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Figment

Getting all BB matches now.

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Not seen this prior to patch 0.3.1:

 

(Nearly) full BB teams on both sides (sometimes with one to three other units total, CVs becoming even more rare).

 

 

And no, they're not all US BBs. 80% of them are Amagi's and Yamato's. For the record, was playing my own Amagi. Ended in a draw with just carriers and one other ship on both sides remaining.

 

 

Patch "coincidence"?

 

EDIT: *slight edit for more specific phrasing of observation and patch number*

Edited by Figment
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[RONIN]
[RONIN]
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Only thing I can see is when I load a BB I'll wait in the queue for 2-3 mins. (Along with other BB). If I load a cruiser/destroyer then as soon as I press battle I'll be put in a fight. Now I don't ever feel that Im put upon in these fights, but I doubt the MM will ever let the numbers of CA/DD build up atm.

I know that it says max queue waiting time is 5 mins, so maybe it just dumped all the remaining BB into one match?

 

Different note, how did it play out? Interesting, challenging, or a dull long range shoot out?

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[EIRE]
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I see mainly BBs yea. Still plenty of balanced games, but every 3rd or 4th is very BB heavy.

 

People aren't stupid, they play to win and right now its easier with BBs.

I've stopped playing IJN DDs as they're kind of unplayable. DDs you see now are US or premium mainly.

There are either a few balance issues with 0.3.1 or we just haven't adapted to play the new patch well enough yet.

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Alpha Tester
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IJN DDs are boring to play in high tier and Minekaze gets old sooner than later. Without IJN DDs to prey on, US DDs become useless and without DDs and now that US BBs carry loads of AAA, CAs became useless, also US CVs stole their "niche" of AA protection for the team but most players doesn't enjoy CVs, so they aren't that popular. Hence, right now, there is no reason to play other kind of ship than BBs. Is the cycle of life.

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Beta Tester
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Not seen this prior to patch 3.1.0:

 

Full BB teams on both sides (sometimes with ONE DD or C, CVs becoming even more rare).

 

 

And no, they're not all US BBs. 80% of them are Amagi's and Yamato's. For the record, was playing my own Amagi. Ended in a draw with just carriers and one other ship on both sides remaining.

 

 

Patch "coincidence"?

 

So, the MM has the following in queue: 4 CV, 100BB, 10CA, 4DD...

Now, what do you think you get with that when you want to create 5 matches with that?

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View PostXevious_Red, on 18 May 2015 - 03:00 PM, said:

Different note, how did it play out? Interesting, challenging, or a dull long range shoot out?

 

It was the Ice map. I went after the two cruisers (New Orleans and Pensacola) that had separated from the rest and killed them close range (they received one citadel hit each from another BB about 15km behind me, rest was citadel hits from me and my secondaries putting the Pensacola on fire). Had lost several secondaries to the Pensacola. Sadly it's very hard to tell how many and which come to think of it, would be nice to know.

 

All in all, everyone had stayed at range first part of the match, then as more and more sank in the ice fields where many got stuck.

 

I then went after the only DD (Fubuki) they had, but it got insta-killed as soon as I spotted it by another Amagi of ours. Around that time, both teams had lost most their BBs by then (five-six remaining each) and the remaining few were coming out of the "C" area into the encounter capture ring one by one or in pairs, typically sinking with a bunch of citadel hits whoever sailed in front.

 

I went down last of our BBs after helping sink several BBs of the Carolina class, mostly due to a triple fire (double bomber hit after already being lit up by the New Mexico). They still had a near full health New Mexico (I took maybe 15K-17K of it) in the end and we a Shimakaze that failed to hit anything all match except for turret fire. Very little he could do the New Mexico that easily kept a 7km distance with it.

 

Both sides had one Lexington. They fought each other mostly and each got the clear sky merit badge. Beyond that, they did some bombing damage, but hardly hit anything with torps as far as I could tell. Think one of the BBs caught a full load of torps on our side, rest seemed to have dodged most on both sides. I caught one torp in the final duel with a New Mexico from either an automated drop or panic spread, where the right side torpedo moved nearly perpendicular to the torp spread towards the left, crossing the rest, which was... weird. Easily went out of the way of most of them, just not that weird one that came in at a really weird angle from the rest. That on top of the fires and New Mexico fire killed my last 20K hp in the end.

 

View PostKirasa, on 18 May 2015 - 03:48 PM, said:

So, the MM has the following in queue: 4 CV, 100BB, 10CA, 4DD...

Now, what do you think you get with that when you want to create 5 matches with that?

 

Well yeah. That's what I'm getting at. The massive increase in BBs usage, without all of those even being the new BBs, which is what I would have expected. To me it's like people are shifting their choice of tool heavily towards BB.

 

 

That or the new BB line is so popular, that "regular" matchmaking slots are easily filled up and you get an overabundance of BBs that the matchmaker can't place.

 

So either BBs in general gained a lot of popularity this patch or the matchmaker cannot handle a (temporary?) popularity increase when a new line is introduced. Looks like something a dev might want to look into.


 

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Beta Tester
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I think they need to buff Cruisers so they don't get 1 shotted by bbs all the time, i don't see how a cruiser has to be blown up by a bb in 1 salvo.

 

So people take bbs i got it.

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Don't hurry to judge guys.

 

Yes, maybe the Japan DDs need a little love in high tiers, but you see mostly BB matches in med. tiers too, so it's not (only) that.

 

Yes, they (may) buffed armor a little and so ppl like to play their BBs more (but this would fade out at some point imo).

 

I'd say it's mostly the new patch and the introduction of US BBs, that old beta's/alpha's who may went a little inactive (I also saw a spike in "players in quee") and the above. (armor buff, etc).

 

So yeah, a little patience imo and see where this goes.

 

Regards,

Stugga

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Beta Tester
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The things that kept BB's in check prior to the patch, ie torpedo's are so much more easy to dodge with the recent changes. Armour is also worth more than it was prior to the patch. BB's are now very very strong and of course this means very very common / popular. Cruisers are BB food, so their numbers diminish as their players think, 'no more', and hop into a battleship too. Destroyers are in an odd place, there are less cruisers gunning for them, but they've benefited least from the changes. Carriers are in a sorry state right now and vanishing from the queues.

 

So, we see a ratio of 1 CV : 12 BB : 4 CA : 3 DD

 

Hopefully WG will take note of the trend since the update

 

 

 

 

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[EIRE]
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The armour buff is fine, as is critical shots from BBs one shotting CAs. CAs are not supposed to toe to toe BBs, BBs are supposed to to toe to BBs with CA support. CAs are supposed to shield BBs from DDs and aircraft, and provide extras DPM and distraction in BB fights. DDs are supposed to counter BB and CV. However, the rock paper scissor is all fooked up. BBs counter aircraft fairly well at higher tiers. They also turn quickly enough to be fairly safe from DDs if they plan well enough ahead and don't make tactical errors.... So everyone just uses BBs.

 

I hope 3.1.1 has some balance changes included. A minor change here and there is all that is needed. Small debuff to turning circles and something for the HE round issue. I also think the US DD main gun fires slightly too fast and could do with an extra half km range for their torpedos, and I think it will get better.

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Partly agree with vonBlashyrkh.  Cruisers are not BB food, if you kite well in long ranges you can do well. However, this patch introduced the "fire effect" and it's easier to mitigate fires in a BB with your Y (heal), than with a cruiser R (repair) every 1,5 or so mins.

Also about HE dmg, I find it ok, it's the constant fires that tip off the balance, maybe a decrease in chance of fire or something is needed (but that is discussed in other threads).

 

Futhermore, I partially agree with Shagulon too. I agree that BBs have too much AA on their own. They don't need cruiser AA support (if at all). And between them and the cruisers, high tier carriers are reluctant to play. However, I don't think BBs turn fast enough to avoid torps (except US BBs but that's their selling point). It's just that ppl have started to learn the game and learn to avoid DDs, keep them in range, don't go into corners or islands, don't enter that "little smoke cloud', etc.), however, I find myself being hit often enough by torps even when I play cruisers, so I think the turning thingy is ok. Maybe there's some bug in spotting range of torps or I dunno that needs to be checked out, but nerfing BBs turning speed  even more, nop, I don't agree.

 

The above also makes it clear that high tier DDs need a little love, same as carriers (or rather, carriers may not need love, the crazy AA of ships (all the more so BBs) may need some nerf). At this point, my med tier carrier entering a fight... I have no valid targets. AA everywhere so hey, throw a bomb in a lonely DD and gg...

 

Regards,

Stugga

Edited by Stugga

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@Stugga: "[...], but nerfing BBs turning even more, nop, I don't agree."

 

You of course meant to say "buffing BBs turning even more"... Right? NERFED? What have you been patching? .___.'

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I get hit in my BBs by torps every game, but generally only from TBs, I never (well unless really distracted) get hit by a DD torp in a US BB.

 

Don't often get hit by TBs in a US BB...

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@Stugga: "[...], but nerfing BBs turning even more, nop, I don't agree."

 

You of course meant to say "buffing BBs turning even more"... Right? NERFED? What have you been patching? .___.'

 

Yes, sorry, I meant buffing. Good thing you were paying attention :)

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I'm not good with BBs one shotting CAs and never have been. It's the same reason that arty and the 183 are nonsense in WoT: it destroys immersion, adds crutches for bad players and overly punishes small mistakes in exposure. Rock/paper/scissors is just a bad way of balancing generally, since if one element is missing in a match then the match doesn't work properly. WoT tried that dynamic and (fortunately) was so bad at it that interesting interclass dynamics appeared and the whole thing ended up working because class strengths were diminished and individual strengths were enhanced. Basically: screw RPS balancing, it doesn't work.

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[EIRE]
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Apart from magazine detonation, BBs do not one shot CAs unless they are around 8km away. If you're in a CA and you come within the max range of your guns of a BB who has her guns pointed in your direction, you haven't made a small mistake, you made a huge one. If you can no longer dodge salvos (too close) you're fooked. I'm fine with it. BBs counter CAs.

 

I guess you'd also argue that CAs shouldn't one shot DDs by the same rationale?

Edited by Shagulon

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Well, to be honest, if anything gets oneshooted by any ship it already made a huge mistake, unless you are one of the unlucky ending up in a +4 tier matchup.

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