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HassenderZerhacker

changes to radar? ...

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Just now, HassenderZerhacker said:

yes.. but I am seeing more USN radars too

You seeing more US radar does not mean there is more US radar in the game.

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2 minutes ago, xxNihilanxx said:

Oh man, can you imagine a party at Pete's house...

 

Partygoer: Hey Pete, Happy Birthday!

Pete: Actually my birthday was yesterday and you have no way of knowing how happy or otherwise it was.

Partygoer: No man, I was wishing you a Happy Birthday...

Pete: Well, as I said, it was yesterday and even if wishes weren't just ridiculous superstitions there is no way they could go back in time and change history so wishing me happiness for an event in the past that cannot be altered is purely redundant.

Partygoer: OK.

Partygoer: Well I bet you got loads of cool presents and stuff...

Pete: You have no proof of that, it is pure specualtion on your part. Actually, according to maplesyrup.birthday.com I received just about the average number of presents of nominal temperature in comparison to the last five years.

Partygoer: Yeah, that's great.... I...think... So anyway, it's quiet in hear. It's time for some paaartyyy tuuuuuunes.

Pete: I think if you look at your invitation you will see that the party is scheduled to begin at 8p.m. prompt whereas, as you can clearly see from the carriage clock on the mantle it is currently 7.57p.m. so no, as I have clearly explained, it is NOT time for pa a a a rty tu u u nes.

Partygoer: Seriously dude.... IIIIIIII'm coming up so you better get this party started, I'm coming up, I'm coming...

Pete: Actually, according to my spreadsheets you are at about the same height you have always been.

Partygoer: No, Pete mate, you're not getting it.... listen.... "IIIIIII'm coming up so you better get this party started!!!

Pete: No I have cross checked with the three theodolites I have positioned at various triangulation points around the room and can confirm that, regardless of how you may perceive your position to be your actual level of elevation has remained constant.

Partygoer: Fat Sam's?

Partygoers: Fat Sam's!

Did I invite you last time?

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It's the rise of the Russian Cruiser.

That's why.

 

If you are on a DD and thrown into a radar prevalent game, you are basically guaranteed not having fun. Others will have fun with you though.

 

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18 minutes ago, Winged_Cat_Dormant said:

If you are on a DD and thrown into a radar prevalent game, you are basically guaranteed not having fun. Others will have fun with you though.

Are you sure?

That are my solo DD games the past weeks:

image.png.2018d02c3147b5108f91bf1d6fc2f28f.png

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7 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Are you sure?

That are my solo DD games the past weeks:

image.png.2018d02c3147b5108f91bf1d6fc2f28f.png

 

Z39 and T61 might not be the best examples here...

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8 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Are you sure?

That are my solo DD games the past weeks:

image.png.2018d02c3147b5108f91bf1d6fc2f28f.png

Fat Sam's anyone? :Smile_trollface:

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9 minutes ago, Murqy said:

 

Z39 and T61 might not be the best examples here...

Had I removed them, somebody would have accused me of hiding something...

And both can see radar, Z39 does that frequently.

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I don't see a shima in there Colonel, or a khaba I think you'd find both a little more challenging at the moment than any of those ships in the list you posted. It looks to me like you got carried pretty hard in the oland and yu yang as well.

 

Can excellent players perform in dds in this current meta, yes they can. Does it mean it is fun or pleasant for them? I don't know. Is it a little oppressive for the average player that isn't sailing the on meta most powerful ships.

 

I certainly think so and I suspect I'm not alone in that respect. 

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6 minutes ago, Thracen said:

I don't see a shima in there Colonel, or a khaba I think you'd find both a little more challenging at the moment than any of those ships in the list you posted. It looks to me like you got carried pretty hard in the oland and yu yang as well.

 

Can excellent players perform in dds in this current meta, yes they can. Does it mean it is fun or pleasant for them? I don't know. Is it a little oppressive for the average player that isn't sailing the on meta most powerful ships.

 

I certainly think so and I suspect I'm not alone in that respect. 

As I wrote, these were solo games, no carrying needed. My Yugumo game in a division yesterday went fine too. See no reason why the faster Shima should have more trouble with radar...

 

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3 hours ago, HassenderZerhacker said:

yes.. but I am seeing more USN radars too

Maybe to do with a couple of the more straightforward dockyard missions having the option to complete them in US cruisers?

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Colonel I may have missed the point. I am assuming you showed stats of you doing well in dds as anecdotal evidence that the meta for dds is perfectly fine and to be enjoyed by all. Is that correct?

 

If so I would question your enjoyment of three games with a average PR below 800

 

I'm also not familiar with the yu myself but I can't help but think her torps are far more suited to longer range than the shimas 20km mines, the 12km passable option and the F3 meme fish. She also has a reputation for being a better gun boat with more fast reloading smoke something I imagine is quite handy if you are forced out of one by radar. I think it also has a possible gun range out to beyond 12km something the average shima doesn't.

 

My point is, your experience doesn't strike me as representative and in itself seems a little disingenuous. 

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20 minutes ago, Thracen said:

Can excellent players perform in dds in this current meta, yes they can. Does it mean it is fun or pleasant for them? I don't know. Is it a little oppressive for the average player that isn't sailing the on meta most powerful ships. 

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20200620/eu_week/average_class_u.html

If i look at those numbers, doesnt seem like DDs are played less than usually? If id have to answer, if players are having fun, id say 50%+ of the playerbase cant have fun regardless of what ships they play, just by the way they "succeed" (more like fail).

For all i care, then let them play Cruisers. If they think its more fun, shouldnt be a problem right?

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16 minutes ago, TeaAndTorps said:

Maybe to do with a couple of the more straightforward dockyard missions having the option to complete them in US cruisers?

that might be an explanation, yes!

 

2 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20200620/eu_week/average_class_u.html

If i look at those numbers, doesnt seem like DDs are played less than usually? If id have to answer, if players are having fun, id say 50%+ of the playerbase cant have fun regardless of what ships they play, just by the way they "succeed" (more like fail).

For all i care, then let them play Cruisers. If they think its more fun, shouldnt be a problem right?

many will be playing the DD missions in the current directives as well as the Polish campaign. I see many Öland and Östergötland.

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Just now, HassenderZerhacker said:

many will be playing the DD missions in the current directives as well as the Polish campaign. I see many Öland and Östergötland.

 

Thats an interesting point, which i covered some time ago, where i basicly called WoWs being more like work or a chore than something you play 4 fun. In the end, they tell us what we should play, to run after the next thing they are dangeling infront of our heads.

I decided to break that chain and simply not participate in that grind-work any longer. I have too many ships which i cant play. But i guess its one way to keep the playerbase active and engaged in the game, by constantly giving them something to do :cap_old:

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DFens, as far as I can tell that is a simple snapshot of very broad categories. The simple fact of classing ships as either high or low tier makes it pretty irrelevant to issue since it is a discussion of radar at high tier. There are also no number of other periods to compare too.

 

Frankly what concerns me the most is the number of 0 dd matches I am ending up in at higher tiers. I do not like the game at all without proper dd spotting. This game is about positioning and you cannot do that effectively without spotting. 

 

Sadly we won't get a definitive answer because wargaming won't release the number of 0 dd matches per given time period. I suspect because it would support the evidence that they have hammered many a dd player out of the top tiers. But supposition isn't proof so I'll rest there. 

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1 hour ago, Thracen said:

Colonel I may have missed the point. I am assuming you showed stats of you doing well in dds as anecdotal evidence that the meta for dds is perfectly fine and to be enjoyed by all. Is that correct?

 

If so I would question your enjoyment of three games with a average PR below 800

 

I'm also not familiar with the yu myself but I can't help but think her torps are far more suited to longer range than the shimas 20km mines, the 12km passable option and the F3 meme fish. She also has a reputation for being a better gun boat with more fast reloading smoke something I imagine is quite handy if you are forced out of one by radar. I think it also has a possible gun range out to beyond 12km something the average shima doesn't.

 

My point is, your experience doesn't strike me as representative and in itself seems a little disingenuous. 

I showed you a complete sample, not just the stuff of me doing well.

The problem is that some games just end too quickly. You beat up a DD a bit, get the cap, spot for the team and then the game is over. The Base XP is decent, but PR does not care about that.

 

Shima has the same 12km torps as Yugumo. Shima and Yugumo have nearly identical reload on the guns, not that it makes any difference in dealing with radar ships. Shooting them is usually not a good idea...

 

Somebody claimed that DD players are GUARANTEED of not having fun when playing in a radar enviroment. Looks like it is not a guarantee. That is what I wanted to show... :Smile_smile:

Spoiler

At least 3 radar on the enemy team.

95737_968_1592143787.jpg

And it felt like seal clubbing.

And no, I was not just gunboating:

95737_29_1592143787.jpg

And for the people unfamiliar with the Mogador. That are 8km torps with 7.5km concealment on the ship.

 

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6 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Thats an interesting point, which i covered some time ago, where i basicly called WoWs being more like work or a chore than something you play 4 fun. In the end, they tell us what we should play, to run after the next thing they are dangeling infront of our heads.

I decided to break that chain and simply not participate in that grind-work any longer. I have too many ships which i cant play. But i guess its one way to keep the playerbase active and engaged in the game, by constantly giving them something to do :cap_old:

yes you are very correct.

 

but I think it's ok as long as players have to fulfill a lot of missions to get the ships.

 

in WoT, I was disgusted when they were giving away tanks I spent long hours to get through missions.

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4 minutes ago, Thracen said:

Frankly what concerns me the most is the number of 0 dd matches I am ending up in at higher tiers.


See, thats quite weird, and not something i personaly have experienced lately. Ill share some screens:

 

image.png.50a4effd7aa3efa3a071be7b56d0ec51.pngimage.png.e5be59bd9e3941b20c65bbb6b32046a5.pngimage.png.d2aa4d83c6b47d0830073039c61452b1.pngimage.png.cff141c8835d013d2c550a84fe40fed5.pngimage.png.3ff919dc6f1df4b6f6baaf995b0c82b1.png

image.png.956ee64c1e50b7a969ee67588483679d.pngimage.png.05d6c36c5c42a4b1ee84fbf9b84a1950.pngimage.png.60d8bc5e604925564e204cd9f094d505.png

image.png.1f6a831234b2e8138132170847c93ef3.pngimage.png.ce166af0cce1af8d6b0dc329301216d9.png

 

+ 1 donskoi game is missing which had 1 DD in it.

 

I think the average is more than 2DDs per game, sure you can say, i basicly always have my own DD in my division, which guaranteed atleast 1 DD. But normaly there is more than 1 DD.

2 / 3 / 3 / 4 / 2 / 2 / 4 / 4 / 2 / 3 / 1 = 2,7 DDs on average, which is close to what it should be by the numbers? (slightly more maybe... ~20% vs 22,5%)

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