The Bayern and other hidden gems

[Gnolfus]

Just returned to the game.

Before I left the last time, I switched my 15 point Bismarck captain over to the Bayern.

The Bayern is a beast at T6. Easily the best in tier armor, middle of the pack speed of 25kts, good rudder, turning circle and 12.1km concealment with camo and captain skills. 380mm guns which means you can overmatch the bow, stern and sometimes deck/upper belt armor on other T6-7 BBs (26mm). The drawbacks are gun accuracy along with only 8 guns without the best firing angles, but unless you're in +2MM, you have the concealment and tankiness to comfortably play closer and more aggressively to make up for it.

 

I absolutely recommend this ship for newer players, naughty clubbers and everyone in between, it has become my go-to low effort high reward ship for relaxed games.

What's your lesser known favourite ships at low to mid tiers?

[Grandgilad]

Dunkerque, Prinz Eitel Friedrich, Kuma. They are all a real Brawler you dont want to mess with on their Tiers. With the right modules and a good captain you can hunt DDs, cruisers, BBs, CVs. Maybe even Subs soon.

 

[1MajorKoenig]

Well good for you. I don’t find her any exciting. 

 

Have you played Ismail? Or Arizona? These are the references at the tier along with Dunkirk. 

[xxNihilanxx]

In my opinion there are a load of really good ships at the low to mid tiers but as you ask for the lesser known ones I'd have to say...

 

BB: Normandie - this is a great ship but I feel it is often overlooked in favour of the Lyon (with it's 16 barrels of "phuqez vous").

Cruiser: Emile Bertin - another great little ship that has a lot going for it, maybe not as overlooked as some of the others but I still don't think it gets the recognition it deserves.

DD: Shinonome - for some reason I get told frequently that this is a bad ship but I absolutely love it.

[Gnolfus]

2 hours ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

Well good for you. I don’t find her any exciting. 

 

Have you played Ismail? Or Arizona? These are the references at the tier along with Dunkirk. 

 

The Bayern isn't exciting, just very solid all around and easy/relaxing to play.

The Izmail is pretty fragile with a gigantic citadel and poor manouvreability. It's good for blapping people that are clueless enough sailing broadside to you (which happens a lot at T6) though.

You underestimate the advantage of being able to overmatch all T6-7 BBs and CAs you'll face. Had many situations with other BBs where I chunk them for 5-10k every volley through the bow.

[Miragetank90]

1 hour ago, xxNihilanxx said:

DD: Shinonome - for some reason I get told frequently that this is a bad ship but I absolutely love it.

 

They're trying to keep her secret all to themselves 

 

Shinonome is excellent. 

AA is her only issue and it's a moot point.

[Butterdoll]

 

I used to hate Bayern.

Then i returned to the game and something happened.

And now it's a workhorse, with a 19 point captain.

Very often i pick Bayern over Bismarck and Gneisenau and i don't have any problem being bottom tier in my Bayern.

It's good in Co-op , Ops, random, sprint.

I don't have Warspite and until i do, Bayern it's the best t6 BB in the game.

I recently bought Alabama    and i see  many similarities with Bayern 

 

[Beastofwar]

Bayern is slightly beter armoured ( in the right places )  and has larger guns then Prince Eitel Friedrich.

 

But Prince Eitel Friedrich is the one with the most secondary guns so guess who gets the action in Operations ?

[Eternus_Damnatio]

Love the Bayern such a solid ship the Gneisenau feels like a downgrade, Yes it gets torps but you lose a turret which would get far more use at missing everything because the dispersion on it is bloody awful.
Seriously the Bayern feels like a god tier sniper in comparison Gneis grind is going to be loooooooooong.

Fuso is still my fave T6 BB though when RNG smiles on that thing you decimate everything.
  

[SoothingWhaleSong]

I played through Bayern back in about November 2016, but I do recall her being rather fun and having some great brawls. Although it was an earlier time (tm).

 

My stats do now have the awkwardness of my average damage in Normandie outperforming Montana...

[Bortasqu]

6 hours ago, Tropenwolf said:

Kuma, Brawler

 

wat.

[1MajorKoenig]

5 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

You underestimate the advantage of being able to overmatch all T6-7 BBs and CAs you'll face. Had many situations with other BBs where I chunk them for 5-10k every volley through the bow.

No I don’t. It’s just that you barely hit anything bow on and that there are plenty of ships these days which do the same. Days are gone when Bayern and Warspite where special with their overmatch.

 

5 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

The Izmail is pretty fragile with a gigantic citadel and poor manouvreability. It's good for blapping people that are clueless enough sailing broadside to you (which happens a lot at T6) though.

Seriously? This ships is beyond broken - probably one of the most OP ships tier by tier. The citadel doesn’t matter at all as you can fully mitigate it by not showing it. The guns are a joke and are good for nuking anything - not just bobs. Plus she’s fast.

 

[OldPappy]

7 hours ago, xxNihilanxx said:

In my opinion there are a load of really good ships at the low to mid tiers but as you ask for the lesser known ones I'd have to say...

 

BB: Normandie - this is a great ship but I feel it is often overlooked in favour of the Lyon (with it's 16 barrels of "phuqez vous").

Cruiser: Emile Bertin - another great little ship that has a lot going for it, maybe not as overlooked as some of the others but I still don't think it gets the recognition it deserves.

DD: Shinonome - for some reason I get told frequently that this is a bad ship but I absolutely love it.

Havent played the Normandie, but Emile and Shinonome I agree totally! Especially Emile. Such an overlooked gem of a ship. A low tier long distance he shooter and firestarter. Fun!!

[RenamedUser_92906789]

There used to be many ships at low tiers that I would call gems.

 

Now I call them CV food.

[_HomTanks_]

6 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

 

The Bayern isn't exciting, just very solid all around and easy/relaxing to play.

All BBs can be citadeled when they show perfect broadside or easily by DBs. It is a brawling, slow ship with inaccurate guns which probably works against beginners. 

Bayern is solid but it doesn't mean it won't get melted by other tier 6 BB guns. Mutsu, WV, Fuso, Izmail, Warspite wil outgun him any day. Dunkek will play with Bayern like cat and mouse. 

 

6 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

The Izmail is pretty fragile with a gigantic citadel and poor manouvreability. It's good for blapping people that are clueless enough sailing broadside to you (which happens a lot at T6) though.

Well, by design Izmail is not played broad side anyway. And many BBs including Bayern will be citadeled in a perfect broad side condition, only harder compared to Izmail. On the other hand, an Izmail will always outgun a Bayern, and will tank more if played right (not stationary).

 

6 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

You underestimate the advantage of being able to overmatch all T6-7 BBs and CAs you'll face. Had many situations with other BBs where I chunk them for 5-10k every volley through the bow.

You overestimate Bayern guns and underestimate other BBs guns. For example, do you have any idea what WV or Mutsu guns can do to Bayern? 

[Butterdoll]

48 minutes ago, Execute0rder66 said:

do you have any idea what WV or Mutsu guns can do to Bayern? 

that can go both ways.

Do you know what Bayern can do to WV or Mutsu?

 

At least Bayern has something going for it, any other BB are much more squishy.

[Procrastes]

The Bayern is tough as an old boot.

 

I am not a solid enough shot to take full advantage of her guns, but I've sailed through enough gauntlets in her to recognize her for what she is, namely a brawler, a pugilist and a street fighter. The closest comparison at her tier is probably the Warspite, and I'd be hard pressed to say which one of them is the better brawler. The Warspite has more accurate guns, but I think the Bayern is probably tougher and has better secondaries. Victory would most likely go to the better player, with no particular advantage to either ship.

 

The Warspite is my go-to battleship for Operations, though, in no small part due to the fact that she is captained by the inimitable Commander Mighty Jingles!

[invicta2012]

1 hour ago, Execute0rder66 said:

For example, do you have any idea what WV or Mutsu guns can do to Bayern? 

In Mutsu's case, provide a gentle breeze and some water spray as they fall all around the Bayern and completely fail to do any damage. 

[Yedwy]

10 hours ago, Gnolfus said:

Just returned to the game.

Before I left the last time, I switched my 15 point Bismarck captain over to the Bayern.

The Bayern is a beast at T6. Easily the best in tier armor, middle of the pack speed of 25kts, good rudder, turning circle and 12.1km concealment with camo and captain skills. 380mm guns which means you can overmatch the bow, stern and sometimes deck/upper belt armor on other T6-7 BBs (26mm). The drawbacks are gun accuracy along with only 8 guns without the best firing angles, but unless you're in +2MM, you have the concealment and tankiness to comfortably play closer and more aggressively to make up for it.

 

I absolutely recommend this ship for newer players, naughty clubbers and everyone in between, it has become my go-to low effort high reward ship for relaxed games.

What's your lesser known favourite ships at low to mid tiers?

Bayern is really nice, she is also the highest tiered german BB with 15" guns that can somewhat be relied upon to actually perform adequately IMHO, Gneis works to a degree depending on MM and Bis and Tirp are just horribly unreliable and inconsistent unless top tier, their HE is anemic and AP is all shatter and bounce unless its a perfect shot, not worth the bother, also a reason why I will skip Pommern unless they do something radical to it...

 

Siegfried works ok despite it since she has cruiser accuracy and that is devastating with 15" guns even when shells are wonky

[HaachamaShipping]

7 hours ago, Eternus_Damnatio said:

Love the Bayern such a solid ship the Gneisenau feels like a downgrade, Yes it gets torps but you lose a turret which would get far more use at missing everything because the dispersion on it is bloody awful.
Seriously the Bayern feels like a god tier sniper in comparison Gneis grind is going to be loooooooooong.

Fuso is still my fave T6 BB though when RNG smiles on that thing you decimate everything.
  

Bayern is great, but Gneisenau is not a downgrade. Gneisenau just is different. Bayern is your typical BB, just with a ton of armour. Mediocre speed, mediocre guns (for T6), good concealment, decent AA (still will get you nuked by something like Weser), okish secondaries (really, secs at T6 and below are largely laughable). You play this thing like your typical BB and have success.

 

Gneisenau is meanwhile just peak German BB of the tech tree line. The guns on a per gun basis are an upgrade with better penetration, traverse and reload. You get one less turret, but still two front, so whenever typically you had to struggle getting rear turrets on target without broadsiding, now you have to care less. 32 knots is highest in tier speed and even hard uptiered to T9 is still very good. Armour is an upgrade mostly in form of improved deck armour. Secondaries are a major upgrade as they can be 8 km and accurate. And torps are the ticket to win almost any 1v1 with a BB.

 

Bayern is basically WWI Germany, well-rounded and prepared for a battle of attrition where it will only go down to overwhelming odds. Gneisenau is basically WWII Germany, there to blitz in with utmost aggression and run others down before they realise what happened. May lead to overextension and miserable death though, if you bite off too much.

 

I'm perpetually conflicted whether German line peaks at Bayern or Gneisenau, given the former is just great, while the latter is the last German BB that really can dictate its own pace upon the enemy given its in-tier speed advantage.

[Uglesett]

13 hours ago, xxNihilanxx said:

(with it's 16 barrels of "phuqez vous").

 

Agreed on the Normandie. And such a pretty ship, particularly with the ocean liner camo. Definitely one I'm keeping in my port.

[Procrastes]

1 minute ago, Uglesett said:

Agreed on the Normandie. And such a pretty ship, particularly with the ocean liner camo. Definitely one I'm keeping in my port.

I would have liked to have the Ocean Liner camo for the Normandie, it is easily the best-looking and most inspired "player-based" camo pattern that has so far been introduced. Unfortunately, I had no possibility of completing the missions to get it. I hope it will be made available for doubloons.

[_HomTanks_]

5 hours ago, Butterdoll said:

that can go both ways.

Do you know what Bayern can do to WV or Mutsu?

 

At least Bayern has something going for it, any other BB are much more squishy.

Did you ever play with WV or Mutsu?

[_HomTanks_]

4 hours ago, invicta2012 said:

In Mutsu's case, provide a gentle breeze and some water spray as they fall all around the Bayern and completely fail to do any damage. 

If you can't do damage to not only Bayern but any other ship, it is not Mutsu's fault. 

[invicta2012]

15 minutes ago, Execute0rder66 said:

If you can't do damage to not only Bayern but any other ship, it is not Mutsu's fault. 

Like most Japanese battleships, it's a bit inaccurate, so if I feel it's more difficult to do damage in it than all the other Tier VI BBs I have, that is down to the ship.