lovelacebeer]

Sadly I wouldn't recommend this game to a new player given the current state it's in. All my friends who I introduced to the game have quit as a direct result of CVs.

 

It's possible for us who have been in the game a long time to know how to mitigate the effects of the majority of CV players but for a new player trying to develop the skills for how to play I do not envy them. 

[Latouche_Treville]

@Marrant,

No offence, but, as stated KFA, you know almost nothing about the game mecanics.

Friendly

 

But, i totally agree witn my upstairs neighbor

[Prospect_b]

25 minutes ago, Marrant said:

amouflages are a joke now. We used to see loads of ships in Camo in the low tiers, but now it's a rarity. Everyone knows that Camo is no use whatsoever because you will ALWAYS be detected soon after the start of the match by enemy aircraft

Camo's aren't really used for detection adjustment (well, except dds I guess), because they only change your detection range a very small bit, but for extra xp, captain xp, freexp or credits.

 

And while some of the guys above have (vaguely) a point about you being unfamiliar with the mechanics, at the same time they refuse to see that you describe the exact experience beginners have of this game, i.e. a totally unwelcoming one. And the low tier carrier spam will never change, cause they are kept artificially too powerful for their tier, else the total CV numbers would crumble to below RTS numbers & weegee would have to admit they made a mistake. Will never happen.

 

In all fairness, unless you really are eager to continue, I'd say join your friends in the other games. I wouldn't recommend this game unless for a hefty bribe.

[SV_Kompresor]

While I agree that having 2 CVs in a match is way too much, you're wrong on just about every other thing. So let's go over them.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

MAPS - Way, way way too small. Start a Tier IV or V match on a CC or a BB and half the zone is within your Main Gun range.

Low tier maps could be a bit bigger...but just a bit. Being in a dreadnought (or got forbid a pre-dreadnought) that can only do 20kts would be a horrible pain otherwise. Also, they're not community contributors...they're cruisers (CL or CA, not CC)

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

It's basically impossible to do a sneak attack because everyone, by Tier IV, knows all the maps, where to go, where the enemy is likely to go and where not to go.

In lower tiers nobody knows where to go.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

I have never, ever managed to get a DD half way across the zone without being detected by aircraft, no matter what speed or route I try to take.

And that is a problem why exactly? In most cases it won't stop your attack even if you do get spotted, just as long as you're good at judging the situation.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Two CVs per side in a match can do a detection run on the whole zone in about 25 seconds or less.

Yes, two CVs in a single match are a bad thing. Too bad WG isn't listening.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

DETECTION RANGES - are a joke. No matter how many Camouflages and appropriate Flags you equip, you WILL be detected, usually by aircraft, within 30 seconds of the match starting, and if you are on a DD you WILL get focussed. Please check, usually the first ship to die is a DD because within 30 seconds of the map, the CVs aircraft have detected you and everyone on the enemy team has focussed you. Gone are the days when a DD could sneak up on a CV and give him the good news, it's a rarity nowadays. Detection ranges need to be reduced, a lot. 

Then I suggest you start playing tier 5 and above. Those maps are large enough to usually prevent the enemy from shooting you instantly. Also, knowing your detection ranges and trying to actually dodge the planes helps. (btw...if your AA range is greater than your spotting range turn it off by pressing P). If a DD dies in the first 30 seconds, that means they're just a bad player. Nothing more.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Camouflages are a joke now. We used to see loads of ships in Camo in the low tiers, but now it's a rarity.

That's beacuse a lot of players are dumb enough to not equip them. (I'm sorry but it's the truth)

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Everyone knows that Camo is no use whatsoever because you will ALWAYS be detected soon after the start of the match by enemy aircraft. Some Flags are worth the effort, but the ones that reduce detection range aren't worth it. I tried equipping a DD with a Camo and the Flags that reduce detection ranges, but over several matches, there was no noticeable difference in the time I was detected whether I had Camo and Flags on or not.  

This statement proves you don't know anything about the game.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Using Bombers means having to line up precisely on a target because as soon as you start your bomb run and the enemy makes even a slight course correction, it's almost impossible to re position your bomber for a successful drop. I don't use bombers any more, my hit ratio with them is appalling.

That's tier 4 for you.

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Rocket equipped aircraft are good, my hit ratio with them is fine, but their damage is laughable.

Do you propose they one shot DDs everytime instead?

 

40 minutes ago, Marrant said:

Actually attacking an enemy CV is a horrendous experience and I just don't bother trying any more. No matter whether you use Bombers, Rockets or Torp planes, if the Anti Aircraft Fire coming from the CV doesn't get you, then the fighters that the CV launches definitely will. In one match, I sent in 11 waves of aircraft towards an enemy CV, and didn't get a SINGLE plane on a full attack run before they were shot down by CV AAA or Fighters. I just don't attack a CV with planes any more, you are just wasting time. 

Do one attack and recall the planes. Or just spot it for your team.

 

Yes, WG should increase the AA values on all tier 3 and 4 ships, yes WG should implement a 1 CV hardcap on all tiers not just 6,7 and 8, yes WG should do a lot more rebalancing and yes it can deter players from coming into the game. That being said, most of these problems could be avoided if WG just found a better way to educate players on how to play the game. CVs are a part of the problem yes, the other part is you not knowing how to play the game well because you haven't been playing it long enough.

[Prospect_b]

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

you're wrong on just about every other thing.

So the guy admits he doesn't really like the game anymore, especially since his mates all fled off, and you feel the need to criticize him on every point he makes? (while even agreeing on some of them...) Ok.

 

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Also, they're not community contributors...they're cruisers (CL or CA, not CC)

Not sure if he even knows what community contributers are, mr smartypants, but CC is often enough (though inaccurate) used as an abbreviation for "cruisers", although technically they only ever referred to battlecruisers.

 

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

And that is a problem why exactly? In most cases it won't stop your attack even if you do get spotted, just as long as you're good at judging the situation.

You continue your dd "attack" when spotted by planes? What a novel tactic...

edit: at OP: if that happens, drop your smoke, or get asap back to whatever has some AA near you (mostly bbs) - and preferably a fighter.

 

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Then I suggest you start playing tier 5 and above.

Yes. Skip the tiers intended to easily learn the game, and go learn it in t5 and up. Definitely not a recipe for even more frustration.

 

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Do one attack and recall the planes. Or just spot it for your team.

Or don't attack the enemy cv at all, cause that's just useless and a waste of planes, unless he is low or it's the end of the game. In case he is in a stupid position, drop a fighter planes to keep him spotted.

 

10 minutes ago, domen3 said:

This statement proves you don't know anything about the game.

[Lord0]

I used to enjoy playing Tier IV (historical ships, less salt etc) but double CV completely ruin it. If you play well and make it to the end of the round you're guaranteed to be focussed to death. What's the point?

[SV_Kompresor]

7 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

So the guy admits he doesn't really like the game anymore, especially since his mates all fled off, and you feel the need to criticize him on every point he makes? (while even agreeing on some of them...) Ok.

This is a forum. This is what it is for.

7 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

You continue your dd "attack" when spotted by planes? What a novel tactic...

Depends on the situation but yes. Being spotted doesn't necessarily mean under attack. As I've said. You need to judge the situation.

 

7 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

Yes. Skip the tiers intended to easily learn the game, and go learn it in t5 and up. Definitely not a recipe for even more frustration. 

He wants bigger maps, he'll get bigger maps. Also, I think that 600 battles is about ripe for tiers 5, 6 and 7

 

7 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

Or don't attack the enemy cv at all, cause that's just useless and a waste of planes, unless he is low or it's the end of the game. In case he is in a stupid position, drop a fighter planes to keep him spotted.

Yes

 

 

[GarrusBrutus]

The current state of low tier gameplay is very unenjoyable for new players. Tried to get some friends into WoWs but facing double cvs each game quite surprisingly didn't appeal to them either. 

[Prospect_b]

7 minutes ago, domen3 said:

This is a forum. This is what it is for.

It's everyone's free choice to interpret "what a forum is for". I'm hardly uncritical of people myself, but I don't specifically feel the urge to make a point by point critique of a guy who has 500 games, especially when they mainly serve to give an impression of his perception. Maybe what the forum, as an extention everything WG related, "is for", is for hungry masses to all fall on easy prey.

 

7 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Depends on the situation but yes. Being spotted doesn't necessarily mean under attack. As I've said. You need to judge the situation.

"Depends on the situation" <> "yes"

On low tiers, your torps don't have much range and you need to close the distance. If you get spotted at that range by planes, even if they don't attack, you'll be in a world of pain. Hence you drop smoke or retreat if possible.

 

7 minutes ago, domen3 said:

He wants bigger maps, he'll get bigger maps.

His problem with feeling the maps as being too small is cause the plane spotting, as he says repeatedly. T5-7 maps don't change that at all.

 

7 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Yes

Indeed.

[SV_Kompresor]

1 minute ago, Saiyko said:

His problem with feeling the maps as to small is cause the plane spotting, as he says repeatedly. T5-7 maps don't change that at all.

I'm gonna have to disagree with that. But hey, it does eliminate the problem of meeting 2 CVs, so at least there's that.

[Prospect_b]

1 minute ago, domen3 said:

it does eliminate the problem of meeting 2 CVs, so at least there's that.

Again, wrong. It doesn't eliminate the problem, it just makes the probability lower.

[SV_Kompresor]

2 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

Again, wrong. It doesn't eliminate the problem, it just makes the probability lower.

Isn't there a hardcap on tier 6 CVs? Or is it just me being lucky and not meeting two of them for a very very very long time?

[rurkovsky]

Can i have some of those detection lowering flags. Thanks in advice.

Also i think the should make tier IV 15 vs 15 or more on slighty bigger maps. 

And auto lost after last non cv player dies. Chasing cv on map edge in 20kn ship surely is fun.

[Prospect_b]

3 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Isn't there a hardcap on tier 6 CVs?

It isn't capped by tier, but by tier span, and those tiers (iirc) are capped at two these days. I had a double t6 cv game recently, and I barely play those tiers anymore. Will always depend on queue, and with recent german fantasyships, it is overloaded enough to give regular double cv games. I haven't seen a t8+t6 cv anymore in a while, but as I said, I don't play there too often.

 

@El2aZeR - you know the details?

[Dominik_Tirpitz]

2 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Isn't there a hardcap on tier 6 CVs? Or is it just me being lucky and not meeting two of them for a very very very long time?

In some rare cases i had either 2 T6 CV, 1 T6 + 1 T8 or 2 T8, but it's pretty rare

[SV_Kompresor]

1 minute ago, Dominik_Tirpitz said:

T6 + 1 T8

Wait what? That's actually still a thing? I haven't seen those since beta.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

As I have stated elsewhere CV's are killing player retention and growth wp WG for the sake of selling some premium CV's you are killing your own game.
And all of that for the least popular class in the game remove CV's and you will make more money in the long run due to more players coming in and staying.

[Dominik_Tirpitz]

Just now, domen3 said:

Wait what? That's actually still a thing? I haven't seen those since beta.

Yea I had probably like 2 or 3 such games in the last 2 months

[Prospect_b]

1 minute ago, domen3 said:

Wait what? That's actually still a thing? I haven't seen those since beta.

See? Isn't the forum a nice place to gather new information...

[SV_Kompresor]

1 minute ago, Saiyko said:

See? Isn't the forum a nice place to gather new information...

Doesn't prevent me from disagreeing with stuff.

[Latouche_Treville]

.

[Yedwy]

3 minutes ago, domen3 said:

Wait what? That's actually still a thing? I haven't seen those since beta.

It is, not in div ofc but you can get T6-T8 match with one cv each